Possibility Of Making Provincial Side If A Player Does Not Play In Schools

EKClarke

How difficult is it or what is the route a rugby player takes if he didn't or doesn't play schools rugby to get into a provincial side.

CatFromHue

well there used to be provincial A sides at schools level made up of the weaker schools that might just have one senior team made up of 2 or even 3 years in school. then there is the provincial youths teams made up of players from clubs as opposed to schools. sean o brein has both A and youth provincial caps. here is the leinster profile on him with a bit of a story on his under age career

http://www.leinsterrugby.ie/profiles/index.php?player=20048&includeref=dynamic

chupacabra

Well when I was in school I had a trial for the Munster sub-academy. They were doing a province wide drive for young props at the time. I was in a VERY non-rugby school which goes for every school in Kerry really but im guessing that if you are good enough at that level you would get some kind of academy contract and progress from there. Not being part of a rugby school isnt the end of the road.

RMD

If in a non-Rugby school the player will be scouted through his club. The province's will generally enquire with the clubs if they have any players they'd recommend to send through to trials. O'Brien and Horgan both came from non-Rugby schools, it does happen albeit it's a harder process.

ormond lad

CatFromHue wrote: »

well there used to be provincial A sides at schools level made up of the weaker schools that might just have one senior team made up of 2 or even 3 years in school. then there is the provincial youths teams made up of players from clubs as opposed to schools. sean o brein has both A and youth provincial caps. here is the leinster profile on him with a bit of a story on his under age career

http://www.leinsterrugby.ie/profiles/index.php?player=20048&includeref=dynamic

There still is u18 A schools interpros, Munster play Leinster every season home and away. Munster A schools played connacht this season in an interpro as well as leinster. (winning 19-5 v connacht and winning 30-11 and 22-11 against leinster)

Players from the clubs system not involved in an A school in Munster, Section B(??) in Leinster, play for the youths, the year after playing at u17 level for regional sides within their province. Those players will have been initially picked for those regional squads at u15/16 level(cadet level) and made those squads after coaches at that level will have seen them play or asked their club coaches which of their players are good enough for that level.

jacothelad

This is actually a very important question and one which is frequently and hotly debated in Ulster rugby coaching circles. My pals who coach club rugby outside of the major sides are often apoplectic about the way that their players are totally ignored. Ulster Rugby draws it's players almost exclusively from those schools who compete in the Ulster Schools Cup. Not necessarily those who actually usually win it either. The players from outside the grammar sector don't get exposed to the selectors at schools level. In order to play rugby they have to join junior clubs. These fall outside the purview of the Academy selectors.

When you consider that about 35% of pupils attend the Grammar Schools, 65% of those in the other schools rarely get the opportunity to play rugby as the accent is on soccer and GAA. This almost certainly excludes 60% of boys from exposure to the game and the chance to explore the untapped skills available in this group is lost. The whole system was set up by the Grammar Schools, ran by them for their own benefit and still is. I see hjunior players every bit as good as those in Inst or M.C.B. turning out for junior clubs every Saturday. No matter if we have a new SOB, BOD etc they are going to be lost to the system.

An even more insidious and damaging turn of events is the introduction of daft age groupings. We now have 12 year olds in junior rugby in Ulster who, because of their birthdates end up in age groups with players almost 2 years older. Similar disparities run all through the system. As a result, a growing and substantial number of really keen players are being withdrawn from the game by concerned parents. They don't want their children being exposed to much bigger and far stronger players. The possible consequences of this mismatch are obvious - except to the rugby authorities

CatFromHue

Is there no A teams in Ulster for the "weaker" non grammar schools and what about Ulster Youths for the clubs?

jacothelad

There are but studiously ignored by the elite. Let's face it, any bunch who select guys like NOC don't know there gluteous maximus from their medial epicondyle.

GerM

jacothelad wrote: »

any bunch who select guys like NOC don't know there gluteous maximus from their medial epicondyle.

muscleshirt

ormond lad wrote: »

There still is u18 A schools interpros, Munster play Leinster every season home and away. Munster A schools played connacht this season in an interpro as well as leinster. (winning 19-5 v connacht and winning 30-11 and 22-11 against leinster)

Players from the clubs system not involved in an A school in Munster, Section B(??) in Leinster, play for the youths, the year after playing at u17 level for regional sides within their province. Those players will have been initially picked for those regional squads at u15/16 level(cadet level) and made those squads after coaches at that level will have seen them play or asked their club coaches which of their players are good enough for that level.

there were talks of disbanding the A schools next year which would be a pity,sean o brien came trough the leinster A schools,the munster A schools played exceptionally well this year winning all their inter-pro games and beaten
munster youths in a challenge in cashel comfortably,with a lot of new GAA schools now playing rugby it should be explored further

ormond lad

muscleshirt wrote: »

there were talks of disbanding the A schools next year which would be a pity,sean o brien came trough the leinster A schools,the munster A schools played exceptionally well this year winning all their inter-pro games and beaten
munster youths in a challenge in cashel comfortably,with a lot of new GAA schools now playing rugby it should be explored further

Was there talk of disbanding the A schools??
Pity if there is as it gives lads in schools like bandon grammer, midleton college who may not play clubs rugby but are at a decent standard a chance to play interpro rugby.
Sean O Brien came through the Youths and A schools,... couldnt you play for both back then

muscleshirt

ormond lad wrote: »

Was there talk of disbanding the A schools??
Pity if there is as it gives lads in schools like bandon grammer, midleton college who may not play clubs rugby but are at a decent standard a chance to play interpro rugby.
Sean O Brien came through the Youths and A schools,... couldnt you play for both back then

you can still play both to a degree ,james reaves was called to the munster youth after some good performances for the schools A ,some more looked at as well but were slightly over age for youths

EKClarke

What's usually the age cut off where players will no longer be accepted into an Academy.

ormond lad

EKClarke wrote: »

What's usually the age cut off where players will no longer be accepted into an Academy.

Most players will be 19/20 when entering the academy but some will be older, alan cotter was nearly 24 when he joined and some but not as many will be younger, JJ hanrahan was only 18 when he joined the academy. Depends on what position someone plays etc on when they join