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Replacment for Cessna 172

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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 18,313 CMod ✭✭✭✭The Black Oil




  • Registered Users Posts: 3,355 ✭✭✭punchdrunk


    The timing of this “oh look, Airbus sent us a few photos!” is hilarious, Nothing to do with the avalanche of negative commentary online after abandoning a couple of dozen of our fellow countrymen and women in AFG then??



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,888 ✭✭✭sparky42




  • Registered Users Posts: 3,640 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    An to highlight it more Cathal Berry just on RTE proposing deployment of rangers to get them and it was mentioned the rangers have no taxi to get them there!!!



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,355 ✭✭✭punchdrunk




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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,818 ✭✭✭donvito99


    The original, non grey PC-12 was (very) low over the South city this afternoon, any (public domain) ideas why?



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,858 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    On approach to Baldonnel?

    You'd often see low approaches anywhere from Dun Laoghaire to Dundrum to Tallaght for runway 28 at the Don, especially with the wind in the NW, which it was for the last few days.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,818 ✭✭✭donvito99


    No this was inside the canals, flying east to west, essentially down Cuffe St.



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,858 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    I see.

    Could have been a training or calibration flight on the surveillance equipment, or even an ACP sortie.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,640 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    Looking at FR24 i see IRL 280 coming back from germany. The PC12's seam to be good value for money for the useage they are getting



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,320 ✭✭✭Dohvolle


    Or, alternatively, they are being given missions that could be done by UPS or DHL with a crew of 4 pilots in order to build up flight hours.

    The objective of course being to have type rating on the most popular single engine fixed wing air ambulance before heading on your ticket... because getting multi engine hours up is impossible with the limited availability of the Casa.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭Stovepipe


    this is the point in the build contract where the second last cheque has been cashed and the airframe will go to the Irish. Manufacturers tend to get paid in stages. This is one of them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭Stovepipe


    Now , now,that's just being cynical. Four pilots to move a few boxes that could fit in a small Transit van. You'd swear somebody might have an ulterior motive.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,259 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    Flight hour requirements are a thing, even in the US. We've received some odd aircraft just so some folks could make the hours. I remember asking for a Nevada C-130 to move us from one end of Nevada (Where they were based) to the other end of Nevada for a weekend. We got a C-130 from North Carolina which needed more hours, so they flew empty trans-continental, and they got a weekend in Vegas out of it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,858 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    In celebration of the Air Corps Centenary which occurs in 2022, the original additional PC-12, 280, has finally been repainted, in a WWII emergency commemorative colour scheme. The scheme and roundel echoes that of the period Coastal Patrol Squadron based at Shannon, comprised of Avro Ansons, Lockheed Hudson and Supermarine Walrus flying boats.

    Images © Air Corps Instagram




  • Registered Users Posts: 3,888 ✭✭✭sparky42


    That actually looks really good.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,075 ✭✭✭jonnybigwallet


    Looks great!



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,818 ✭✭✭donvito99


    They should have gone the whole hog and reliveried the whole thing.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,075 ✭✭✭jonnybigwallet


    Ya might be right. Still, it's the way they do things I guess...half measures!



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,858 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    I think the deliberate blend is an appropriate nod from the contemporary to the historic. Makes it more of a talking point for a lay audience and those with a passing interest.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 590 ✭✭✭Leonidas BL


    Gorgeous!!



  • Registered Users Posts: 298 ✭✭tippilot


    I'm not against the blend of both schemes but I must say I'm not loving the serrated crossover.



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,858 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    No other suitable thread, sorry. Sparky had alluded to this the other day.

    Govt has leased a Citation CJ3 as concern about the availability of the Lear grows.

    (Insert eyeroll emoji at Irish Examiner using a picture of long defunct G.4 251.)



  • Registered Users Posts: 298 ✭✭tippilot


    It looks like they are assuming this will be a highly unpopular but necessary acquisition and they are leaking the negative aspects of the current situation before a tender is issued.

    The common sense direct replacement for the Lear is the PC 24 but there may be an opportunity to get something with longer legs and more capacity.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,320 ✭✭✭Dohvolle


    They tried that with the G4 also, claiming it was falling apart, sold it for basically scrap value, it's still flying in private hands.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,888 ✭✭✭sparky42


    True, though I can well imagine the political costs of trying to buy a new jet in the midst of Post Crash Ireland…



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,640 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    Thats where you could sell a A320 Neo or 737 Max multi mission. Gov jet, Medical rescue, Citzen Rescue ,Refugee rescue, Aid delivery.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,888 ✭✭✭sparky42


    Didn’t they try that during Bertie’s time?



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,858 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    They did indeed, there is a desk model of an A320 mocked up in Air Corps colours gathering dust somewhere.

    Geopolitical circumstances are a million miles from what they were in Bertie's time. Both the Kabul farce and the refugee exodus, and our involvement with both, as well as very convoluted resupply and repatriation missions to our DF personnel in remote locations, has shown up a glaring need for a narrow body, extended range aircraft with a capacity for ~100, to include options for medevac, light logistics and VIP.

    Ideally we need both that and a tactical airlifter immediately. But for this matter, the Government should immediately issue an RFQ in Europe for extended dry lease of an A320/21 or 737, wet lease if necessary. There are multiple Irish leasing companies that are suffering badly after the mess of the last two years and the opportunity for a mutually beneficial arrangement is there.

    Options to purchase can be looked at later in the context of LOA decisions to be taken in due course.

    I hate to take advantage of circumstances in a cynical way, but on days where Ryanair are ramping up prices from Poland to Ireland for people fleeing Ukraine, I think the people of this Country would absolutely support the Air Corps having the capacity to go and ferry people back who already have connections here and host families to go to.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,320 ✭✭✭Dohvolle


    It was discussed at one of those defence forums in recent years about the option of leasing an airliner type, to be used for evacuations etc. The expert advice was not worth it. Most leasing companies (with airliners) do so on the understanding it will only fly into approved airfields and airspace. In A-Stan the airspace was closed to commercial aircraft, while it may wear the military emblem, as far as the leasing company is concerned, its still a commercial aircraft, and when you return it to them, they will not be happy to tell future users that it flew in and out of unapproved airspace, and the potential damage that brought. (Ask yourself why the Ex WFP Casa 235s are sitting idle, waiting for a new owner). The insurance question is also an avenue that would cancel out any potential cash saving.

    In short leasing company want you to fly commercial airliners like commercial airliners, not strategic transport.



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