2012 seedings???

kenco · 13-10-2011 7:57pm #1

Ok on the assumption we get there (yes I hear ya..)

Im thinking the top seeds are;

Spain, Germany, Ukraine, Poland

I figure we have to then be in the last pot which should be something like;

Ireland, Croatia, Czech Repub, Portugal (???)

Some very tasty group knocking around there as as assume Pot 2 would be along the lines of;

France, Italy, England, Holland

Dont fancy us Spain, Holland and say Denmark but;

Ukraine, England, Greece might work.

I think the draw is in Dec and if we get a host then we play all the group games there??

SantryRed · 13-10-2011 7:59pm

Have to win against Estonia first

Lumbo · 13-10-2011 7:59pm

Are you for real? :rolleyes:

kenco · 13-10-2011 8:10pm

Lumbo wrote: »

Are you for real? :rolleyes:

Yes

With so much negativity around about this team and they fact that they have a very strong shout for a tournament that some commentators think they should be in let alone do some what well in I think it's worth a discussion?

dan1895 · 13-10-2011 8:16pm

kenco wrote: »

Yes

With so much negativity around about this team and they fact that they have a very strong shout for a tournament that some commentators think they should be in let alone do some what well in I think it's worth a discussion?

When/if we qualify maybe

Bukman13 · 13-10-2011 8:16pm

kenco wrote: »

Ok on the assumption we get there (yes I hear ya..)

Im thinking the top seeds are;

Spain, Germany, Ukraine, Poland

I figure we have to then be in the last pot which should be something like;

Ireland, Croatia, Czech Repub, Portugal (???)

Some very tasty group knocking around there as as assume Pot 2 would be along the lines of;

France, Italy, England, Holland

Dont fancy us Spain, Holland and say Denmark but;

Ukraine, England, Greece might work.

I think the draw is in Dec and if we get a host then we play all the group games there??

How did you come up with these?

The top seeds are Poland, Ukraine, Spain, Netherlands.

Germany, Italy and England will be in pot 2, with either Russia or Croatia joining them.

France can only be in pot 3 or 4 (if either Portugal or Croatia get through France will be in Pot 4).

v3ttel · 13-10-2011 8:18pm

How are Poland top seeds?

Blatter · 13-10-2011 8:19pm

Rooney10 wrote: »

How are Poland top seeds?

Hosts.

Lumbo · 13-10-2011 8:20pm

Rooney10 wrote: »

How are Poland top seeds?

Cause they are the hosts, same with Ukraine.

Lumbo · 13-10-2011 8:21pm

kenco wrote: »

Yes

With so much negativity around about this team and they fact that they have a very strong shout for a tournament that some commentators think they should be in let alone do some what well in I think it's worth a discussion?

Just think you're getting way a head of yourself.

kenco · 13-10-2011 8:24pm

Bukman13 wrote: »

kenco wrote: »

Ok on the assumption we get there (yes I hear ya..)

Im thinking the top seeds are;

Spain, Germany, Ukraine, Poland

I figure we have to then be in the last pot which should be something like;

Ireland, Croatia, Czech Repub, Portugal (???)

Some very tasty group knocking around there as as assume Pot 2 would be along the lines of;

France, Italy, England, Holland

Dont fancy us Spain, Holland and say Denmark but;

Ukraine, England, Greece might work.

I think the draw is in Dec and if we get a host then we play all the group games there??

How did you come up with these?

The top seeds are Poland, Ukraine, Spain, Netherlands.

Germany, Italy and England will be in pot 2, with either Russia or Croatia joining them.

France can only be in pot 3 or 4 (if either Portugal or Croatia get through France will be in Pot 4).

Purely guess work. Assumed the hosts are top seeds by default and then also assumed Spain and Germany but if Holland I bow to your knowledge? Is it world rankings at time of the draw or performance in previous tournaments??

Regardless this is an unusual tournament of its nature as there are two potentially soft top seeds and therefore for Ireland a reasonable chance (if beating Estonia, etc) of getting to the quarters (compared to a normal draw). This is important from a future seeding perspective and also for the amount of money we would get and therefore allow the FAI to waste on our behalf...

Blatter · 13-10-2011 8:25pm

Lumbo wrote: »

Just think you're getting way a head of yourself.

I think he's entitled to discuss very possible future scenarios if wants.

If you don't, maybe click out of the thread and let people who want to discuss it get on with it?

I for one am interested in who we could possibly be paired with if we qualify.

kenco · 13-10-2011 8:26pm

Lumbo wrote: »

kenco wrote: »

Yes

With so much negativity around about this team and they fact that they have a very strong shout for a tournament that some commentators think they should be in let alone do some what well in I think it's worth a discussion?

Just think you're getting way a head of yourself.

Fair enough, maybe the case but in gutter and looking at the stars an all!

kenco · 13-10-2011 8:32pm

Blatter wrote: »

Lumbo wrote: »

Just think you're getting way a head of yourself.

I think he's entitled to discuss very possible future scenarios if wants.

If you don't, maybe click out of the thread and let people who want to discuss it get on with it?

I for one am interested in who we could possibly be paired with if we qualify.

Where I am coming from here is that in '88 we got to the finals and got England, Holland and Russia and it was assumed we would lose every game. In fact we were damn unlucky not to get to the semis.

Yes a very different team then but this is a very different tournament were we could (see the caveats) get a decent draw. If we get out of the group we do ourselves huge benefit for future World and Euro draws, i.e we might be 2nd seeds not 3rd etc. '88 started a great run of qualifications and this tournament might too

Bukman13 · 13-10-2011 8:34pm

kenco wrote: »

Purely guess work. Assumed the hosts are top seeds by default and then also assumed Spain and Germany but if Holland I bow to your knowledge? Is it world rankings at time of the draw or performance in previous tournaments??

Regardless this is an unusual tournament of its nature as there are two potentially soft top seeds and therefore for Ireland a reasonable chance (if beating Estonia, etc) of getting to the quarters (compared to a normal draw). This is important from a future seeding perspective and also for the amount of money we would get and therefore allow the FAI to waste on our behalf...

Uefa Co-efficients are used for the rankings, it uses competitive games only, played over the last 3 campaigns. Only Croatia and Portugal can affect any changes.

Poland
Ukraine
Spain
Netherlands

Germany
Italy
England
Russia (Can drop into pot 3 if Croatia win both matches)

Croatia*
Greece (Locked in pot 3)
Sweden (Locked in pot 3)
Denmark (Will drop into pot 4 if Portugal qualify)

Portugal*
France (Can rise into pot 3 if both Croatia and Portugal are eliminated)
Winner or Ireland's game locked into pot 4.
Winner of Czech's game locked into pot 4.

BERBA · 13-10-2011 8:37pm

Ukraine Italy Greece Ireland would be handiest group for us

FatRat · 13-10-2011 8:38pm

Well, hopefully we're in either Poland's or Ukraine's group. I would hate to be up against Spain or Holland if we do get there.

From what I can see, we could well be 3rd seed, all depending on the other play-offs. If Bosnia-herzegovina, Turkey and Montenegro all lose their play-offs there is a possibility we will be 3rd seed (from what I can see), so long as we actually reach the tournament. I think Turkey and Bosnia will both lose. Montenegro will be the favourites against Czech Rep.

We've had such good luck so far I don't see why this couldn't happen! :cool:

kenco · 13-10-2011 8:39pm

Bukman13 wrote: »

kenco wrote: »

Purely guess work. Assumed the hosts are top seeds by default and then also assumed Spain and Germany but if Holland I bow to your knowledge? Is it world rankings at time of the draw or performance in previous tournaments??

Regardless this is an unusual tournament of its nature as there are two potentially soft top seeds and therefore for Ireland a reasonable chance (if beating Estonia, etc) of getting to the quarters (compared to a normal draw). This is important from a future seeding perspective and also for the amount of money we would get and therefore allow the FAI to waste on our behalf...

Uefa Co-efficients are used for the rankings, it uses competitive games only, played over the last 3 campaigns. Only Croatia and Portugal can affect any changes.

Poland
Ukraine
Spain
Netherlands
Germany
Italy
England
Russia (Can drop into pot 3 if Croatia win both matches)
Croatia*
Greece (Locked in pot 3)
Sweden (Locked in pot 3)
Denmark (Will drop into pot 4 if Portugal qualify)
Portugal*
France (Can rise into pot 3 if both Croatia and Portugal are eliminated)
Winner or Ireland's game locked into pot 4.
Winner of Czech's game locked into pot 4.

Thanks Bukman was not sure of the criteria but that could mean Spain, Germany and Denmark or Ukraine, England, Greece.

See what I mean about potential for nightmare Vs relatively soft group as the two hosts are top seeds?

Blatter · 13-10-2011 8:41pm

I think it's a bit ridiculous that Ukraine and Poland are automatically top seeds.

I can understand them qualifying automatically as they're hosts, but why not then seed them accordingly with the other 14 teams?

FatRat · 13-10-2011 8:42pm

Bukman13 wrote: »

Uefa Co-efficients are used for the rankings, it uses competitive games only, played over the last 3 campaigns. Only Croatia and Portugal can affect any changes.

Poland
Ukraine
Spain
Netherlands
Germany
Italy
England
Russia (Can drop into pot 3 if Croatia win both matches)
Croatia*
Greece (Locked in pot 3)
Sweden (Locked in pot 3)
Denmark (Will drop into pot 4 if Portugal qualify)
Portugal*
France (Can rise into pot 3 if both Croatia and Portugal are eliminated)
Winner or Ireland's game locked into pot 4.
Winner of Czech's game locked into pot 4.

Damn! I was looking at the current rankings and thought we might have a chance of getting into pot 3 if we qualify

kenco · 13-10-2011 8:44pm

Blatter wrote: »

I think it's a bit ridiculous that Ukraine and Poland are automatically top seeds.

I can understand them qualifying automatically as they're hosts, but why not then seed them accordingly with the other 14 teams?

Guess its down to the usual they are hosting and therefore seeded for so they play all group games at home and the crowds are big? Can't remember a tournament were there are potentially (big if) such soft top hosts. We may never get this chance again....

tolosenc · 13-10-2011 8:46pm

As it stands:

Pot 1: Poland, Ukraine, Spain, Holland
Pot 2: Germany, Italy, England, Russia
Pot 3: Croatia, Greece, Sweden, Denmark
Pot 4: Portugal, France, Ireland/Estonia, Czech Rep/Montenegro

Bolded countries are locked in.
Italicised countries will move up a pot if they qualify (relegating Russia and/or Denmark).
If the italicised countries fail to qualify, their alternates (Turkey and Bosnia) will be locked into Pot 4.
France will be in Pot 4 unless both Bosnia and Turkey qualify.

EDIT: Beaten to it...
Croatia will lose 2170 from their current total as they will play 2 more matches. Therefore, in order to overtake Russia, they must win both games, or draw one and win the other by at least 11.

Blatter · 13-10-2011 8:47pm

kenco wrote: »

Blatter wrote: »

I think it's a bit ridiculous that Ukraine and Poland are automatically top seeds.

I can understand them qualifying automatically as they're hosts, but why not then seed them accordingly with the other 14 teams?

Guess its down to the usual they are hosting and therefore seeded for so they play all group games at home and the crowds are big? Can't remember a tournament were there are potentially (big if) such soft top hosts. We may never get this chance again....

If they were seeded accordingly, ie. Pot 4, they would still be playing all their games at home?

FatRat · 13-10-2011 8:48pm

I don't know about everyone else, but I'd prefer Sweden over Greece and Italy over England. I'd also prefer Poland over Ukraine, unless Ukraine have gotten worse since I last saw them.

So.....

Poland
Italy
Sweden
Ireland

Ireland and Italy to qualify...... Wow I'm way ahead of myself, we haven't even qualified yet :pac:
But ye get what I mean. This is all theoretical.

kenco · 13-10-2011 8:55pm

Blatter wrote: »

kenco wrote: »

Blatter wrote: »

I think it's a bit ridiculous that Ukraine and Poland are automatically top seeds.

I can understand them qualifying automatically as they're hosts, but why not then seed them accordingly with the other 14 teams?

Guess its down to the usual they are hosting and therefore seeded for so they play all group games at home and the crowds are big? Can't remember a tournament were there are potentially (big if) such soft top hosts. We may never get this chance again....

If they were seeded accordingly, ie. Pot 4, they would still be playing all their games at home?

Possibly but I think it would be the first host not to be seeded.

Not sure but I reckon South Africa would have been 3rd seeds at best in the last world cup if they were not top seeds and look who got out of that group!

Bukman13 · 13-10-2011 8:59pm

tolosenc wrote: »

As it stands:

Pot 1: Poland, Ukraine, Spain, Holland
Pot 2: Germany, Italy, England, Russia
Pot 3: Croatia, Greece, Sweden, Denmark
Pot 4: Portugal, France, Ireland/Estonia, Czech Rep/Montenegro

Bolded countries are locked in.
Italicised countries will move up a pot if they qualify (relegating Russia and/or Denmark).
If the italicised countries fail to qualify, their alternates (Turkey and Bosnia) will be locked into Pot 4.
France will be in Pot 4 unless both Bosnia and Turkey qualify.

EDIT: Beaten to it...

Croatia will have to win both their games to go ahead of Russia, simply progressing wont be enough for them to get into Pot 2.

ArmaniJeanss · 13-10-2011 9:13pm

kenco wrote: »

Can't remember a tournament were there are potentially (big if) such soft top hosts.

Switzerland and Austria as co-hosts and top seeds way back in er, 2008?

kenco · 13-10-2011 9:14pm

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

kenco wrote: »

Can't remember a tournament were there are potentially (big if) such soft top hosts.

Switzerland and Austria as co-hosts and top seeds way back in er, 2008?

Good point!

Bukman13 · 13-10-2011 9:21pm

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

Switzerland and Austria as co-hosts and top seeds way back in er, 2008?

Funny thing was along with Switzerland and Austria, Greece were also top seeds as they were defending champions. And Spain only just scraped into Pot 3.

tolosenc · 13-10-2011 9:22pm

Bukman13 wrote: »

Croatia will have to win both their games to go ahead of Russia, simply progressing wont be enough for them to get into Pot 2.

See the further edit about a minute before your post.

2012 seedings???

Comments