Why do Kazakhstan play in UEFA?

ILikeBananas

I'm just looking at the world cup qualifying groups in the AFC zone and see that Uzbekistan are joint top of their group. That means that they'll likely progress to the next stage of qualifying where they'll actually have a shot of booking a place in Brazil.

In 2002 Uzbekistan's neighbours Kazakhstan switched from being members of the AFC to being members of UEFA. Prior to this they had recorded similar World Cup qualifying results to Uzbekistan. They were eliminated on goal difference in the penultimate round in 2002 and in 1998 they made the final round but came joint last in their group (with Uzbekistan).

Since they have joined UEFA their record has been as follows in the various qualification groups:

WC 2006: bottom of group with 1 point
Euro 2008: 6th in group (both Azerbaijan and Armenia played 2 games less for political reasons so they probably would have finished 7th)
WC 2010: 2nd last with 6 points (beat Andorra home and away)
Euro 2012: Currently bottom of group A with 3 points

They're currently ranked 50th out of 53 nations in UEFA

So they've gone from a team with an outside chance of qualifying from the AFC to being cannon fodder in UEFA.

So how about their club teams? Well, this is slightly better. Only slightly though. The Kazakh league is ranked 40th but if you consider that the Moldovan league is 36th and the league of Ireland is 33rd it should give you an idea of where they are at. Their club teams are usually scrapping it out in the early qualification rounds of the two UEFA club tournaments. No Kazakh team has ever reached the group stages.

So their national team hasn't benefited, their domestic league doesn't appear to be doing very well. How about Kazakh players? Has becoming a member of UEFA benefited them and enabled them to start lucrative careers abroad? The short answer is no. Of the 25 man squad that they've called up for their two games this week only two play outside their domestic league. One for a Russian team and one in the German second division.

So, I cannot see any benefit for Kazakhstan playing their football in Europe. It certainly isn't beneficial to all of the teams who have to travel to matches there. Consider this fact: Astana, the city where the national team plays their home fixtures, is closer to Beijing then it is to Rome (never mind London or Reykjavik).

Can anybody shed any light on this? Do you think Kazakhstan should return to playing in the AFC?


Originally when writing this, I was going to ask how Kazakhstan managed to join UEFA considering they are an Asian country but as it turns out they are one of the few transcontinental countries in the world (besides, as Israel and Australia have shown, you don't have to be geographically from an area to play there).

dreamers75

St Pats asked the very same question in July

basically the answer is tv money, they compete in Asian games for almost every other sport but football.

briany

There may be some financial benefit to being in UEFA like the gate receipts from potentially having some of the best teams in the world showing up in Astana for qualifying games.

I've often wondered why Israel are included in UEFA but then again if they were playing in the AFC, competing against their neighbors on a regular basis presuming their neighbors agreed to play them, well that might not end so well.

jaykay74

It helps if you read it in a Borat type voice.

ALMATY, May 11 (Reuters)(DS) - Kazakhstan is to quit the Asian Football Confederation to try to become a member of UEFA, the country's soccer authorities said on Friday.

"Our experts and fans are deeply convinced that our soccer
today needs to be part of UEFA, which in our opinion has the
most developed and progressive system of soccer in the world," the Kazakhstan Soccer Federation (KSF) said in a statement.

"The absolute majority of fans and soccer experts favours
resignation from the AFC and support membership of UEFA," the statement added. "The KSF leadership will spare no effort to achieve membership of UEFA."

A large chunk of Kazakh territory lies in Europe, and many
refer to the country as being Eurasian rather than Central
Asian. UEFA currently has 51 member associations.

OneColdHand

NOOOTTT!

_blank_

They had to leave the AFC to make room for Australia when they left Oceania.

A more pertinent question would be why do Israel play in UEFA? Every country they border plays in the AFC - Lebanon, Palestine, Jordan, Iraq, Iran, Syria.

also, why is Israel in the Eurovision?

ArmaniJeanss

I don't think the Kazakhstan FA, clubs, and people ever felt part of the Asian Zone.

After all, as part of the USSR, their top teams would have been playing in the Soviet League looking to qualify for the European Cup, UEFA Cup etc. Their players would have dreamt of playing big games against Barcelona, Juventus, Holland and Germany, not South Korea.

_blank_

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

I don't think the Kazakhstan FA, clubs, and people ever felt part of the Asian Zone.

After all, as part of the USSR, their top teams would have been playing in the Soviet League looking to qualify for the European Cup, UEFA Cup etc. Their players would have dreamt of playing big games against Barcelona, Juventus, Holland and Germany, not South Korea.

Ridiculous

For one thing, more than one former Soviet state play in the AFC at the moment.

Uzbekistan
Turkmenistan
Tajikstan

For another, the USSR broke up in the early 90s, how many players are still around who would have "dreamed" of playing against Barcelona?

ArmaniJeanss

Des wrote: »

They had to leave the AFC to make room for Australia when they left Oceania.

A more pertinent question would be why do Israel play in UEFA? Every country they border plays in the AFC - Lebanon, Palestine, Jordan, Iraq, Iran, Syria.

also, why is Israel in the Eurovision?

Eurovision is the name of a company, its nothing to do with Europe.

Huge safety and political issues if Israel play in the AFC, there were boycotts etc in the 60s when Israel got a walkover when no-one was willing to play in a country they didn't recognise etc.

Whether you're pro or anti Israel it should be clear it an issues thats best served by making it a non-issue and having them play elsewhere, believe it or not they played in Oceania qualifying at one stage.

ArmaniJeanss

Des wrote: »

Ridiculous

For one thing, more than one former Soviet state play in the AFC at the moment.

Uzbekistan
Turkmenistan
Tajikstan

For another, the USSR broke up in the early 90s, how many players are still around who would have "dreamed" of playing against Barcelona?

Not sure whats the relevance of naming 3 other countries - if those 3 are happy to play in the AFC then good luck to them. All independent countries and they don't have to vote in some bloc and all agree to do the same thing.

Personally I think UEFA would/should have accepted any of the Soviet States who wanted to play in UEFA, if Kazakstan of the Eastern ones was the only one then fair enough.

jaykay74

Des wrote: »

Ridiculous

Story on the left of the link below. Thank you google

Football competition grew up in Kazakhstan in the European tradition.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1309&dat=20010614&id=lSwhAAAAIBAJ&sjid=j3gFAAAAIBAJ&pg=6337,2191242

Luis21

Why do Israel ?

citytillidie

Luis21 wrote: »

Why do Israel ?

They were expelled from the AFC in the 70's as lots of Asian Countries refused to play Israel

Fight_Night

Israel are in the European Broadcasting Area which is why they're in the Eurovision.

Kazakhstan is huge and a relatively large(for our standards) plot of land is west of the Ural Mountains and technically in Europe. That holds for a few countries too but they play in the AFC. Not sure why they play in Europe but seeing as they technically can have a claim I don't see the problem.

Horrible country though. People are nice but shocking human rights abuses.

briany

It begs the question : If Israel can and Kazakhstan can, what other countries can? What about Greenland? Not currently an affiliated team anywhere but hey, if the Faroes can then why not? If Australia can compete in the AFC, a continent which they can not really claim to be a part of although geo-politically the lines between Oceania and Asia are blurry, then why not a North African team like Algeria in UEFA?

dsmythy

briany wrote: »

It begs the question : If Israel can and Kazakhstan can, what other countries can? What about Greenland? Not currently an affiliated team anywhere but hey, if the Faroes can then why not? If Australia can compete in the AFC, a continent which they can not really claim to be a part of although geo-politically the lines between Oceania and Asia are blurry, then why not a North African team like Algeria in UEFA?

Have they applied? They would likely be rejected.

UglyBolloxFace

The answer is politics.

From The Guardian:

"How did it transpire that Kazakhstan falls under Uefa's jurisdiction while Uzbekistan, their neighbour to the south, play in the Asian department?" wonders Mikael Colville-Andersen.

This goes back to 2002, Mikael, when Kazakhstan became the 52nd member association of Uefa. Despite its location in the heart of Asia (bordering China, Kyrgyzstan, Turkmenistan, Russia and, of course, Uzbekistan), the Kazakhs were keen to leave the Asian Football Confederation (AFC) behind. It could well have had something to do with their failure to qualify for the 2002 World Cup, when they had finished their qualifying group unbeaten, and with an identical record to Iraq, who eventually progressed. But, officially at least, their addition was seen as a return to the fold, having formerly been a part of the Uefa-affiliated USSR.

"They had resigned from the AFC and in that sense were homeless," explained Mike Lee, former Uefa communications director, at the time. "They believe that they're more naturally European, they want to be more European-turning in their outlook as a nation and as an economy. If a country has a historical and territorial base that is relevant it has a right to pursue that." Kazakhstan FA president Rakhat Aliyev added: "Practically speaking, it means more contacts with Europe and more investment projects. It will also lead to a better future for players and especially young people in the country. It will lead to a higher professional level."

For the time being, however, their switch to Europe hasn't proved so lucrative; in qualifying for the 2006 World Cup, Kazakhstan finished bottom of Group Two with a solitary point from 12 games.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2005/nov/02/theknowledge.sport

And the reason Israel is in UEFA is because just about all of their neighbours, and thus their competitors if they were part of that football union, are hostile toward them. It would be too much of a security risk for the Israeli team and fans to travel to these countries. And also throw in the fact that the other nations would refuse to compete against Israel as they do not recognise them.

_blank_

UglyBolloxFace wrote: »

And also throw in the fact that the other nations would refuse to compete against Israel as they do not recognise them.

This falls down easily.

Would these nations refuse to play Israel if one of them qualified via the AFC for a World Cup, and Israel qualified via UEFA?

Would they fúck.

dfx-

dreamers75 wrote: »

St Pats asked the very same question in July

In fairness, Pats have to be put somewhere if they insist on qualifying..

dsmythy

The Kazakhs finish their campaign with a draw at home against Austria. might as well add that in there

pablomakaveli

Des wrote: »

This falls down easily.

Would these nations refuse to play Israel if one of them qualified via the AFC for a World Cup, and Israel qualified via UEFA?

Would they fúck.

If it was a World Cup the match would at least be in a neutral venue. It's a different story with the qualifiers though where they could be faced with visits to the likes of Iran and Saudi Arabia.

The Israeli team mightnt even be allowed into these countries and they could be at serious risk of being attacked if they were.

And to be fair if Turkey and Cyprus are allowed into UEFA then theres no real reason to deny the Israelis either.

starbelgrade

Kazakhstan are No.2 team in Kazakhstan.

delta_bravo

Des wrote: »

This falls down easily.

Would these nations refuse to play Israel if one of them qualified via the AFC for a World Cup, and Israel qualified via UEFA?

Would they fúck.

Several Asian states refuse admission to a person with an Israeli stamp on their passport.

Also in turn I doubt the Israelis would be keen on 100s of Iranian or Egyptians coming into their country for a game.

Its not too dissimilar with the situation with Derry City.

davocesque

Its not too dissimilar with the situation with Derry City.[/QUOTE]

I like your comment on Derry, i was wondering when they would be mentioned.

i actually think Derry is a more interesting case then Kazak and Isreal, obviously partly because its closer to home, but also the story is less obvious.

Dub13

UEFA currently has 51 member associations.

This is the biggest joke.From the next Euros 24 teams will qualify for the finals,thats just under half the teams in Uefa.What a joke.Its getting as bad as the 'rugby world cup'.

busyliving

Des wrote: »

A more pertinent question would be why do Israel play in UEFA? Every country they border plays in the AFC - Lebanon, Palestine, Jordan, Iraq, Iran, Syria.

also, why is Israel in the Eurovision?

Because any visiting Arab national side could be targeted and the same can be said of Israeli national side in Arab states...

markesmith

Dub13 wrote: »

This is the biggest joke.From the next Euros 24 teams will qualify for the finals,thats just under half the teams in Uefa.What a joke.Its getting as bad as the 'rugby world cup'.

Well, that's a good thing for Ireland, and to be fair I like the big groups thing, more matches. By God if we qualify, I'm going over there. Hoping we get stationed in Krakow!

My 1,000th post