Question on tender process

hammondkeys

Hi,

Wondering if anyone could help me out on this. I just bought a semi detached on the northside of Dublin and it needs some work, rewiring, dry lining, bit of plastering etc. From a construction point of view nothing too major. I just want a builder to look after all issues, sort out the electrician, plasterer, do any building work that needs doing etc.

As I’ve never bought second hand before or put something out to tender my question is do i just make a list of the stuff I want done, contact a few builders, bring them to see the house and wait for an itemised price list if they are interested in doing the job? Even though I am not doing any extensions would I still need proper house plans drawn up before I contact any builder? If yes then would it have to be an archetict who would draw them?

Any responses greatly appreciated.

BryanF

Did you get a rough layout drawing of the house off the auctioneer? that might do as a drawing in this case, then all you will need is the list of works you require and a bit of specification to give clear parameters of what is expected to allow for fair pricing (ie everybody qouting for the same work).
maybe you should have a chat with a good arch/ arch tech, for instance, as retro-fitting has taken off in Ireland there is now an appreciation that dry-lining may not be the best solution..

hammondkeys

BryanF wrote: »

Did you get a rough layout drawing of the house off the auctioneer? that might do as a drawing in this case, then all you will need is the list of works you require and a bit of specification to give clear parameters of what is expected to allow for fair pricing (ie everybody qouting for the same work).
maybe you should have a chat with a good arch/ arch tech, for instance, as retro-fitting has taken off in Ireland there is now an appreciation that dry-lining may not be the best solution..

Cheers for the prompt reply. Yeah i spoke withe auctioneer and they have none (1930's house) and don't think solicitor received any with the contract either. Looks like a new set will have to be drawn up....more money!

Just wondering what other option you were hinting at apart from dry lining? External and cavity wall won't work on this house.

BryanF

hammondkeys wrote: »

Cheers for the prompt reply. Yeah i spoke withe auctioneer and they have none (1930's house) and don't think solicitor received any with the contract either. Looks like a new set will have to be drawn up....more money!

not necessarily.. get an arch tech out for an hour telling them you want a brief spec done and some help selecting the preferred tender.

hammondkeys wrote: »

Just wondering what other option you were hinting at apart from dry lining? External and cavity wall won't work on this house.

ok,the EWI wont work because of the external features or space issues? the issues with dry-lining is that

• your losing floor area,
• your disrupting every room in the house,
• your not (in many cases) solving thermal bridging
• or adding adequate insulation because if you insulate too much you run the risk of condensation forming in the wall structure.
• and by dry-lining you also losing the structures thermal mass

SureHome.ie

Very few people get architects involved for non structural internal work like you mentioned.The most common way is to make up a list yourself of what you want done in each room and then invite out any builders you want a quote from.

DOCARCH

SureHome.ie wrote: »

Very few people get architects involved for non structural internal work like you mentioned.

.....and that's why lots of people come on here having problems with their builders!

FWIW, I am of the belief that you can more easily eliminate cold bridges with internal insulation than with external insulation (EWI), especially at eaves, etc. One to watch with EWI - 1930's houses sometime have concrete eaves, which are virtually impossible to deal with in terms of cold bridging/making connection with your roof insulation.

If considering internal insulation, carefully consider the construction of the existing in conjunction with the proposed insulation material and the risk of condensation/mould within the construction.

carz

DOCARCH wrote: »

.....and that's why lots of people come on here having problems with their builders!

FWIW, I am of the belief that you can more easily eliminate cold bridges with internal insulation than with external insulation (EWI), especially at eaves, etc. One to watch with EWI - 1930's houses sometime have concrete eaves, which are virtually impossible to deal with in terms of cold bridging/making connection with your roof insulation.

If considering internal insulation, carefully consider the construction of the existing in conjunction with the proposed insulation material and the risk of condensation/mould within the construction.

You are better off getting some professional advice to what materials would be best, drylining only sometimes is the best idea, and there are different types of lining.
Some builders will do what u ask them to even if they know that its not the best solution, but their attitude can be "your the boss", and just do as you ask.
An engineer would point you in the right direction, give you good advice and in the long run probably save you money.

sydthebeat

DOCARCH wrote: »

FWIW, I am of the belief that you can more easily eliminate cold bridges with internal insulation than with external insulation (EWI), especially at eaves, etc. .

maybe in some specific areas, but in the vast majority of cases EWI is clearly better at closing thermal bridges than IWI

sinnerboy

DOCARCH wrote: »

FWIW, I am of the belief that you can more easily eliminate cold bridges with internal insulation than with external insulation (EWI), especially at eaves, etc.

No , the opposite is the case . Upper floors and internal partitions fixed to the external wall always interrupt the insulation layer

DOCARCH

sinnerboy wrote: »

No , the opposite is the case . Upper floors and internal partitions fixed to the external wall always interrupt the insulation layer

Really what I meant to say was 'in certain cases'.

I specified/detailed the thermal upgarde of two different 1930's bungalows, with concrete eaves and with a portion of the existing internal ceilings sloping (approx. 600mm in) all round, following the line of the roof.

In those cases, internal wall insulation/dry-lining was really the only option to complete the insultion throughout the house (in addiation we insulated floors and roofspaces).

In addition, where existing internal walls abutted the external walls, we thermally isolated the internal walls from the external walls by cutting the walls and installing 50mm of insulation at the junction (with engineer approved detail).

BryanF

DOCARCH wrote: »

Really what I meant to say was 'in certain cases'.

I specified/detailed the thermal upgarde of two different 1930's bungalows, with concrete eaves and with a portion of the existing internal ceilings sloping (approx. 600mm in) all round, following the line of the roof.

In those cases, internal wall insulation/dry-lining was really the only option to complete the insultion throughout the house (in addiation we insulated floors and roofspaces).

In addition, where existing internal walls abutted the external walls, we thermally isolated the internal walls from the external walls by cutting the walls and installing 50mm of insulation at the junction (with engineer approved detail).

Hi Doc
did ye consider just knocking out the conc soffits? and that cost + ewi V all the internal work?

DOCARCH

BryanF wrote: »

Hi Doc
did ye consider just knocking out the conc soffits? and that cost + ewi V all the internal work?

Not really! Both houses were being re-plumbed and re-wired anyway, so I suppose if that was not happening, I would have considered.

One other consideration is that when you apply EWI, if the soffits/eaves are not deep in the frist place, they become really 'stumpy' after installation. That's an aesthetic issue (rather than technical).

focus_mad

For the issues you have a Building Surveyor would be your best bet (IMO).

They can draw up your and compile a schedule of work which then would be sent to a number of contractors (3/4) and then can assist you in the comparision of the tenders so you are getting the best value for money as cheaper is not always better.

scwazrh

DOCARCH wrote: »

.....and that's why lots of people come on here having problems with their builders!

surprise surprise your an architect!! Obviously you would think an architect is needed ,

And thelast poster says a surveyor is needed! Guess what his profession is :rolleyes:

muffler

scwazrh wrote: »

surprise surprise your an architect!! Obviously you would think an architect is needed ,

And thelast poster says a surveyor is needed! Guess what his profession is :rolleyes:

Your point is?

focus_mad

scwazrh wrote: »

surprise surprise your an architect!! Obviously you would think an architect is needed ,

And thelast poster says a surveyor is needed! Guess what his profession is :rolleyes:

If a certain person actually read me post i declared my post to be IMO (In my opinion).
I was giving my opinion in an attempt to aid the OP.

Also no need to guess my friend, I am indeed a Building Surveyor.

And last but not least, do you have any positive output or merely to have a go at posters? :rolleyes:

DOCARCH

scwazrh wrote: »

surprise surprise your an architect!! Obviously you would think an architect is needed..

Well why wouldn't I?

I have been in practice 15 years and have worked on small to medium sized projects and have yet to come across any builder who has had a comprehensive understanding of the building regulations. Most even have less understanding about things like thermal bridging.