A week of nearly getting milled out of it (MOD WARNING #127)

doc1976

Been almost milled out of it a few times this week. What the hell is goin on?

I'm pretty well lit up coming home in the evenings, do I need to dress up as a lightbulb???

The good old Gardai had a go at knocking me down to, they were driving in a double cycle lane with an empty road beside them. BTW no sirens going so I don't think there was an emergency.

DOC

CianRyan

Lights, reflective jacket and presume everyone wants to kill you.

christeb

I've got disc brakes and cycle with hands constantly over the levers in heavy traffic. I'm quite a defensive aggressive cyclist, I think you gotta be.

Maybe it's; the change in weather, schools back etc but other motorists have been slightly crazier this week. Be careful out there

tomasrojo

I mentioned this already today, but I find these make a big difference.




Home-made, adapted from an obsolete make of iPod shuffle wrist bands.

It's not that they make you more visible the way fixed lights would. It's that you can suddenly become more visible by moving your hand (vigorously, if you have to). You can also angle the light to make you as visible as possible. For example, if you're merging with another road (say, turning right up to Parnell Square from Parnell Street), you can point the light towards the traffic to your left and make yourself suddenly very conspicuous. When you're stopped at lights, you can rest a hand so it is turned towards approaching traffic for a bit of extra visibility. There are quite a few other situations where they come in handy.

Surveyor11

2 taxi drivers, 2 consecutive days, almost killed me. First pulled out of Blackhorse Ave at the Ashtown exit of the Phoenix Park on Thurs evening, I mean right in front of me - and the kn*b proceed to block up alll the traffic to gt into the traffic queue to the Nav Road - god knows what this'll be like when the road works kick off. Another this evening at the filling station at Castleknock, coming towards me and suddendly veers accross my path to do a 3 point turn. Ah don't mind me, only a cyclist. Only for I stopped really quick he would have t-boned me, closest call I've been in ages to coming a cropper. And I'm lit up with a cateye strobe at the front. A**holes.:mad:

Beasty

Or there's this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IiBtVFoqP-I

Available at BeeSeenOnABike

tomasrojo

Beasty wrote: »

Or there's this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IiBtVFoqP-I

Available at BeeSeenOnABike

Funnily enough, a friend of mine bought one of them to emulate my home-made wrist lights. They didn't work out too well. They weren't nearly as conspicuous, they were heavier and the solar panel never seemed to recharge the light. That is, if that is the light he bought, but it looks like it.

There were Australian ones, which looked ok, but they must have gone out of business because the Safe Turn website seems to be a porn site now.

They're still on Amazon though:

http://www.amazon.com/Safe-Turn-Portable-Bicycle-Indicator/dp/B0015MIEX2
(Mixed reviews)

Maybe BBB or Cateye should look into making wrist mounts for their products. That's all I've done. I do get asked by other cyclists where I bought them, so there's modest demand for them (probably).

Stollaire

I heard this morning that a cyclist was knocked down at the junction of the N11 and Foster's Avenue in Mount Merrion.
The collision may have happened with a 4x4 jeep

doc1976

Two days out cycling to work and two near misses!!!

One guy was driving up the wrong side of the road towards me, the d**k had the balls to start gesticulating towards me!!!

On a side note it would be interesting to film a month in the life of a cyclist in Dublin. Where would one get a camera that could fit on your helmet??

DOC

Rew

doc1976 wrote: »

Two days out cycling to work and two near misses!!!

One guy was driving up the wrong side of the road towards me, the d**k had the balls to start gesticulating towards me!!!

On a side note it would be interesting to film a month in the life of a cyclist in Dublin. Where would one get a camera that could fit on your helmet??

DOC

Either:
http://gopro.com/

or:
http://contour.com/

Neither are great at night, both are/should be available in Dublin shops (cons cameras, and Great Outdoors have GoPro's)

SerialComplaint

doc1976 wrote: »

On a side note it would be interesting to film a month in the life of a cyclist in Dublin.

99% of it would be dead boring. Here's the highlights of my past few weeks;

http://www.youtube.com/user/CycleDub

doc1976 wrote: »

Where would one get a camera that could fit on your helmet??

You can get fairly cheap helmet cams easily enough;

http://www.7dayshop.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=777_8&products_id=110950

canhascheez

SerialComplaint wrote: »

99% of it would be dead boring. Here's the highlights of my past few weeks;

http://www.youtube.com/user/CycleDub

Are you serious? I cycle daily, drivers don't own the road... neither do I. Give and take.

I can't imagine being so up tight that I would film my daily commute and take it upon myself to enforce the rules of the road for all.

Edit: http://www.youtube.com/user/CycleDub#p/u/7/vlo8kyr0DUI you didn't come to a complete stop at the stop sign

SerialComplaint

canhascheez wrote: »

Edit: http://www.youtube.com/user/CycleDub#p/u/7/vlo8kyr0DUI you didn't come to a complete stop at the stop sign

Actually, there are two stop signs in that clip that I didn't come to a complete stop for. I do use my eyes and ears to check for traffic as I go through these junctions.

canhascheez wrote: »

Are you serious? I cycle daily, drivers don't own the road... neither do I. Give and take.

I don't own the road, but I am assertive about taking the space I need. If a driver cuts me up, or stops in traffic right up to the gutter leaving no room for filtering, I'll let them know. Generally, this is done in a warm, friendly manner. Generally, it gets a warm friendly reaction (though it does occasionally result in threats of violence etc).

canhascheez wrote: »

I can't imagine being so up tight that I would film my daily commute and take it upon myself to enforce the rules of the road for all.

It's a bit mad all right, but there is a whole community of helmetcaming commuting cyclists on Youtube, from foul-mouthed Magnatom in Glasgow to confrontational Taypet in Bristol to the TheVexatiousLitigant in NZ. It's really no more or less mad than many web communities.

mp31

SerialComplaint wrote: »

99% of it would be dead boring. Here's the highlights of my past few weeks;

http://www.youtube.com/user/CycleDub




You can get fairly cheap helmet cams easily enough;

http://www.7dayshop.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=777_8&products_id=110950

Is this the camera you used for your YouTube vids or did you use something else?

SerialComplaint

mp31 wrote: »

Is this the camera you used for your YouTube vids or did you use something else?

It was an earlier model from that same supplier - similar spec and cost, but mine is probably a bit bulkier by the looks of it.

bad2dabone

i'd like to get a camera but I think if the mrs saw how many near incidents happen on my commute she'd flip out and have me back on the Bus to work. And i'm not going back!

tomasrojo

bad2dabone wrote: »

i'd like to get a camera but I think if the mrs saw how many near incidents happen on my commute she'd flip out and have me back on the Bus to work. And i'm not going back!

Perhaps reconsider your route? I don't think anyone should be having frequent near misses, although occasional ones are inevitable.

bad2dabone

Ah its probably only once a twice a week on my commute, I just tend to remember the incidents for ages and try to anticipate the same thing happening again. Folks pulling out in front of you, taxis and busses squeezing you while in the bus lane etc. Once I get out of the city centre its usually fine.

BostonB

Surveyor11 wrote: »

2 taxi drivers, 2 consecutive days, almost killed me. First pulled out of Blackhorse Ave at the Ashtown exit of the Phoenix Park on Thurs evening, I mean right in front of me - and the kn*b proceed to block up alll the traffic to gt into the traffic queue to the Nav Road - god knows what this'll be like when the road works kick off. Another this evening at the filling station at Castleknock, coming towards me and suddendly veers accross my path to do a 3 point turn. Ah don't mind me, only a cyclist. Only for I stopped really quick he would have t-boned me, closest call I've been in ages to coming a cropper. And I'm lit up with a cateye strobe at the front. A**holes.:mad:

Perhaps you could go a different way. That Ashtown exit is dangerous in a car never mind a bike.

If you're having a lot of grief on a route sometime, going a different way even if its a few minutes longer, makes more sense.

blorg

Presume drivers will do something stupid and don't cycle with any sense of entitlement. And relax. Things will go a lot smoother I guarantee (I have been cycling the last year in an environment infinitely more noxious than Dublin.)

tomasrojo

BostonB wrote: »

Perhaps you could go a different way. That Ashtown exit is dangerous in a car never mind a bike.

If you're having a lot of grief on a route sometime, going a different way even if its a few minutes longer, makes more sense.

Largely cutting the North Circular Road out of my commutes resulted in a much happier time for me.

alie

SerialComplaint wrote: »

mp31 wrote: »

Is this the camera you used for your YouTube vids or did you use something else?

It was an earlier model from that same supplier - similar spec and cost, but mine is probably a bit bulkier by the looks of it.

I cycle every day and I find the worst offenders are taxi drivers and pedestrians. I always cycle with my hands on the brakes.

BostonB

For me it would depend which way I go. some routes are worse than others for hazards. Also the time your travelling. Sometimes, leaving 30 mins later or earlier means you miss most of the pedestrians.

alie

BostonB wrote: »

For me it would depend which way I go. some routes are worse than others for hazards. Also the time your travelling. Sometimes, leaving 30 mins later or earlier means you miss most of the pedestrians.

I work in community care so am going from house to house at set times so can't leave early.

Surveyor11

tomasrojo wrote: »

Largely cutting the North Circular Road out of my commutes resulted in a much happier time for me.

Agree, for some strange reason, I go in to work through the Park, and out the North Circular on the way home. Going through the park is a lot less stressful, now just got pedestrians in the cycle lane to contend with.:rolleyes:

SerialComplaint

tomasrojo wrote: »

Perhaps reconsider your route? I don't think anyone should be having frequent near misses, although occasional ones are inevitable.

I've changed my route to avoid the twice-crossing of the green Luas line that I used to be part of my routine, following this incident. I know the family involved.

SerialComplaint

Here's a great reason for cyclists to wear cameras;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qycF0raqpg

Chips Lovell

SerialComplaint wrote: »

99% of it would be dead boring. Here's the highlights of my past few weeks;

http://www.youtube.com/user/CycleDub

You're shouting at people over that? Seriously?

SerialComplaint

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

You're shouting at people over that? Seriously?

Assuming that you're referring to the recent 'mooching' video, then yes - when a car is driving into my path, showing no sign of stopping and the driver hasn't seen me - I start shouting. What do you do?

Chips Lovell

SerialComplaint wrote: »

Assuming that you're referring to the recent 'mooching' video, then yes - when a car is driving into my path, showing no sign of stopping and the driver hasn't seen me - I start shouting. What do you do?

Nothing.

That car was barely moving and posed no threat. I don't think you're doing yourself any favours behaving like that.

ROK ON

SerialComplaint wrote: »

Assuming that you're referring to the recent 'mooching' video, then yes - when a car is driving into my path, showing no sign of stopping and the driver hasn't seen me - I start shouting. What do you do?

I am not sure what to make of the videos. On the mooching video, it seemed that the car was already in your path as opposed to moving into your path (which is dangerous).

If I felt the need to wear a camera to record incidents while cycling, then I wouldnt bother cycling - but that's just me.

I think there is a fine line between being prepared for encounters with people who cannot use the road and sort of hoping that when you meet one you record it. Again, just not sure what to make of it.
BTW, I am not having a go at you as I am a bit of a shouter on a bike also and from your videos you seem pretty mild compared to me.
Just that everytime I see these cycling cam videos, I wonder why bother.

SerialComplaint

ROK ON wrote: »

I am not sure what to make of the videos. On the mooching video, it seemed that the car was already in your path as opposed to moving into your path (which is dangerous).

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

Nothing.

That car was barely moving and posed no threat. I don't think you're doing yourself any favours behaving like that.

You're right - it was barely moving. You're wrong if you think that poses no threat. The reason it was barely moving was because of the line of traffic in front of it. If a gap appears in front of them, they'll be out of there like a hot snot, regardless of where I am or what I do.

What I'm hoping is that if I make a bit of a fuss, then when they drive through that same junction tomorrow, they just might look to their right to check for cyclists before moving out.

ROK ON wrote: »

If I felt the need to wear a camera to record incidents while cycling, then I wouldnt bother cycling - but that's just me.

I think there is a fine line between being prepared for encounters with people who cannot use the road and sort of hoping that when you meet one you record it. Again, just not sure what to make of it.
BTW, I am not having a go at you as I am a bit of a shouter on a bike also and from your videos you seem pretty mild compared to me.
Just that everytime I see these cycling cam videos, I wonder why bother.

I'm sure this is stating the obvious, but I'm not suggesting that cycling cams are compulsory, or that viewing my Youtube channel is compulsory. If it's not your thing, don't feel obliged to watch.

I find it interesting to get some discussion going about some of these incidents. It helps me improve my cycling, and maybe it might even contribute in some small way to an overall discussion about safe cycling.

moomooman

I think filiming is a good idea. I did it myself for a while for my own amusement, mounted a Kodak Playsport on the handlebars.

Caught a couple of dodgy moments but it was really my response to an earlier incident where I was leisurely cycling home from work, in a bike lane, wearing a high vis, a van slowly crept up alongside me and then just pulled in on top of me, handlebars hit the van, instinctively put a hand up against it as he continued running me up against a high kerb, he didnt stop moving in until I started screaming and banged on the side of the van as I was losing my balance. Whole incident probably took 2-3 seconds but it scared the crap out of me.

Guy then came after me screaming threats & abuse, until I pointed out that he ran me off the road and I was in the bike lane, that seemed to shut him up, I think he just hadnt seen me and got a fright (as I did).

Funtimes :rolleyes:

Edit: I've had that exact same mooching thing happen by a white van man, looking off to his left waiting to pull out, no where for him to go but he just decides to roll forward and block the bike lane as I passed in front from his right. Ended up on the front bonnet banging and screaming, didnt linger though, dont want me head kicked in

BostonB

ROK ON wrote: »

I am not sure what to make of the videos. On the mooching video, it seemed that the car was already in your path as opposed to moving into your path (which is dangerous). ...

Maybe its hard to see but as the cyclist approaches the car rolls forward. They had no awareness of the cyclist. Not that big a deal but its a good example for drivers to check right when filtering.

Chips Lovell

SerialComplaint wrote: »

You're right - it was barely moving. You're wrong if you think that poses no threat. The reason it was barely moving was because of the line of traffic in front of it. If a gap appears in front of them, they'll be out of there like a hot snot, regardless of where I am or what I do.

If a gap opened up. But you could see the line of traffic yourself and it wasn't moving. Essentially you roared at that motorist over a hypothetical. If you're going to go around doing that I'd say most people will treat you like a crank and not reflect on their behaviour.

ROK ON

For me they are rather like CCTV footage that you see on crimecall. They dont prevent an accident, they dont cause an accident. If you unlucky enough to be in an accident then they maybe of some use.

But to be honest, I am not sure what type of person carries one and then goes home and looks at it. It strikes me as odd - as if you expect bad stuff to happen.
As a cyclist and a driver I notice bad road behaviour regularly. It could be dangerous, but more often than not it isnt. If I installed a camera to my car or bike, I would have very little time to do anything else.
Again, I just dont see the point.

Lumen

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CORFpujaNOI

W.T.F. ?

Raam

Lumen wrote: »

W.T.F. ?

He's an urban cycling hero.

HivemindXX

ROK ON wrote: »

For me they are rather like CCTV footage that you see on crimecall. They dont prevent an accident, they dont cause an accident. If you unlucky enough to be in an accident then they maybe of some use.

But to be honest, I am not sure what type of person carries one and then goes home and looks at it. It strikes me as odd - as if you expect bad stuff to happen.
As a cyclist and a driver I notice bad road behaviour regularly. It could be dangerous, but more often than not it isnt. If I installed a camera to my car or bike, I would have very little time to do anything else.
Again, I just dont see the point.

You stated the point in your first paragraph. If you are in a serious incident it's nice to have video footage. I was deliberately run off the road by a bus, my word against his, no action against the driver. I saw a cyclist in front of me get taken out by a car who pulled in across him, that motorist claimed the cyclist was equally at fault and without me as a witness the victim would have no evidence the motorist had done anything wrong.

Unfortunately there's a 'loophole' in our legal system where a person can get out of their just penalty by lying their ass off about what happened. I don't record my cycling but in my incident with the bus I certainly wish I had video to back me up.

For the record, while it's hard to tell exactly how bad something is from a video like that, I think SerialComplaint over reacted. However if video evidence can help convict one dangerous driver who seriously injures or kills a cyclist and then tries to claim it was "single witness suicide swerve" then I'm happy to have 1000s of youtube videos making mountains out of molehills that I will continue to ignore.

monkeybutter

SerialComplaint wrote: »

99% of it would be dead boring. Here's the highlights of my past few weeks;

http://www.youtube.com/user/CycleDub




You can get fairly cheap helmet cams easily enough;

http://www.7dayshop.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=777_8&products_id=110950

Some shocking bad cycling out of you there mate, clearly you should have stopped to let the pedestrian go. You should always give way to pedestrians.

Lusk Doyle

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

Nothing.

That car was barely moving and posed no threat. I don't think you're doing yourself any favours behaving like that.

God - that reminds me of something that happened to me the other day. I was walking past a person who was sitting down. If they had stood up I would have been forced to take extreme evasive action or be faced the likelihood of me walking into them/them walking into me. It was a close call really...imagine the carnage if that had happened :eek:

I should have shouted at them to let them know I was approaching and to not stand up in my way.

Edit: There were people coming towards me from the opposite direction so it could have been complete mayhem. Lucky escape for all (potentially) involved IMHO.

SerialComplaint

monkeybutter wrote: »

Some shocking bad cycling out of you there mate, clearly you should have stopped to let the pedestrian go. You should always give way to pedestrians.

Here's what the ROTR says for drivers;

http://www.rotr.ie/rules-for-driving/junctions-roundabouts/junctions.html

Vehicles do not have an automatic right of way on the road. The overriding rule is, in all circumstances, proceed with caution.

You must always yield to:

pedestrians already crossing at a junction,
pedestrians on a zebra crossing,
pedestrians on a pelican crossing when the amber light is flashing, and
pedestrians and traffic when you are moving off from a stationary position (for example from your position at a stop sign or a parking space).
To avoid doubt and in the interest of road safety a vehicle should always yield to pedestrians.

And here's what it says for cyclists
http://www.rotr.ie/rules-for-pedestrians-cyclists-motorcyclists/cyclists/cyclists_cycling-safely.html

When turning left, keep close to the left-hand side of the road and watch out for pedestrians.

And here's what it says for pedestrians;

http://www.rotr.ie/rules-for-pedestrians-cyclists-motorcyclists/pedestrians/pedestrians_crossing-the-road.html

Do look for a safe place to cross.
Do stop and wait near the edge of the path. If there is no path, stand close to the edge of the road.
Do look right and left and listen for traffic.
Do let any traffic coming in either direction pass, then look right and left again.
Do walk briskly straight across the road when it is clear.
Do continue to watch and listen for traffic while crossing.

I'm not going to run down a pedestrian, as much for my own safety as for his safety. In a situation like this, I'm going to be covering my brakes or braking if required, and looking for escape routes if something goes wrong.

I'm also going to be assertive enough to stop a pedestrian from walking into the road without seeing me.

ROK ON wrote: »

As a cyclist and a driver I notice bad road behaviour regularly. It could be dangerous, but more often than not it isnt. If I installed a camera to my car or bike, I would have very little time to do anything else.

If I tried to show every red-light-jumping driver or cyclist, or every jaywalking pedestrian, or every speeding or mobile phone using driver, I'd certainly have very little time to do anything else. It really is just the highlights.

ROK ON wrote: »

But to be honest, I am not sure what type of person carries one and then goes home and looks at it. It strikes me as odd - as if you expect bad stuff to happen....
Again, I just dont see the point.

Can't really argue with the 'odd' bit - but is it any more or less odd than posting hundreds of posts to the cycling forum, or to politics.ie or rollercoaster.ie or [pick your own poison]

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

If a gap opened up. But you could see the line of traffic yourself and it wasn't moving. Essentially you roared at that motorist over a hypothetical. If you're going to go around doing that I'd say most people will treat you like a crank and not reflect on their behaviour.

Look closely. The blue BMW HAS moved forward and IS creating a gap, which is where the moocher is headed. This isn't a hypothetical. It is an accident waiting to happen. And if you like to look at today's vid from that junction, it pretty much happened again;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qnfaNs22gq0

tomasrojo

When turning left, keep close to the left-hand side of the road and watch out for pedestrians.

Watch out for pedestrians: good advice.
Keep close to the left-hand side of the road: poor advice. You should take primary position at any turn.

galwaycyclist

Lumen wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CORFpujaNOI

W.T.F. ?

First impression is that the guy on the bike is the one in the wrong on this occasion and the person in the volvo is positioned as taught for a left hand turn.

BostonB

If it were me I'd have stopped behind the volvo, and put myself right bang in front of the car behind.

galwaycyclist

SerialComplaint wrote: »

Here's what the ROTR says for drivers;

<snip>

Can't really argue with the 'odd' bit - but is it any more or less odd than posting hundred
Look closely. The blue BMW HAS moved forward and IS creating a gap, which is where the moocher is headed. This isn't a hypothetical. It is an accident waiting to happen. And if you like to look at today's vid from that junction, it pretty much happened again;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qnfaNs22gq0

If you look at the end of this video clip the cyclist looks to be trying to squeeze himself up on the left of a very clearly moving car. At a location where the road is both narrowing and going into an outside bend. Unless the black car was signalling a right turn, the phrase "accident waiting to happen" seems appropriate.

BostonB

Bit iffy not stopping at the yield in this one...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i4JLBhWgsgU&feature=related

galwaycyclist

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUzKG0z6Egc

In this one the pedestrian very clearly has right of way over turning traffic it is difficult to see how the behaviour of the person on the bicycle is in any way defensible.

SerialComplaint

I see we had an outbreak of pedantism on the forum last night.

galwaycyclist wrote: »

First impression is that the guy on the bike is the one in the wrong on this occasion and the person in the volvo is positioned as taught for a left hand turn.

'Positioned as taught' by who? The ROTR instructions for a right-hand turn are "take up a position just left of the middle of the road or in the space provided for right-turning traffic". This is not a rally track. The Volvo doesn't need to hug the left hand kerb in order to save a couple of nanoseconds when taking off. Hugging the kerb is a selfish driving position, blocking other road users - cyclists - for no good reason.

galwaycyclist wrote: »

If you look at the end of this video clip the cyclist looks to be trying to squeeze himself up on the left of a very clearly moving car. At a location where the road is both narrowing and going into an outside bend. Unless the black car was signalling a right turn, the phrase "accident waiting to happen" seems appropriate.

The cyclist didn't squeeze anywhere. He was filtering along the left side of a line of traffic moving at slow to moderate speeds. There is plenty of room to filter safely. The cyclist occasionaly runs into problems on this stretch with buses or trucks (where I pass on the outside, if it is safe to do so), or with bad drivers hugging the kerb, where I communicate their incorrect positioning to them.

galwaycyclist wrote: »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUzKG0z6Egc

In this one the pedestrian very clearly has right of way over turning traffic it is difficult to see how the behaviour of the person on the bicycle is in any way defensible.

Where do get this 'right of way' for pedestrians to walk out on the road without looking from? Roads are for road users - pedestrians should check for traffic before stepping out.

BostonB wrote: »

Bit iffy not stopping at the yield in this one...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i4JLBhWgsgU&feature=related

Yield means yield - there was no other traffic coming from the right, and there was room to filter through on the left. The timing worked for me, and I knew I could safely filter to follow the car that came from the right before Army Girl got into gear.

Lumen

Army girl is pretty hot. Did you get her number?

monkeybutter

Dude, you didn't yield for the pedestrian, you have to