Modifier & barrel length & boards

E. Fudd

Lads,

Gonna buy an a-tec cmm 4 mod for my tikka t3 lite stainless in .243

I was thinking of getting the barrel shortened whilst it was in getting threaded. What length would yee recommend shortening it down to or in other words how much would you recommend taking off? Who would yee recommend to carry out the work, I'm in Kildare.

Also, I need to apply for permission for the mod, what's the process for this considering I already have the rifle?


Ta muchly!

Should read application, not boards!! Missus asked me what I was doing as I typed!!!

Cass

I was thinking of getting the barrel shortened whilst it was in getting threaded. What length would yee recommend shortening it down to or in other words how much would you recommend taking off?

How long is it currently? I'm assuming approx. 24" or so. The mod is about 7" or so? Therefore you have a 31" "barrel length". Have a think of what total length you would be more comfortable with. Say its 27". Well if the mod is 7 the the 4" must come off your barrel. However, and i say this fro a personal POV, i would try the mod without shortening the barrel first. See how you fair out. If you simply cannot live with it, then look to getting it cut.

Who would yee recommend to carry out the work, I'm in Kildare.

If you decide the rifle is fine as is, then any dealer will have some lads that can do a threading job for you. If you decide you want it cut then go with a competent rifle builder. Cutting requires recrowning, etc. Fergal White would be a good choice. In Athlone.

Also, I need to apply for permission for the mod, what's the process for this considering I already have the rifle?

As a mod is classed as a firearm in itself it requires a seperate applciation on an FCA1. Ideally a mod should be sought when applying for the rifle, but thats moot. Three things will happen.

1. You will be approved and have to pay nothing depending on your Super/FO.
2. You will be approved and have to apy €80 (this is th more lkely scenario)
3. You will be refused.

Sparks

And don't forget that while there's some gray area around buying a rifle whose barrel length is under 50cm when it comes from the factory; there's no gray at all around shortening an existing barrel to less than 50cm, it's just plain illegal under the Firearms Act (section 12a)

rowa

Isn't there a proof issue surrounding barrel threading also ? I heard of someone being not allowed to fire a rifle in the midlands because it had not been reproofed after being screwcut for a mod.

Sparks

Not in Ireland I don't think rowa, not legally anyway - in the UK, yes, but not here.

zeissman

A t3 lite barrel is just over 22 inches long so you could leave it as it is and just get it threaded.
I know a couple of guys that got their 243s cut back to 20 inches and and are very happy with them.
I wouldnt go any shorter than 20 inches myself though.
I would still take it to a proper gunsmith though to get the work done as I have seen a few bad threading jobs done in my time.

DR6.5

my tikka is 20 inch and have the atec cmm4 on it, find it great.

another lad i shoot with has his tikka .243 cut to 18inch and uses a t8 and without any problems.

dr6.5

Tackleberrywho

In regards to barrel length and a mod.
I have a 20" Remington barrel with a 4" ASE Mod.
Leaving the OAL 24"
I find this very effective in offhand shots as the rifle is balanced very well.
I have a 24" .223 which uses the same mod and I find off hand shots more difficult.
I would not go shorter that 20" even though I have researched it.
I think 22" is the best compromise accuracy Vs OAL

Don't shorten your barrel so you can fit a big donkey of a mod, buy a shorter mod

E. Fudd

Cheers for the help gents.
Think I'm gonna go to Fergal and get the barrel shortened down to 20 inches and recrowned.

A number of years ago during a routine medical in my job it was discovered that I have 30% hearing in my left hear caused most probably due to using firearms without hearing protection. I was back in today for my now yearly hearing test (I work on the railway and they are concerned about my hearing getting worse and working on the track) and I've gotten a letter from the doctor stating the extent of my noise induced hearing damage. I'm going to put this in along side my application and mention it in my reasons for requiring a moderator.

Here's hoping!

E. Fudd

Exactly three weeks from the day I applied for my mod a new license with the magic 's' appeared in the door. I'm chuffed, especially considering I was told by a local gunshop that the super in Naas had a thing against moderators and that numerous guys were going through court proceedings!
I'm going to talk to fergal White about getting my tikka shortened by 2 inches, recrowned, and threaded for an atec mod.

Cass

Out of curiosity how did you fair? Did it cost you another €80 or did they do a sub for ya?

E. Fudd

Ezridax wrote: »

Out of curiosity how did you fair? Did it cost you another €80 or did they do a sub for ya?

New licence just arrived in the door Ezri. Doesn't say substitution anywhere on it and no mention of 80 snots!

dCorbus

Sparks wrote: »

there's no gray at all around shortening an existing barrel to less than 50cm, it's just plain illegal under the Firearms Act (section 12a)

Now, don't forget the bit that comes after Section 12A(1).....which would be Section 12A(2) :rolleyes:

Which kinda adds in the grey area of which you speak!

And Section 12A(6)b specifically refers to the possession by a licenced firearm-owner of a firearm whose barrel has been shortened by an RFD in the circumstances provided for in 12A(2).

All these sections allow for a barrel to be shortened (by an RFD) to less than 50cm (= 500mm, i.e. approx. 19.685in) to repair a defective crown, remove a length of rusted or damaged barrel, remove a damaged muzzle-thread, etc. AND also gives provision for the rifle-owner - with "reasonable excuse" (i.e. the fact that the barrel had to be shortened by an RFD to repair a defective part of the barrel, in accordance with 12A Subsection 2) - to possess such an altered rifle.

At least that's my reading of it.

I may be wrong and I'm not a barrister expert in Firearms legislation.


One thing that jumps out at me is that I cannot seem to find anywhere in the legislation which defines what or how the "barrel length" shall be determined - Does it include the chamber, does it include that part of the barrel which is engaged into the action, or is it that part of the barrel which is visible / measureable from the front metal of the action?

Typically, the regulations seem to bang on about stuff which the drafters haven't taken the bother to write a definition for!

That said, IMvHO (and it's not a legal opinion by any means) I'd measure the barrel as being the length of the barrel in its entirety as has been manufactured and fitted as one piece of metal, i.e. from back of chamber to tip of crown: It's all one piece of barrel.

Perhaps there's a definition floating around out there - if there is, maybe someone more knowledgeable on this stuff could post it here. Thanks.

landkeeper

i too got mine amended for a moderator rang the fo on a monday evening the new licence arrived through the post Wednesday no mention of any charge

Sparks

dCorbus wrote: »

At least that's my reading of it.

You missed a line in 12A(2)... I did mention it somewhere else on here when this came up - but all it says is that your dealer can cut the barrel shorter than the 50cm limit if they immediately build the barrel back up past the 50cm limit (and it's quite silent on how that'd be done).

Typically, the regulations seem to bang on about stuff which the drafters haven't taken the bother to write a definition for!

Yup
And there's not much in there as to whether or not the moderator is considered part of the length of the barrel...

Cass

E. Fudd wrote: »

New licence just arrived in the door Ezri. Doesn't say substitution anywhere on it and no mention of 80 snots!

Nice one. Congrats again.

dCorbus wrote: »

One thing that jumps out at me is that I cannot seem to find anywhere in the legislation which defines what or how the "barrel length" shall be determined

Not sure about the legal definition, but a barrel is measured in its entirity. If you measure a 24" barrel on a rifle about 22 - 22.5" of it comes out past the receiver.

vixdname

rowa wrote: »

Isn't there a proof issue surrounding barrel threading also ? I heard of someone being not allowed to fire a rifle in the midlands because it had not been reproofed after being screwcut for a mod.

Contrary to what you were told before Rowa, yes you are correct, I was in the Midlands and heard the lad behind the desk telling a lad that he COULDNT use his rifle there as it had been threaded AFTER he bought it and wasnt reproofed.
Reckon its an insurance issue perhaps incase someones barrel exploded !!!