Is it possible to be trans-genderqueer?

yawha

Do there exist any cases of people who are born with a male or female body, but do not identify as 100% male or female, and seek treatment to have a more inter-sexed body?

deirdre_dub

yawha wrote: »

Do there exist any cases of people who are born with a male or female body, but do not identify as 100% male or female

Yes.

and seek treatment to have a more inter-sexed body?

I wouldn't put it like that. Every trans person who has significant gender dysphoria seeks treatment to have a body that they can live with, and the amount of medical intervention that trans people need to gain that comfort is quite individual.

Freiheit

If that's what you are then of course it's possible,all sorts of identities exist.

WonderWoman!

yawha wrote: »

Do there exist any cases of people who are born with a male or female body, but do not identify as 100% male or female?

yes im one

G.K.

yawha wrote: »

Do there exist any cases of people who are born with a male or female body, but do not identify as 100% male or female

I am one also.

yawha

I am one too, but you both left out the second part of the question, which is what I'm more interested in.

Kanoe

I too are that.

some people take hormones, some people don't feel it's necessary. some people just wear who they are on the inside well on the outside. I think the more comfortable you become with who you are the more you begin to express it externally, if that makes sense.
I find that when I work out with weights I get the body I'm more comfortable with, I like the feeling of being physically strong (because it reflects how I feel internally) and it does up my testosterone levels which I find helps increase my focus..and sex drive. But I like the all the contradictions too. my skin is soft, my eyes are feminine and I am a mother at the end of the day which epitomises femininity but I'm not as easily identifiable as such, which I like. but I wear it well because it's me.

deirdre_dub

yawha wrote: »

I am one too, but you both left out the second part of the question, which is what I'm more interested in.

It's a personal question. Each individual does what they need to do in order to be able to live with themselves. For some, that means doing nothing, for others, it means HRT, and for others, it means HRT and one or more operations.

Kanoe

jaysus I sound gorgeous

Kanoe

just wanted to add that for me it's almost a spiritual thing, using that terminology it's as if I have a soul which is greater than the physical body represents and it surpasses the idea of gender. and I don't want to keep it locked up in there either.

Freiheit

I view myself as a human being in a male body. You know I think there is going to be a greater emphasis on choice in the future in relation to surgical or hormonal treatment. I don't think there's going to be the same need to fit certain psychological criteria to access various treatments.

Mind if I ask what surgeries you have in mind?.

Links234

yawha wrote: »

Do there exist any cases of people who are born with a male or female body, but do not identify as 100% male or female, and seek treatment to have a more inter-sexed body?

there are people who identify as neither male nor female, as both, or anything else and wish to have some form of treatment for their body. I know there are certain genital nullification surgeries for example, so there are people out there who want to have no sexual characteristics at all.

here's one case that you might find interesting, legally the world's "first" genderless person: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/howaboutthat/7446850/Briton-is-recognised-as-worlds-first-officially-genderless-person.html

Gender isn't a binary, and sex isn't a binary either. I think there are more people out there that experience their gender differently to anyone else than we have labels for, a vast and greater wealth of human experiences than we have words to describe.

syklops

WonderWoman! wrote: »

yes im one

Fascinating.

Kanoe

syklops wrote: »

Fascinating.

I giggled. I think the most difficult thing about it is I can't identify as a lesbian because then I'd have to identify as a woman which doesn't sit right with me. as it happens I don't appear to be able to relate with a lot of lesbians either and I'm mostly only attracted to/have had relationships with straight women.

WonderWoman!

Kanoe wrote: »

I'm mostly only attracted to/have had relationships with straight women.

I've had relationships with gay women but "smooched" straight women who were adamantly straight even though it was more than one occasion

Kanoe

I know it's a bit of a misnomer, them being straight but then I don't consider myself a lesbian either.

WonderWoman!

Kanoe wrote: »

I know it's a bit of a misnomer, them being straight but then I don't consider myself a lesbian either.

I normally don't like labels but do you get turned on by males or was there ever a time you did

Only reason I identify as lesbian is because I've predominantly been in mainly female relationships but I'm not totally off the idea of being with a guy , I do realize I have a masculine side Which I like to embrace - but saying lesbian is easier than saying I'm a wsw but I'm not opposed to dating a guy .

Kanoe

WonderWoman! wrote: »

I normally don't like labels but do you get turned on by males or was there ever a time you did

Only reason I identify as lesbian is because I've predominantly been in mainly female relationships but I'm not totally off the idea of being with a guy , I do realize I have a masculine side Which I like to embrace - but saying lesbian is easier than saying I'm a wsw but I'm not opposed to dating a guy .

think this was covered elsewhere a little while ago but no, when I was with a guy I felt gay ..and awkward.

but I think this thread is more about gender and less about orientation, which is why when it comes to it if I am with a woman I would find it difficult to call myself a lesbian. because that would be gender confirming.

WonderWoman!

So do you just identify as a wsw ?

Kanoe

WonderWoman! wrote: »

So do you just identify as a wsw ?

no ..maybe..if it helps someone else understand then I suppose yes, it would be a better alternative.

rainbow kirby

Genderqueer, attracted to women?

hare05

Kanoe wrote: »

no ..maybe..if it helps someone else understand then I suppose yes, it would be a better alternative.

Just identify as a TotallyAwesome who likes women or feminine TotallyAwesomes. :rolleyes:

Kanoe

That's a mouthful and then a lot of people wouldn't be very familiar with the term genderqueer but I suppose that's what I am, although human being works just as well and what I'm attracted to is irrelevant.

Kanoe

hare05 wrote: »

Just identify as a TotallyAwesome who likes women or feminine TotallyAwesomes. :rolleyes:

isit cuz i is not like u?

WonderWoman!

Kanoe wrote: »

That's a mouthful and then a lot of people wouldn't be very familiar with the term genderqueer but I suppose that's what I am, although human being works just as well and what I'm attracted to is irrelevant.

Oh its totally relevant because i need to know what you are so i can hate on you:rolleyes:

Kanoe

but I could totally agree with you and then we'd could totally be besties forever.

WonderWoman!

Kanoe wrote: »

but I could totally agree with you and then we'd could totally be besties forever.

I dont be besties with "your kind" :mad:.......




................:p

Kanoe

just as well because you're not a bloke and I only do besties with blokes.

WonderWoman!

Kanoe wrote: »

just as well because you're not a bloke and I only do besties with blokes.

I could be whatever you want for the right price ........(just watched sham marriages)

Annasopra

Take the flirting to the Off Topic thread please

Annasopra

rainbow kirby wrote: »

Genderqueer, attracted to women?

Or maybe just Queer?

yawha

Question: When we say homosexual/heterosexual, are we referring to attraction to the same/opposite physical sex or brain gender?

jaffacakesyum

yawha wrote: »

Question: When we say homosexual/heterosexual, are we referring to attraction to the same/opposite physical sex or brain gender?

Good question! Personally for me its both but if one were different to the other i don't know. I've never been attracted to anyone with a different brain gender to their physical sex

WonderWoman!

You don't know that unless they tell you

Kanoe

mango salsa wrote: »

Or maybe just Queer?

I use the term queer a lot but some people find it offensive although when asked it's how I refer to myself as I couldn't be bothered getting into a debate about sexuality, which is what tends to happen.

Kanoe

yawha wrote: »

Question: When we say homosexual/heterosexual, are we referring to attraction to the same/opposite physical sex or brain gender?

I would say same physical sex attraction, but the majority of lesbians I know would be offended if you suggested they were anything but woman. (or liked anything but women, hence why I've rarely been attracted to one)

deirdre_dub

yawha wrote: »

When we say homosexual/heterosexual, are we referring to attraction to the same/opposite physical sex or brain gender?

I would have thought that it was common knowledge that transgender people only ever really refer to ourselves by our brain gender.

WonderWoman!

deirdre_dub wrote: »

I would have thought that it was common knowledge that transgender people only ever really refer to ourselves by our brain gender.

I would have thought the same

yawha

deirdre_dub wrote: »

I would have thought that it was common knowledge that transgender people only ever really refer to ourselves by our brain gender.

Oh, I know this. I don't really see the relevance to the question though...

What I'm thinking is that when we say homosexual or heterosexual, we are referring to the brain gender of the attractee and the physical sex of the attracter.

Like, I wouldn't say that a cisgendered man attracted to a transgendered woman who hasn't undergone HRT or SRS is heterosexual attraction, even if it's a man who is attracted to a woman.

However, I think that in the opposite direction, i.e. the mtf individual being attracted to the cisgendered man is heterosexual attraction.

It's interesting really. The notions of heterosexuality and homosexuality break down when you start considering the different kinds of gender identities that exist. They're really just abstractions which only work within a more traditional and rigid gender framework.

deirdre_dub

yawha wrote: »

Like, I wouldn't say that a cisgendered man attracted to a transgendered woman who hasn't undergone HRT or SRS is heterosexual attraction, even if it's a man who is attracted to a woman.

Just goes to show what you know. :rolleyes:

yawha

You know, people sometimes ask questions and put things out there to learn more and try to understand more about a subject.

I don't really understand your reaction and I don't understand why you expect everybody to understand every nuance and facet of gender and sexuality 100% perfectly.

deirdre_dub

yawha wrote: »

You know, people sometimes ask questions and put things out there to learn more and try to understand more about a subject.

You asked a question? Questions usually start with words like "who", "what", "why", "does", "is" etc, and they finish up with a question mark. I've re-scanned your post - I don't see a single question in it!

Your post, to my eye, contains a number of statements of your opinion. It doesn't contain a single question. If I had seen a question, I might have answered. But I didn't. I just saw opinion, and so all I could do was to offer my opinion in response.

So, do you have a question or two you would like to ask?

Kanoe

yawha wrote: »

You know, people sometimes ask questions and put things out there to learn more and try to understand more about a subject.

I don't really understand your reaction and I don't understand why you expect everybody to understand every nuance and facet of gender and sexuality 100% perfectly.

I know you don't really want me to respond to your questions on this topic at all but I'm going to anyway. In your first post you established how you identify.

Do there exist any cases of people who are born with a male or female body, but do not identify as 100% male or female, and seek treatment to have a more inter-sexed body?...

yawha wrote:

I am one too..

which suggests that you would have some personal experience or inkling on the subject. It would help to have something of your perspective too so feel free to share and if you are genuinely interested in seeking advice than there are links stickied at the top of the page that you might find helpful.


so far I've established you're straight male/trans gender queer ?? -cool.

Kanoe

*dips biccy in tea

yawha

deirdre_dub wrote: »

You asked a question? Questions usually start with words like "who", "what", "why", "does", "is" etc, and they finish up with a question mark. I've re-scanned your post - I don't see a single question in it!

Your post, to my eye, contains a number of statements of your opinion. It doesn't contain a single question. If I had seen a question, I might have answered. But I didn't. I just saw opinion, and so all I could do was to offer my opinion in response.

So, do you have a question or two you would like to ask?

I didn't ask a question (note the or in my last post), correct, I put something out there, I proposed an idea. A statement prefaced with "I wouldn't think" isn't a steadfast statement of opinion, it's a thought.

You didn't offer an opinion on my thoughts at all. You just responded with an ad hominem.

The implicit questions I was asking were "What do you think of the thoughts I've proposed?" "What is your opinion on the matter?" "What would be your response to the question I asked in the post before that one?"

Kanoe wrote: »

I know you don't really want me to respond to your questions on this topic at all

Kanoe wrote: »

In your first post you established how you identify.

which suggests that you would have some personal experience or inkling on the subject. It would help to have something of your perspective too so feel free to share and if you are genuinely interested in seeking advice than there are links stickied at the top of the page that you might find helpful.


so far I've established you're straight male/trans gender queer ?? -cool.

I'm a straight male who's for the most part comfortable as identifying and presenting as male, but I feel I identify as being female in certain aspects of myself. Hard to explain really. I guess to put it simply, I would answer no if asked if I feel I am 100% male.

I'm not looking for advice or support in this thread, I just find the subject interesting. This interest is partly fuelled by how I feel about my gender identity, however.

Kanoe

yawha wrote: »

I'm a straight male who's for the most part comfortable as identifying and presenting as male, but I feel I identify as being female in certain aspects of myself. Hard to explain really. I guess to put it simply, I would answer no if asked if I feel I am 100% male.

I'm not looking for advice or support in this thread, I just find the subject interesting. This interest is partly fuelled by how I feel about my gender identity, however.

that's the part I'm interested in coincidently which is why I would like to hear more about you.
I had gathered from your approach that you would prefer a response from mtf or people who have transitioned or are going through transition, either way the links at the top of the page contains lots of information that might be relevant to you on your quest. Best of luck

CrystalLettuce

The issue is that it's very hard to get an "Intersexed" body right. Hormones can be a bit all or nothing to work correctly and androgynous features can be hard to replicate properly. Hormones aren't dished out willy nilly, only serious cases of transgenderism are meant to be addressed by them, which means androgynes and the like can be left out in the cold because most people don't understand.

Even though a lot of trans end up that way unintentionally, I feel bad for those who do not identify with the male female dichotomy as the question of treatment is more difficult. Keep in mind too the difference between gender roles and gender identity. Girls can dress like boys and boys like girls if they want without having to take anything(though of course it's more difficult to get it right as a boy).

A lot of transwomen actually like the idea of keeping their penis though.

Freiheit

I relate to a lot of what you say Crystal lettuce (interesting name!:)),for a long time I wasn't sure what I considered myself,regarded the male female dichotomy as to a large extent socially constructed,couldn't really fit either box. Took me a long time to decide whether I wanted hormonal treatment

I still regard the gender system as oppressive,partially socially constructed and feel it's boundaries restrict a lot of people. But I've realised that whatever reservations I have about the concept of gender,I'd be much happier living as a woman,but took ages for me to reach this stage. I've recently been approved for hrt.

I was very much an androgyne,but perhaps some of that was due to overanalysis. With less analysis I might have 'transitoned' happily years ago.