Kill List [** SPOILERS FROM POST 36 ONWARD **]

johnny_ultimate

Wow.

So this is probably the most fascinating film in quite some time. I'm reluctant to say anything about it, to be honest. The joy is discovering the weirdness for yourself. But let's just say it's a violent, disturbing blackly comic and utterly bizarre British film. After a relatively innocuous start (well, the credits are a bit weird) the film becomes progressively more unusual as it hurdles towards a conclusion that borders on insanity. It's held together by two terrific performances from Neil Maskell and the Irish Michael Smiley, and a witty, inventive script & dialogue by Ben Wheatley (also director), Amy Jump and 'the cast'. The visuals and music are borderline Lynchian, and later the film resembles a certain other British movie, whose name I won't mention for various reasons. Suffice to say, odd this film most certainly is. There's a trailer below, but I'd recommend not watching it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqkqF--v1tg

For those of you who've seen it, definitely a few points worthy of discussion.

What did you think of the radical tonal shift towards something bordering on high camp? I think I liked it, but am not entirely sure yet. The tunnel chase, though, was fantastic. I loved how the background information was kept cleverly ambiguous, and themes and symbols - occult elements, religious iconography etc... - were introduced but left up to the audience's interpretation. While there are certainly some disturbing moments of hyperviolence and straight up horror, I found the character's casual acceptance of this lifestyle and violence the most disturbing of all. Little things like the casual Skype call with Jay's wife showing a terrifying acceptance of this lifestyle. Luckily, there was always a genuinely hilarious bit of random banter to contrast nicely with the grim tone.

I think Kill List might be brilliant, but it's definitely something. And that's better than nothing.

Sad Professor

Lynchian - sounds like my type of film. Looking forward to it.

Phony Scott

It maybe the drinks I had before going into this film, but I was bored with the film, thought it was just dull. The performances were very good though.

Phony Scott

@ Johnny_Ultimate:

Bits of it were amusing, such as the aftermath of the guy getting his head smashed in with the hammer and Michael Smiley's character telling his friend to clean it up. The tunnel chase was gripping, but for me, and alcohol may have had a part to play in this, the rest of the movie was just...dull. I just felt it was riffing a little too close to 'The Wicker Man' and other occult films. Maybe I should watch it sober!

johnny_ultimate

Definitely wouldn't call it dull anyway, but yeah the

Wicker Man

side of things is definitely something I can see being a sticking point for a lot of people!

Otis Driftwood

I saw this today and liked it alot.I felt there are parallels with A Serbian Film of all things with this movie ie someone being lulled into an old way of life by the promise of lots of money,brutally jarring violence and a shock (if somewhat predictable) ending.

The violence in this is what really stood out for me.There are some extremely brutal scenes in this one including one involving a lump hammer that would put the extinguisher scene in Irreversible to shame.

I liked the banter between the two lead actors and there were some funny and uncomfortably funny moments in it.

Its not perfect,charector development left a little to be desired and we get teased about the main charectors past life too but all in all,an enjoyable little slice of British cinema.

I saw it in Screen 3 in the IFI and had mini lol's to myself at the amount of people that turned away from the screen during the hammer scene.

/sadist.

epigramsqueen

In my opinion, this is the move of the year. It's a dubstep of blood and a hard core mindf*** that has been long needed. I walked out of it wanting to walk back in again.

paddyismaddy

is it getting or was it released over here?

frag420

Just out from seeing this. Viscarel and disturbing but brilliant. Got the impression there was something coming after the credits but didn't wait to fund out......... Did I miss anything??

WHIP IT!

Hmmm, had this (strongly) recommended to me by a pal only last week. Hadn't even heard of it til then.... seems interesting....

Twee.

Saw it tonight and thought it was excellent.

The tunnel scenes were fantastic, you almost felt trapped in there with them! Really had me on the edge of my seat. Knowing it was a horror film, the slow, creeping beginning of the film had me feeling tense, where was the horror? All we could do was wait!

I was definitely one of those who turned away at the hammer scene, mother of god! As someone with a bad knee, seeing his get smashed just made me shudder!

As already said, I enjoyed the connection between the two main men, they had work banter like everyone else, only their work was a little more serious!

What the hell happened in Kiev?! I suppose it was annoying only getting snippets of the lads' former assignments, but it also meant that we had no idea what they were capable of in their line of work.

Anyway, thumbs up from me, even though I may not sleep tonight.

Cork boy 55

2nd trailer
Teaser 2

marvsins

Heard about this film last month but it doesn't seem like its getting nationwide release. Nothing listed in Cork

plastic glass

saw this on Saturday in the Screen cinema. Pretty disturbing but I liked it. Dont know how to tag spoliers so just going to warn everyone spoilers from now on******

I kinda knew half way through the film that we were not going to get an answers at all but I guess that can work sometimes. Also suspected a couple of time the main character might have been suffering from post traumatic stress or something like that but by the end I didn't really think that anymore. I don't think anyway. One of the most disturbing things I thought was the way the people in the cultish costumes and masks were seemingly so willing to die.

Fysh

Finally got around to seeing this last weekend, and it was excellent! Not what I expected (which was basically an action film about two hitmen) but much more interesting and bizarre for it. It's a definite DVD-buy for me, and one I look forward to re-watching several times...

Sad Professor

Is this still on anywhere in Dublin by any chance? I seem to have missed it and I'm raging.

Tipsy McSwagger

Just watched this and it's a pure mind fcuk of a film. Was he in a coma? Was it all a dream? Was his wife in the cult? Was he imagining his dead friend being with him? So many questions.

Otis Driftwood

Is it out on dvd yet Tipsy?Its defo on my buy list.

Basq

Otis Driftwood wrote: »

Is it out on dvd yet Tipsy?Its defo on my buy list.

Tis indeed.. was released last Monday in UK / Friday in ROI.

Waiting on my Blu atm, hoping it arrives in tomorrows post. Surprising number of copies of the film appearing on ebay and for trade/sale on various sites. I guess its a film which is polarising viewers and many who blind bought are off loading it asap.

seeing_ie

you could read the film as an allegory of the anxieties and nihilism of contemporary Britain...a society morally bankrupted through ten years of fighting futile wars in distant lands, whose security services practice torture, whose police carry out extra judicial killings, a country riven by a pernicious class system (a clear class distinction between The Client, Jay and Gal signified through speech and dress), a kleptocracy of bankers and craven politicians. People left with few comforts aside from drinking (observe the bottles of wine and crates of beer in Jays garage). At the end Jay kills his wife and son and the allegory is made explicit. England has no future left. This is what the Doctor says to Jay: Let me give you some advice. the past is finished, the future is not here. There is only this present.

beautifully written, bang on the money analysis imo

Sad Professor

I got home around 2 last night and couldn't sleep, so I decided to pop this in. To sum it up: wow!

I found the first 30 minutes very bland and the film didn't really come alive for me until the last act, but once it did it made sense of everything that went before. Brilliant ending that was nicely foreshadowed at the beginning. Like all the best horror films this is about more than just delivering cheap scares. The film touches on a lot of contemporary issues: the war in Iraq and the financial crisis.

Note how all of the targets in the film represent key parts of society: religion, education, politics and of course the final one - family.

The result is a very Conradish-like trip into the darkness that lurks beneath a society which seems to be losing touch with its own morality.

A film for our times, which i really regret missing in the cinema. It's hard to imagine this not being a horror classic in years to come.

barone

watched it few nights ago, very underwhelmed by the whole thing, its just violent in parts and thats pretty much it, a classic ? no chance..

wakewood is far superior imo

johnny_ultimate

barone wrote: »

watched it few nights ago, very underwhelmed by the whole thing, its just violent in parts and thats pretty much it, a classic ? no chance..

wakewood is far superior imo

It's violent for a reason. It's there to shake the viewer out of their comfort zone. This is anything but gore for the sake of it - I'm not sure I've seen many films that has made me so uncomfortable viewing the actions taking place on screen. It's a very considered mesh of nightmare and reality. 'Just violent' is doing it an injustice IMO.

As for Wakewood? A good first half let down by a painfully formulaic second. Not a patch on Kill List, which is one of the creepiest and bravest genre experiments in year.

barone

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

It's violent for a reason. It's there to shake the viewer out of their comfort zone. This is anything but gore for the sake of it - I'm not sure I've seen many films that has made me so uncomfortable viewing the actions taking place on screen. It's a very considered mesh of nightmare and reality. 'Just violent' is doing it an injustice IMO.

As for Wakewood? A good first half let down by a painfully formulaic second. Not a patch on Kill List, which is one of the creepiest and bravest genre experiments in year.

different opinions, thats all

Sugarlumps

Absolute pants, you'd find better acting in an episode of Fair City.

johnny_ultimate

barone wrote: »

different opinions, thats all

Yeah and that's fair enough: Kill List is one I can entirely understand polarising an audience, especially the final act.

However, objectively rather the subjectively speaking, I don't think it's fair to dismiss it as 'just violence'. To me that suggests a film that revels in careless, empty and graphic violence just for the sake of it. If anything, Kill List is a direct response to that sort of filmmaking, and why despite shocking moments it isn't a mere gorefest.

Goldstein

I think there's a lot of wishful thinking going on here with the movie Übers. They wish it was this generation's A Clockwork Orange but I'm not sure if it's genuine article if it's trying too hard to be so "different" that it ends up forcing the issue. For me although enjoyable film, it did stink somewhat of a rehashed and utterly unorignial A Serbian Film, The Wicker Man, Eyes Wide Shut & A Clockwork Orange mashed together. A good attempt but there's not enough genuine originality gong on here to justify all the plaudits.

Victor

Twee. wrote: »

What the hell happened in Kiev?!

I suspect it was a routine security / hit-type job. I think the reference was there just to tease the audience.

plastic glass wrote: »

One of the most disturbing things I thought was the way the people in the cultish costumes and masks were seemingly so willing to die.

The film is about the lead's (Jay) hypocrisy - dealing out punishment, when he himself is no better. I think if someone had killed a child in a blameworthy fashion, such a behaviour may be understandable.

Tipsy McSwagger wrote: »

Was he in a coma? Was it all a dream? Was his wife in the cult? Was he imagining his dead friend being with him? So many questions.

Why do you think this?

As to whether the wife was in on it, I don't know - the way she laughs at the end suggests she was.

johnny_ultimate

Goldstein wrote:

I think there's a lot of wishful thinking going on here with the movie Übers. They wish it was this generation's A Clockwork Orange but I'm not sure if it's genuine article if it's trying too hard to be so "different" that it ends up forcing the issue. For me although enjoyable film, it did stink somewhat of a rehashed and utterly unorignial A Serbian Film, The Wicker Man, Eyes Wide Shut & A Clockwork Orange mashed together. A good attempt but there's not enough genuine originality gong on here to justify all the plaudits.

I don't think 'original' is the word I'd use to describe it - indeed, A Serbian Film (which I haven't seen) and The Wicker Man have already been mentioned by those of us who liked it, and the overall nightmarish style isn't far removed from Lynch et al. Although there is argument that combining disparate and familiar styles & ideas into something new is 'original', but that's being pedantic

What it does have IMO is a confident directorial and visual style, strong performances and a manic energy that I personally found refreshing and engaging. It also has a level of depth and considered thematic ambiguity that isn't forced upon the viewer - a rare trait that I consider a very admirable one. It's not jumping all over it just because it isn't 'generic blockbuster no. 44'. It's jumping all over it because as a cinema experience not many provide quite the same sensual and emotional rush as I had watching this.

Goldstein

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

I don't think 'original' is the word I'd use to describe it - indeed, A Serbian Film (which I haven't seen) and The Wicker Man have already been mentioned by those of us who liked it, and the overall nightmarish style isn't far removed from Lynch et al. Although there is argument that combining disparate and familiar styles & ideas into something new is 'original', but that's being pedantic

What it does have IMO is a confident directorial and visual style, strong performances and a manic energy that I personally found refreshing and engaging. It also has a level of depth and considered thematic ambiguity that isn't forced upon the viewer - a rare trait that I consider a very admirable one. It's not jumping all over it just because it isn't 'generic blockbuster no. 44'. It's jumping all over it because as a cinema experience not many provide quite the same sensual and emotional rush as I had watching this.

True enough. Don't get me wrong it was certainly a welcome addition to this years film (I'd include it in any arbituary top 15/20 of the year), and I did very much enjoy the movie, but I'm just not sure it's worthy of the high esteem it's receiving in some ports

The end is directly transplanted from A Serbian Film, albeit in a slightly less graphic sense

, a personal choice no doubt though, so others will differ. Long may such films be produced for us to debate

Tusky

Just watched this and really enjoyed it although not sure I really 'got' the plot. Maybe someone can enlighten me?

Everything didn't really hang together for me. I don't mind films that have open ended endings which leave certain things to the viewers imagination, but I just can't make sense of the plot with this one.

So this 'cult' decided to initiate Jay and in doing so got him to kill three targets. I assume this is why they were thanking him while being killed? Because it was a sort of sacrifice on their part.

Why was Jay chosen?

How did they know that Jay would stumble upon their ritual (the hanging of the woman) at the end?

Why did the cultists storm his house? (their is a scene of his wife shooting a few men)?

And was his mate (Gal?) in on it? If not, how did the woman at the start, who seemed to be a cultist too, come onto the scene?

I really liked the movie but wish it made a bit more sense. It doesn't hang together well enough for me.

Joshua Jones

Yeah I think Gal was in on it. In the tunnel before Jay kills him he also says thank you. I think Gal put him forward as a possible candiate and Gals girlfriend, Laura IIRC, went to give him the once over and when she felt he was the right candidate maked his house with the group sign (back of mirror).

Mickeroo

Did

Gal say thank you when he was killed? I was under the impression the chick just used Gal to get to Jay.

I thought it was a great movie but I agree

the overly ambiguous ending didn't add anything to it, didn't want it all wrapped up in a bow but when a film plays out like a mystery I want some answers at the end. I kind of felt like the wife laughing was just thrown in for the sake of raising even more questions.

Victor

Tusky wrote: »

So this 'cult' decided to initiate Jay and in doing so got him to kill three targets. I assume this is why they were thanking him while being killed? Because it was a sort of sacrifice on their part.

It is unclear if the cult is a suicide cult, a murder cult, a death cult or a combination. I wonder had the people he killed done 'very bad things' and being killed brought them closure.

Why was Jay chosen?

He's a (sadistic) killer.

How did they know that Jay would stumble upon their ritual (the hanging of the woman) at the end?

Good question. I'm not sure that they 100% expected it.

Why did the cultists storm his house? (their is a scene of his wife shooting a few men)?

To get his wife and son for the final showdown, which would potentially draw him deeper in.

And was his mate (Gal?) in on it?

I don't think so.

If not, how did the woman at the start, who seemed to be a cultist too, come onto the scene?

I think she knew 'the client'. The client seems to have been a facilitator for the cult, who knew where to get mercenary types. All she had to do then was to seduce him.

I really liked the movie but wish it made a bit more sense. It doesn't hang together well enough for me.

We wouldn't be here talking about it then.

Joshua Jones wrote: »

Yeah I think Gal was in on it. In the tunnel before Jay kills him he also says thank you.

Interesting. It certainly puts a twist on things. However, I read it as one mercenary not leaving his fellow mercenary to be captured The Wild Geese-style http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0078492/

Mickeroo wrote: »

Did Gal say thank you when he was killed? I was under the impression the chick just used Gal to get to Jay.

I think its easy to think that, but it is a useful theory.

I thought it was a great movie but I agree

the overly ambiguous ending didn't add anything to it, didn't want it all wrapped up in a bow but when a film plays out like a mystery I want some answers at the end. I kind of felt like the wife laughing was just thrown in for the sake of raising even more questions.

When you think about it, she was also ex-military and a killer - she had no compunction in killing the guys at the house. She was happily living off blood money.

Sad Professor

I've added a spoiler warning to the title to make things easier to discuss.

Spoilers from this post onward. If you haven't seen the film then read no further.

Syferus

It's a strange one all right. It feels like a film you need to digest a bit before you can form firm opinions on but there was some lovely little touches - the sound effects were almost perfect and it's something that rarely is highlighted because if it's good we shouldn't really be all that aware of it. In the early stages you got subtle references to what was to come and by the end they become completely overtly sinister.

I also enjoyed the little reference (as opposed to the big reference that was the last quart of the film) to The Wicker Man when Jay looks of his hotel window to see Fiona waving at him, echoing the scene in The Wicker Man when Sergeant Howie sees Laird outside his bedroom window.

Definitely an impressive fusion of alot of different genres and influences, managing to never feeling like it's falling apart.

louloubella

Hi there
I watched the kill list and I am dying to know who sings the song at the dinner scene, its a long scene and there is a song by someone like Joan Armatrading but its not her! If you know post here! I watched it at someones house so I cant check myself and there is nothing on line.

longshanks

'It could have been better' by Joan Armatrading

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UODmptNidE

frag420

Heads up,

Kill List is on this sat on film4 at 10:50pm!!

frAg

Frankie Lee

I'm watchin it for the first time here now.
I reckon it might well go down as a great film in the years to come but is a film that requires plenty of analysing to fully appreciate it.

tok9

I watched this last night and I was understanding the majority of it fine until the end where the wife died.

When she laughed it just threw me completely off. I actually thought she survived at the end too which added more confusion but it seems she did die so I'm going to take it that she wasn't involved.