Man arrested for querying change given on flight

Evaex

An Aer Arann passenger was arrested after a flight for querying the change he was given by a flight attendant. The flight attendant contacted airport police stating her life and the safety of the plane were under threat.

Instead of apologising to the passenger, he later received a nasty two-faced letter from the airline stating ""Aer Arann would like to have the opportunity to welcome you on board our flights again, subject to your assurance that your future conduct will be appropriate and acceptable".


Seems on the surface to be disgraceful behaviour from both the flight attendant and the airline.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/airline-probes-mans-arrest-over-complaint-2847974.html

Delta Kilo

There is more to that story than is in that article.

Evaex

Delta Kilo wrote: »

There is more to that story than is in that article.

Not according to the mans version, or what the gardai found who immediately released him. It certainly doesnt seem that the life of the attendant or safety of the aircraft were in question at any stage.

GAAman

Evaex wrote: »

Delta Kilo wrote: »

There is more to that story than is in that article.

Not according to the mans version, or what the gardai found who immediately released him. It certainly doesnt seem that the life of the attendant or safety of the aircraft were in question at any stage.

This was in after hours awhile back, i was able to read the guys blog (on my phone here so cant get link) but the gist from his side was that the air hostess was a snotty yoke and he paid for his friends and his own drink with a €50 note, she gave him a load of shrapnel for change and he asked did she not have better change (notes etc) and she got snotty.

Also the staff chairs they sit on was directly opposite his and when she was seated she kept tellin him to "stop staring" at her, where was he supposed to look, the ceiling!?

When the plane landed she went straight to the phone and supposedly gave him a sly grin, next thing there was airport police everywhere.

This is all his side of course but if it is true she should get into alot of trouble for it imo

Evaex

Hu

GAAman wrote: »

This was in after hours awhile back, i was able to read the guys blog (on my phone here so cant get link) but the gist from his side was that the air hostess was a snotty yoke and he paid for his friends and his own drink with a €50 note, she gave him a load of shrapnel for change and he asked did she not have better change (notes etc) and she got snotty.

Also the staff chairs they sit on was directly opposite his and when she was seated she kept tellin him to "stop staring" at her, where was he supposed to look, the ceiling!?

When the plane landed she went straight to the phone and supposedly gave him a sly grin, next thing there was airport police everywhere.

This is all his side of course but if it is true she should get into alot of trouble for it imo

Thanks I didn't realise it was already discussed. I'll look it up

CaptainSkidmark

a serious kick up the arse is what she needs if thats the way it went down

cyrusdvirus

there was a thread here about it, but it got locked.... cos someone (me!) had quite strong opinions about the passenger and his behaviour.

My opinions haven't changed, and i still think he was suffering from an I.D TEN-T error, but.......

Delta Kilo

I remember one thing from it...
Apparently he was using the phone inflight to despite them telling him to turn it off. He denied he had his phone turned on while on the plane, yet later in the blog he uploaded a picture of his change, taken with his camera phone on the flight, contradicting what he just said.

My opinion, the guy was an obnoxious pr*ck who made life a little tough on the cabin crew, who decided to get her own back and teach him a lesson, no harm in that imo, you dont go to work to get abuse.

Fact that gardai didnt do anything doesnt mean a whole lot, as there probably wasnt a law they could charge him with breaking, and there are probably a load of legal loopholes since it happened in the sky.

Evaex

Delta Kilo wrote: »

I remember one thing from it...
Apparently he was using the phone inflight to despite them telling him to turn it off. He denied he had his phone turned on while on the plane, yet later in the blog he uploaded a picture of his change, taken with his camera phone on the flight, contradicting what he just said.

My opinion, the guy was an obnoxious pr*ck who made life a little tough on the cabin crew, who decided to get her own back and teach him a lesson, no harm in that imo, you dont go to work to get abuse.

Fact that gardai didnt do anything doesnt mean a whole lot, as there probably wasnt a law they could charge him with breaking, and there are probably a load of legal loopholes since it happened in the sky.

The whole premise of your argument is that he was an obnoxious prick for using his phone. How do you know the picture wasn't taken with a regular camera?

There is harm in "getting your own back" if you waste the time of airport police, bring your airline into disrepute, waste gardai time and allege a criminal complaint about a passenger when his actions are nothing of the sort.

The department of Aer Arann who wrote the letter come across as really pathetic with the statement highlighted in the paper, grudgingly accepting they were wrong, but throwing in an insult. Just looks really unprofessional - if he was at fault they should have stated so. If he wasnt they should have apologised.

pclancy

The origonal thread was closed as someone had reported it as possibly opening up Boards.ie to libel, any report like that has to be investigated by some other moderators so that's why it was locked. Everyone's free to have an opinion but at the end of the day its a privately owned website that has to be protected

mikemac

I remember that thread and it only gave the guy's side of the story so realy it's not enough to say for sure what happened

Of course he's not going to write a blog and damn his own behaviour

ResearchWill

Delta Kilo wrote: »

I remember one thing from it...
Apparently he was using the phone inflight to despite them telling him to turn it off. He denied he had his phone turned on while on the plane, yet later in the blog he uploaded a picture of his change, taken with his camera phone on the flight, contradicting what he just said.

My opinion, the guy was an obnoxious pr*ck who made life a little tough on the cabin crew, who decided to get her own back and teach him a lesson, no harm in that imo, you dont go to work to get abuse.

Fact that gardai didnt do anything doesnt mean a whole lot, as there probably wasnt a law they could charge him with breaking, and there are probably a load of legal loopholes since it happened in the sky.

For the life of me I can't remember the act but there is an act that states when any Irish plane is in the air it is covered by all criminal law, a strange thing is the plane is covered by Irish law from full power, which means if a plane is on the stand in other state it is covered by local law, there is also a separate offence of being abusive etc on a flight, in that case the crew have to ask you to stop the activety and if you refuse you commit an offence.

jhegarty

Delta Kilo wrote: »

My opinion, the guy was an obnoxious pr*ck who made life a little tough on the cabin crew, who decided to get her own back and teach him a lesson, no harm in that imo, you dont go to work to get abuse.

You think wasting the time of the emergency services is a valid way to teach a lesson to rude customer ?

BrianD

I read the guys blog but he removed the post on legal advice. The event occurred back in June.

It seems that the Garda/airport police couldn't find him at fault and reading the press report the distinct impression given is that the airline don't disagree with his complaint. He seems to have put the ball back in the court - perhaps they were hoping he'd quietly go away.

It's unusual to get obnoxious in flight staff but I have seen it being dished out to other passengers - American aircrews seem to be good at it.. On one occasion I was walking up the air bridge in Heathrow making that last call, when a steward passed turned and told me to switch off my phone and just kept at me. I was about to give him an earful but decided that the paperwork would be too much and not worth missing the last leg of a long journey.

Delta Kilo wrote:

Apparently he was using the phone inflight to despite them telling him to turn it off. He denied he had his phone turned on while on the plane, yet later in the blog he uploaded a picture of his change, taken with his camera phone on the flight, contradicting what he just said.

Flight mode?

Tenger

I too have read the guy's blog. He gives the impression that he was a complete innocent and was merely returning form a "contemporary cultural event" in England (his term for Glastonbury)
Apparently the crew were rude to him when telling him to switch off his phone. He says that he arrived very early at the airport but had not had anything to drink as he had driven a hire car to the airport.

During the flight he only had a E50 note and ordered 4 drinks on the 30 mins flight (he was with a mate so 2 each) The crew had no change and told him he would have to wait for change. Later on he was handed something like E17 in coins with a E10 note. He complained and was told 'you got your change didn't you?' His mate then took a photo of the coins with his phone.

He then claimed that crew were smirking at him. He was looking at the female crew member to get her name when she told him to stop staring. (Bit aggressive from her I think) On another note he named the crew member on his initial blog.

Personally I feel he is being less than honest on his blog with how he behaved, HOWEVER I feel that Aer Arann were in the wrong here. Yes he may have been an arse on the flight but getting the Gardai to meet him is over the top.

I would really love to hear about this flight from another passenger who may have been sitting behind the 2 guys.

A thing to keep in mind with many airlines is that in their terms and conditions (that you must agree to to book) you agree to follow all instructions issued to you by the crew. I'm not sure how could pan out if the guy was not turning off his phone when told to do so by a crew member.

David086

Tenger wrote: »

I would really love to hear about this flight from another passenger who may have been sitting behind the 2 guys.
.

If you go into the comments section in the blog there's a person who commented several times saying he/she was sitting behind him. He/she is called "P sitting directly behind you on that plane". Makes it a little more interesting hearing it from someone else.

Tenger

David086 wrote: »

If you go into the comments section in the blog there's a person who commented several times saying he/she was sitting behind him. He/she is called "P sitting directly behind you on that plane"............

Well spotted David086

Here's the quote from the latest blog that says what was commented on in the original blog:

I wrote this in the other post: “Hey Leo, I was sitting directly behind you on that flight and lets face it you’re painting a very one sided picture here. They were very wrong not giving you back the right change and the attendant in question was off her trolly [excuse the pun] but you were no angel yourself and you became very threatening in your body language. You probaly wont publish this comment as I’m giving a witness account but your behaviour was so threatening that I’m leaving an anon comment!”

followed by

You probably are feeling very aggrieved by your experiance but from my viewpoint looking towards the attendent it did look like you were ‘staring out’ her while figuring out a way to make your own complaint regarding the stupid non return of your change. When I first read this I did take it as someone [you] plainly in the wrong but playing the victim and wrongly telling thousands of people that you were hard done by. As I said you probably do feel very aggrived by the embarassing situation you were in.

followed by

Anne the reason why I’ve stayed Anon is because I seen the threatening behaviour I’ve described and to be honest I don’t want any of it coming my way. I know it’s a **** excuse but I happened to chance upon this article through twitter and felt compelled to comment. I know that air attendant felt scared and intimidated and don’t really want to correspond personally to someone who would do that.

And new comments on the latest blog:
-This will be my last comment here and fair play to you Leo for allowing me to have my say. I’m keeping myself Anon because from what I seen I do not want to have anything to do with you after what I seen on that flight. I too had a wonderful weekend at Glastonbury and the flight home should have been a distant memory. However when you intimidated that female attendent and frightened her to the extent that she had to phone for Gardai back-up it really shook me. I was delighted to see the Gaurds and their dogs on the runway. The attendant was cocky, slightly rude and together her collegue made a stupid error of judgement. But when you became intimidating you lost all right to a complaint. It sickens me thatso many of your readers feel sorry for you. I cant imagine how long it took for that flight attendant to get ‘over’ the situation. Believe it was worse for her than for you!

-@EjB, it all stems from the change from a fifty scenario. What Leo describes is pretty much what happened. I think Leo & his companion should have kept to themselves and wrote their letter of complaint about both air hosts as it’s crazy that they were over-charged for their drinks. At this point I’m on their side and the attendants are assholes. When it came to preparation for landing the attendant needed her chair and Leo’s leg was in the way. Could have been something in that from either party! At this stage the attendant was looking for Leo’s reaction and she got what she was looking for. There was some dialogue about getting attendants name so he could make a complaint. At this point there’s just 2 feet between the two. She thought he was being intimidating by staring at her. She feft adequately threatened to call for back-up. Behind all these comments, all these tweets and an irresponcible Irish Times article there is someone who felt so frightened for her safety that she needed the Gaurds. No one can defend the airlines responce but if Leo continues with his complaints isn’t going to prolonge her distress? 2 sides to every story folks. I’d like to read your reply to this Leo.

I would like to point out that I still think the Aer Arann response to the guy is threatening and the wrong approach to take.

copacetic

That looks like the flight people getting their comment in tbh, behaviour was so threatening that they had to stay anonymous, then only description is of him 'staring out'? No actual behaviour at all.
Exactly how you see someone staring while also sitting directly behind him is never explained.

Guards should have taken complainant in imo and charged with malicious false reporting.

Evaex

copacetic wrote: »

That looks like the flight people getting their comment in tbh, behaviour was so threatening that they had to stay anonymous, then only description is of him 'staring out'? No actual behaviour at all.
Exactly how you see someone staring while also sitting directly behind him is never explained.

Guards should have taken complainant in imo and charged with malicious false reporting.

Agreed looks so obviously to be flight staff talking absolute nonsense. It looks like the airline has a serious problem here if that's the kind of witness report they are relying on.

cyrusdvirus

Are any of you taking into account what tenger has posted?

Another PASSENGER on the flight was delighted to see the Gardai. Now if this Leo twat had been the reasonable chappie he makes himself out to be, then why would another element of Self Loading cargo be delighted??

The guy was/is and always will be (in my opinion) a twat

jum4

interesting, I once tried to pay for 2 bottles in wine in left over shrapnel of a currency I hardly ever use. I had spent ages counting it out and piled them up to make it easier to count! low and behold I was told I could not pay with so many coins! admittedly there were loads but I wasn’t taking the piss!

ScouseMouse

I may get a slap for going slightly off topic, but this has happened elsewhere with worse consequences:eek:

Magic Beans

I must admit I find the power now seemingly vested in flight attendants to be very disquieting. After all the primary qualifications for the job is to be personable and less than a certain height. The standards are nothing like they were a few years ago with Aer Lingus and the other flag carriers and there was never any trouble then. Now you have many attendants who are much rougher for want of a better word and if they have a bad day they can take it out on a passenger and their word is law.

The cheap airlines and the lower standards they have brought to the whole industry have a lot to answer for imho.

squonk

By my reading, yer man, Leo, sounds like a bit of an arsehole. I haven't seen here how much he was overcharge by but it can't have been much if the got E17 back from the attendant from a Fifty. I'd imagine the drinks were 5 or 6 quid anyway. In any event, he should have made a complaint once the flight was landed and in writing to Aer Arann. The attendant herself sounds a bit up herself but you get that and it's a 30 minute flight so just grin and put up with it. You haven't paid to fly first class and those two incidents alone should have been enough for Leo to say "Hey! I'm not flying Aer Arann anymore! I'm going to blog about my experiences in conjunction with my written complaint to the company and make sure that other people are aware of the shoddy behaviour of some of their staff". That should have been the end of the matter.

On a final note, anyone who describes Glasto as a 'Contemporary cultural event' is a bit of an arsehole in my book anyway.

cyrusdvirus

Magic Beans wrote: »

I must admit I find the power now seemingly vested in flight attendants to be very disquieting. After all the primary qualifications for the job is to be personable and less than a certain height. The standards are nothing like they were a few years ago with Aer Lingus and the other flag carriers and there was never any trouble then. Now you have many attendants who are much rougher for want of a better word and if they have a bad day they can take it out on a passenger and their word is law.

The cheap airlines and the lower standards they have brought to the whole industry have a lot to answer for imho.

Not true.

Just because you don't hear about them because some wanna be journo :rolleyes: posts incidents up on a blog doesn't mean that there were not issues.

My stance may be coming across as totally pro flight crew in this incident, but that's because, as per usual, we are only hearing one side of the story. I work for a large retail organisation and i have dealt with my share of customers who feel that they have a grievance, even though this may not always be the case.

Magic Beans

Never is perhaps an overstatement, I should have used "rarely".

I accept that Joe Public can be a bit of an asshat sometimes but that does not mean that everyone with a genuine point to make is an asshat. It's too easy to dismiss staff issues with saying that the public are often wrong too.

cyrusdvirus

Magic Beans wrote: »

Never is perhaps an overstatement, I should have used "rarely".

I accept that Joe Public can be a bit of an asshat sometimes but that does not mean that everyone with a genuine point to make is an asshat. It's too easy to dismiss staff issues with saying that the public are often wrong too.

I'm not dismissing all Staff Issues as makey uppy stories by upset/annoyed/aggrieved customers. As a customer i have received shoddy service on occasion, so i know that it happens no matter how reasonable the customer is.

However when i have had an issue, i've contacted the company directly, and dealt with it through them.

This goonbag contacted the internet and screamed about how badly he was treated after drinking a double shot of whiskey on a 30 minute flight, included the F.A.'s name on his blog (only to be told to take it down by his lawyer). My issue with him is that his first resort was to get a bit of public backing THEN to contact the service provider, in this case Aer Arann.

There are ways of dealing with a company as an aggrieved customer. Throwing your toys out of the pram all over the internet before contacting the company is not one of them.

Happyman42

Regarding the photo, can you not take a pic when your phone is in airplane/flight mode?

cyrusdvirus

Happyman42 wrote: »

Regarding the photo, can you not take a pic when your phone is in airplane/flight mode?

How are flight crew to know when a phone is in flight mode? It says it on the screen of the device, but nowhere else.

What if it was during a period of the flight that the device was supposed to be turned off, flight mode or not?

There are too many things about this story that don't quite ring true.

GeorgeOrwell

It wasn't his phone. It was his partner's phone.

It's on the blog.

bette

This is worth a read!

Unacceptable Behaviour on Board
Under UK law, there are two pieces of legislation relating to disruptive behaviour on-board aircraft. Offences include:

Endangering the safety of an aircraft;
Being drunk in an aircraft;
Smoking when prohibited;
Disobeying a lawful command by the commander of an aircraft; and
Acting in a disruptive manner (including interfering with the performance by a member of the cabin crew in the course of their duties).
If a member of crew deems your behaviour disruptive, they have the right to take measures they think reasonable to prevent you continuing your behaviour. When the aircraft lands, their actions may include:

Making you leave the aircraft and possibly under Police escort;
Refusing to carry you on the remaining sectors of the journey shown on your ticket; and
Reporting the incident on board the aircraft to the relevant authorities with a view to them prosecuting you for any criminal offences you might have committed.

cyrusdvirus

GeorgeOrwell wrote: »

It wasn't his phone. It was his partner's phone.

It's on the blog.

Oh well if it's on his blog then it must be true, mustn't it.

Happyman42

gatecrash wrote: »

How are flight crew to know when a phone is in flight mode? It says it on the screen of the device, but nowhere else.

What if it was during a period of the flight that the device was supposed to be turned off, flight mode or not?

There are too many things about this story that don't quite ring true.

I can't see a situation where you would be asked to turn off phones or electronic devices and the drinks trolley is still allowed to operate, can you?

In fact, I have often seen the drinks trolley stalled because of weather, but I have never been asked to turn of equipment during the cruise.

I'm only saying like.

cyrusdvirus

Happyman42 wrote: »

I can't see a situation where you would be asked to turn of phones or electronic devices and the drinks trolley is still allowed to operate, can you?

In fact, I have often seen the drinks trolley stalled because of weather, but I have never been asked to turn of equipment during the cruise.

I'm only saying like.

How do we know that the drinks trolley was still in operation when this guy got the bright idea to take a picture of the change he was given?

We don't.


only saying like.. ;)

Happyman42

gatecrash wrote: »

How do we know that the drinks trolley was still in operation when this guy got the bright idea to take a picture of the change he was given?

We don't.


only saying like.. ;)

Feck me...that was a turbulent flight.

Tenger

bette has posted a very relevant piece of info:

Offences include:
Disobeying a lawful command by the commander of an aircraft; and
Acting in a disruptive manner (including interfering with the performance by a member of the cabin crew in the course of their duties).
If a member of crew deems your behaviour disruptive, they have the right to take measures they think reasonable to prevent you continuing your behaviour........

Can we stretch our imagination a bit to consider that perhaps this guy was being bolshie about the pre flight instruction from the crew, ie turning off the phone or talking during the safety demo. (I'm sure many of us have all been on flight were people didn't co-operate) This could lead to the crew taking a dislike to him and trying to get their own back by giving him his change in coins. His subsequent anger fuelled that of the crew which resulted in this farce. This theory still doesn't absolve RE of any blame in the matter.

People forget that when you board a transport vehicle (bus/train/plane) you are subjecting yourself to the by-laws/T&C's of the transport company, these can be enforced more harshly than the laws of the land as YOU have entered into a contract with the company by agreeing to them in the first place.



In reading the latest blog I think it is very funny that some people are fully supporting 'leothegeek' but completely dismissive of 'P sitting behind you on the flight'. In reality they are both anonymous internet posters, why is one more plausible than the other. If 'P' was the flight crew as posited above, surely their comments would be a bit more aggressive towards 'Leo'.

BrianD

gatecrash wrote: »

How are flight crew to know when a phone is in flight mode? It says it on the screen of the device, but nowhere else.

They need to ask. They have already made an announcement that devices can be used in flight mode.

What if it was during a period of the flight that the device was supposed to be turned off, flight mode or not?

If he had been served a drink I think it's safe to assume that they were inflight.

There are too many things about this story that don't quite ring true.

Seems OK to me.

You have to remember that a lot of people are rude or abrupt. If you are dealing with people you have to accept this. The passenger is also the customer and sometimes one has to turn the other cheek. You have also to remember that people are also consciously or sub consciously anxious when they fly and I'm sure air crews are well aware of this. They may also have travelled distances before their flight and be tired. There's a lot of factors. In general, airlines don't help matters by making alcohol available on top of the above.

If the customer was rude and his behaviour is as he described it did not merit calling the police. This is over the top and a waste of taxpayer resources. If the guy was taken off by police, he has every right to say what he likes wherever. However, he also did the right thing by making a complaint in writing to the airline.

BrianD

Tenger wrote: »

Well spotted David086

Here's the quote from the latest blog that says what was commented on in the original blog:

I wrote this in the other post: “Hey Leo, I was sitting directly behind you on that flight and lets face it you’re painting a very one sided picture here. They were very wrong not giving you back the right change and the attendant in question was off her trolly [excuse the pun] but you were no angel yourself and you became very threatening in your body language. You probaly wont publish this comment as I’m giving a witness account but your behaviour was so threatening that I’m leaving an anon comment!”

followed by

You probably are feeling very aggrieved by your experiance but from my viewpoint looking towards the attendent it did look like you were ‘staring out’ her while figuring out a way to make your own complaint regarding the stupid non return of your change. When I first read this I did take it as someone [you] plainly in the wrong but playing the victim and wrongly telling thousands of people that you were hard done by. As I said you probably do feel very aggrived by the embarassing situation you were in.

followed by

Anne the reason why I’ve stayed Anon is because I seen the threatening behaviour I’ve described and to be honest I don’t want any of it coming my way. I know it’s a **** excuse but I happened to chance upon this article through twitter and felt compelled to comment. I know that air attendant felt scared and intimidated and don’t really want to correspond personally to someone who would do that.

And new comments on the latest blog:
-This will be my last comment here and fair play to you Leo for allowing me to have my say. I’m keeping myself Anon because from what I seen I do not want to have anything to do with you after what I seen on that flight. I too had a wonderful weekend at Glastonbury and the flight home should have been a distant memory. However when you intimidated that female attendent and frightened her to the extent that she had to phone for Gardai back-up it really shook me. I was delighted to see the Gaurds and their dogs on the runway. The attendant was cocky, slightly rude and together her collegue made a stupid error of judgement. But when you became intimidating you lost all right to a complaint. It sickens me thatso many of your readers feel sorry for you. I cant imagine how long it took for that flight attendant to get ‘over’ the situation. Believe it was worse for her than for you!

-@EjB, it all stems from the change from a fifty scenario. What Leo describes is pretty much what happened. I think Leo & his companion should have kept to themselves and wrote their letter of complaint about both air hosts as it’s crazy that they were over-charged for their drinks. At this point I’m on their side and the attendants are assholes. When it came to preparation for landing the attendant needed her chair and Leo’s leg was in the way. Could have been something in that from either party! At this stage the attendant was looking for Leo’s reaction and she got what she was looking for. There was some dialogue about getting attendants name so he could make a complaint. At this point there’s just 2 feet between the two. She thought he was being intimidating by staring at her. She feft adequately threatened to call for back-up. Behind all these comments, all these tweets and an irresponcible Irish Times article there is someone who felt so frightened for her safety that she needed the Gaurds. No one can defend the airlines responce but if Leo continues with his complaints isn’t going to prolonge her distress? 2 sides to every story folks. I’d like to read your reply to this Leo.

I would like to point out that I still think the Aer Arann response to the guy is threatening and the wrong approach to take.

Do you honestly believe that this is from a passenger? First, how would she has seen his body language if she was sitting behind him? When I'm on a flight I can't even see who's in front of me. I can see the people in the row across and not in front of me. That's on a 737, maybe different on the turboprops.

Looking forward to seeing the airlines response on this one.

Goldenegg

jum4 wrote: »

interesting, I once tried to pay for 2 bottles in wine in left over shrapnel of a currency I hardly ever use. I had spent ages counting it out and piled them up to make it easier to count! low and behold I was told I could not pay with so many coins! admittedly there were loads but I wasn’t taking the piss!

What currency was it though? For example, aerlingus does not except coins unless it is euro or sterling coin. Banks will not except foreign currency coin.

cyrusdvirus

BrianD wrote: »

They need to ask. They have already made an announcement that devices can be used in flight mode.

And could quite easily have made the announcement that they are on approach,l please turn off ALL mobile devices.

BrianD wrote: »

If he had been served a drink I think it's safe to assume that they were inflight.

As i said, it could have been on the approach

BrianD wrote: »

Seems OK to me.

Fair enough. I still think there is too much we DON'T know about this incident.

BrianD wrote: »

You have to remember that a lot of people are rude or abrupt. If you are dealing with people you have to accept this. The passenger is also the customer and sometimes one has to turn the other cheek. You have also to remember that people are also consciously or sub consciously anxious when they fly and I'm sure air crews are well aware of this. They may also have travelled distances before their flight and be tired. There's a lot of factors. In general, airlines don't help matters by making alcohol available on top of the above.

If the customer was rude and his behaviour is as he described it did not merit calling the police. This is over the top and a waste of taxpayer resources. If the guy was taken off by police, he has every right to say what he likes wherever. However, he also did the right thing by making a complaint in writing to the airline.

I have no issue with him making a complaint to the airline. He's entitled to. Who knows, he MIGHT even be correct to.

I have an issue with a complaint being made and ever before the airline having a chance to deal with it, he goes squealing on the internet about it, thus removing any chance of a fair examination of the facts.

The company is going to close up shop around their employee, the crew are going to protect their colleague as best they can, and Joe Public is going to give out about how badly Cabin Attendants have gotten since the hey day of Catch Me If You Can!!

End result, no-one know what happened and people who don't know each other and weren't there when the incident in question occurred are discussing and disagreeing it on the internet.

cyrusdvirus

BrianD wrote: »

Do you honestly believe that this is from a passenger? First, how would she has seen his body language if she was sitting behind him? When I'm on a flight I can't even see who's in front of me. I can see the people in the row across and not in front of me. That's on a 737, maybe different on the turboprops.

Looking forward to seeing the airlines response on this one.

I'm sure that the blog owner would be able to identify the poster of this sequence of posts.
It would be more than a Cabin Crew members career is worth than to lie and impersonate a passenger on a flight (not literally, but they would get in a world of trouble if they were to attempt such a deception)

Evaex

Whatever about what happened on the flight, I think the attendants call to the police was completely unnecessary at best. The airlines follow-up was basically thinly veiled cheap shots. Now that extracts have been published in two national newspapers, the whole incident has become really bad PR for the company.

Having read their response and gotten an insight into how they handle their affairs, I wouldn't be in a rush to support Aer Arann anytime soon.

copacetic

gatecrash wrote: »

I'm sure that the blog owner would be able to identify the poster of this sequence of posts.
It would be more than a Cabin Crew members career is worth than to lie and impersonate a passenger on a flight (not literally, but they would get in a world of trouble if they were to attempt such a deception)

But it's ok to falsely accuse a passenger of threatening behaviour and call the airport police and guards? That isn't more than their career is worth?

Evaex

squonk wrote: »

On a final note, anyone who describes Glasto as a 'Contemporary cultural event' is a bit of an arsehole in my book anyway.

Stupid unnecessary personal insult on the guy, does nothing to enhance your argument.

BrianD

gatecrash wrote: »

And could quite easily have made the announcement that they are on approach,l please turn off ALL mobile devices.




As i said, it could have been on the approach



Fair enough. I still think there is too much we DON'T know about this incident.



I have no issue with him making a complaint to the airline. He's entitled to. Who knows, he MIGHT even be correct to.

I have an issue with a complaint being made and ever before the airline having a chance to deal with it, he goes squealing on the internet about it, thus removing any chance of a fair examination of the facts.

The company is going to close up shop around their employee, the crew are going to protect their colleague as best they can, and Joe Public is going to give out about how badly Cabin Attendants have gotten since the hey day of Catch Me If You Can!!

End result, no-one know what happened and people who don't know each other and weren't there when the incident in question occurred are discussing and disagreeing it on the internet.

But all the narrative of the event points to the event happening in flight and the "staring out incident" happened when the crew member took her seat for landing facing the passenger in question.

My opinion is that the two individuals hit it off badly and best course of action would be to walk away. However, the passenger can't do this if the police were called, he was publicly humiliated and a less than satisfactory letter from the airline.

As regards to other respondent on the blog, is this person real? They seem to have an insight that would go beyond what a passenger could see and know?

tricky D

If I was the Garda or Airport Police who responded, I'd simply tell the pair of them to grow up and don't waste our time.

cyrusdvirus

BrianD wrote: »

But all the narrative of the event points to the event happening in flight and the "staring out incident" happened when the crew member took her seat for landing facing the passenger in question.

Where does it say that they were in the cruise? To the best of my knowledge that is the only point at which operation of a flight mode enabled device is acceptable. I can't remember for certain, but I'd warrant it doesn't say it anywhere.

BrianD wrote: »

My opinion is that the two individuals hit it off badly and best course of action would be to walk away. However, the passenger can't do this if the police were called, he was publicly humiliated and a less than satisfactory letter from the airline.

In the original thread there was a post pointing to the procedures to be used by crew in the event of an unruly or disruptive passenger. One of those procedures, dictated by Aer Lingus, is that the Airport Police/Gardai are called. The crew were following company procedure in calling the authorities

BrianD wrote: »

As regards to other respondent on the blog, is this person real? They seem to have an insight that would go beyond what a passenger could see and know?

i can't prove that they are. Any more than you can prove that they aren't.

I personally believe that it is NOT a fellow crew member anonymously posting on the blog.

cyrusdvirus

copacetic wrote: »

But it's ok to falsely accuse a passenger of threatening behaviour and call the airport police and guards? That isn't more than their career is worth?

following company policy

Shelflife

To Simplifiy matters.

customer boards plane. Lets say his default mode is rude.

orders 4 drinks , has to wait for his change and when it comes he queries the charge and the make up of the change.

he gets a smart answer from fa which hightens his rudeness. he stares her out and unnerves her.

seems to me that two people got out of the bed the wrong side, but by calling the security into it and alleging that she felt that her personal safety and the planes safety was in question she slighty over egged it.

when dealing with the public esp as was said earlier in a stressful situation there will always be disputes and arguements, if every airline dealt which them in this way every second flight would be met by security.

imo the customer may well have been a knob, but from the basics of having a proper float to giving change in a proper fashion and not been smart in any way to a paying customer i feel that the airline were in the wrong.(everyone knows the way to deal with knobs is to rise above them).

to then go and call security and have the man arrested on what was a minor dispute is madness.

to say that the customer should just never use Aer arran again may not be an option, if say he needed to fly on a regular basis from galway for example, its reasonable to expect good customer sevice when you fly and unreasonalble to expect him to drive to another airport becaise AA couldnt be bothered.

Evaex

Aer Arann have come out of this as the biggest losers. The attendant thought she was getting one up on the man by calling the gardai, but I wonder at what cost to the company who are carrying out internal investigations, and getting negative publicity online and in several national newspapers.

cyrusdvirus

Evaex wrote: »

Aer Arann have come out of this as the biggest losers. The attendant thought she was getting one up on the man by calling the gardai, but I wonder at what cost to the company who are carrying out internal investigations, and getting negative publicity online and in several national newspapers.

In the original thread there was a post pointing to the procedures to be used by crew in the event of an unruly or disruptive passenger. One of those procedures, dictated by Aer Lingus, is that the Airport Police/Gardai are called. The crew were following company procedure in calling the authorities