Galway bus services, confusing?

Zoney

On the subject of Galway bus services, does anyone else find the routes/route numbers and all the various minor variations very confusing as a visitor to the city? It doesn't seem to follow the same scheme at all as in other cities and I think it could do with a LU style map at all the city centre stops to help explain things.

foggy_lad

Zoney wrote: »

On the subject of Galway bus services, does anyone else find the routes/route numbers and all the various minor variations very confusing as a visitor to the city? It doesn't seem to follow the same scheme at all as in other cities and I think it could do with a LU style map at all the city centre stops to help explain things.

Most of the Bus Eireann City/town services are impossible to follow, it looks like they were less complex at one time but years of having bits changed and added on to the routes has left them probably less efficient than using a seive to carry water.

n97 mini

Zoney wrote: »

On the subject of Galway bus services, does anyone else find the routes/route numbers and all the various minor variations very confusing as a visitor to the city?

Not just Galway.

Turn up at a random bus stop in Dublin, and unless it's RTPI enabled you'll have no idea when then next bus arrives as the timetables tell you what time the bus departs from somewhere else. If your destination isn't served by one of the routes that stops at that stop, well then forget it as there are no maps!

Compared to LU. Concise map. Excellent in station information system.

CIE's biggest failure down through the years has been an inability to communicate.

foggy_lad

n97 mini wrote: »

Not just Galway.

Turn up at a random bus stop in Dublin, and unless it's RTPI enabled you'll have no idea when then next bus arrives as the timetables tell you what time the bus departs from somewhere else. If your destination isn't served by one of the routes that stops at that stop, well then forget it as there are no maps!

Compared to LU. Concise map. Excellent in station information system.

CIE's biggest failure down through the years has been an inability to communicate.

Apart from not having precise timings for each and every stop which is not very practical or necessary considering the approximate times given on the timetables I doubt Dublin Bus have ever had timetables as messed up as these,

http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1202229915-Galway1.pdf
http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1260982884-Galway2Ems.pdf
http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1260982886-Galway2W.pdf
http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1260982850-Cork5.pdf
http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1305559611-Cork2.pdf

obviously these services are not intended for use by tourists/blow-ins at all or they would have been made easier to understand.

Mrs OBumble

Zoney wrote: »

On the subject of Galway bus services, does anyone else find the routes/route numbers and all the various minor variations very confusing as a visitor to the city? It doesn't seem to follow the same scheme at all as in other cities and I think it could do with a LU style map at all the city centre stops to help explain things.

Yes, it's confusing.

You can find my "take" at a summary map (both companies, not just BÉ) here. And making a printout for the bus stops would require licensing from Google Maps, so I'm sure won't happen.

There are lots and lots of variations for individual services though, eg the 8:20 goes along <<road that no other bus uses>>, the 7:40 goes to Castlepark instead of going all the way to the terminus.

A big part of me thinks that they want tourists to use taxis, not buses.

n97 mini

foggy_lad wrote: »

Apart from not having precise timings for each and every stop which is not very practical or necessary considering the approximate times given on the timetables

That's when they're present. The nearest Dublin Bus stop to my house is a pole with a DB logo atop, and nothing else.

When they are present they're useless unless you know exactly where you are, as the timings are only for a few stages along the route.

E.g. route 33. Two of the stages are Drumcondra Stn and Omni SC. A visitor/tourist needs to know where these are to have any hope of determining if they are somewhere in between!

LXFlyer

Zoney wrote: »

On the subject of Galway bus services, does anyone else find the routes/route numbers and all the various minor variations very confusing as a visitor to the city? It doesn't seem to follow the same scheme at all as in other cities and I think it could do with a LU style map at all the city centre stops to help explain things.

For what it's worth, this is the Bus Eireann map:

http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1290178711-Galway_City.pdf

foggy_lad

n97 mini wrote: »

That's when they're present. The nearest Dublin Bus stop to my house is a pole with a DB logo atop, and nothing else.

When they are present they're useless unless you know exactly where you are, as the timings are only for a few stages along the route.

E.g. route 33. Two of the stages are Drumcondra Stn and Omni SC. A visitor/tourist needs to know where these are to have any hope of determining if they are somewhere in between!

Agreed that the bus stops are often without any timetable and often even without the sign at the top but the website is a lot better for Dublin Bus than Bus Eireann and gives the locations of most stops on most routes but the timetables for Bus Eireann give no such information apart from their city maps which are of no help.

highlydebased

foggy_lad wrote: »

Apart from not having precise timings for each and every stop which is not very practical or necessary considering the approximate times given on the timetables I doubt Dublin Bus have ever had timetables as messed up as these,

http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1202229915-Galway1.pdf
http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1260982884-Galway2Ems.pdf
http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1260982886-Galway2W.pdf
http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1260982850-Cork5.pdf
http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1305559611-Cork2.pdf

obviously these services are not intended for use by tourists/blow-ins at all or they would have been made easier to understand.

There should be times at every bus stop, for that bus stop. They have it in the UK (where the city bus networks are far more comprehensive). Very confusing for a tourist or someone not familiar with the system who sees a random timetable on a bus stop that might be halfway through the route.

The Cork timetables are not too bad but the Galway ones are damn confusing.

Lapin

lxflyer wrote: »

For what it's worth, this is the Bus Eireann map:

Fixed that link for you lxflyer

http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1290178711-Galway_City.pdf

I actually like this map. It a huge improvement on the ones they used to issue.

I agree that it should be on display at every bus stop to allow people to become familiar with it.

Zoney

JustMary wrote: »

Yes, it's confusing.

You can find my "take" at a summary map (both companies, not just BÉ) here. And making a printout for the bus stops would require licensing from Google Maps, so I'm sure won't happen.

There are lots and lots of variations for individual services though, eg the 8:20 goes along <<road that no other bus uses>>, the 7:40 goes to Castlepark instead of going all the way to the terminus.

A big part of me thinks that they want tourists to use taxis, not buses.

Thanks for that, now it finally clicks why some services are have E and W appended! Yes of course obvious in retrospect, but not something standard for bus routes anywhere else in Ireland that I've encountered.

I'm not sure whether to ascribe it to maliciousness, but rather the usual malaise here in Ireland of people making it up as they go along. Actually the plus thing is we do have plenty of ideas and innovation, but there is no-one on top filtering it all (removing the nonsense) and keeping everything organised!

Everything ends up being like the unrestrained spewing out of people's random ideas.

n97 mini

foggy_lad wrote: »

the website is a lot better for Dublin Bus than Bus Eireann and gives the locations of most stops on most routes but the timetables for Bus Eireann give no such information apart from their city maps which are of no help.

Website. Not much use if you're standing at a bus stop!

Zoney

n97 mini wrote: »

Website. Not much use if you're standing at a bus stop!

Actually I have your namesake and on my first occasion in Galway spent some time online at Eyre Square vainly trying to figure out what bus to get (I took a taxi).

n97 mini

Zoney wrote: »

on my first occasion in Dublin spent some time online at Eyre Square

While I don't doubt you, I'm not aware of an Eyre Sq in Dublin!

leeroybrown

The city bus service in Galway is a mess with the exception of the Parkmore service which is just about usable. I pretty much refuse to use it on a point of principle.

foggy_lad

n97 mini wrote: »

Website. Not much use if you're standing at a bus stop!

Most people have smart-phones now so it is a lot easier than you think to get around Dublin and is very easy to guesstimate the times for most busses. Bus Eireann city buses are not as easy to predict.

n97 mini

foggy_lad wrote: »

Most people have smart-phones now so it is a lot easier than you think to get around Dublin

I disagree. At most 10% know how to get internet on their phone.

And a website is not the way to communicate with your customers at bus stops.

foggy_lad

n97 mini wrote: »

I disagree. At most 10% know how to get internet on their phone.

And a website is not the way to communicate with your customers at bus stops.

Whatever about the merits of the internet or the text service currently available to find out when your next bus is, the idea of having a different timetable for every single one of the thousands of bus stops in the city and county is beyond silly IMHO

If anything this would lead to utter confusion and would also not provide anymore accurate information to customers due to the nature of bus transport in Dublin and the issues of busses being delayed in traffic or being brought forward by controllers(also the issues involved in maintaining headway).

At the moment it seems easier to look at the departure time and see how far along the route you are and calculate with the information available at your stop or online when your bus should reach your stop.

In the screenshot below of the 33 bus timetable it has the main stages listed and times estimated between various points on the journey, this happens with all the timetables available online. There is also a map available which shows great detail right down to showing individual bus stops when viewed in hybrid mode so areas are even more familiar to those finding themselves a bit lost.

n97 mini

foggy_lad wrote: »

Whatever about the merits of the internet or the text service currently available to find out when your next bus is......................,

I obviously completely disagree. More information at individual bus stops would make the system easier to use. It is ironic that you are opposed to more information as bus stops.

Considering the vast majority of people don't have internet access on their phones, how would you suggest the system is made more user-friendly?

Guessing where a bus stop is in relation to two landmarks that a visitor would not be familiar with is not an acceptable modus operandi.

Mrs OBumble

foggy_lad wrote: »

...the idea of having a different timetable for every single one of the thousands of bus stops in the city and county is beyond silly IMHO

I used to live in a city the size of Cork, and in the early/mid 2000's they installed signs like this at every single bus stop: though it's a bit of work to install all the signs, actually producing the sign-content is not that difficult given the computerised route planning systems that pretty much any modern bus company uses.

Mrs OBumble

Lapin wrote: »

http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1290178711-Galway_City.pdf

I actually like this map. It a huge improvement on the ones they used to issue.

Agree it's a huge improvement.

But the "LU style" approach means they get away with seeming to cover the whole city - when in fact there's a huge residential area between Seacrest and Westside Shopping Centre (to use the names on the map) that they don't serve at all. There are some buses go up there, but because they're City Direct ones they're not on the map.


And that's the guts of the problem: BÉ are not the only company providing public transport. It's not, and should not be, their responsibility to tell people about the service. Either the NTA needs to get a hell of a lot more locally responsive, or local government should have some responsibility and authority here.

It amazes me that housing is one area that could really, really do with national policies, but it's almost totally under local control (Yes, I know they're trying to change this now ... but emphasis on trying). But public transport, which could soooo benefit from local control is totally nationally (mis)managed.

dowlingm

JustMary wrote: »

making a printout for the bus stops would require licensing from Google Maps, so I'm sure won't happen.

Maybe someone should tell them about OpenStreetMap?

ciotog

Lapin wrote: »

Fixed that link for you lxflyer

http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1290178711-Galway_City.pdf

I actually like this map. It a huge improvement on the ones they used to issue.

I agree that it should be on display at every bus stop to allow people to become familiar with it.

Yes, that map is much better than previous versions. +1 for displaying at every stop.