A Complicated Mortgage/Legal Issue

Shivers26

Maybe somebody here can help........

My brother in law to be essentially owns a house in a rural location. His mother conned him into signing mortgage applications years ago and told him he was only going guarantor on the loan because at the time she had a very small income and he was her only child with a full time job. Since then the mother has been living in the house abd making all of the repayments but the mortgage and deeds are in my brother in laws name so on paper he owns a house.

Anyway, my sister is living in a house provided by a county council housing scheme in Dublin and in a few weeks herself and himself are due to get married and he will live in the house with her. However the council do not provide housing for people who own property and they are running a very real risk of losing the council house.
They have zero interest in living in the house in the country as its very rural and they have 3 small children who are in school and playschool in Dublin.

Is there any solution to this?
He wants his name off the deeds and mortgage as the house is nothing but a liability for him
His mother is not elderly or anything but she doesn't work so is unlikely to get a mortgage to take over the house

julianne2009

Hi OP,
Unfortunately, I can't see you Brother in Law getting out of this situation without a lengthy and expensive legal battle, and high potential for serious breakdown in relations with the in-laws, unless his mother-in-law is willing to cooperate. Plus he has the difficulty of proving that he was unaware of what he was signing. (Ultimately the liability remains with him - caveat to never sign any document that you havent read/don't understand fully). The bank will continue to hold him liabile for the debt unless his Mother-in-law herself applies to the Bank to take over the debt (and proves repayment capacity).

mari2222

AS the council will not let him be a tenant (because he owns a house) the couple need to rent where it suits them - they don't have to move down the country. He could have a chat with his mother to see what her long term plans are if any - maybe she has plans of her own.

phormium

His mother conned him! Sounds a bit strange, firstly however easy it might be to con someone into signing mortgage application documents (and its not as easy as all that, you have to produce income details etc to bank) the final mortgage documents are signed with a solicitor who normally would explain clearly what was involved. Is the mortgage in both their names? It is unlikely the son was not at the mortgage meetings with the bank, the mother could not have done it on her own. Unless the solicitor was also involved in conning the young man in question he should have been more aware of what he was doing. That part of the story sounds very suspect, however whatever the real situation was does not matter to the preset problem he has, it is highly unlikely the mother is going to be able to get a mortgage in her own name to buy him out if she was not able to get it day one, things being much tighter now.

Shivers26

phormium wrote: »

His mother conned him! Sounds a bit strange, firstly however easy it might be to con someone into signing mortgage application documents (and its not as easy as all that, you have to produce income details etc to bank) the final mortgage documents are signed with a solicitor who normally would explain clearly what was involved. Is the mortgage in both their names? It is unlikely the son was not at the mortgage meetings with the bank, the mother could not have done it on her own. Unless the solicitor was also involved in conning the young man in question he should have been more aware of what he was doing. That part of the story sounds very suspect, however whatever the real situation was does not matter to the preset problem he has, it is highly unlikely the mother is going to be able to get a mortgage in her own name to buy him out if she was not able to get it day one, things being much tighter now.

I know what you are saying - it does sound very suspect. He has always maintained that as far as he was concerned he was only guarantor on this loan. At the time this transaction took place he was only about 20 but in a full time, civil service job.
The mortgage documents and deeds are in his name only, that much he was recently told by the solicitor but any post relating to this is directed to the house that his mother lives in.
It really is a big mess. Plus there is nothing to stop her from packing up and leaving and he will be responsible for the mortgage.
I dont know are my sister and her OH in a position to rent privately as they are supporting a family of 5 on one modest income. Personally I think they need to explain the predicament to his mother and let her come up with a solution. I think selling the house is the least messy solution but I dont think he will do it.

phormium

I have processed many mortgages over the years where the parent was not in a position to secure the loan so an adult child would go on the mortgage to enable the mortgage to be granted. Usually the parent would be a joint mortgage holder but maybe there was some reason why that was not possible in this case, however the fact that he was an only child would have simplified the matter as more than likely the house will be his in future. I never processed a mortgage for a client who I did not meet face to face and it would be made clear that they were totally on the hook for this mortgage and how it might affect them in relation to future borrowing ability. It is really hard to believe that he was not made aware of the situation or chose not to listen, he was only 20 after all! To be fair most children were happy to do this for the parent to help them out, in fact I never met one who wasn't ok with the situation. I have one child and I would like to think that if I needed this sort of help they would agree.

Is there a breakdown in the relationship between the son and mother as I can't think of any other reason that would justify him now suggesting to her that she sell her home? Your comment that she could go off and leave the mortgage for him to pay kind of suggests that too. It appears she has being paying the mortgage since it was taken out so basically he will have a house in his name eventually that he did not have to pay for, not a bad deal.

Shivers26

phormium wrote: »

I have processed many mortgages over the years where the parent was not in a position to secure the loan so an adult child would go on the mortgage to enable the mortgage to be granted. Usually the parent would be a joint mortgage holder but maybe there was some reason why that was not possible in this case, however the fact that he was an only child would have simplified the matter as more than likely the house will be his in future. I never processed a mortgage for a client who I did not meet face to face and it would be made clear that they were totally on the hook for this mortgage and how it might affect them in relation to future borrowing ability. It is really hard to believe that he was not made aware of the situation or chose not to listen, he was only 20 after all! To be fair most children were happy to do this for the parent to help them out, in fact I never met one who wasn't ok with the situation. I have one child and I would like to think that if I needed this sort of help they would agree.

Is there a breakdown in the relationship between the son and mother as I can't think of any other reason that would justify him now suggesting to her that she sell her home? Your comment that she could go off and leave the mortgage for him to pay kind of suggests that too. It appears she has being paying the mortgage since it was taken out so basically he will have a house in his name eventually that he did not have to pay for, not a bad deal.

He's not an only child, he has 3 siblings but he is the only one with a job and this is the case for many years.
The issue is that he is going to be living with my sister in a house in Dublin that is provided by a council housing scheme and the council only provide housing to people who are in need of housing and this is where the problem arises. From their perspective he is not in need of housing as he owns a house.
He wants the house, mortgage, deeds etc out of his name. I don't know what happened years ago but I am sure at the time he was happy to help his mother but over time his circumstances have changed and now he about to be married and he has 3 small children. They have no interest in living in the house in the country now or ever (its a dump in the middle of nowhere). As for the solicitor, I am sure he must have explained things at the time as I know when I was buying my house I had a few very lenghty meetings when he explained the contracts and documents to me. Im not sure if my brother in law fully understood what he was being told to be honest.