Do you see a future for yourself, family, potential family in Ireland?

CommuterIE

Do you see a future for yourself, family, potential family in Ireland?

I don't really for myself, never mind potential family

Praetorian Saighdiuir

Yes, 100 lottery tickets please!

Superbus

Sure.

My American great-great-great-great-great grandson will come to Dublin on vacation in however long claiming to be Irish.

leeroybrown

In the long term yes, but not in the short to medium term. I can see myself leaving the country at some stage and coming back eventually.

Mickjg

I moved stateside last year and to be honest I don't really see a future for me there. I loved living in Ireland, and there's plenty of things I miss but not enough to bring me home. I feel that the scumbag element is just so off putting and there's no future there in my career.

I went back for a two week holiday, had a nice time but was happy to be leaving.

PseudoFamous

Pshht, you're all just miserable and not sending out enough CVs if you don't. Stop being so pessimistic.

CommuterIE

We are staring at least two decades of stagnation and depression... 70's and 80's basically, its sad but true... taxes will only go up, social welfare will go down, the only viable place to get is out of here

T2daK

if the ra can get away with robbing post offices I don't see why I can't guarantee my kids a future.

D1stant

No, but sure I'll just stay here until I starve to death

On the upside, I get to moan with you chuckleheads every day till then:)

galwayrush

Only if i win the lotto or inherit a lot of money.

mackg

I'll leave but....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M1ypn0y32Ac

CommuterIE

T2daK wrote: »

if the ra can get away with robbing post offices I don't see why I can't guarantee my kids a future.

Sure how could you gaurantee them anything?? Unemployment is @ 15% nearly, and trust me, it will hit 20% in the coming years, our problems haven't even started!!!! thanks to governments not putting proper austerity in NOW!

easyeason3

I don't really have a choice but to be optimistic due to the mortgage I have to pay.

I don't have any kids at the moment, the recession won't stop me having kids but it will certainly limit the amount I have.

parker kent

Life goes on. Ireland didn't die out in the 80s, we'll still exist in 10 years and I'm sure people will still be riding and having kids.

A lot of recession chat is needlessly dramatic.

PseudoFamous

CommuterIE wrote: »

Sure how could you gaurantee them anything?? Unemployment is @ 15% nearly, and trust me, it will hit 20% in the coming years, our problems haven't even started!!!! thanks to governments not putting proper austerity in NOW!

Your sensationalist statements, excessive exclamation and question marks, and random capitalisation would lead me to believe you could possibly have a future with The Sun.

johnnyskeleton

Where else would we go?

Cavehill Red

CommuterIE wrote: »

We are staring at least two decades of stagnation and depression... 70's and 80's basically, its sad but true... taxes will only go up, social welfare will go down, the only viable place to get is out of here

This.

When everyone's completed their education in Ireland (soon enough, thank God), we'll be off.

I love this country and its people. but collectively not enough people listened when there were warnings of a housing bubble, collectively we kept electing Ahern and his posse of crooks repeatedly, collectively permitted Lenihan to hand over our future earnings to foreign banksters, and are collectively, docilely accepting every rod prepared for our back.

I am proud to be Irish, but being Irish now means the same it meant for so long - having to leave to have a future because you're not part of a tiny golden circle for whose sole benefit this country is corruptly run.

And while I'm proud to be Irish, I will say this - right now I'd be a damn sight prouder to be Icelandic or Greek. At least they stood up and said no to having their future wealth robbed from them.

Oh_Noes

CommuterIE wrote: »

We are staring at least two decades of stagnation and depression... 70's and 80's basically, its sad but true... taxes will only go up, social welfare will go down, the only viable place to get is out of here

I remember growing up in the '80s which was the same kind of deal. My parents could have moved to England but I'm delighted they didn't, we had a happy life here and I don't regret it in the slightest.

I'd love to live here for the rest of my life. Money isn't everything.

Resi12

No, no great resources at all here for much I am interested in unfortunately.

T2daK

CommuterIE wrote: »

Sure how could you gaurantee them anything?? Unemployment is @ 15% nearly, and trust me, it will hit 20% in the coming years, our problems haven't even started!!!! thanks to governments not putting proper austerity in NOW!

because i'll rob enough money to last generations....oops ireland has non to rob. we're ****ED

blackdog2

Nope, getting my education here and then upping sticks

parker kent

Cavehill Red wrote: »

When everyone's completed their education in Ireland (soon enough, thank God), we'll be off.

This is an example of the needlessly dramatic as I mentioned earlier. Everyone won't be leaving. Sure some will, but obviously everybody won't leave.

I say this as a recent graduate too, so I can't be accused of being out of touch with students.

pragmatic1

All my family live in Ireland and a good lot of friends. Its where I grew up so naturally I have a strong affinity to the place. Dont care if I have to go back to living off the land. Staying put.

Cavehill Red

parker kent wrote: »

This is an example of the needlessly dramatic as I mentioned earlier. Everyone won't be leaving. Sure some will, but obviously everybody won't leave.

I say this as a recent graduate too, so I can't be accused of being out of touch with students.

You've misread what I wrote. I was referring to everyone in my house. We'll all be off as soon as the last one completes their education.
So easy on the misplaced allegations of sensationalism. I've no doubt that plenty of people will stay and sign up for two decades of pointless impoverishment. People stayed in this place through worse times before (1840s, for example.)
That doesn't make it sensible in general for people to do so, though many are trapped here financially for many years even if they wished to leave.
Those who do leave are the ones you'd most wish would stay - the self-starters, the young and well-educated, the entrepreneurs, those keen to achieve.
Farmers will stay (and likely suffer). So will the third generation doleys. So will the golden circle of course. And when all's said and done, they'll be the only cohort for whom it makes sense to stay.

pragmatic1

Cavehill Red wrote: »

You've misread what I wrote. I was referring to everyone in my house. We'll all be off as soon as the last one completes their education.
So easy on the misplaced allegations of sensationalism. I've no doubt that plenty of people will stay and sign up for two decades of pointless impoverishment. People stayed in this place through worse times before (1840s, for example.)
That doesn't make it sensible in general for people to do so, though many are trapped here financially for many years even if they wished to leave.
Those who do leave are the ones you'd most wish would stay - the self-starters, the young and well-educated, the entrepreneurs, those keen to achieve.
Farmers will stay (and likely suffer). So will the third generation doleys. So will the golden circle of course. And when all's said and done, they'll be the only cohort for whom it makes sense to stay.

Not really. Actually loads of jobs in IT, science and engineering.

Teyla Emmagan

I don't want to be anywhere else to be honest. I've lived in a few other places, but there's no place like home.

Right now I can keep up with the bills and I hope to have kids in the future. My family are here, and I want to raise any children I might have to be Irish, and in the place I grew up myself. I believe in this country, I would hate to be anywhere else, even if the quality of life was better.

D1stant

Cavehill Red wrote: »

You've misread what I wrote. I was referring to everyone in my house. We'll all be off as soon as the last one completes their education.
So easy on the misplaced allegations of sensationalism. I've no doubt that plenty of people will stay and sign up for two decades of pointless impoverishment. People stayed in this place through worse times before (1840s, for example.)
That doesn't make it sensible in general for people to do so, though many are trapped here financially for many years even if they wished to leave.
Those who do leave are the ones you'd most wish would stay - the self-starters, the young and well-educated, the entrepreneurs, those keen to achieve.
Farmers will stay (and likely suffer). So will the third generation doleys. So will the golden circle of course. And when all's said and done, they'll be the only cohort for whom it makes sense to stay.

You kind of miswrote what he read

Bon Voyage

Noo

pragmatic1 wrote: »

Not really. Actually loads of jobs in IT, science and engineering.

Only speaking as a graduate of the above. There are no jobs for graduates in engineering, hence the point being made that it is the young and educated leaving. I'm motivated to currently work 9-5:30 mon-fri for free but i'm emigrating in january.

parker kent

Cavehill Red wrote: »

You've misread what I wrote. I was referring to everyone in my house. We'll all be off as soon as the last one completes their education.
So easy on the misplaced allegations of sensationalism. I've no doubt that plenty of people will stay and sign up for two decades of pointless impoverishment. People stayed in this place through worse times before (1840s, for example.)

You said:

When everyone's completed their education in Ireland (soon enough, thank God), we'll be off.

That does not mention your housemates. Saying they are misplaced allegations of sensationalism and then following that up with bull about "two decades of pointless impoverishment" is sensational wouldn't you say? Unless you have access to a crystal ball and are 100% positive that all the people staying are signing up for such a dramatic outcome?

Cavehill Red

pragmatic1 wrote: »

Not really. Actually loads of jobs in IT, science and engineering.

Many of the jobs in IT require foreign languages, I note from employment websites. Which suggests to me that they may be call centre-related. In any case, they tend to go to foreign nationals.
And while we do have a useful IT business infrastructure here, I would fear that it could transpire to be as mobile as the former computer manufacturing industry here was. In my experience, many IT entrepreneurs I'm aware of have already headed for Calif or London.
I couldn't comment on science except, again, anecdotally. Of all the recent science graduates I know, which is admittedly not too many, only one is employed and that in the public sector in an unrelated employment field. The rest are unemployed, in further education or abroad. I've heard of post-doc lab positions for 25K, which is hardly going to entice people to remain here.
There may well be jobs in engineering, but it would seem to me that the downturn of construction projects will have an adverse affect there too.
I hope you understand, I'm not trying to rubbish what you're saying. Of course Ireland is not the Horn of Africa. But our economy has been effectively destroyed for a long time to come, and that has knock-on effects in terms of living standards, infrastructure, employment prospects and a lot of other things that people might wish to have in their lives. And seeking those things, those people will inevitably move abroad.

parker kent

Cavehill Red wrote: »

Those who do leave are the ones you'd most wish would stay - the self-starters, the young and well-educated, the entrepreneurs, those keen to achieve.

Farmers will stay (and likely suffer). So will the third generation doleys. So will the golden circle of course. And when all's said and done, they'll be the only cohort for whom it makes sense to stay.

Also this is a load of nonsense. I'm staying and I'm not a farmer or in a golden circle. I'm not a third generation "doley". I have a degree and 2 masters, I'm pretty well educated. I could freely travel elsewhere if I so wished. But I want to live in Ireland and I'm getting that opportunity.

easyeason3

Cavehill Red wrote: »

Many of the jobs in IT require foreign languages, I note from employment websites. Which suggests to me that they may be call centre-related. In any case, they tend to go to foreign nationals.
And while we do have a useful IT business infrastructure here, I would fear that it could transpire to be as mobile as the former computer manufacturing industry here was. In my experience, many IT entrepreneurs I'm aware of have already headed for Calif or London.
I couldn't comment on science except, again, anecdotally. Of all the recent science graduates I know, which is admittedly not too many, only one is employed and that in the public sector in an unrelated employment field. The rest are unemployed, in further education or abroad. I've heard of post-doc lab positions for 25K, which is hardly going to entice people to remain here.
There may well be jobs in engineering, but it would seem to me that the downturn of construction projects will have an adverse affect there too.
I hope you understand, I'm not trying to rubbish what you're saying. Of course Ireland is not the Horn of Africa. But our economy has been effectively destroyed for a long time to come, and that has knock-on effects in terms of living standards, infrastructure, employment prospects and a lot of other things that people might wish to have in their lives. And seeking those things, those people will inevitably move abroad.

You said in an earlier post that you plan on emigrating.
Where do you plan on going & why pick that country?

Sleepy

I can see a fairly impoverished future for myself and my family but we're stuck here. Were I in the position to emigrate, I'd already be in Sydney or the UK tbh.

Cavehill Red

parker kent wrote: »

That does not mention your housemates.

I said that we would all have completed education "soon enough, thank God". Since more people enter education every year, it's obviously impossible to interpret that as referring to the entire nation. Nevertheless you did so, presumably because you skimmed what I'd written or else wished to deliberately misinterpret what I'd written.

parker kent wrote: »

Saying they are misplaced allegations of sensationalism and then following that up with bull about "two decades of pointless impoverishment" is sensational wouldn't you say?

Not at all. The impoverishment is the result of the state taking liability for debts accrued by banks. Hence pointless. It burdened all of us with a debt that we never accrued, and hence had not benefitted from.
This mistake - the conflation of Celtic Tiger excess with the state of the nation's debt crisis - is a common error. We're not in this crap because people bought houses for too much or had flash holidays and cars. Those who did so still owe those debts personally. The state's debt is a large multiple of our recent deficit, singularly as a result of Lenihan's insane decision to assume liability for broken banks.
That leaves the debate over how long it will take to process this debt. Germany finally paid off a similarly scaled debt following WW1 only a couple of years ago. In the intervening 90 odd years, they admittedly suffered another war defeat, but followed that up with decades of exceptional manufacturing and export success.
On the basis of that single example, I'd say 20 years was me being optimistic. What is much more likely to happen is a sovereign default, which would be significantly uglier again than a couple of decades of moribund stagflation where every penny of profit we turn gets handed over to AIB's creditors.

parker kent wrote: »

Unless you have access to a crystal ball and are 100% positive that all the people staying are signing up for such a dramatic outcome?

Two points here - it doesn't take a crystal ball to be aware that the national debt is now utterly unsustainable and that kicking the can repeatedly down the road will result in Japanese style stagnation without their export capacity or indigenous savings to draw upon.
Secondly, I agree with you. People haven't signed up for what's coming. I think the vast majority of people are still hoping it will all somehow work out fine and go away. The dreams of quickly returning to the Celtic Tiger are finally dying off, but I see no evidence that people in general comprehend that economies can go backwards and quite dramatically so, nor that they realise that Ireland isn't just flirting with such an event but is already enmired in it.

Dangerous Man

Mickjg wrote: »

I moved stateside last year and to be honest I don't really see a future for me there. I loved living in Ireland, and there's plenty of things I miss but not enough to bring me home. I feel that the scumbag element is just so off putting and there's no future there in my career.

I went back for a two week holiday, had a nice time but was happy to be leaving.

It makes me sick to say it but I have to agree with this. I love Dublin so much but scummers are allowed to walk around and just ruin people's lives with no recriminations. I was there recently and the sheer amount of them depressed me; it really is getting worse. Where I live now, it's just not tolerated.

Cavehill Red

parker kent wrote: »

Also this is a load of nonsense. I'm staying and I'm not a farmer or in a golden circle. I'm not a third generation "doley". I have a degree and 2 masters, I'm pretty well educated. I could freely travel elsewhere if I so wished. But I want to live in Ireland and I'm getting that opportunity.

Good luck to you. It won't be easy. You may end up regretting your decision. But I admire your courage to wish to live in the land of your birth and heritage. However, for me and for many others, there are other priorities such as securing opportunity and a decent standard of living for our families.

starbelgrade

WE'RE ALL DOOMED!

Meh.

Cavehill Red

easyeason3 wrote: »

You said in an earlier post that you plan on emigrating.
Where do you plan on going & why pick that country?

With my particular skillset, I'd be primarily looking to the English-speaking world, most likely North America.
However, I'm aware that most of those countries also have economic difficulties, but not as exacerbated as we do.
In an ideal situation, I'd like to be moving to one of the countries on the way up rather than on the way down. Instead, it's more a game of 'pick the least fecked.'

ilovesleep

CommuterIE wrote: »

We are staring at least two decades of stagnation and depression... 70's and 80's basically, its sad but true... taxes will only go up, social welfare will go down, the only viable place to get is out of here

It doesn't bear thinking of.

For people who lived through the 80s recession - How was it? I mean I don't want to be working just to pay bills and only bills and have nothing left over at the end of each month for a meal out, or drinks, or cinema, or other leisurely activities.

parker kent

Cavehill Red wrote: »

I said that we would all have completed education "soon enough, thank God". Since more people enter education every year, it's obviously impossible to interpret that as referring to the entire nation. Nevertheless you did so, presumably because you skimmed what I'd written or else wished to deliberately misinterpret what I'd written.

Or maybe you just made bags of writing the post. Now if I were writing that post I would start:

"As my housemates and I will be finished education soon, we will..."

Anyway, enjoy leaving Ireland.

easyeason3

Cavehill Red wrote: »

With my particular skillset, I'd be primarily looking to the English-speaking world, most likely North America.
However, I'm aware that most of those countries also have economic difficulties, but not as exacerbated as we do.
In an ideal situation, I'd like to be moving to one of the countries on the way up rather than on the way down. Instead, it's more a game of 'pick the least fecked.'

Well best of luck to you whenever you do go.
Even if I didn't have a mortgage I don't think I'd emigrate to be honest.

Cavehill Red

parker kent wrote: »

Or maybe you just made bags of writing the post. Now if I were writing that post I would start:

"As my housemates and I will be finished education soon, we will..."

Anyway, enjoy leaving Ireland.

See, I wouldn't write that, because I don't have 'housemates'. I have children. Your inability to comprehend is not my problem.
I fully intend to enjoy leaving Ireland and am currently discontented solely by the fact that I can't leave sooner and start on a more successful existence more quickly.
I hope you'll find a similar joy in paying personally for the mistakes of Fingleton et al for most if not all of your productive working life.

Absurdum

beats being in Italy

steddyeddy

CommuterIE wrote: »

Do you see a future for yourself, family, potential family in Ireland?

I don't really for myself, never mind potential family

No I dont to be honest I will have to make a move after I further educate myself. Once I do that Im out. I did it before to get an education in the first place and Im sorry to say Ill do it again. Theres just to many mistakes this country is making to make life here worthwhile.

PseudoFamous

Cavehill Red wrote: »

See, I wouldn't write that, because I don't have 'housemates'. I have children. Your inability to comprehend is not my problem.

Your inability to admit you wrote a terribly worded sentence, is, however, your problem.

Cavehill Red wrote: »

I fully intend to enjoy leaving Ireland and am currently discontented solely by the fact that I can't leave sooner and start on a more successful existence more quickly.

Grass is always greener. While you say this, I get the impression that you think of many jobs as below you, and we can't do anything to change your opinion, and I personally can't be arsed mounting an argument.

Cavehill Red wrote: »

I hope you'll find a similar joy in paying personally for the mistakes of Fingleton et al for most if not all of your productive working life.

Pssht, it's not as if you aren't going to be paying a pretty penny in whatever country you're going to, in some shape or form, which will be spent on things you don't approve of there, too.

Lord TSC

parker kent wrote: »

Also this is a load of nonsense. I'm staying and I'm not a farmer or in a golden circle. I'm not a third generation "doley". I have a degree and 2 masters, I'm pretty well educated. I could freely travel elsewhere if I so wished. But I want to live in Ireland and I'm getting that opportunity.

I'm with you Parker I'm the same in terms of being educated and such and I've no intentions of leaving. Hell, you look at America, Italy and Spain struggling financially as well and you wonder is there anywhere that's still in a golden period?

Regardless, I grew up in Ireland, my family and friends are in Ireland and I've always been an optamistic. There's a lot of people jumping ship without even trying to do something, happy to abandon ship with sensationalist ideas running through their heads, hyperbole dripping from their tounges.

parker kent

Cavehill Red wrote: »

See, I wouldn't write that, because I don't have 'housemates'. I have children. Your inability to comprehend is not my problem.
I fully intend to enjoy leaving Ireland and am currently discontented solely by the fact that I can't leave sooner and start on a more successful existence more quickly.
I hope you'll find a similar joy in paying personally for the mistakes of Fingleton et al for most if not all of your productive working life.

Your ability to write seems to be the problem. When people refer to students finishing education whilst referring to people in their house finishing education, it is pretty normal to infer they are housemates. Since at no stage did you say otherwise (including the numerous times the word housemates was used), I'm not sure why I have "inability to comprehend". Perhaps if you were a little clearer in your posts or expected us to read your mind a little less.

Not that it matters anyway as it just highlights how unclear the post in question was.

steddyeddy

ilovesleep wrote: »

It doesn't bear thinking of.

For people who lived through the 80s recession - How was it? I mean I don't want to be working just to pay bills and only bills and have nothing left over at the end of each month for a meal out, or drinks, or cinema, or other leisurely activities.

In the eighties we had no money but most of us didnt have the debts some people do now.

CommuterIE

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

I'm with you Parker I'm the same in terms of being educated and such and I've no intentions of leaving. Hell, you look at America, Italy and Spain struggling financially as well and you wonder is there anywhere that's still in a golden period?

Regardless, I grew up in Ireland, my family and friends are in Ireland and I've always been an optamistic. There's a lot of people jumping ship without even trying to do something, happy to abandon ship with sensationalist ideas running through their heads, hyperbole dripping from their tounges.

America is not struggling financially :rolleyes:

Oh_Noes

PseudoFamous wrote: »

Grass is always greener. While you say this, I get the impression that you think of many jobs as below you, and we can't do anything to change your opinion

Luckily enough, all the top employers in the US and Australia are just hanging around the airports waiting for recently graduated young Irish people to get off the plane.

Sure if that wasn't the case you'd have to work your way up from the bottom, just like you have to do in Ireland.

easyeason3

steddyeddy wrote: »

In the eighties we had no money but most of us didnt have the debts some people do now.

Very true.
My parents never owned a credit card, never had a mortgage, never had a car loan etc.
We didn't wear Levi's when they were in but we didn't go hungry either.