New Household Tax - Boycott

bkeano

Hi all Boardies

Can we all please make a stance here and get our non boardies to do the same. Enough is Enough We should not pay this new household Tax. Its the same as the Poll tax in the UK. I am an normal Joe Soap with 2 kids. I cant pay any more Taxes. I can afford it as it is. I am lucky to have my Job.

We need to mount a serious objection here and nationwide.

thanks
Brian

bkeano

come people are we going to take all this crap

RedXIV

As another someone with 2 kids, I sympathise. but I'm not gonna get thrown out of my house for an extra €9 a month

Jumpy

bkeano wrote: »

Hi all Boardies

Can we all please make a stance here and get our non boardies to do the same. Enough is Enough We should not pay this new household Tax. Its the same as the Poll tax in the UK. I am an normal Joe Soap with 2 kids. I cant pay any more Taxes. I can afford it as it is. I am lucky to have my Job.

We need to mount a serious objection here and nationwide.

thanks
Brian

How much is your internet costing you?

ei.sdraob

Apparently it be 100 euro in first year, who is this paid for Revenue or Local council?? what will the tax go towards exactly??

mikemac

Minister for the Environment Phil Hogan is expected to announce a new temporary “household charge” of €100 per year later this afternoon.

Proposals for the new tax, viewed as a forerunner to a property tax and a water charge, were presented by the Minister to the Cabinet this morning.

So are people with their own wells paying the full charge or not? So little information out there

ncc1699

I won't be paying it. If you were getting something for this charge like your bins being collected I would have considered it but it's just another tax to get us out of the mess we are in.

The majority of the Irish people didn't cause the situation we find ourselves in, useless politicians and dodgy bankers did!

And isn't it ironic how Fine Gael were the party that were lashing fianna fail in the last government for trying to tax the Irish people out of a recession and that they wouldn't succeed with it

Einhard

bkeano wrote: »

Hi all Boardies

Can we all please make a stance here and get our non boardies to do the same. Enough is Enough We should not pay this new household Tax. Its the same as the Poll tax in the UK. I am an normal Joe Soap with 2 kids. I cant pay any more Taxes. I can afford it as it is. I am lucky to have my Job.

We need to mount a serious objection here and nationwide.

thanks
Brian

Please don't presume to talk for everyone. I note the way you shift from "we" to "I" in the course of your post, in that "we should not pay this new household Tax", and then "I cant pay any more taxes". If you can't afford the taxes, you'll likely get an exemption. After that, whether you pay or not is up to you. But these posts by people who seek to project their own disillusion and anger about policies onto the rest of us, and thus subtly judge those who don't share those views, are getting a bit tiresome. I think the new charges are both reasonable and necessary, so I'll be paying them. Good luck to you if you won't, but I doubt your children will thank you when the water is cut off.

rubberdiddies

€100 might seem reasonable to you now but will you feel the same in 5 years when the total of your household tax and water usage bills amount to €1000 per year?

Although I'm sure once we are being charged we can claim back for every night the water is cut off here during the summer.
Oh wait, this is Ireland!

LeixlipRed

Worrying how some people can't connect the introduction of such a tax and the dangerous precedent it sets for the future. The "eh, it's only 100 euro, I can afford that, can't you?" attitude is shortsighted. Absolutely support a boycott, another indirect tax which will of course hit those least well off in society more than the rich. Watch this space for a huge grassroots campaign on the issue from the ULA.

Also, can anyone tell me how this affects people in rented accommodation? Would the landlord or tenants have to pay?

Einhard

rubberdiddies wrote: »

€100 might seem reasonable to you now but will you feel the same in 5 years when the total of your household tax and water usage bills amount to €1000 per year?

Although I'm sure once we are being charged we can claim back for every night the water is cut off here during the summer.
Oh wait, this is Ireland!

Well your tax rates might seem reasonable now, but will you feel the same in 5 years time when they are 100% of all income, and the first born child of every family! Will you?? Huh??

Everyone can play that game...

rubberdiddies

Einhard wrote: »

Well you're tax rates might seem reasonable now, but will you feel the same in 5 years time when they are 100% of all income, and the first born child of every family! Will you?? Huh??

Everyone can play that game...

As a business owner who pays water rates already I know how much it costs each year once you start to be metered. And I uses lot less water in my business than I do in the house

subway

too late, country f&cked.
pay up or leave. govt cant cut any more expenditure.

CiaranC

bkeano wrote: »

come people are we going to take all this crap

Yes.

Yes we are.

Uriel.

LeixlipRed wrote: »

Worrying how some people can't connect the introduction of such a tax and the dangerous precedent it sets for the future. The "eh, it's only 100 euro, I can afford that, can't you?" attitude is shortsighted. Absolutely support a boycott, another indirect tax which will of course hit those least well off in society more than the rich. Watch this space for a huge grassroots campaign on the issue from the ULA.

Also, can anyone tell me how this affects people in rented accommodation? Would the landlord or tenants have to pay?

I am sure most people see that the €100 rate won't last forever and it is likely to increase, but at the end of the day, household taxes are quite normal in modern economies and WE (the STATE) needs all the money WE can get.

Low income families will be exempt.

You can have your grassroots campaign, but the ULA will do well not to rely on my support.

As it is coined as a Household tax, I assume it will be the tenant that pays. Landlords already pay a tax of €200 per property.

ncc1699

LeixlipRed wrote: »

Also, can anyone tell me how this affects people in rented accommodation? Would the landlord or tenants have to pay?

Matt Cooper made the point the other night that it would be the responsibility of the landlord but that more then likely this would be passed down to the tenant as part of their rental charge, but he was only giving his own private opinion

Einhard

CiaranC wrote: »

Yes.

Yes we are.

Is Féidir linn!! :pac:

meglome

ncc1699 wrote: »

I won't be paying it. If you were getting something for this charge like your bins being collected I would have considered it but it's just another tax to get us out of the mess we are in.

The majority of the Irish people didn't cause the situation we find ourselves in, useless politicians and dodgy bankers did!

And isn't it ironic how Fine Gael were the party that were lashing fianna fail in the last government for trying to tax the Irish people out of a recession and that they wouldn't succeed with it

I am really sick of all the crying. We are not taxed heavily in this country and the rich are paying most of our taxes. The poorer will either be exempt from paying or will be paying basically no tax already so the €100 is not the end of the world.

If we had been paying a property tax and a water tax all along we would have decent water pipes and we wouldn't have gone mad wasting fast money got from stamp duty.

Liam Byrne

meglome wrote: »

I am really sick of all the crying. We are not taxed heavily in this country and the rich are paying most of our taxes.

We are not directly taxed heavily in this country, but we are screwed by stealth taxes and "I can't believe it's not a tax" taxes.

Is this "household charge" going to be the same in areas that have County Council bin removals as those who have to pay private operators ?

ei.sdraob

meglome wrote: »

I am really sick of all the crying. We are not taxed heavily in this country and the rich are paying most of our taxes. The poorer will either be exempt from paying or will be paying basically no tax already so the €100 is not the end of the world.

If we had been paying a property tax and a water tax all along we would have decent water pipes and we wouldn't have gone mad wasting fast money got from stamp duty.

Property taxes in 4 digit range did not prevent property bubbles in other countries.

Seve OB

We roll over and die to easily in this country.

The recent introduction of this pension thing where the government decided that the good citizens who decided to put a few bob away for their retirement should be the ones to bail out the country.

This was the very same as if they dipped into any savings accounts we might have tucked away.

They are short of a few bob, but if they were honest and said that from now on you can only claim relief at the standard rate or even if they said you have to pay 1% of future pension contributions it would have earned them a hell of a lot more cash and would not have been at all devious, but up from and honest, but oh God no way could a politician be honest. And as for their excuse of the relief we got on it, not all people claim relief at the high rate and I would hazzard a guess that most don't, so that is poppycock.

So many people say sure isn't it only half a percent.... it's not, it was .6% of your money every six months for the next two years, 2.4%.

Ah sure it's only 2.4%...... Only me arse, until next time they come looking, and now there is a precedent set. I'm tellin ya, get your savings into another country because they will want them next!

As for the "household charge" I'm in for the Boycot, F"<& them I wont be paying. A few years ago we all of a sudden had to pay twice for our bins in Fingal. We always had tags so no problem, out with the sheckels, round to spar and about €5 or €6 later you bin was gone. It was Fine Gael who brought in the annual charge on top of this of €110 and the bin tag is about €8.50 now!! Fine Gael scum, we should have known the would try every underhanded method to steal our money.

Now on the other side, I do realise that we are completely knackered in this country, or as the crowd standard and pores call us, "junk". Our water has been in dire straits for years and if you ask me we have dont nothing about it. We are in Ireland for God's sake, water should not be an issue, sure doesn't it rain 597 days a year!

Someone needs to fix the pipes etc to solve the problem, and I don't mind paying for that in a fair and reasonable method, so for everyone connected to the water mains, and only those connected to the water mains a meter should be installed, with maybe a small flat fee to allow you so many gallons of water and then a charge per gallon thereafter. The point of the meter should be for water conservation purposes and not as a revenue raising tool.

If that c#^t Moany Joany Brutal or Leo lap Dog Vladivofstock ever come near my house again I will turn the bloody hose on them

meglome

Liam Byrne wrote: »

We are not directly taxed heavily in this country, but we are screwed by stealth taxes and "I can't believe it's not a tax" taxes.

The rich are paying most of our tax. Though I disagree that we are heavily taxed it's irrelevant as the poor aren't paying much tax of any kind.

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Is this "household charge" going to be the same in areas that have County Council bin removals as those who have to pay private operators ?

There are questions to be answered about this charge, no doubt. It's still not an unreasonable charge though nor does it add up to high taxes.

ei.sdraob wrote: »

Property taxes in 4 digit range did not prevent property bubbles in other countries.

Sure. Our fat wads of stamp duty let us go mad throwing money at everything. Instead of trimming the PS we bloated it, instead of fixing anything we threw money at it in the hopes it would go away. A yearly property tax wouldn't have allowed the same recklessness.

stevieob wrote: »

We roll over and die to easily in this country.

As for the "household charge" I'm in for the Boycot, F"<& them I wont be paying. A few years ago we all of a sudden had to pay twice for our bins in Fingal. We always had tags so no problem, out with the sheckels, round to spar and about €5 or €6 later you bin was gone. It was Fine Gael who brought in the annual charge on top of this of €110 and the bin tag is about €8.50 now!! Fine Gael scum, we should have known the would try every underhanded method to steal our money.

Why let the fact we are not a high tax country get in the way of a rant.

ei.sdraob

meglome wrote: »

Sure. Our fat wads of stamp duty let us go mad throwing money at everything. Instead of trimming the PS we bloated it, instead of fixing anything we threw money at it in the hopes it would go away. A yearly property tax wouldn't have allowed the same recklessness.

A constitutional spending limit with provision for saving of X if economy is growing above Y% a year would have been much better idea, and as added bonus would require a referendum to change the limit, taking the power of being reckless out of the hands of politicians.

Anyways property taxes are often used by local councils to maintain the local area, this it seems will just disappear into a multitude of black holes and not actually go towards roads, water etc
There is no mention of this revenue stream being ring fenced. It is yet another tax with little to show for it, dont make any mistakes.

meglome

ei.sdraob wrote: »

Anyways property taxes are often used by local councils to maintain the local area, this it seems will just disappear into a multitude of black holes and not actually go towards roads, water etc
There is no mention of this revenue stream being ring fenced. It is yet another tax with little to show for it, dont make any mistakes.

Hopefully not but in the present situation who knows.

What happened the the TV licence thing. Were our money was going to the government instead of RTE, BCI

FreudianSlippers

I think it's a great tax and should probably be higher in all honesty.

ei.sdraob

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

I think it's a great tax and should probably be higher in all honesty.

What exactly is great about it

ncc1699

meglome wrote: »

I am really sick of all the crying. We are not taxed heavily in this country and the rich are paying most of our taxes. The poorer will either be exempt from paying or will be paying basically no tax already so the €100 is not the end of the world.

If we had been paying a property tax and a water tax all along we would have decent water pipes and we wouldn't have gone mad wasting fast money got from stamp duty.

No crying going on here Meglome. I'm stating my intent to not pay this as I believe I shouldn't have to. It may backfire on me and probably will going by the opinions of some people on this forum.

I'm just stating my opinion on it, like you are stating yours!

careca11

RedXIV wrote: »

As another someone with 2 kids, I sympathise. but I'm not gonna get thrown out of my house for an extra €9 a month

eh , they can't throw you out of your house for not paying the household charge (only the non-payment of your mortgage/rent can get you thrown out )
We must take a stand , the gov must realise that they need to cut expenditure (espcially from within the amount of money paid to themselves)

if no-body pays they can't actually do anything to you

!3theraven

RedXIV wrote: »

As another someone with 2 kids, I sympathise. but I'm not gonna get thrown out of my house for an extra €9 a month

If you accept paying €9 a month now, do you think it will still be €9 a month the year after or two years from now? what will you do if and when it comes to €20 a month or more then that? its obvious the €100 a year charge is only a foot in the door tactic to get people to say that,s not much I can afford that, once you say that and accept it, just watch as the goverment rack up the property tax each and every year afterwards.

Its time to now to take a stand and refuse to pay any property tax, if we don,t do it now, we will look back in a good few years time when property tax could be say €1000 a year and wonder why didn,t we resist when they tried to get a foot in the door?

careca11

meglome wrote: »

Why let the fact we are not a high tax country get in the way of a rant.

We are not a low income tax Country , but overall YES we are a HIGH TAXED country (you name it in this country and you will find there is a tax on it)

this household charge will be used to prop up the salaries of the country councils who are claiming they are broke .
Just like the TV LICENSE pays for all the big wigs in RTE (who in turn claim their salaries thru , they're own self run production businesses thus availing of tax loopholes where the likes of Pat Kenny etc only pay tax at the lower rate )

mikom

And remember kids some RTE executive with a mansion in Ballsbridge will be paying the same household tax as Paddy the the street sweeper with a 2 bedroom cottage.
Fair and balanced as Fox news likes to say.

Einhard

careca11 wrote: »

We must take a stand , the gov must realise that they need to cut expenditure (espcially from within the amount of money paid to themselves)

I'm with you, and so are the people of Rosscommon, who stoically accepted that their A&E was an unaffordable luxury in the current climate, and assented to its closure.

Oh, no, wait a moment...

The government are slashing expenditure and are being condemned for it. The they seek to raise monies, and are condemned for it. You can;t have it every which way.

if no-body pays they can't actually do anything to you

Yoooinnnnnnk!

That's the sound of the government swiping the charge from your pay/SW!

Einhard

!3theraven wrote: »

If you accept paying €9 a month now, do you think it will still be €9 a month the year after or two years from now? what will you do if and when it comes to €20 a month or more then that? its obvious the €100 a year charge is only a foot in the door tactic to get people to say that,s not much I can afford that, once you say that and accept it, just watch as the goverment rack up the property tax each and every year afterwards.

Its time to now to take a stand and refuse to pay any property tax, if we don,t do it now, we will look back in a good few years time when property tax could be say €1000 a year and wonder why didn,t we resist when they tried to get a foot in the door?

So you're going to protest now against a rather reasonable charge on the entire hypothetical scenario that it could be punitive in years to come? If that were the standard for outrage, we'd be marching against everything.

hatrickpatrick

Ireland's average response: Bend over and take it up the ass to continue funding bailed out gangsters.

WAKE THE F*** UP, PEOPLE.

Zubeneschamali

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

WAKE THE F*** UP, PEOPLE.

In case you missed it, we had an election, and the current Government won it.

They are now doing what they said they would do: sticking to the EU/IMF plan without raising income taxes.

meglome

ncc1699 wrote: »

No crying going on here Meglome. I'm stating my intent to not pay this as I believe I shouldn't have to. It may backfire on me and probably will going by the opinions of some people on this forum.

I'm just stating my opinion on it, like you are stating yours!

But why shouldn't you have to? There are many thing to protest in about this country but a €100 property/water tax isn't one of them IMHO. I keep repeating this... we are not a high tax country especially for the lower paid so it really not unreasonable to pay this charge. As long as the money is used to install water meters so that people ultimately pay for what the use.

Liam Byrne

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

In case you missed it, we had an election, and the current Government won it.

They are now doing what they said they would do: sticking to the EU/IMF plan without raising income taxes.

That's a complete con.

"Not raising taxes" while "creating completely new ones" is just another way of doing the stupid "we'll have no new taxes but we'll call this a 'levy'" bull.

It's a tax. It comes (directly or indirectly) out of your income.

Meanwhile the rats that ruined the country get €500,000 payoffs and massive pensions and will never see jail or have to pay compensation or even account for their actions.

Absolutely and utterly sickening.

Zubeneschamali

Liam Byrne wrote: »

That's a complete con.

No, it isn't. They specifically said they wouldn't raise income taxes.

Raising levies, fuel taxes, local charges, excise duty etc. etc. is not the same thing, and tends to fall on a broader section of the public. Only half of workers pay income taxes.

s_gr

This is a complete joke, well i for one having paid huge stamp duty will NOT be paying any more..... ive prepaid for the next 30 years. Wheres our exemption? Mass Boycott is the only way!!!!!!!!!!!!

Vanbis

Ex: If someone has spent the past 30yrs paying their mortage and now they own their house out right, what exactly can they do if they refuse to pay the tax?

bkeano

bkeano wrote: »

Its the same as the Poll tax in the UK.

It's nothing like what they have in UK, and it's called a Council Tax. The UK Council Tax you pay helps pay for the services provided in the area you live in, ie. policing, bins, water charges etc... The rate of Council Tax you pay is based on the value of your home.

All I heard today so far about this new "household tax" is that it is been brought in to generate an annual Revenue of €150 million. It's just another money making racket from which we will see no benefit to us or the towns and cities we live in :mad:. So it is nothing like the UK system.

seamus

Vanbis wrote: »

Ex: If someone has spent the past 30yrs paying their mortage and now they own their house out right, what exactly can they do if they refuse to pay the tax?

Exactly the same as what happens if you don't pay a TV licence, or income tax or a whole pile of other things.

1. Send you a warning notice
2. Heap on penalty fees
3. Take you to court
4. Throw you in jail

I'm confused as to why you think ownership of the property has any bearing on paying such a tax?

I imagine the intention is for all households to pay it (renting or owner), but the logistics of levying a fee on renters is troublesome, so more likely the landlord will be obliged to pay it on their behalf.

FreudianSlippers

s_gr wrote: »

This is a complete joke, well i for one having paid huge stamp duty will NOT be paying any more..... ive prepaid for the next 30 years. Wheres our exemption? Mass Boycott is the only way!!!!!!!!!!!!

This isn't a replacement of stamp duty though...

Einhard

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Ireland's average response: Bend over and take it up the ass to continue funding bailed out gangsters.

WAKE THE F*** UP, PEOPLE.

hatpatrick's proposed response: do something, anything, just for the sake of it, to show we have a bit of mettle, then hope to God everything works out all right.

Vanbis

seamus wrote: »

I'm confused as to why you think ownership of the property has any bearing on paying such a tax?

Just curious was all.

Trampas

Those in receipt of mortgage interest supplement will not have to pay the charge, nor will those living in social housing or so-called 'ghost estates'.

Can someone define what a 'ghost estate' is?

Where I live there are houses which have remained unsold and the road in the estate is not finished. People have had to build slopes from the road to the footpath since there is about a 6 inch step between the road and the footpath. There is a slope on the footpath for cars but since the road is not finished or never will be finished since the developer is bust. Does that count as a 'ghost estate' or will a 'ghost estate' be impossible to an exact definition.

nextbestintown

Thank Christ for this. Tied into a rental lease as house prices collapse further.

This is temporary though. By 2014, there will be an AVERAGE tax of 500eur and a water tax on average of 400eur...

x

DoesNotCompute

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/ghost-estate-residents-exempt-from-euro100-household-tax-2831535.html

So now people who bought in ghost estates are exempt? WTF, loike?

msg11

nextbestintown wrote: »

Thank Christ for this. Tied into a rental lease as house prices collapse further.

This is temporary though. By 2014, there will be an AVERAGE tax of 500eur and a water tax on average of 400eur...

x

In 2014 we won't have any money left if we keep going at this rate. This is taking more money away for people to spend in shops etc...

The way I see it, the IMF are going to ruin us they don't give a bollox like any company they just want to make money.

And we will be ruined anyway if we don't get money into the country.

So to be honest, we are better just letting this place go to the wall no point in putting it off for a few years.

Tim Robbins

I'm in favour of property tax. We pay management fees of 1.5K to just provide general upkeep of the place we live. This would indicate that those not getting private companies (which don't forget compete) to provide upkeep of their estates are getting at least 1.5K from the state to pay the county council to do it. Unless the public sector is mega efficient and can do it for less which is exceptionally unlikely. It's also a good way to get self employed people who dodge tax to actually pay some.

It would seem fairer then that people pay property tax based on the consumer pays principle. The more upkeep the common areas for your house require the more you should have to pay.

The tax should be in proportion to size of the gaf.