"Rates NOT Payable in Ireland"/The Common Law Society

RGDATA!

Somehow got subscribed to an email list, won't name the sender, but they're representing themselves as "The Common Law Society".

The gist of the repeated mails is that businesses are not legally required to pay rates. Excerpt (edited for brevity) follows. Just looking for thoughts on this. I'd be interested to hear someone with an informed opinion on how such a scenario might play out - i.e. I refuse to pay my rates, demand an invoice from the council and to see the contract which binds me to pay etc.

You DO NOT have to PAY rates in Ireland (Legally)!
Your local county council know this and are hiding from this LAWFUL FACT ... STOP PAYING THEM !!!

Most people [are] not aware of a little old thing called Contract LAW. They [do not] know the LAW and most could not discern some very subtle differences between things like ...

# Obligatory and Mandatory ...
Rates ARE Obligitary, NOT Mandatoty.
You do not have to legally pay them.

# Civil and Criminal ...
NOT Paying Rates is NOT a Criminal Offence !!!
It is a CIVIL Matter, and You WONT go to Jail as the man from ISME suggested, for asking questions.

# See, Hear and Listen to this ...
CONTRACT LAW is where it's at!!!

In Summary:-
A DEMAND or a BILL or a NOTICE or a STATEMENT is NOT Legally or Lawfully enforceable as a Mandatory Legal or Lawful Requirement.
Rates are Obligatory and Cannot be Lawfully Enforced [FACT] ...

A DEMAND Must be preceded by a Valid, Signed and Lawful INVOICE!
No Council issue Lawful Invoices, as they have provided NO GOODS
OR SERVICES. If they do, report them to AN GARDA for extortion.

An INVOICE is Legally defined as : “An itemised list of goods or services Furnished by a seller to a buyer, usu. specifying the price & terms of Sale”.
- (Blacks LAW Dictionary 2009 – 9th. Edition)

An INCOICE Must be preceded by a Valid, Signed and Lawful CONTRACT!

A CONTRACT is Legally Constituted as follows:-
1. Consensus Ad Idem … meeting of the minds.
2. Genuineness of Consent.
3. Wet Ink Signatures.
4. Full Disclosure.
5. Valuable Consideration.
6. Certainty of Terms.
7. Privity of Contract.

NO CONTRACT ? --- DO NOT PAY!
NO INVOICE ? --- DO NOT PAY!
A DEMAND ? --- ASK QUESTIONS!

If Your Local Council are Making Demands ...
Ask them to "Document and Verify the Obligation" ...
by producing the following:-
1. The Original CONTRACT.
2. A Signed, Valid & Lawful INVOICE.
3. A Set of THEIR ACCOUNTS (Pertaing to any Loss).

If you are unsure about these FACTS, bring them to a Barrister of LAW. Your local solicitor is probably a plebeian, so won’t know or 'remember' CONTRACT LAW.

Please pass this information to ALL the business people in Ireland that you know. It may well save their business, their lives and their family.

Wolfe Tone

Sounds like freeman stuff

RGDATA!

RGDATA! wrote: »

TI'd be interested to hear someone with an informed opinion on how such a scenario might play out - i.e. I refuse to pay my rates, demand an invoice from the council and to see the contract which binds me to pay etc.

It'll play out badly for you. Pay your rates. They're ridiculously high I know, but you are obliged to pay them.

Got a good giggle at "wet ink signatures" being needed for a contract. The author must be one of those "plebians" who forgot their contract law.

MagicSean

Basically it will end in you having to go to court and inform the judge that you do not recognise the courts authority in this matter. He most likely won't appreciate this.

dermot_sheehan

Rates do not exist pursuant to contract but rather are levied pursuant to the Poor (Relief) Ireland Act 1839 by local authorities who pursuant to the Local Government Act are the successors to the guardians of the poor.

If this turns into another acts of parliament are not valid because I say that they aren't and courts aren't valid because I say they aren't type of debate, it won't get very far.

RGDATA!

Deleted User wrote: »

It'll play out badly for you. Pay your rates. They're ridiculously high I know, but you are obliged to pay them.

Got a good giggle at "wet ink signatures" being needed for a contract. The author must be one of those "plebians" who forgot their contract law.

I have no intention of not paying, just curious.
I have to say, the tone of the emails is strong on the "DON'T PAY YOUR RATES" stuff, but weak on the "and when you don't, here's what will happen" stuff.
I enquired of the author whether he could link to any cases where this had been tried, but unsurprisingly perhaps he had only anecdotal evidence.

thanks for the responses all. I am aware of the Freeman concept and i figured this was ideologically the same neck of the woods.

Delancey

Wolfe Tone wrote: »

Sounds like freeman stuff

+ 1 , follow that advice at your peril - pure crap.

Drumpot

Yeh, not sure where he got my email address either as hes been spamming me with loads of stuff.

For anybody who wants to know more click http://www.blankofireland.com/

hes also promoting not paying mortgages etc!

Has anybody gone to one of his roadshows ?

I havent a clue whether or not anything he states is true (have serious reservations), but my default setting is if in doubt, shut them out!

Robbo

Drumpot wrote: »

Yeh, not sure where he got my email address either as hes been spamming me with loads of stuff.

For anybody who wants to know more click http://www.blankofireland.com/

hes also promoting not paying mortgages etc!

Has anybody gone to one of his roadshows ?

I havent a clue whether or not anything he states is true (have serious reservations), but my default setting is if in doubt, shut them out!

I do admire his grasp of figures in stating that the eBook is 1000% free.

It all boils down to telling a bank/council/whoever that I reject your reality and substitute my own.

seamus

It's freeman nonsense.

When asked of a single incidence of them ever being successful at using this defenece, they fail.

They'll often refer to cases where the case has been deferred to a later date, or where something hasn't been followed up on by a police officer as proof that what they say works.

The whole thing is based on a false premise about laws coming from God (that should give you the first clue that they're talking nonsense) and arbitrarily deciding that common law does apply, but more recent statutes don't. For no specific reason except that they've decided so.

Wolfe Tone

seamus wrote: »

It's freeman nonsense.

When asked of a single incidence of them ever being successful at using this defenece, they fail.

They'll often refer to cases where the case has been deferred to a later date, or where something has been been followed up on by a police officer as proof that what they say works.

The whole thing is based on a false premise about laws coming from God (that should give you the first clue that they're talking nonsense) and arbitrarily deciding that common law does apply, but more recent statutes don't. For no specific reason except that they've decided so.

There is a few incidents of them being successful, although that could be the result of people simply getting fed up.

Not necessarily god, I have never heard them say that natural law comes from God tbh.

Robbo

Wolfe Tone wrote: »

There is a few incidents of them being successful, although that could be the result of people simply getting fed up.

Not necessarily god, I have never heard them say that natural law comes from God tbh.

They'll either go for God or Admiralty law. In other words, Flying Spaghetti Monster and Cap'n Crunch are their deities.

Add to that the general whiff of bong water and too much time on the internet that follows their philosophies, you may as well throw in something about Tesla's free energy machine being repressed by the Rockefellers.

seamus

Wolfe Tone wrote: »

There is a few incidents of them being successful

It depends on your definition of "success" tbh.

They only way they can be deemed successful is if a judge rules that they are correct. Incidences where you've frustrated the system and they've simply stopped bothering to pursue it, are successes for the individual, but are not successes for the freeman "system".

Of course, we will never know how many people have tried to defend themselves using the freeman system and failed. The proponents of this system will never admit to it, and the courts will never report it.

Fey!

I had a passenger in my car yesterday trying to convince me of this nonsense. He insisted that a couple of thousand people had successfully stopped paying their mortgages on the back of this, and that he didn't have to pay his credit card bill or a €42,000 loan.

I asked him if that meant that he could be prosecuted for theft, as he took goods but didn't actually pay for them when he used his credit card and loan money.

He also reckons that he copyrighted his name, so that when the banks wrote to him he could bill them for €1,000,000 every time they wrote to him, as well as €1,000 per letter to and from them for solicitors fees.

On the copyrighting, he has the same name as an old RTE presenter; does that mean that RTE or the presenter can never actually use that name again without paying this guy royalties?

Interestingly, he went on about the banks owning the state and the Queen owning the banks, so she should never have been let onto our sovereign soil, or some such stuff.

I really wanted to leave him on the side of the road after 20 minutes. If I was caught speeding, would "I wanted to get this guy out of my car but couldn't leave him on the edge of the motorway" be a decent defence?

Our man in Havana

Some people need urgent psychiatric help as evidenced by the post above.

Finnbar01

Drumpot wrote: »

Yeh, not sure where he got my email address either as hes been spamming me with loads of stuff.

For anybody who wants to know more click http://www.blankofireland.com/

hes also promoting not paying mortgages etc!

Has anybody gone to one of his roadshows ?

I havent a clue whether or not anything he states is true (have serious reservations), but my default setting is if in doubt, shut them out!

AFAIK, the same guy who wrote that book was also posted up on the Gardaí/emergency thread where he refused to hand over any of his details when stopped for doing 90 in a 50 zone. The utube video has since been taking down.

I wonder was he ever taken to court over that?

Avatargh

It's complete and utter rubbish. Someone's seen some very basic law and misunderstood everything, including (it seems) basis for levying rates.

They may as well say "CONTRACT IS 4 TAXES. And Since you DON'T contract with DA STATE Den U DONT PAY TAXES."

It's beyond rubbish.

Does that fact that it appears that it was written by a four year old not give you all you need to know about this crap?

nuac

This is silly nonesense. Do not try it on in court asit would test the patience of the judge.

Reloc8

Crazy people be crazy.

Athlone_Bhoy

RGDATA! wrote: »

Somehow got subscribed to an email list, won't name the sender, but they're representing themselves as "The Common Law Society".

The gist of the repeated mails is that businesses are not legally required to pay rates. Excerpt (edited for brevity) follows. Just looking for thoughts on this. I'd be interested to hear someone with an informed opinion on how such a scenario might play out - i.e. I refuse to pay my rates, demand an invoice from the council and to see the contract which binds me to pay etc.

Ok when you get a letter it's MR. JOHN DOE - notice the capitols. You see this person isn't really you unless you say you're the fiction.

But if your brought to court and you say I am such a person that's a different story. You see what you do is say your first name he will ask for surname but you don't give it. It's a about common law. You know what common law is - well most do. Never cause harm for example and never cause a man harm.

Then there's admiralty law - this is what your been charged with but admiralty law only applies if you let it apply to you.

Basically only God can judge you and believe it or not it's in the constitution.

Look up some videos on youtube by robert menard.

source

Athlone_Bhoy wrote: »

Ok when you get a letter it's MR. JOHN DOE - notice the capitols. You see this person isn't really you unless you say you're the fiction.

But if your brought to court and you say I am such a person that's a different story. You see what you do is say your first name he will ask for surname but you don't give it. It's a about common law. You know what common law is - well most do. Never cause harm for example and never cause a man harm.

Then there's admiralty law - this is what your been charged with but admiralty law only applies if you let it apply to you.

Basically only God can judge you and believe it or not it's in the constitution.

Look up some videos on youtube by robert menard.

There's a little concept known as statute, which when introduced replaces the previous common law concept for that particular Act. The only relevant Law is the most recent.

Regarding your name, there's this little thing, a document if you will which outlines your name under statute. There is no separation between you and your "legal entity". You are one and the same....This document to which I refer is you birth certificate.

While your proof is on youtube and google. My proof is http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/home.html, this is ACTUAL LAW!!! Which is legally binding if you live in the state. And don't go on about not entering into contract with the state, you do that by living here.

If you don't recognise the state, then stop paying taxes and don't claim benefits.

This freeman crap really annoys me, a freeman argument makes just as much sense as me saying that grapefruit juice cures a bullet wound. It's all nonsense.

Finnbar01

Athlone_Bhoy wrote: »

Ok when you get a letter it's MR. JOHN DOE - notice the capitols. You see this person isn't really you unless you say you're the fiction.

But if your brought to court and you say I am such a person that's a different story. You see what you do is say your first name he will ask for surname but you don't give it. It's a about common law. You know what common law is - well most do. Never cause harm for example and never cause a man harm.

Then there's admiralty law - this is what your been charged with but admiralty law only applies if you let it apply to you.

Basically only God can judge you and believe it or not it's in the constitution.

Look up some videos on youtube by robert menard.

Robert Menard is a fraud. Please see this thread here: http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=176799

drunkmonkey

dermot_sheehan wrote: »

Rates do not exist pursuant to contract but rather are levied pursuant to the Poor (Relief) Ireland Act 1839 by local authorities who pursuant to the Local Government Act are the successors to the guardians of the poor.

So you could call it a Robin hood tax, if a business wasn't doing all that well and the rates were making the owners poor, could you contest it on that grounds?

Athlone_Bhoy

source wrote: »

There's a little concept known as statute, which when introduced replaces the previous common law concept for that particular Act. The only relevant Law is the most recent.

Regarding your name, there's this little thing, a document if you will which outlines your name under statute. There is no separation between you and your "legal entity". You are one and the same....This document to which I refer is you birth certificate.

While your proof is on youtube and google. My proof is http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/home.html, this is ACTUAL LAW!!! Which is legally binding if you live in the state. And don't go on about not entering into contract with the state, you do that by living here.

If you don't recognise the state, then stop paying taxes and don't claim benefits.

This freeman crap really annoys me, a freeman argument makes just as much sense as me saying that grapefruit juice cures a bullet wound. It's all nonsense.

That's the point you don't pay tax, you don't have a license, you get no benefits this is the point you're a free man. Only god can judge. I'm not saying people can kill people and get away this has nothing to do with breaking the law and getting away with it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Us8lI2JAvfg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTQf51TjeHs There's three parts please watch them then tell me what you think.

Athlone_Bhoy

Athlone_Bhoy wrote: »

That's the point you don't pay tax, you don't have a license, you get no benefits this is the point you're a free man. Only god can judge. I'm not saying people can kill people and get away this has nothing to do with breaking the law and getting away with it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Us8lI2JAvfg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTQf51TjeHs There's three parts please watch them then tell me what you think.

Please don't engage with this clown. He is either trolling, in which case you're all giving him what he wants, or his is serious, in which case he is WAY beyond help (notice the capitals Athlone Boy, that means it's you I'm referring to).

Best to let these things die.

Paulw

Athlone_Bhoy wrote: »

Only god can judge.

But, does "god" exist? If so, which god? Christian god, muslim god, jewish god, buddhist god? Can you prove that god exists?

source

Athlone_Bhoy wrote: »

That's the point you don't pay tax, you don't have a license, you get no benefits this is the point you're a free man. Only god can judge. I'm talking people can kill people and away this has nothing to do with breaking the law and getting away with it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Us8lI2JAvfg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTQf51TjeHs There's three parts please watch them then tell me what you think.

I've watched enough about that crap, it's all nonsense. No matter how much you try to tell yourself that it's legitimate, it will remain nonsense.

Despite what you say it is just a way of trying to get away with breaking the law. People who "have no contract with the state" holding licences, having motor insurance and tax then trying to pull this crap when they get pulled over.

As for only God being able to judge you, that's really worked out well for the catholic church in recent times hasn't it????

Athlone_Bhoy

Paulw wrote: »

But, does "god" exist? If so, which god? Christian god, muslim god, jewish god, buddhist god? Can you prove that god exists?

If he doesn't exist what's the put of putting your hand on the bible in court? Anyways not the point your born with rights.

Despite what you say it is just a way of trying to get away with breaking the law. People who "have no contract with the state" holding licences, having motor insurance and tax then trying to pull this crap when they get pulled over.

No it's not.

If I make a claim of right send it away and get no reply then that becomes law? I'm a freeman away from the state. Is it nonsense?

I honestly don't know much and that's why I've posted, my thread was locked as this will be.

234

If freemen wish to have no contact with the state or pay any taxes then they should not expect to derive benefits from the services provide by the state with taxpayers' money:
Roads
Healthcare
Education
Policing
Emergency Services
State Pensions
Welfare Payments
Public Transport
Publicly provided water
Etc

jhegarty

Athlone_Bhoy wrote: »

Is it nonsense?

Yes

Athlone_Bhoy

From what I read you have a right to health care and education. No benefits.

You have a right to travel.

But hey everyone says it's bull****. Wouldn't mind hearing a reply from someone who has actually watched the video from anti-terrorist though.

234

The only right to travel that you have is a constitutoinal one- a document that freemen think has no meaning or power.

Our man in Havana

Are you for real?

MagicSean

Athlone_Bhoy wrote: »

From what I read you have a right to health care and education. No benefits.

You have a right to travel.

But hey everyone says it's bull****. Wouldn't mind hearing a reply from someone who has actually watched the video from anti-terrorist though.

Who would provide this healthcare? With no licence or passport travel would be difficult too.

johnnyskeleton

Athlone_Bhoy wrote: »

From what I read you have a right to health care and education. No benefits.

You have a right to travel.

But hey everyone says it's bull****. Wouldn't mind hearing a reply from someone who has actually watched the video from anti-terrorist though.

So you have the right to obey the law when it suits you, and not when it doesn't?

Even more bizzarely, on the one hand they say that the only law is contract law so you can't be prosecuted unless you enter a contract voluntarily with the court to accept its outcome. But when it comes to repaying debt, they refuse to acknowledge contracts that they have already entered with other people.

Freemen often talk about their beliefs from the very narrow context of getting off a criminal charge or avoiding an order for repossession etc. I'd like to hear from a Freeman who is prepared to give a global theory about how their views might work. I mean, if everyone in Ireland subscribed to their views tomorrow, what would happen? People would insist on free healthcare and education, but would refuse to pay taxes. They would insist that wrongdoers be punished, yet the wrongdoer would refuse to accept the punishment. Businesses would enter contracts for sale of goods, and break the contract when it comes time to ask for payment.

This is the world you advocate?

No.2

Finnbar01 wrote: »

Drumpot wrote: »

Yeh, not sure where he got my email address either as hes been spamming me with loads of stuff.

For anybody who wants to know more click http://www.blankofireland.com/

hes also promoting not paying mortgages etc!

Has anybody gone to one of his roadshows ?

I havent a clue whether or not anything he states is true (have serious reservations), but my default setting is if in doubt, shut them out!

AFAIK, the same guy who wrote that book was also posted up on the Gardaí/emergency thread where he refused to hand over any of his details when stopped for doing 90 in a 50 zone. The utube video has since been taking down.

I wonder was he ever taken to court over that?

Take it that was this guy:

"A man facing a series of motoring offences demanded that a judge produce his oath of office yesterday during a dramatic stand-off.The hearing at Wexford District Court was brought to a standstill when a 29-year-old man demanded that the judge produce his oath before he proceeded with the case.Declaring he had been brought to the court against his will, and was "under duress", Bobby Oliver Sludds, of Ballagh Cove, Enniscorthy, Co Wexford, said Judge David Anderson had no jurisdiction to deal with the case unless he first produced his oath. "Do you have your oath here? Because if you don't, you're not operating a lawful court," he said."Where did you read that?" asked the judge."The Constitution. It says that a judge must offer up his oath when requested and I am asking you do you have your oath?" said Mr Sludds, before picking up a copy of the Constitution and beginning to quote at length from Article 34, which deals with the appointment of judges."This is not a quiz, I ask the questions. I made my oath in front of the Chief Justice and I have no idea if he kept a record or not," replied Judge Anderson."Do you speak English or legalese?" replied Mr Sludds, before discarding the Constitution and picking up a copy of 'Black's Law Dictionary'.Quoting the definition of "summons", Mr Sludds proceeded to dispute the validity of the summons issued by the court, in which he was charged with a number of motoring offences in Enniscorthy in April 2010."

Defendant asks judge to show oath of office in court stand-off - Irish Independent, August 11th, 2011

Our man in Havana

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/courts/defendant-asks-judge-to-show-oath-of-office-in-court-standoff-2845275.html

Having heard repeated denials that he was the man named in the summons, Judge Anderson said he had no other choice but to remand Sludds in custody due to the confusion.

"I can't accept a bail bond from someone whose signature can't be verified," he said, remanding Mr Sludds to Cloverhill prison.

"You can't do this. This isn't over -- you can expect a bill," shouted Mr Sludds, as he was led away by a number of gardai. He was remanded to Cloverhill Prison until September 17.

Fair play to the Judge.

i believe in change

To be honest people are very quick to shoot down any new argument or theory as to why this world is falling apart. After reading this guys efforts in effectively fighting the banks with their own poison i was inspired and intrigued...how do more people not know this and havent known this for years if it was there to be discovered this whole time.This is not the first recession the world has faced...in fact theres been much harsher times..just ask your grandparents. Education is key people and I am a well educated, young business owner in Dublin city. It is no secret that hundreds of thousands of people not only in Ireland but across the world are being ruined by these unscrupulous banks and corporate FACIST governments hiding behind a cloke of deceipt and are doing with us as they wish all right in front of our eyes and no one is doing a damm thing. we are like little lamb being scared into this or that, first it was terrorism, then wars and invasion of countries, no there is the global meltdown. People we need to turn around and stop believing these cruel and manipulating governments and banks who pretend they have our best interests in mind but screw us over at every chance they get. I'm not a hippy or a radical. I'm just a frustrated and restrained citizen who only started getting familiarised with the terms fractional reserve banking, Mortgage Securitisation, Contract Law!! These are all terms we should all get a little bit more familiarised with and help each other as a nation, as human beings to sharing one planet. one purpose. one future...our future not theirs!Each and every single human being on this planet. We need to get educated, learn how to fight the system which is currently crippling many hard working families I know..and all this suffering being inflicted on your daughters, son, brother or sister. we all know someone and all for what...so that they work hard provide for their families and then maybe be laid off or come into difficult circumstances caused by our own governments or banks which we the peasants pay for....something needs to be done. and what that something is no one knows i think.. or no one actually has enough power to do anything. Time will hopefully change this and hopefully one day humans will learn a way forward, how to use alot more of our brains for our benefit and not allowing people in power who don't actually seem to be able to have a clue what to do for the country or the planet. I actually don't blame the governemnts or banks i blame us the people for being so stupid and allowing ourselves as a deep rooted rebel nation to being submitted to this misery. It time to think of us as part of a global village, which we are, and have been the past decade with mainstream technologic advances, consciously make decisions for the future generations and live in today's and tomorrow's world...not yesterdays troubled and pained past. our kids and their kids. Let's all stop being a bit less selfish and start caring about this planet a bit more. Let's harvest it's resources abundantly without depleting them for everyone's benefit without greed, death, war and pain. I know for now we have no choice but to follow "the system" but I live with hope to be able to witness the next big change and be part of it whenever it happens. I hope all this chaos is the beginning of some sort, something has to give. This chaos is not sustainable forever and people like me and you who have the desire for information will get it and make their on minds up when it begins to affect them, their families or touch someone they know. Fair play to Darrell and ANYONE who challenges any of these scumbag phone companies who stalk you for your bill one day past it due date, credit card companies that live in your nightmares with their extortionate lending rates, banks limiting our futures and dreams. FAIR play to them. afterall who the hell wants to be stuck paying a 700K + mortgage for a property that probably was overpriced to begin with and to a bank who did actually create the money out of nowhere......eh hellllllo has nobody been watching the news the past two years or more....BANKS have caused most of this mess by creating money that didn't exist in the first place. UNREAL!!! People of the Sovereign Republic of Ireland...wake up:eek:

seamus

I would bother reading your post if you used punctuation and paragraphs and didn't CAPITALISE words for greater EFFECT.

Paulw

seamus wrote: »

I would bother reading your post if you used punctuation and paragraphs and didn't CAPITALISE words for greater EFFECT.

Would you really? Why waste your time?

It's always someone else's fault, and we should just stop paying our debts. :eek:

nuac

Freeman rubbish. Approach with caution.

i believe in change

If you guys actually took the time to realise that actually no one has ever said don't pay them straight out. This man supposably spent three years of his life fighting this bank and researching everything to it including the legalities and taking up counsel. So regardless i would trust anything he had to say more than any of the last 3 ignoramouses that posted before me. I think that If you just decide not to pay your bills you would end up in big trouble eventually. By law you are allowed request these documents and they offered to pay any outstanding debts once the banks could substantiate their claims of being owed money and furthermore they also need to prove that you not paying your loan back effectively caused them a direct loss, but as the Fractional reserve banking system does not actually back its money with any real tangible assets such as gold or silver etc you must realise this is one big racket initiated by the governments and the banks of the world to have us all under control. Eventually they will try take real money out of operations altogether as they have done with NIB. walk into any of their branches and ask them do they hold money in their branches and they will tell you. Forget about my punctuation and grammar, focus on the real subject at hand instead of being ridiculous pointing out my use of capital letters. you are exactly my point. humans are dumbing themselves down by refusing to actually pay attention to the real information in front of their eyes instead of actually doing something positive to contribute towards this dilemma which faces us all.

MagicSean

i believe in change wrote: »

If you guys actually took the time to realise that actually no one has ever said don't pay them straight out. This man supposably spent three years of his life fighting this bank and researching everything to it including the legalities and taking up counsel. So regardless i would trust anything he had to say more than any of the last 3 ignoramouses that posted before me. I think that If you just decide not to pay your bills you would end up in big trouble eventually. By law you are allowed request these documents and they offered to pay any outstanding debts once the banks could substantiate their claims of being owed money and furthermore they also need to prove that you not paying your loan back effectively caused them a direct loss, but as the Fractional reserve banking system does not actually back its money with any real tangible assets such as gold or silver etc you must realise this is one big racket initiated by the governments and the banks of the world to have us all under control. Eventually they will try take real money out of operations altogether as they have done with NIB. walk into any of their branches and ask them do they hold money in their branches and they will tell you. Forget about my punctuation and grammar, focus on the real subject at hand instead of being ridiculous pointing out my use of capital letters. you are exactly my point. humans are dumbing themselves down by refusing to actually pay attention to the real information in front of their eyes instead of actually doing something positive to contribute towards this dilemma which faces us all.

So by purchasing your house with this imaginary money you have actually committed a fraud on the previous owner and stolen their property. And when you go to an ATM you engage in theft by stealing money you don't actually have any claim to.

i believe in change

I didn't actually commit any crimes as I was told a lie from inception and this constitutes an unlawful contract according to contract law. It's practically the same as going to bed with a tranny, you might not know they are a tranny before you see them downstairs, because you had no suspicion they were a tranny and they never mentioned anything(hiding the truth to benefit them) so you agree to consensual sex beforehand you knew this very important information but once you discover the truth your mind changes very quickly and you then want nothing further to do with them(sorry for example,not talking from personal experiences either, hope it does not cause any offense to anyone if it's lowering the tone but I think this is a very effective method of demonstrating what I mean)but I think your missing the point. If i bought a house no matter who from, and i was working my arse off every month to ensure my family had a roof over their heads and then I was told that after 30 years of wasting my life away working to pay the bank back for something they would never have even made a loss from if I never even paid my mortgage at all. These are simple questions you would expect a national bank to answer, after all Bank of Ireland is Ireland's national treasures...hahaha That is ridiculous, why are we arrested if we commit fraud but bank officials get to live in cushy suburbs around the most expensive areas with their crooked beleives while us the ordinary joe's work like little horses to help them achieve their goals and plans to destroy Ireland and the world, or what can you not actually see it happening already. I am just learning about these gross misconducts and atrocities banks are committing and have been committing under the Fractional Reserve banking system for a long time. the banks don't care that they are riding you, me or the person we bought our house from. Fact is none of these private commercial multinational organisations in our country who send us bills regularly care one bit about you and all they care about is you paying them until the next month again. Stop paying your phone bill and see how long it takes your phone company to cut you off, they don't care and never will care about your presonal circumstances. However I care about my fellow human beings and so should everyone else. that's whats wrong with this world, everyone is out to help themselves and it doesn't matter what they have to destroy or who they have to destroy to achieve it. I'm sure that if you or I were in one of these positions of power our lives would be very different & i guarantee you would be the first to turn your back on your own beliefs. It's crazy how intelligent we humans are but how stupid we are at the same time, allowing ourselves to be sold prefabricated stories from the media, the governments, the banks etc. if you decide to go with it go ahead. no one is telling you not to. everyone has the choice to make the own decision. Just the way you are not being judged for your believes you should learn how to do the same for others. It's all the one deception and the same principles to form a lawful contract and the same contract law is used to make these scams binding when we don't and never had a clue they didn't have vaults full of money, my actual understanding up to recently was that banks did have tangible assets or vaults full of real cash to back up their loans lawfully, not just type figures into computer systems that are probably designed to multiply money in the same unlawful way as probably the majority of the banks loan given out within the last decade(of what i am aware of at least, first hand info, i don't bother preaching about stuff i don't know so I'm not going to get into the atrocities bank of Ireland and others committed in the since 1980's) What is your problems anyway why are you so against people asking questions...If the banks don't mind you certainly shouldn't.

Paulw

You're preaching to the educated here.

Sell crazy some place else, we're all stocked up here.

source

Try after hours, they love crazy crap like this over there, also dude seriously, punctuation, grammar, paragraphs, etc etc.

MagicSean

Don't you have a relevant response to my post? I take it you don't use credit cards or overdrafts at all?

shaneybaby

My flipn eyes! they burn

Our man in Havana

The freeman keyboard does not have a return key.

Fey!

Our man in Havana wrote: »

The freeman keyboard does not have a return key.

It does, but a return would possibly be a contract which they do or do not have to fulfil depending on their mood and/or the position of the moon.

blueythebear

i believe in change wrote: »

It's practically the same as going to bed with a tranny, you might not know they are a tranny before you see them downstairs, because you had no suspicion they were a tranny and they never mentioned anything(hiding the truth to benefit them) so you agree to consensual sex beforehand you knew this very important information but once you discover the truth your mind changes very quickly and you then want nothing further to do with them(sorry for example,not talking from personal experiences either, hope it does not cause any offense to anyone if it's lowering the tone but I think this is a very effective method of demonstrating what I mean)but I think your missing the point.

You equate banking with going to bed with a tranny. I'm no psychologist but that's some Freudian slip...