N40 - Jack Lynch Tunnel Safety Upgrade

blindsider

Today's Examiner:

The National Roads Authority (NRA) confirmed last night that the multimillion-euro project at the Jack Lynch Tunnel will close it completely for 11 hours each weekday night from October until March 2012.

The Dublin Port Tunnel is compliant with the regulations, but the busy Cork tunnel, which was opened in May 1999, is not.

NRA spokesman Sean O’Neill said that the "fire protection upgrade" would necessitate both the tunnel’s bores being closed every weekday night. Work could proceed more quickly if the tunnel was closed all day, but the NRA and gardaí are aware this would lead to major gridlock in the city.

Tunnel manager Dan O’Neill said that in excess of 65,000 vehicles pass through it on an average weekday.

However, he said that between 8pm and 7am just 8,000 vehicles used the tunnel, so closing it then would cause much less disruption.

The NRA said the closures would apply on Mondays to Fridays and the tunnel would remain open throughout the weekend.

"The closures will be modified if there are any major events etc which have to be catered for," Mr O’Neill said. He added that talks are ongoing between the roads authority, gardaí, the two local authorities and the fire brigade to co-ordinate the operation.

The work will involve putting up special flame retardant cladding to protect the tunnel structure if a major fire breaks out.

Meanwhile, the contract for two long-awaited flyovers on the city’s South Ring Road was signed yesterday. The flyovers, at the Bandon Road and Sarsfield’s Road roundabouts, will cost €100 million.

It is expected that construction will start before the end of the summer and take about two years to complete. Engineers believe that the flyovers, including the one already built at the Kinsale Road junction, could cut motorists’ peak-time journeys by up to 30 minutes.

Read more: http://www.examiner.ie/ireland/busy-city-tunnel-to-close-at-night-158879.html#ixzz1QBBBuXDL

Tonio

Closing the JLT at night for 6 months is going to be really annoying for alot of people. Might be a dumb question but I often wondered if they could work on one bore and keep the other open to traffic?

Stark

I imagine it's possible. They've cones instead of a permanent carriageway barrier on both sides of the tunnel so they could set up a contra flow easily enough there.

niloc1951

Tonio wrote: »

Closing the JLT at night for 6 months is going to be really annoying for alot of people. Might be a dumb question but I often wondered if they could work on one bore and keep the other open to traffic?

Not a dumb question at all, but I bet the answer you will get as to why it can't be done will be really dumb.

Amtmann

RTE have a report on the Jack Lynch Tunnel here: http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/0624/jacklynch.html

The photo they show of the tunnel's interior was taken by me. I released it to the public domain way back.

Jayuu

In fairness to the NRA, while it will be a big inconvenience to close both sections, I'd say there's no way they could risk two-way traffic in one tunnel for safety reasons.

Could you imagine the chaos that could be caused by a head-on collision in the tunnel? It would be extraordinarily difficult to get people out safely in such a situation.

AugustusMinimus

I must say I'm very interesting in one thing. What exactly do the workers do when they are closing off the tunnel ?

Do they just walk out into the middle of traffic and start waving traffic up the Mahon exit on the South Ring Road ? Imagine being the first car not allowed through the tunnel after the car ahead of you get's through. Obviously you have to stop the traffic at some point.

Chris_5339762

They do contraflow in the tunnel all the time, I cant think why they dont sort the fire safety issues in one bore at a time. Seems overkill to the close the whole thing.

AugustusMinimus

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

They do contraflow in the tunnel all the time, I cant think why they dont sort the fire safety issues in one bore at a time. Seems overkill to the close the whole thing.

I've tried to use it a few times when it was completely blocked. Barricades were thrown across the eastbound carriageway and all traffic was forced up the Mahon interchange.

I'd imagine this was primarily due to a crash in the tunnel, where they didn't have a chance to operate contraflow in the other bore.

niloc1951

So the JLT is to be closed for 11 hours 5 nights a week for 6 months.

This finally confirms to me that the NRA is populated by people with no concept of road safety, good traffic management or value for money. Having traveled over 70,000 Kms throughout Europe in the last 6 years alone and observed how road repair/upgrade work is carried on elsewhere I have now finally given up all hope that the above QUANGO has any real measure of competence.

The JLT Fiasco
All work will need to be done at night for which a premium will have to be paid.
Of the 11 hours available a significant amount of the time will be non-productive due to the requirement to set up after the open period and then clean-up in preparation for the 'new' day's opening.

Tunnel closures are not uncommon, I have come across many but I have never come across a total diversion.
I have seen one side close while work continues uninterrupted on the other, which would appear to be the most efficient use of funds and minimises traffic disruption.

The contra-flow traffic can be dangerous in a single bore, however this is successfully managed elsewhere with reduced speed limits, often 30 KmPH when necessary.

Finally to manage the speed issue a set of Mobile Average Speed Cameras can be used, such systems are common at roadwork sites in the UK and my experience is that they are 100% effective in ensuring that traffic travelling through the road works area observes the posted speed limit.

OT I know, but an a recent trip of over 2,000Kms I took particular notice of the many 'LILO' junctions I came across, not one was without the physical separation of opposing lanes, the absence of which here facilitated the recent multiple fatality on the N25 near Little Island.

Rant over and hard hat firmly on :mad:

L1011

I drove through a daytime contraflow in the tunnel within the last 6 weeks or so - they definitely still do these so I can't see why they won't do it for these works.

Jayuu

I stand corrected on the contraflow issue. However I suppose the longer one is in place the greater the chance of an accident. Let's face it, one serious accident here and there will be all sort of people on to say that they shouldn't have allowed this to happen. Seems a case of damned if you do and damned if you don't.

flazio

Well there are extra safety measures that could be put in place to minimise the possibility of an accident in the event of a long term contraflow, such as concrete bollards blocking the closed bore, and those pole shaped cones along the median, tightly packed to prevent any gobsheen trying to overtake in the tunnel. My only guess is that perhaps the substances in use, such as the fire proof paint, may provide a health hazard to the public while being applied and therefore the public need to be kept away.
Incidentally has anyone ever photographed the rotating road signs around the tunnel as to what they say in the event of A, B or C?

Bullseye1

The NRA have been a disaster for this country. Run by a bunch of amateurs.

BluntGuy

Bullseye1 wrote: »

The NRA have been a disaster for this country. Run by a bunch of amateurs.

Some would argue that, particularly when compared to other quangos, the NRA have done a decent job. There may be technical reasons why it would not be possible to do a contraflow for the types of upgrades being carried out.

audab

tbh I think the approach to carrying out these works makes perfect sense.

1. There is absolutely no option but to do the works at night. The tunnel is critical to traffic in Cork and to close it during the day for six months would cause total chaos across the city, especially if the Sarsfield & Wilton roundabouts contract goes ahead at the same time.

2. Closing both bores means that work can be carried out in each tunnel in parallel reducing overall working time. If it takes 6 months to fireproof it with both bores closed, then it could take 12 months only working on one at a time. Quicker contract should also mean reduced contract costs.

3. I'd say traffic management for a complete closure must also be simpler, safer and cheaper than trying to manage a contraflow over a long term.

All in all, looks like the right way to go for me

niloc1951

audab wrote: »

tbh I think the approach to carrying out these works makes perfect sense.

1. There is absolutely no option but to do the works at night. The tunnel is critical to traffic in Cork and to close it during the day for six months would cause total chaos across the city, especially if the Sarsfield & Wilton roundabouts contract goes ahead at the same time.

2. Closing both bores means that work can be carried out in each tunnel in parallel reducing overall working time. If it takes 6 months to fireproof it with both bores closed, then it could take 12 months only working on one at a time. Quicker contract should also mean reduced contract costs.

3. I'd say traffic management for a complete closure must also be simpler, safer and cheaper than trying to manage a contraflow over a long term.

All in all, looks like the right way to go for me

Maths not quite right.

Remember the proposal is to close the tunnel only 11 hours every night and allowing for 'setting up' before work can begin and 'clearing up' before re-opening everyday, productive time on the job to be done might well be less than 8 hours. AND, the whole 11 hours will have to be paid for at a night working premium rate.

Contrast the above with the alternative closing one bore 24/7.
This would facilitate continuous working, the labour cost of the job the 'day-time' working would reduce the overall cost as the number of night worked man/hours should be reduced by two thirds, remember 24 hours continuous productive working versus about 8 hours each night.

So overall, the job should take only one third the number of days (less if Saturdays and Sundays are worked) and cost significantly less.

As regards contraflow, the St Gotthard Tunnel on the motorway between Luzern in Switzerland and Lugano in Italy has a contraflow system 24/7/365 and it's nearly 17Kms long not a the six hundred odd metres we're talking about.

munchkin_utd

blindsider wrote: »

Today's Examiner:

The National Roads Authority (NRA) confirmed last night that the multimillion-euro project at the Jack Lynch Tunnel will close it completely for 11 hours each weekday night from October until March 2012.

An October start doesnt seem to be happening.

The tender just released for substantial tunnel works seems to be the same as what is planned for the closure. http://www.etenders.gov.ie/search/show/search_view.aspx?ID=AUG260735

But the tendering process isn't even finished till November 1st so ruling out any October start on work itsself.

It doesnt go into too much detail on the works to be done but this is mentioned:

The Works will involve the night time installation of passive fire protection in both traffic bores.

along with the need to remove bits and bobs temporarily to mount the insulation.

HarryPotter41

niloc1951 wrote: »

Maths not quite right.

Remember the proposal is to close the tunnel only 11 hours every night and allowing for 'setting up' before work can begin and 'clearing up' before re-opening everyday, productive time on the job to be done might well be less than 8 hours. AND, the whole 11 hours will have to be paid for at a night working premium rate.

Contrast the above with the alternative closing one bore 24/7.
This would facilitate continuous working, the labour cost of the job the 'day-time' working would reduce the overall cost as the number of night worked man/hours should be reduced by two thirds, remember 24 hours continuous productive working versus about 8 hours each night.

So overall, the job should take only one third the number of days (less if Saturdays and Sundays are worked) and cost significantly less.

As regards contraflow, the St Gotthard Tunnel on the motorway between Luzern in Switzerland and Lugano in Italy has a contraflow system 24/7/365 and it's nearly 17Kms long not a the six hundred odd metres we're talking about.

Presumably any company doing 24/7 work would have a rotating shift pattern which means all workers would be paid a shift premium which means there would be little or no savings on wages ( possibly would even cost more )

niloc1951

HarryPotter41 wrote: »

Presumably any company doing 24/7 work would have a rotating shift pattern which means all workers would be paid a shift premium which means there would be little or no savings on wages ( possibly would even cost more )

Maybe so.

But, the non-productive time needed to 'set-up' before each nights work and 'clean-up' before each mornings re-opening would be saved, and the disruption to the local economy should be reduced to less than one third (24/24/7 productive working Vs. 8/24/5 productive working)

sdanseo

Tonio wrote: »

Closing the JLT at night for 6 months is going to be really annoying for alot of people. Might be a dumb question but I often wondered if they could work on one bore and keep the other open to traffic?

Stark wrote: »

I imagine it's possible. They've cones instead of a permanent carriageway barrier on both sides of the tunnel so they could set up a contra flow easily enough there.

niloc1951 wrote: »

Not a dumb question at all, but I bet the answer you will get as to why it can't be done will be really dumb.

Jayuu wrote: »

In fairness to the NRA, while it will be a big inconvenience to close both sections, I'd say there's no way they could risk two-way traffic in one tunnel for safety reasons.

Could you imagine the chaos that could be caused by a head-on collision in the tunnel? It would be extraordinarily difficult to get people out safely in such a situation.

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

They do contraflow in the tunnel all the time, I cant think why they dont sort the fire safety issues in one bore at a time. Seems overkill to the close the whole thing.

The Mont Blanc Tunnel, one of the longest road tunnels in operation, is two-way traffic in a single bore. And the only accident it's ever had, while devestating, was not caused by a collision and was 5 miles from either end - JLT is 600 metres by comparison.

marmurr1916

The works have been postponed until January:

BUSINESS leaders and Christmas shoppers will breathe a deep sigh of relief at a decision, by the NRA (National Roads Authority), to postpone planned safety woks on the Jack Lynch Tunnel.
The planned scheme will now commence in January.

Under an EU directive, the NRA and the tunnel’s operators, Cork City Council, were obliged to fireproof the route.

Initially, the statutory bodies announced plans to close the tunnel, at nights, from October to next March to complete a planned €5 million project.

However, there had been consternation within the hard-pressed business community amid claims the planned works would affect shopping in the run up to, and during, the busiest period of the year.

Cork Business Association (CBA) has been lobbying Cork City Hall officials who, in turn, conducted a series of discussions with the NRA.

CBA chief executive Donal Healy said, as a result of the talks, the NRA had agreed to postpone the project.

"We pointed out to them the two-month lead-up to Christmas and the January sales accounted for 25% of all sales recorded during the year. We asked that the contract be postponed until next January. If they had gone ahead and started the closure in October, it had the potential to have a tsunami affect on business and employment," he claimed.

The NRA had planned to close the tunnel for 11 hours each weekday night between 8pm and 7am.

Mr Healy said that if the closures had gone ahead from October, it would have driven late night shoppers away from Mahon Point in particular, but would also have had a negative impact on the shopping centres in Douglas and Wilton.

"We had a number of meetings with Cork City Council officials who discussed the situation with the NRA. I have to say we found the council officials very helpful and we would like to thank them for that and we’d like to also thank the NRA," Mr Healy said.

The city council now plans to close the tunnel after January 9.

Daily closures will be from 9.30pm to 7am on every day of the week, apart from Friday nights, for a six-month period.

Read more: http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/businesses-relieved-as-tunnel-work-postponed-165677.html#ixzz1WQbZxAMz

Chris_5339762

I was all set for a good NIMBY rant, but this

Mr Healy said that if the closures had gone ahead from October, it would have driven late night shoppers away from Mahon Point in particular, but would also have had a negative impact on the shopping centres in Douglas and Wilton.

is completely true. Access to all three of these from the east is impractical without the tunnel in the evenings.

All that said, they should still do a contraflow.

niloc1951

sdeire wrote: »

The Mont Blanc Tunnel, one of the longest road tunnels in operation, is two-way traffic in a single bore. And the only accident it's ever had, while devestating, was not caused by a collision and was 5 miles from either end - JLT is 600 metres by comparison.

Also the St. Gotthard Tunnel which is over 16Kms of two-way single bore.

dowlingm

sdeire wrote: »

The Mont Blanc Tunnel, one of the longest road tunnels in operation, is two-way traffic in a single bore. And the only accident it's ever had, while devestating, was not caused by a collision and was 5 miles from either end - JLT is 600 metres by comparison.

European drivers though

suds1984

Anyone know when the night time works are beginning?

Hey Zeus Quintana

There's been works on the tunnel at night last week (the routine maintenance closures were only a few weeks ago).

Anyways, I was driving through it this morning and this evening when the radio broadcasts were interrupted by;

"Toggle testing is underway. Please turn on your headlights. Lighting levels may vary..." or words to that effect.

kub

It is very easy to predict these night time maintenance closures.
Just drive through from the Mahon side and of there is a little damp spot at the lowest point of the tunnel then expect a closure within 2 weeks.

It is the silicone, they have to refresh it every few months.

Padraig Mor

It's being closed overnight for the next few weeks to install some form of barriers AFAIK.

MrDerp

http://www.jacklynchtunnel.ie/plannedtunnelclosures/