Wicklow Rail service

Niles

I know this is already in the Commuting section but as it effects people in Wicklow I thought it would be worth posting in case people aren't aware of it. Irish Rail have issued a draft timetable for the Dublin-Rosslare service, and are inviting people to submit their views on it.

http://www.irishrail.ie/news_centre/news.asp?action=view&news_id=1130


Personally I'm not that impressed with the same old frequency compared to the bus service.

PseudoFamous

Niles wrote: »

Personally I'm not that impressed with the same old frequency compared to the bus service.

Lower frequency, actually, now that they've dropped two of eight services each way. If anyone is still subjecting themselves to this sort of service, they should be reminded that the bus is faster, more frequent, and even cheaper.

Niles

PseudoFamous wrote: »

Lower frequency, actually, now that they've dropped two of eight services each way. If anyone is still subjecting themselves to this sort of service, they should be reminded that the bus is faster, more frequent, and even cheaper.

Yes indeed. The only point the train wins on in my opinion is comfort - and then only when it's one of the new Intercity railcars. Ten years ago the Sligo line had more or less the same service level that the Rosslare one does today and look at it now - a train every two hours, virtually all Intercity standard. If it can work for Sligo-Dublin there's no reason it won't work for Rosslare-Dublin. I'd be happy with that level on this route. I know nothing may come of it but it's no harm using the feedback facility for people to voice their ideas on the service, there's always the remote chance if enough people do it they might start listening.

BigMoose

Added my comments. Cant see it will change anything though, they clearly have no desire to make this a usable stretch of railway. I live within cycling distance of Wicklow station but for a working day in Dublin or a casual trip the times are utterly useless. I have to drive to either Greystones or Bray and get a dart. Mostly having driven that far I'd drive the rest unless I was going to the centre of Dublin.

Tiradon

In terms of adding additional trains, I think they're incredibly hindered by the "bottle-neck" between Greystones and Bray. With only one track all the way, between these stops, trying to facilitate a half hourly DART service, there's very little lee-way to add in additional Rosslare trains. Just a thought - I don't know the actual logistics of it all.

Cookie_Monster

Tiradon wrote: »

In terms of adding additional trains, I think they're incredibly hindered by the "bottle-neck" between Greystones and Bray. With only one track all the way, between these stops, trying to facilitate a half hourly DART service, there's very little lee-way to add in additional Rosslare trains. Just a thought - I don't know the actual logistics of it all.

which is just another reason for the concept of changing trains needs to come into this country. Either cut DARTs from Bray to Greystones and use the IC and commuter as a feeder between the two, or terminate some commuters in Greystones and let the DART take the traffic for affected trains. Inconvenient for some maybe, but better than losing two trains a day entirely each way

Tiradon

Fair point, I think the second option sounds more feasible to me, to use Greystones as a transfer point for additional services.

BigMoose

If they were capable of timing it at greystones to meet a dart then yes, it could terminate there. But platform 3 at Bray would be even better. Anyway I dont get the notion that the darts fill up the slots between greystones and bray leaving no room for IC trains. Since there are a tiny number of ICs a day that run without impacting the dart, surely there could be at least one an hour which could do the same. What's special about the hours the ICs do run? I was at greystones the other day when the IC turned up, waited for the dart to arrive then left in front of it, the dart leaving in theory 5 mins later.

Niles

Tiradon wrote: »

In terms of adding additional trains, I think they're incredibly hindered by the "bottle-neck" between Greystones and Bray. With only one track all the way, between these stops, trying to facilitate a half hourly DART service, there's very little lee-way to add in additional Rosslare trains. Just a thought - I don't know the actual logistics of it all.

The restrictions placed on the Rosslare service by the DART are more in terms of journey times (the Rosslare train is slowed by having Darts stuck in front of it, though to an extent this has been eased in the draft timetable). It shouldn't really prevent more trains (well not a two hourly service anyway), the Dart timetable is the same every hour, so if the Rosslare services can be fitted in at 16:30, 17:30 and 18:30, there's no reason why one couldn't be fitted in at (for the sake of argument) 10:30, 12:30, 14:30, etc... The only way it could prevent more trains would be if you were to schedule more than one train per hour.

Cookie_Monster wrote:

which is just another reason for the concept of changing trains needs to come into this country. Either cut DARTs from Bray to Greystones and use the IC and commuter as a feeder between the two, or terminate some commuters in Greystones and let the DART take the traffic for affected trains. Inconvenient for some maybe, but better than losing two trains a day entirely each way

Changing trains aren't necessary to achieve a more better timetable in this case though;it's the same basic template used each hour, so you could still have a two hourly service using the same timetable pattern. I'm not convinced this changing trains concept has much to offer people (in terms of the Rosslare line anyway); (i) journeys will be longer as people need time to change, the DART makes more stops, (ii) people may be put off using the service if they have to change (if I can get a bus direct to Dublin it's quicker, less hassle, without having to change) and (iii) it could lead to overcrowding on the DART, which will have an Intercity load of passengers loaded in with their normal commuters.

LEIN

BigMoose wrote: »

Anyway I dont get the notion that the darts fill up the slots between greystones and bray leaving no room for IC trains. Since there are a tiny number of ICs a day that run without impacting the dart, surely there could be at least one an hour which could do the same. What's special about the hours the ICs do run?

It takes a Dart 10 minutes to clear the cliffs. That means there is 20 minutes of the half hour slot taken up (Dart inbound and Dart outbound). So in theory you are correct, an IC would need to be running very close to two Darts in an hour slot. Now correct me if i am wrong but AFAIK its a single line on most of the east coast? (Bray to Wexford) If that's the case how is it possible for IR to have an hourly service? They would have to double line some parts for trains to pass each other.

On another note the half hour slot would be crammed and will leave no room for delayed trains to catchup.

PseudoFamous

Damo9090 wrote: »

Now correct me if i am wrong but AFAIK its a single line on most of the east coast? (Bray to Wexford) If that's the case how is it possible for IR to have an hourly service? They would have to double line some parts for trains to pass each other.

There are completely underutilised passing loops at every station except Kilcoole and Rosslare

LEIN

PseudoFamous wrote: »

There are completely underutilised passing loops at every station except Kilcoole and Rosslare

Didn't know that. Thanks for clearing that up.