Trying to cut back on dairy - tips?

Lucyloo1

I've read a few books recently that point to the connection between dairy and cancer, particularly breast cancer. Ideally I'd like to cut it out completely, but think I'd be miserable and would miss it too much. Can anyone offer advice on nice-tasting non-dairy alternatives? I've tried soya milk and rice milk and hated them. I'm reducing the amount of milk I have in tea / coffee (and trying to get used to having them black) and trying to find non-cereal based ideas for breakfasts, but would like to do more.

Any advice would be much appreciated.

Thanks.

flikflak

Which brands of soya milk/rice milk have you tried? Sweetned or non? What have you tried it in?

If you keep trying it then you will find one you like - its all about re-educating your tastes.

Dont forget there are also almond, oat, hazelnut and other milks to try.

I use Provamel organic unsweetned soya milk and find this to be my favorite.

I simply have oats, flaxseed and cold water for breakfast. I find anything milk like on my cereal horrible! You could have toast (using non-diary spread), various types of eggs, pancakes,yoghurt/fruit/seeds/nuts, and as you dont say you are avoiding meat then you could also have meat (bacon/sausage).

When I have time for a treat I have a big wholemeal soft roll with fried mushrooms and fake bacon with fresh avocado, tomatoes and rocket with a big dollop of egg free mayo and ketchup/reggae sauce mmmmmmmm.

maameeo

id ask again which soya milk you tried, some a yuck. i tend to go for the alpro light or tesco brand one in the fridge, i never get the ones on the shelf.

And you would have to train yourself, you're tasting it expecting it to taste like milk, it doesnt, its a new taste
i have water in my porridge, dont like milk in it anymore, took awhile but id never go back now!

for butter i use Pure soya, ive tried to other Pure range but the 'soya' one tastes the best.

when it comes to cheese im afraid i havnt found anything nicer then real cheese, the fake stuff i just dont like. you could go with easi singles, cant imagine theres much dairy there :pac:

but remember you need calcium!!!

Omelettes are great for breakfast. Stuff em with some veggies.
Fried potatoes with crushed garlic and spinach...is a favorite.
Or quiches. Any thing eggy.

If your a veg*n watch your Iron and B vitamins if you cut out cereal.

The alternative milks are an acquired taste. If you just keep plugging away at it for a couple of weeks. You'll come around to them.

--LOS--

Lucyloo1 wrote: »

I've read a few books recently that point to the connection between dairy and cancer, particularly breast cancer. Ideally I'd like to cut it out completely, but think I'd be miserable and would miss it too much. Can anyone offer advice on nice-tasting non-dairy alternatives? I've tried soya milk and rice milk and hated them. I'm reducing the amount of milk I have in tea / coffee (and trying to get used to having them black) and trying to find non-cereal based ideas for breakfasts, but would like to do more.

Any advice would be much appreciated.

Thanks.

I try to cut back on dairy too for the very same reason although I have to say I'm doing a pretty bad job at it at the minute
Like the others have said it really depends on the type of soya milk, I wouldnt give up on it just yet. Personally I prefer the shelf ones rather than the fresh ones, the fresh ones just have a much stronger taste imo. The lidl fresh one is especially bad imo. I normally go for alpro soya organic, the aldi shelf one is pretty good for a cheap brand too and if I get any other alpro one it is a shelf one and unsweetened, maybe I'm just used to it but these ones will not make a significant taste difference to your tea/coffee/food. I use pure soya butter. I also really like the cheezly cheese but theyre not for everyone. Other than that I get soya yoghurts which are a nice alternative to milk on cereal.

Lucyloo1

Thanks all. It was the Alpro soya milk that I tried, both sweetened and unsweetened, plus the Rice Dream rice milk. I'll try a few others and will see if I can get my taste buds to adjust.

Maameo, I also only use water in porridge but just put a splash of milk on top with honey. Yum.

Thanks for all the breakfast suggestions. I'm also working to reduce the amount of animal protein in my diet generally, trying to limit it to one meal a day at most. With 2 sisters and a mother who've had cancer, the incentive is certainly there - just need to turn it into motivation!

Thanks again.

maameeo

Lucyloo1 wrote: »

Maameo, I also only use water in porridge but just put a splash of milk on top with honey. Yum.

i have my brekkie in work, so i use jumbo oats, throw in a bowl with water and microwave for 2mins. if i put enough water in there will be a bit left after the two mins but it goes a pale milky colour. then i chuck in flaxseed and honey and YUM!!
dont need the milk at all at all

Rancid

With soya milks, it's very much down to personal taste, so you really do have to give them all a try and then settle on the one you like the best... or hate the least!
I used the Tesco sweetened for a couple of years, then went off it completely and changed to coconut milk for about 6 months.

Right now I use Alpro Original from the shelf, not the fridge and I'm 100% happy with it for use in tea or coffee. It actually makes the perfect latte, too.
For porridge, I have always preferred the taste when made with water.

sh1tstirrer

Lucyloo1 wrote: »

I've read a few books recently that point to the connection between dairy and cancer, particularly breast cancer. Ideally I'd like to cut it out completely, but think I'd be miserable and would miss it too much. Can anyone offer advice on nice-tasting non-dairy alternatives? I've tried soya milk and rice milk and hated them. I'm reducing the amount of milk I have in tea / coffee (and trying to get used to having them black) and trying to find non-cereal based ideas for breakfasts, but would like to do more.

Any advice would be much appreciated.

Thanks.

You read a few books and now you are convinced dairy causes cancer. Here is a list of other things you need to avoid the sun, esb pylons, traffic fumes, smoking, alcohol etc. etc. etc. the list goes on. Pretty much everything you do and around you in life can cause cancer.

fillefatale

I watched a documentary movie this weekend called 'Planeat' and am thinking of making the transition to veganism. I wandered around the biscuit section of my local supermarket today trying to find something vegan friendly and had no luck

flikflak

^ hob nobs! A lot of bourbons are vegan, fruit shortcakes, some makes of fig rolls and a few others.

Absurdum

some brands of digestives too, and those sugary things you get with coffee.

or bake yer own

Gauge

Hmmm, oreos are vegan too right?
I want some now

Lucyloo1

sh1tstirrer wrote: »

You read a few books and now you are convinced dairy causes cancer. Here is a list of other things you need to avoid the sun, esb pylons, traffic fumes, smoking, alcohol etc. etc. etc. the list goes on. Pretty much everything you do and around you in life can cause cancer.

True. But it's pretty startling to see a chart outlining the rates of breast cancer and dairy / animal protein intake in various countries. I know there could be other factors at play, but it seems likely that the stuff we put into our bodies plays the largest part in our health.

Couldn't find hazelnut / almond milk in Tesco last week - must try coconut milk.

Absurdum

sh1tstirrer wrote: »

Here is a list of other things you need to avoid the sun, esb pylons, traffic fumes, smoking, alcohol etc. etc. etc. the list goes on.

That's why governments are actively encouraging people to stop smoking, wear sunscreen, reduce exhaust emissions, drink less etc. etc. etc.

Slowly but surely, the truth is coming out
http://www.independent.ie/health/latest-news/red-meat-raises-bowel-cancer-risk-2655298.html

sh1tstirrer

Absurdum wrote: »

That's why governments are actively encouraging people to stop smoking, wear sunscreen, reduce exhaust emissions, drink less etc. etc. etc.

Slowly but surely, the truth is coming out
http://www.independent.ie/health/latest-news/red-meat-raises-bowel-cancer-risk-2655298.html

You forgot to mention stop breathing

Red meat doesn't cause cancer it's the additives they put in it that is the problem. Organic meat doesn't have any of these additives or preservatives

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

fillefatale wrote: »

I watched a documentary movie this weekend called 'Planeat' and am thinking of making the transition to veganism. I wandered around the biscuit section of my local supermarket today trying to find something vegan friendly and had no luck

Gingernut biscuits seem to be pretty good too as far as I can tell from the ingredients

Lucyloo1

Thanks for all the tips folks - found an organic rice milk that tastes perfect in tea and coffee. Also tried coconut milk on my porridge this morning and it was lovely. The suggestions not to expect it to taste exactly the same have really helped me to get into the right frame of mind.
Thanks.

Larkenn

Jacobs Jaffa Cakes (orange box) are dairy free too.

fillefatale

sh1tstirrer wrote: »

You read a few books and now you are convinced dairy causes cancer. Here is a list of other things you need to avoid the sun, esb pylons, traffic fumes, smoking, alcohol etc. etc. etc. the list goes on. Pretty much everything you do and around you in life can cause cancer.

She didn't say it caused it. The consumption of dairy can create the right environment in the body for the growth of cancerous cells.

fillefatale

Lucyloo1 wrote: »

Thanks for all the tips folks - found an organic rice milk that tastes perfect in tea and coffee. Also tried coconut milk on my porridge this morning and it was lovely. The suggestions not to expect it to taste exactly the same have really helped me to get into the right frame of mind.
Thanks.

whats the rice milk? thinking of trying this because i'm not keen on soya.

Lucyloo1

fillefatale wrote: »

whats the rice milk? thinking of trying this because i'm not keen on soya.

Rice Dream is the brand. Also came across a watered down coconut milk in Super Valu the other day and it seems reasonable too.

spiralbound

fillefatale wrote: »

She didn't say it caused it. The consumption of dairy can create the right environment in the body for the growth of cancerous cells.

Have you got a source for this?

Lucyloo1

spiralbound wrote: »

Have you got a source for this?

Personally, I've based my efforts on what I've read in The China Study.. a 25-year study of the incidences of various diseases in the East vs the West and comparing same to dietary factors, particularly the consumption of animal protein. It's noticeable that the countries that don't consume dairy products (or as much animal protein) and who do have a more varied diet involving wholegrain foods, fruit & vegetables have much lower incidences of cancer, heart disease, and other diseases. There is also scientific evidence from experiments involving rats and exposure to highly carcinogenic materials. Those who consumed less than 10% animal protein didn't develop cancer and those who consumed over 10% did. I've also read that humans are generally supposed to grow out of the ability to digest milk by the age of 5. In Africa and Eastern countries, people can't digest milk beyond that age but, for some reason, we have retained this ability. Maybe it's having an effect on our bodies. The conclusion of the China Study was not that animal protein causes cancer, but that where there is an opportunity for cancer to develop (e.g. genetic factors, exposure to carcinogens), the absence of animal protein can help to prevent the cancerous cells from developing.

I have to admit that I'm not vegetarian or vegan, but I am making efforts to reduce the amount of animal protein in my diet, because I have a strong family history of female cancers. Dairy products form a big part of this for me.

RussellTuring

Lucyloo1 wrote: »

I've read a few books recently that point to the connection between dairy and cancer, particularly breast cancer. Ideally I'd like to cut it out completely, but think I'd be miserable and would miss it too much. Can anyone offer advice on nice-tasting non-dairy alternatives? I've tried soya milk and rice milk and hated them. I'm reducing the amount of milk I have in tea / coffee (and trying to get used to having them black) and trying to find non-cereal based ideas for breakfasts, but would like to do more.

Any advice would be much appreciated.

Thanks.

I think, as others have said, it's a matter of finding what you like. There's plenty of options when it comes to milk and a few for yogurt and cheese. I haven't yet found anything that can properly replace cheese in flavour or texture but nutritional yeast is a powder you can sprinkle on your pasta, popcorn or beans on toast that has a somewhat cheesy/nutty taste.

Pure is cheaper than dairy based spreads and is a great replacement for them. It's just as versatile and has a few vitamins and other stuff that you may need.

sh1tstirrer wrote: »

You read a few books and now you are convinced dairy causes cancer. Here is a list of other things you need to avoid the sun, esb pylons, traffic fumes, smoking, alcohol etc. etc. etc. the list goes on. Pretty much everything you do and around you in life can cause cancer.

Which is why it's a good idea to avoid one of them if you can. Why don't you stop trying to stir sh1t and either offer the OP some advice or go away and do something more productive with your time?

Breezer

sh1tstirrer wrote: »

Red meat doesn't cause cancer it's the additives they put in it that is the problem. Organic meat doesn't have any of these additives or preservatives

What's your source for this? There is an association between a diet high in red meat and colorectal cancer, and my understanding is that most studies point to either the high temperature cooking or the haem iron contained in it as being the culprit, not any particular additives. On the other hand, in some studies, dairy has been shown to be protective against colorectal cancer.

I've never come across a link between dairy consumption and breast cancer, I'll look into it.

Edit: Did a very quick search for relevant articles on PubMed there. Found very few. The link between dairy and breast cancer seems to have been a theory in the past, but the evidence seems inconclusive at best. On the other hand, high dairy consumption does increase the total fat intake. Fatty tissue produces oestrogen, and high oestrogen levels is a risk for breast cancer. But I'm not convinced that dairy in and of itself can be said to be linked to breast cancer. Of course, there are lots of other good reasons one mightn't want to consume it, not least animal rights/welfare.

fillefatale

Lucyloo1 wrote: »

Rice Dream is the brand. Also came across a watered down coconut milk in Super Valu the other day and it seems reasonable too.

I tentatively bought this before and was too chicken to taste it.

spiralbound wrote: »

Have you got a source for this?

Someone above mentioned it, its The China Study.

Breezer

fillefatale wrote: »

Someone above mentioned it, its The China Study.

Hmm. I'd be wary of that study (which I admittedly hadn't read anything about prior to 5 minutes ago). Without getting too deep into it, from reading here, I've inferred that it's a 30 year old cohort study (by which I mean one group was studied, rather than directly compared with a different group, which would be a case-control study.) There also appears to have been a number of statistically insignificant results drawn from the study (which means that while the data used produced a positive result, once errors are allowed for, the same data may on a different occasion have produced a negative result). And numerous other things that make me wary.

Now, I'm not going to immediately trust a website called "BeyondVeg.com" to write completely unbiased articles. I'm sure it's not giving the whole picture. But presuming the information in that article is at least factual, there's enough there to make me think "China study: interesting, potentially useful, but old research, quite a few caveats, I'd like to see more studies please."

I think I'll be reading this study in more detail over the next while if I can though

The current medical view is that a diet high in red meat and low in fibre is a risk factor for colon cancer, but the association is nowhere near as strong as, say, that between smoking and lung cancer. I've never heard much said about dairy and breast cancer so I won't comment further on that.

RussellTuring

Breezer wrote: »

Hmm. I'd be wary of that study (which I admittedly hadn't read anything about prior to 5 minutes ago). Without getting too deep into it, from reading here, I've inferred that it's a 30 year old cohort study (by which I mean one group was studied, rather than directly compared with a different group, which would be a case-control study.) There also appears to have been a number of statistically insignificant results drawn from the study (which means that while the data used produced a positive result, once errors are allowed for, the same data may on a different occasion have produced a negative result). And numerous other things that make me wary.

Now, I'm not going to immediately trust a website called "BeyondVeg.com" to write completely unbiased articles. I'm sure it's not giving the whole picture. But presuming the information in that article is at least factual, there's enough there to make me think "China study: interesting, potentially useful, but old research, quite a few caveats, I'd like to see more studies please."

I think I'll be reading this study in more detail over the next while if I can though

The current medical view is that a diet high in red meat and low in fibre is a risk factor for colon cancer, but the association is nowhere near as strong as, say, that between smoking and lung cancer. I've never heard much said about dairy and breast cancer so I won't comment further on that.

If only more people were as sceptical as you! For me, while not eating dairy may or may not bring some health benefits, the real issue is the process by which we get that milk. It's not essential and I'd rather not contribute to the process for the sake of my own appetite.

Breezer

RussellTuring wrote: »

If only more people were as sceptical as you! For me, while not eating dairy may or may not bring some health benefits, the real issue is the process by which we get that milk. It's not essential and I'd rather not contribute to the process for the sake of my own appetite.

Well to be fair, not everyone's work revolves around this sort of thing, mine does. Agreed regarding the core issue though: for me, any health benefits to veganism are a nice bonus, but secondary to the ethical issues.

Looking Glass

I was worried about going without dairy products when I decided to become a proper vegan, but what I started doing with integrating the Alpro soya milk into my cereal/tea. I wasn't using it all the time, but I'd use it 50% of the time. Then before I knew it, I was using it all the time and didn't even use the normal milk anymore! The cheese was a more tricky thing to give up - I bought some farmer's dairy free cheese in the Old English Market and nearly gagged when I took a taste of it! I can still remember the taste - it was awfully rubbery! I then bought some Sheese (the smoked one) since I read rave reviews of it online. But then when I took a taste of it it was far too overpowering. Not disgusting, but... Odd. A bit too strong. Maybe I should try a different flavour.

Absurdum

interesting/powerful/fanatical reading here....

http://www.rense.com/general26/milk.htm

Weyhey

I would also recommend the coconut milk, the one I tried is Kara with added calcium and it tastes the best out of all the dairy free milks I tried. Also doesn't curdle in tea or coffee.

_Whimsical_

Weyhey wrote: »

I would also recommend the coconut milk, the one I tried is Kara with added calcium and it tastes the best out of all the dairy free milks I tried. Also doesn't curdle in tea or coffee.

Agree here I'm drinking kara coconut milk too and finding it by far the best milk substitute for tea that Ive found and I've tried loads.

I am wary of having too much soya in my diet as I find it definitely invokes a hormonal response in me ,gives me spots and pmt etc. After a year or so on soya I was diagnosed with having a low functioning thyroid too. I didnt tolerate the medication well so had to stop it. When I told my errndocrinologist I was using soya milk regularly he told me to quit it immediately as it's known to be "goitrogenic" in some people, ie. It can interfere with thyroid function. After three months off it my thyroid returned to normal function. It might be worth baring in mind for anyone with similar problems that it's not great for everyone.

sweet-rasmus

That's interesting to hear that soya may affect the thyroid. Good to bear in mind