Autumn Marathon 2011 'Seasoned' Runners thread

ecoli

With the success of the Novice and Improvers thread I thought this would good one to start with 24 weeks from DCM come this monday. Initially this was going to be a Sub 3 thread but I think it should me less intimidating so this is more for people who are aiming for anything between 2.55 - 3.20 marathons.
Whether people are looking to use well established plans ( P&D, Runnersworld, Daniels etc) and wish to discus things or ask questions with like minded aspirants or whether people are looking for a devised plan like last years (if there is some interest in this)

menoscemo

This looks pretty cool. I'll be targetting Berlin though. Probably i'll be using the P&D 12 week programme (55-70 mpw) and aiming for 3'08.

ecoli

menoscemo wrote: »

This looks pretty cool. I'll be targetting Berlin though. Probably i'll be using the P&D 12 week programme (55-70 mpw) and aiming for 3'10.

There will probably be a few doing this (think shels mentioned same in another thread) No reason why it cant be designed as a more autumn marathon thread (especially since there a good build up to both being put up 24 weeks before marathon date)

Brianderunner

Yeah good idea. +1 on making it an autumn marathon thread, doing Berlin too. The training logs are a bit of a shrine to the DCM at the mo.

Oisin11178

menoscemo wrote: »

This looks pretty cool. I'll be targetting Berlin though. Probably i'll be using the P&D 12 week programme (55-70 mpw) and aiming for 3'10.

Kaboom:D

hf4z6sqo7vjngi

Good stuff i will be having a proper crack at a PB later in the year, sub 3.10 3.09 (see what i did there Meno:)).
Thinking of going for Amsterdam or Munich but yet to decide.

Brianderunner

Mercy Fluffy Pointless wrote: »

Good stuff i will be having a proper crack at a PB later in the year, sub 3.10 3.09 (see what i did there Meno:)).
Thinking of going for Amsterdam or Munich but yet to decide.

Remember what happened the busby babes in Munich? Well thats what'll happen to you if you go for that time

Oisin11178

Brianderunner wrote: »

Remember what happened the busby babes in Munich? Well thats what'll happen to you if you go for that time

Dont mind him fran.
Sure brian dont you mean again after london:D
And you have a neck , you are the king of kaboom:D

theboyblunder

anyone doing lucerne? Its the day before the DCM

bueller.....bueller......

PS Frank, brian etc - thats the quickest degeneration of a thread ever

opus

menoscemo wrote: »

This looks pretty cool. I'll be targetting Berlin though. Probably i'll be using the P&D 12 week programme (55-70 mpw) and aiming for 3'08.

Snap! Thinking of something similar myself once the Cork marathon is out of the way.

Brianderunner

theboyblunder wrote: »

PS Frank, brian etc - thats the quickest degeneration of a thread ever

You're right yeah. I'll behave in future

I've been doing a lot of research online about key marathon sessions. Found this on letsrun. I'm not a fan of following schedules so i'm gonna make my own to suit myself with sub 3 in Berlin as a goal.

Here are five key marathon workouts and why they are effective and should be a staple in your marathon program.

1) 24 mile long run at an easy pace (80-85% of marathon pace). This workout has many benefits essential to successful marathon running. It aids mental concentration, adaptation of the muscular structure to competing for multiple hours, it makes the body more efficient at using energy sources such as glycogen and fat (especially in using fat as a fuel source) and boosts the bodies storage capacity for glycogen. To enhance this fuel burning efficiency it is recommened you only take water and electrolyte tablets during this workout.

2) 20 miles run with the first 10 miles at an easy pace (80-85% of marathon pace) and the last 10 miles run at marathon race pace. This run does many of the same things as listed in #1 above but it also teaches your body to run at marathon pace when you are tired. This workout is a staple in many marathoners programs including Ryan Hall's.

3) 10 mile Tempo run at 100 to 102% of marathon race pace. It is recommened this workout be done on the road on a course similar in geography to the course you will be racing on. This workout is often used mid-week to acclimate the body to running at marathon race pace and boost aerobic stamina (endurance). Intimate familiarity with desired marathon pace is crucial in successfully racing a marathon, especially in the critical early stages when you are feeling fresh and its easy to get started at too fast a pace.

4) 10k Tempo run @ 105-106% of marathon pace. It is recommened the workout be done on a track or on a flat surface where the pace can be closely monitored. This workout is a favorite of Renato Canova for building aerobic power/capacity in his marathoners. Many runners substitute a sub-maximum effort 10k road race for this workout. This workout pushes outward the anaerobic threshold and enhances the aerobic efficiency and characteristics of muscles fibers in the muscular system. In addition prolonged efforts at faster than marathon pace have the additional mental benefit of making marathon pace seem easier in comparison.

5) 6 x 1 mile @ 110% of marathon pace with 400 jog recovery. It is recommeneded that this workout be done on a track or flat road course. This workout is a classic speed workout for marathon runners. This workout improves the bodies efficiency (aerobic capacity) as well as it ability to process and get rid of lactate. This increased efficiency enhances the bodies ability to handle, remain relaxed at, and run efficiently at the slightly slower pace of marathon race pace. Studies have found little benefit to running at more than 10% faster than goal race pace, so if able additional reps or a shorter recovery should be used rather than increasing the pace of this workout.

Link at http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=2487659

What are peoples view on these?

ecoli

Brianderunner wrote: »

You're right yeah. I'll behave in future

I've been doing a lot of research online about key marathon sessions. Found this on letsrun. I'm not a fan of following schedules so i'm gonna make my own to suit myself with sub 3 in Berlin as a goal.

Here are five key marathon workouts and why they are effective and should be a staple in your marathon program.

1) 24 mile long run at an easy pace (80-85% of marathon pace). This workout has many benefits essential to successful marathon running. It aids mental concentration, adaptation of the muscular structure to competing for multiple hours, it makes the body more efficient at using energy sources such as glycogen and fat (especially in using fat as a fuel source) and boosts the bodies storage capacity for glycogen. To enhance this fuel burning efficiency it is recommened you only take water and electrolyte tablets during this workout.

2) 20 miles run with the first 10 miles at an easy pace (80-85% of marathon pace) and the last 10 miles run at marathon race pace. This run does many of the same things as listed in #1 above but it also teaches your body to run at marathon pace when you are tired. This workout is a staple in many marathoners programs including Ryan Hall's.

3) 10 mile Tempo run at 100 to 102% of marathon race pace. It is recommened this workout be done on the road on a course similar in geography to the course you will be racing on. This workout is often used mid-week to acclimate the body to running at marathon race pace and boost aerobic stamina (endurance). Intimate familiarity with desired marathon pace is crucial in successfully racing a marathon, especially in the critical early stages when you are feeling fresh and its easy to get started at too fast a pace.

4) 10k Tempo run @ 105-106% of marathon pace. It is recommened the workout be done on a track or on a flat surface where the pace can be closely monitored. This workout is a favorite of Renato Canova for building aerobic power/capacity in his marathoners. Many runners substitute a sub-maximum effort 10k road race for this workout. This workout pushes outward the anaerobic threshold and enhances the aerobic efficiency and characteristics of muscles fibers in the muscular system. In addition prolonged efforts at faster than marathon pace have the additional mental benefit of making marathon pace seem easier in comparison.

5) 6 x 1 mile @ 110% of marathon pace with 400 jog recovery. It is recommeneded that this workout be done on a track or flat road course. This workout is a classic speed workout for marathon runners. This workout improves the bodies efficiency (aerobic capacity) as well as it ability to process and get rid of lactate. This increased efficiency enhances the bodies ability to handle, remain relaxed at, and run efficiently at the slightly slower pace of marathon race pace. Studies have found little benefit to running at more than 10% faster than goal race pace, so if able additional reps or a shorter recovery should be used rather than increasing the pace of this workout.

Link at http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=2487659

What are peoples view on these?

The only thing i would say is this should be dependant on your long term training / mileage. These sessions are good (and i use many of which with athletes i coach) But You should look at this sessions as part of a puzzle in terms of the overall marathon training plan. Your Overall training should have structure to it so that there is constant progression.
I would also include some 10k paced intervals as being a very good staple session (once every 2 weeks atleast). Here are a few session which i have used with some of my athletes:

16x400m @ 10k pace w/ 100m recovery

5 miles easy, 12x 800m (5 seconds faster than MP,5 seconds slower than MP) all continuous running

These are some i use in the weeks building up to the taper:

1 mile easy,1 mile MP,2 mile easy,2 MP,3 mile easy,3 mile MP,2 mile easy,2 MP,1 mile easy,1 MP,

15 miles MP

The main things is consistent miles week in week out better to play consevative and stay on your feet rather than hard weeks training causing you to be forced to take days / weeks off. With a solid 4-6 months training there is no reason why you cant achieve the times you are looking for

RAL3

Great idea Ecoli, I'll be hoping for a time in that bracket in the next marathon so I'll be following this thread with interest.

I'm a P & D 18 week follower and its stood me fairly well in terms of progression ( with the exception on Boston a few weeks ago).

I'd be hoping to do DCM - must remember to wear a helmet to protect myself from the Meno & Brianderunner explosions at mile 22!

menoscemo

RAL3 wrote: »

Great idea Ecoli, I'll be hoping for a time in that bracket in the next marathon so I'll be following this thread with interest.

I'm a P & D 18 week follower and its stood me fairly well in terms of progression ( with the exception on Boston a few weeks ago).

I'd be hoping to do DCM - must remember to wear a helmet to protect myself from the Meno & Brianderunner explosions at mile 22!

Firstly, we'll both be pacing Dublin (after racing Berlin), so there'll be no Blow ups.
Secondly, I thought Boston was to be your last Marathon? Has your Wife relented? :pac:

RAL3

menoscemo wrote: »

Firstly, we'll both be pacing Dublin (after racing Berlin), so there'll be no Blow ups.
Secondly, I thought Boston was to be your last Marathon? Has your Wife relented? :pac:

Negotiations are at an early stage............

Oisin11178

[QUOTE=menoscemo;72229215]Firstly, we'll both be pacing Dublin (after racing Berlin), so there'll be no Blow ups.
Secondly, I thought Boston was to be your last Marathon? Has your Wife relented? :pac:[/QUOTE]
Didint know they had sorted pacers for dublin yet:D

Brianderunner

Oisin11178 wrote: »

Didint know they had sorted pacers for dublin yet:D

Well thats the idea, 3'30 or 3'45. Be sure now that you tell the pacing group organisers about the excellent pacing job i did for you in Barca, just leave out the bit from mile 21 onwards, that didnt happen

Oisin11178

You have not got the time for 3.30 bud, hard luck and try again next year. Meno can do 4 hours no probs. He is another notorious exploder so no lower:d ~

Brianderunner

Oisin11178 wrote: »

You have not got the time for 3.30 bud, hard luck and try again next year. Meno can do 4 hours no probs. He is another notorious exploder so no lower:d ~

Not now but possibly on sept 25th. 3'45 would be fine too.

hf4z6sqo7vjngi

Brianderunner wrote: »

Remember what happened the busby babes in Munich? Well thats what'll happen to you if you go for that time

Oisin11178 wrote: »

Dont mind him fran.
Sure brian dont you mean again after london:D
And you have a neck , you are the king of kaboom:D

London will not be repeated.....these words could come back to haunt me:)

menoscemo

Mercy Fluffy Pointless wrote: »

Good stuff i will be having a proper crack at a PB later in the year, sub 3.10 3.09 (see what i did there Meno:)).
Thinking of going for Amsterdam or Munich but yet to decide.

I think you read my first post wrong

hf4z6sqo7vjngi

menoscemo wrote: »

I think you read my first post wrong

LOL:)

Oisin11178

All the lads racing berlin:D
You should all run together, get yourself a nice little group. It makes it alot easier.
Just dont stand near brian, you dont want any shrapnel hitting you when he explodes:D

Brianderunner

Oisin11178 wrote: »

All the lads racing berlin:D
You should all run together, get yourself a nice little group. It makes it alot easier.
Just dont stand near brian, you dont want any shrapnel hitting you when he explodes:D

At least i have the b*lls to give it a lash in the autumn, while someone else clearly has the ability but chooses to plod round ultra's instead, no names mentioned.

Brianderunner

Mercy Fluffy Pointless wrote: »

London will not be repeated

Your right London will not be repeated, you'll be lucky to break 3'30 next time round

Oisin11178

Brianderunner wrote: »

At least i have the b*lls to give it a lash in the autumn, while someone else clearly has the ability but chooses to plod round ultra's instead, no names mentioned.

haha, yeah i hate marathon training:D
8.15 a mile for 40 miles is not plodding btw, the nerve:D

TheRoadRunner

I'm also in for Berlin. A few stop start weeks coming up and then hopefully 13 weeks of absolute magic training. May also be running Dublin but that will just be a pacing/fun run with a friend of mine if he can make the starting line. Not a fan of autumn marathons. Summer holidays usually mess up my training. I've sorted that this year

liamo123

Berlin for me too... Enjoyed last year (despite the heavy rain ) so back for more... One thing for sure.... its as flat as a pancake!!

RHunce

Hi Ecoli, could you look at my last few posts in the novice thread and recommend anything, should I keep going the way I am, push for more if I'm finding it easy or lay off. Thanks

theboyblunder

liamo123 wrote: »

Berlin for me too... Enjoyed last year (despite the heavy rain ) so back for more... One thing for sure.... its as flat as a pancake!!

feck all of yis anyway. Now I want to do Berlin.

ecoli

RHunce wrote: »

Hi Ecoli, could you look at my last few posts in the novice thread and recommend anything, should I keep going the way I am, push for more if I'm finding it easy or lay off. Thanks

Hey RHunce

Have been looking at your through your posts. No reason why you arent capable of the times you are trying to clock find a good plan and stick to it and build your mileage slowly. At eighteen I would not be a huge fan of jumping into a marathon (especially with your lack of running history) however if your set on it just build things gradually and remember you dont have to kill yourself on your easy runs. Every run has a purpose and is run at a certain pace for each particular purpose so running to hard on an easy day you are not getting the benefits you are looking for.
There are many plans which will get you to your goal P & D (google it) seems to be a popular one among people here which would probably suit you

Art of Noise

I think I may aim for 3:05 this year. Will do both Longford and Dublin again this year as I did last year managing 3:15 in Dublin. Not quite ready for a sub 3 attempt yet with PBs of 19:00 for 5k, 38:50 for 10k and 64:50 for 10 miles this year. I know if I go for it there is a good chance I would DNF so I will leave the Sub 3 goal til next year.

Did my first long run of my marathon training last weekend, 19-20 miles. Will try to get a couple of 22 mile runs in soon enough too. I think I will run some of these miles at PMP (maybe about 6 miles) but the majority at 8 minute miles plus. Ideally the 22 mile runs should take close to 3 hours. Time on your feet as they say is more important than running fast in LSR training.

misty floyd

Art of Noise wrote: »

I think I may aim for 3:05 this year. Will do both Longford and Dublin again this year as I did last year managing 3:15 in Dublin. Not quite ready for a sub 3 attempt yet with PBs of 19:00 for 5k, 38:50 for 10k and 64:50 for 10 miles this year. I know if I go for it there is a good chance I would DNF so I will leave the Sub 3 goal til next year.

don't write it off this early. You are hitting 20's already, nice one. What kind of mileage are you doing at the moment and what do you plan on doing?
You can definitely do it.

18 weeks to Dublin this Monday, Best of luck folks. Hope to be able to give it another lash myself if injuries get sorted.

ELFOYZER

Hi e-coli et al.
I'll definitely be following your thread with great interest.

Down for more punishment in DCM this year.;)

Art of Noise

misty floyd wrote: »

don't write it off this early. You are hitting 20's already, nice one. What kind of mileage are you doing at the moment and what do you plan on doing?
You can definitely do it.

Thanks for the confidence. I still don't think i'm quite there though. Probably not doing enough mileage. While I may do one 20-22 mile at a weekend i'd probably only do about that again spaced out during the week. (i.e) about 40+ miles per week. How much mileage would you do a week preparing for a marathon?

misty floyd

Art of Noise wrote: »

Thanks for the confidence. I still don't think i'm quite there though. Probably not doing enough mileage. While I may do one 20-22 mile at a weekend i'd probably only do about that again spaced out during the week. (i.e) about 40+ miles per week. How much mileage would you do a week preparing for a marathon?

Well I was doing around 50 - 60 mpw for my first sub 3 attempt, which wasn't a sub 3 attempt until about 8 weeks to go. Thats why I'm saying don't call it quits on the sub 3 just yet. In terms of mileage, it depends on what you are capable of. Some people might pick up injuries at higher mileage. Its up to you but I'd be increasing the miles if I was you.

potsy11

Just noticed this thread and thought i'd join you guys here.

I am making my second attemnpt at 3.15 this year. Its my 5th Marathon. Last year I blew up and managed 3.27 (same as the year before).

I have decided to do the P&D 18 week 55 mile plan and have been back running the last 4-5 weeks. Up to 40 miles now and got a 15 miler in on Sunday with avg pace of 8.30.

i did the Docklands run last week (5m / 8k) and did it in 33.35.

Any tips, hints etc...is the P&D plan that I am doing enough or should i be looking at another plan?

good Luck to one and all!

ThePiedPiper

I suppose I'm seasoned at this stage too. I've 11 marathons under my belt with a PB in February this year of 2.58. I'm running Dublin this year too so after a couple of low enough mileage months I'm back to running 3 days a week now, maybe 25 miles a week. I plan on building this up slowly over July and August, then a tough 6 weeks training from the start of September.

I'm not really sure what my goal is for this race. For a few years, every marathon I trained seriously for was aimed at breaking 3 hours. Sub 2.50 is probably the next logical landmark but we'll see how it goes.

I'm down for the 5, 10 and 13.1 in the race series, and will probably throw in another couple of shorter distance races over the next while too, 10k this weekend I think.

Gringo78

Starting training for Dublin last week....aim is <2:50 (2 previous marathons, PB 2:59). Due to never being able to stick to a plan due to a lot of travel with work, I'm kind of just trying to get a good weeks training in rather than any over arching plan. I don't get the time at weekends to do long runs so I hope to counteract the lack of 20-22 mile runs by 2 x 14-18 mile runs each week, on Mondays & Thursdays. I'm sure I will get 2 or 3 20 mile runs in at some stage over the next 16 weeks though.

Averaged 33mpw for 2:59 last time out. Will be looking for 40-50 miles each week with a lot of PMP miles thrown in with some cruise interval sessions at 10k pace. Some runs will be on the dreadmill, I find it more efficeint use of the treadmill to do 5-10% incline hill reps rather than PMP, tempo or speedwork as don't like running fast on the treadmill (its really not the same as the road once you up the pace). Look to run 7 days a week but if I can get 5 days in I'm happy. Travel with work should be well down in september/October so that should give me a good run in to the marathon.

theboyblunder

Gringo78 wrote: »

Starting training for Dublin last week....aim is <2:50 (2 previous marathons, PB 2:59). Due to never being able to stick to a plan due to a lot of travel with work, I'm kind of just trying to get a good weeks training in rather than any over arching plan. I don't get the time at weekends to do long runs so I hope to counteract the lack of 20-22 mile runs by 2 x 14-18 mile runs each week, on Mondays & Thursdays. I'm sure I will get 2 or 3 20 mile runs in at some stage over the next 16 weeks though.

Averaged 33mpw for 2:59 last time out. Will be looking for 40-50 miles each week with a lot of PMP miles thrown in with some cruise interval sessions at 10k pace. Some runs will be on the dreadmill, I find it more efficeint use of the treadmill to do 5-10% incline hill reps rather than PMP, tempo or speedwork as don't like running fast on the treadmill (its really not the same as the road once you up the pace). Look to run 7 days a week but if I can get 5 days in I'm happy. Travel with work should be well down in september/October so that should give me a good run in to the marathon.

Best of luck with it Gringo! Any idea on a target time? How have you been doing over the 10m-half distances recently?

Im doing Lucerne the day before the DCM, started the training on sunday. Pity, we might have been able to trot along together for a while in Dublin otherwise.

Gringo78

theboyblunder wrote: »

Best of luck with it Gringo! Any idea on a target time? How have you been doing over the 10m-half distances recently?

Im doing Lucerne the day before the DCM, started the training on sunday. Pity, we might have been able to trot along together for a while in Dublin otherwise.

Haven't been racing other than a 10k & a few 5k's and prob won't get a 10m or HM race in before the marathon but target for now will be 2:49 and see whether can lower that depending on how training goes. I'd like to think a 2:44:xx is possible if training goes really good.

MisterDrak

Going to pop my head in here for time to time also lads.

Did a 3:14 in DCM 10, but felt there was a bit more there.

Having looked at my splits (many many times) was averaging 7:10m/m for first 20 miles, then the average moved to 7:50m/m for the next 6 miles. I guess i didnt do enough 20+ mile runs, but am open to any other suggestions.

Training this year has been a mixed bag, solid start in Jan , Feb and Mar, followed by injurys to Knees and hip in April and May, so im starting slighlt on the back foot.

That being said i did a new PB for 5K reciently fo 19:40, so not all bad news.

Anyway im off now to, do up my Plan, which is going to be a personalised version of Daniels, to fit in with work / family commitments...

hf4z6sqo7vjngi

Looks like i will be targeting Amsterdam for the marathon pb now that i am pacing Dublin. Anyone ever try it before? I heard it is flat and good potential for a fast time.

Brianderunner

Mercy Fluffy Pointless wrote: »

Looks like i will be targeting Amsterdam for the marathon pb now that i am pacing Dublin. Anyone ever try it before? I heard it is flat and good potential for a fast time.

I know plenty of people who have tried Amsterdam and have had a good time

ThePiedPiper

Mercy Fluffy Pointless wrote: »

Looks like i will be targeting Amsterdam for the marathon pb now that i am pacing Dublin. Anyone ever try it before? I heard it is flat and good potential for a fast time.

Well Jacky. Yes, Amsterdam is a very good marathon, I did it last year. The course is practically pancake flat, maybe not quite Berlin, but close enough.

A lot of the course is a run out and back along the Amstel river out into the countryside. The stadium start and finish is very handy, as are the hot showers afterwards. Apart from some sections of the course being a bit boring through industrial areas, it's a top-class marathon and definitely potential for fast times.

potsy11

i am doing the 55 mile 18 week P&D Plan

Next week is the Irish Runner 5mile

Is it ok to keep the plan as is with 18m the day after the race or am i better off reorganising the week so that I do the 28 fresh?? Any suggestions?

The plan for the week is as follows:

Mon - rest / Cross
Tues - 10m (w/ 5m at 15k pace)
wed - 5m recovery
thurs - 10m easy
fri - rest
Sat - 5m recovery (5m Race)
Sun - Long 18m

ThePiedPiper

potsy11 wrote: »

i am doing the 55 mile 18 week P&D Plan

Next week is the Irish Runner 5mile

Is it ok to keep the plan as is with 18m the day after the race or am i better off reorganising the week so that I do the 28 fresh?? Any suggestions?

The plan for the week is as follows:

Mon - rest / Cross
Tues - 10m (w/ 5m at 15k pace)
wed - 5m recovery
thurs - 10m easy
fri - rest
Sat - 5m recovery (5m Race)
Sun - Long 18m

Potsy,

If I was you, I'd race hard in the 5 mile, and if you really want to do a recovery the following day, I wouldn't do more than 10 miles.

What's your goal race? If it's in October, then building speed at the moment is more benefical than the long run in my opinion.

Too many 18 mile plus runs in the lead-up to a marathon can be counter-productive.

potsy11

RunForestRun wrote: »

Potsy,

If I was you, I'd race hard in the 5 mile, and if you really want to do a recovery the following day, I wouldn't do more than 10 miles.

What's your goal race? If it's in October, then building speed at the moment is more benefical than the long run in my opinion.

Too many 18 mile plus runs in the lead-up to a marathon can be counter-productive.

DCM In October is the goal and aiming for 3.15/3.20.

Currently on wk 3 of 18 wk plan. Have done 15,16 and 17 this week. Up to about 46-48 miles per week.

I have done 5 Matathons previous but the last 2 have been reasonably structured plans.

ThePiedPiper

Potsy,

I'm planning on DCM too which will be my 12th, and aiming for 2.55 ish. At the minute I'm probably averaging about 25-30 miles per week. I'll up it after the 5 miles in mid-July and start by August will be hitting 50. September will be my heaviest month with 60-75 mile weeks probably. Overall, I'll probably have about 4 or 5 20+ mile runs, and 4 or 5 16-20 mile runs.

Did your other marathons have 18 mile long runs so far out from the marathon? I'm not following any specific plan, just the general plan of our club coach, who was a 2.17 runner in his day. It'll become more structured after the 5 miler.

Going from experience and from my coach's experience, I think that too many long runs this far out from the marathon isn't the best approach. In saying that, everybody has different approaches and what works for one may not necessarily work for another.

potsy11

RunForestRun wrote: »

Potsy,

I'm planning on DCM too which will be my 12th, and aiming for 2.55 ish. At the minute I'm probably averaging about 25-30 miles per week. I'll up it after the 5 miles in mid-July and start by August will be hitting 50. September will be my heaviest month with 60-75 mile weeks probably. Overall, I'll probably have about 4 or 5 20+ mile runs, and 4 or 5 16-20 mile runs.

Did your other marathons have 18 mile long runs so far out from the marathon? I'm not following any specific plan, just the general plan of our club coach, who was a 2.17 runner in his day. It'll become more structured after the 5 miler.

Going from experience and from my coach's experience, I think that too many long runs this far out from the marathon isn't the best approach. In saying that, everybody has different approaches and what works for one may not necessarily work for another.

Hi Forest,

Thanks for your response.

Its funny, I asked the question a few months back what the best structured plans for a marathon would be and the majority seemed to think that the P&D book was best...so off i went and got the book. I decdied on the 18 week plan 55 miles as my general running activity has not been great up until 5 weeks ago.

generally speaking my previous plans were based largely on HH Intermediate and advanced and last year I only did a PB by 30 seconds and was aiming at 3.15 (ran 3.27) so was pretty dissappointed. On reflection I put this down to poor execution of the plan (too many missed days) so nobody to blame but me. I've come out fighting and am determined to hit my target.

Bwtween now and DCM this is the weekly long run:

17,18,13,17,18,20,16 (12@RP), 13,20,17,17(14@RP),15,21,17,16,12, marathon. (17 weeks running)

The max in a week is obviously 55miles.

I would have figured that this plan is the norm for most average runner given that the book was so highly recommended.

belcarra

potsy11 wrote: »

Between now and DCM this is the weekly long run:

17,18,13,17,18,20,16 (12@RP), 13,20,17,17(14@RP),15,21,17,16,12, marathon. (17 weeks running)

Hi Potsy,

I'm following the same plan but am a bit confused by your long runs quoted. I have the book beside me here and the Long Runs that take place on the Sunday are (In miles):
12, 13 (w/8 @ PMP), 14, 15, 16 (w/10 @ PMP), 12, 18, 20, 16 (w/12 @ PMP), 14, 20, 17, 18 (w/14 @ PMP), 17, 20, 16, 12, Marathon.

This is 'Advanced Marathoning' from P&D. Not sure where your numbers are coming from but I think these LSRs would tie in with what people would expect this far out, as opposed to doing 18 milers at this stage?