I haven't spoken to my sister in a year - and I don't care

LegacyUser

This will be long, but I'll break it into paragraphs. Thanks to every one who reads.

I'm a 28-yr-old guy, the oldest child of my parents' four children. I'm 5 years ahead of my first sister, ten years ahead of my brother, and 13 years ahead of my youngest sister.

The age gap has contributed to me never being close to any of my siblings. Plus, I've always been closer to my friends than my family. I'm from a rural area and I suppose I've always been an intellectual sort. None of the rest of my family are, and they all love rural life and GAA. I never did, and really only came into my own when I went to college at 17. My life just took off then, and I rarely came home, and because I was never close to my family in terms of socialising with them/confiding in them, I'm most definitely the odd one out within my family.

Anyway, despite this, I have always had a pretty decent relationship (if not a close one) with everyone within my family with the exception of my 23-yr-old sister. They all accept that I'm just different from them in interest and outlook, they tolderate me and I them. With the exception of said sister.

I moved home to the family home to live last June because I was going through a rough time. My girlfriend, whom I loved deeply and proposed to, left me to pursue another man like a bolt out of the blue. In addition, I lost my job due to the economy. This all happened within a month and I saw none of it coming. I had to move home, my parents having kindly offered me accommodation. At 28, it seemed the floor had fallen out from under me: I was broken-hearted and aimless, stunned, and depressed. Privately, I entertained dark thoughts about suicide but would never go through with it because I reasoned my misery was temporary and I could not leave my parents devastated.

Now, the sister in question does not live at home, but she comes home at weekends. We never got along, and I always felt, for some reason, based on the look on her face whenever she was around me, that she hated my guts. It's difficult to explain, but her attitude to me has always been poisonous. She views me as a freak because I eschew the cultural norms of the local community (e.g. I don't attend mass, I don't like GAA or the local club, I don't have friends among the neighbours, and I have interests in things she considers 'weird' such as astronomy, geology and history).

Anyway, the very first weekend was home, we had WW3. I hadn't seen her in months because I had been in another country when the break-up happened and I lost my job. So when I moved home, she knew I was raw.

While I had been abroad, a female friend was taking care of my stuff. When I came back to Ireland, I first had to fetch my stuff from this friend, who kindly offered to drive me and my stuff back to my home. We stopped off along the way, and didn't reach home until 2am. My female friend was going to stay the night in my brother's bedroom, who was away that night.

I got permission from my father to have my friend stay over, explained to him we'd be late, he said no problem and told me he'd be in bed. My mother was also away that night.

Anyway, arrived home with my friend at 2am, and we were sitting down quietly in separate seats, chatting peacefully. My little sister (14) then came home from babysitting, saw that I had a female friend, and came in to the room to say hello. Before we knew it, she was gone again.

Ten mins later I received a text from my little sister, who was now in her bedroom, accusing me of bringing home a woman, breaking the rules, and taking advantage of our mother's absence (my Dad was asleep in bed remember). I was shocked at the txt, but ignored it. I found it cheeky for a 14 year old girl to get it so so wrong, but ignored it nonetheless.

Then ten mins later, I received a vicious text from the older 23-yr-old sister along the same lines, at which time I went down to her bedroom to explain the situation calmly. My two sisters would not listen, said I was ignorant and inconsiderate, and didn't believe that my guest was really my friend. As I couldn't reason with them, I walked away from them and went back to the sitting room.

The next morning my dad was gone out. My friend and I planned to cook a fry, and, as I was up first and didn't want my sisters to barge in on top of us over breakfast and make life awkward, I said I'd go down to them again to explain things diplomatically.

I met my little sister first and explained things to her, said that she had gotten it wrong, and that she could have joined us or texted me to find out who my friend was, instead of just accusing me and creating needless pandemonium. I was very mild and polite to her when I said this. But then the 23-yr-old came charging out of her room, with that look of hatred for me on her face. I started to speak to her diplomatically too. But her face became more twisted at the sight of me, she started shouting, and kept finding new excuses to scold me. Then she said she hates how I speak, she said my ex was right to leave me (remember I had proposed to this ex and was completely devestated at the time), called me ugly, and just had this unspeakably malevolent look in her eyes all the while while saying these things to me. This look convinced me that she meant all the things she was saying.

I was already emotionally raw. Heck, I was an emotional wreck. I was a broken man, and to hear these things, to be the object of such hate, caused something to break in me. I have never laid a hand on anyone my whole life, ever. Never been in a fight. I am gentle. But when she called me ugly (bear in mind my ex left me for another man) and went to slam her door in my face, I snapped. I caught her door before it slammed in her face and pounded it back in her direction, entered her room, caught her, and threw her across the room so that she landed in her bed. She screamed in fear. It was shrill enough for me to stop immediately and leave the room.

Meanwhile my friend had woken up. She texted me to go to her room, as obviously she had heard the bedlam and wanted to know what was going on. I told her. I felt appalled that I had hurt my sister, mortified, afraid, panicked. I thought my parents would kick me out of the house. My friend said she heard everything my sister had said to me, and said she deserved a thump. She said she had never heard the like of it before.

Regardless, I went down to my sister's room to apologise. When I tried to explain to her how shattered I was from the break-up, I started to cry. I really was an emotional wreck. I asked her to forgive me, said I was genuinely sorry, but to no avail. She said I was a freak and said other things calculated to hurt a person who's already down.

I later explained to my parents exactly what had happened and they said to forget about it. But my sister and I have not spoken since. She clearly has not accepted my apology and anyway, now that a year has passed and my mental state has improved, I look back on it and I think she deserved it. No one ever spoke to me like she did that morning; no one ever looked at me with such pure hatred. I feel nothing for her but contempt. She is no sister to me.

I still see her every week when she is home, but we never even make eye contact. The thing is, everyone else in the family must see that we are estranged, yet they say nothing. This is good.... but what happens in the future when she's getting married and I don't want to go? Or when I get married and I don't want to invite her? Sooner or later someone will bring it up...what the heck am I supposed to say when that happens? She is a skilled manipulator and is closer to the rest of my family than I am. They really would take her side.

I'm a little at a loss as to how to handle this when it eventually happens. Any suggestions?

irishdude11

You shouldnt have apologised to her. What she did was way way worse. And then you let her think she was in the right by apologising. So what if you dont invite her to your wedding or she doesnt invite you to hers, theres no point in pretending to be happy families for a wedding just for the sake of when you hate each others guts.

thefeatheredcat

It's great to hear firstly that your mental state has improved, despite what you have been through overall.

I'm actually quite surprised that your sister hasn't been taken aside by your parents and advised to go eat some humble pie and apologise. I'd say she probably does regret it but either too stubborn or proud to admit the mistake.

I would assume that your father explained everything about your arriving and having a friend over at the time to both your sisters? I can understand what it's like to be the younger sibling in the situation of looking after the house (even for a day) and then having the older sibling come along and do things differently from the norm or break the rules. But she was very wrong in how she reacted and what she did.

The issue is really with her and it sounds more like she is the bearing the grudge unnecessarily but it's really a lesson for her to learn and not for you to dwell on too much.

As for the future, well no doubt it would be silly of her to hold one incident against you - I've had many fights down through the years with my siblings over small and serious things but always patched things up or let enough time go by for things to be alright - especially if it was the cost of a family day together in celebration of a family wedding and no doubt your parents would be saddened should that happen.

Some day she is going to realise she is going to need her big brother around as people change over time with attitudes and perception, so you never know something in life may nudge her anyway to swallow her pride and make peace.

I would say there's nothing really you can do except always leave the door open to making peace with her and maybe with some encouragement by your parents it may happen.

If it should be the case that you're still not on speaking terms by the time you get married, then invite her anyway and leave the decision with her. If she gets married, it could be her chance to reconcile and if not, then don't let it effect the relationship with the rest of your family that you cut ties altogether.

Family feuds are never nice - there was a few in my family down the line with some of my dad's cousins and uncles and further back and members like that and it split the family so some of the generations to come never spoke to the others until the feud was buried and resolved as much as could be by my family

dozydora

It sounds to me like your sister has issues and on top of that she is a bully. More than likely she is jealous of you. Your parents probably say nothing so as to keep the peace and who can blame them seeing how vicious she is. My advice (for what it is worth) would be to be polite to her without falling over her. She will probably mellow with age. What seems strange to me is the incident with your younger sister. Maybe she should go away to college as well to get out of what seems to me to be a pretty weird environment. Why should you have had to explain yourself at all. The whole thing seems a bit weird to me. Its like a big to do about nothing. Maybe you should think of moving away again in case you end up like them.

niceoneted

I just read the title and deduced that you must care if you are taking the time to write about it here.
There is a good spread in my house also. The first 3 being born within 4 yrs me 5.5 yrs later and bro 6.5 yrs after that. I get on with all but younger brother only feels he got to know some of the older ones when he grew up and cannot stand some of them but is civil and I must say a great brother (well to me anyway). Always plays his part.
I'm not saying you have to do that, but I do believe that blood is thinker than water. It might take a while to see that it did for us and we are all 30's and late 40's.
Not sure if that helps. But just be yourself.
I must add that at some stage of all of our lives that some of us did not get on or speak with one of the others.
It might improve as all get older.

AdmiralRazor

Continue to ignore her. It sounds like she was just waiting for the opportunity to widen the gulf between you and the rest of your family because she's intolerant and perhaps a little jealous of your intelligence and achievements.

If your family don't choose to take your side at this inevitable future point then you may need to put some distance between yourself and them too.

They'll see her for her true self one day; That, too, is inevitable.

LegacyUser

What a terrible situation. I find the behaviour of your sisters deeply weird; but you shouldn't have reacted with violence OP. I can truly understand how you did, but that doesn't make it right. You know that though, so I'm not going to labour that point.

I can't believe the 14 year old sister's reaction to you having a friend there - I mean it's hardly as though you two were getting down and dirty on the couch?! I know teenagers can get very passionate about beliefs, and over-react sometimes, but her reaction just seems so odd! And it doesn't sound as though it is a reaction to super strict parents, given that she is trusted enough to come home at that time from babysitting.

All I can think of is that the elder sister is a very strong influence on her - and really not in a good way. The 23 year old's reaction is just nuts. I can't even begin to think why. Jealousy? Some issues she has herself? All I can think of is to echo previous posters and say that I would be unfailingly polite to them both, but would never be close to them again - unless a massive change in attitude is shown. I wouldn't worry about not being bosom buddies - just because you are related does not mean a carte blanche on their part for horrible behaviour. But please never, ever react the same way OP; you will be the loser in the long run.

LegacyUser

Thanks to all those who have so far taken the time to read my lengthy post.

I was quite shocked at the actions of both my sisters. I certainly feel now that it was calculated by my 23-yr-old sister to make me feel unwelcome in the house. That morning she spat at me that, because I had become violent with her, my little sister was now "terrified of me". Yet my little sister did say goodbye to me that morning as the two of them were leaving, and while I am not close to my little sister, she seems to have moved on from it for the most part.

Anyway, any tips on what I should specifically say when I inevitably get asked why my sister and I don't speak? I am quite bad at witty replies to awkward situations, and am inclined to blurt out what's on my mind. I did tell my mother last June after it happened that I honestly think my 23-yr-old sister hates me, but my mother reassured me that she doesn't. I know she does though. What the heck should I say when it's raised again? How to phrase it? A shrug of the shoulders? A frank reply? Express regret or just my genuine contempt? I just want to be prepared for the day when it gets raised again. I can imagine my mother trying to force some sort of artificial reconciliation on us or something.

** By the way, I should say at Christmas, as per my mother's request, I shook my sister's boyfriend's hand when he came to the house. I'd never met him before, but for my mother's sake, I greeted him nicely, even though he was the first one my sister called after the room-throwing incident. I had thought that my gesture here would open the door to her reproaching me, but she is as icy and evil-minded to me as ever. Her body language doesn't lie.

slowmoe

I'm sorry op but i think your family are being soft on you because of what you've been through.

Nobody deserved a thump in this situation. You openly admit that you threw her across the room and she shrilled in fear????

And at the end you've said you agree with everyone else that she deserved it? Imo thats disgraceful. I'm actually shocked that you can't understand why she wouldn't be nice to you after all that.

As for before this incident yes she should have been more caring and considerate towards you when you were in a hard time. But she wasn't. Not everyone in our lives stands up to our own moral code unfortunately. Throwing her across the room is seriously not on. You should have approached that situation like an adult and asked her to talk it out and then spoke about it to your parents.

You seem like you really think you're the bigger man for shaking her bfs hand. My bf would never shake the hand of any man that hit me even if that man was related to me.

Honestly reading your posts to me they seem well written to show how evil you feel the sister is, there is a lot of detail aout how malevolent her actions were, spat at you, poisonous etc ut not as equally well written to the point where you are horrified at your own actions.


From your post I look back on it and I think she deserved it

Seriously op have a read through this thread and really think about why she wouldn't feel wonderful towards you. Whatever reason she had for her behaviour before doesn't matter-you've given her a very very good reason to hate you now

And it seems in your head that you're still the victim?

Good luck with this!

username123

Bizarre family behaviour. It sounds like no one in the family knows how to control themselves or behave in an appropriate way towards each other.

The 14 year old was way out of line texting you regarding the presence of a female friend in the house.

The 23 year old was well out of line for the same, and also completely out of order to shout her head off at you the next morning.

You were completely out of order to become physical with your 23 year old sister.

Sounds to me like everyone is at fault, no one knows how to respect other people or behave in a civilised manner - especially with a guest in the house!

To be honest, in your situation Id get my own behaviour under control, learn how not to allow my temper to get the better of me so that I can be provoked into a physical attack and stay away from the family until they can also learn how to behave in a civilised way.

What you describe in the way in which the 14 year old was interfering in your business with your guest and the 23 year old shouting her head off the next morning, and YOU going down to their rooms to explain things is all not normal behaviour. Its how 5 year olds behave. I do not understand why you would have been explaining yourself in what at that time was your own home for having a guest over, plus, even if you had been having a sexual relationship with that guest - its no ones business but your own - not your sisters!! Unless you were in their rooms or on the kitchen table at it - what business is it of theirs?


The whole situation sounds very dysfunctional and with the exception of the 14 year old who is a child anyway, every supposed adult behaved in a disgracefully immature manner.

LegacyUser

Hi op,

Sounds like your sister is jealous of you. It may be due to the fact you were able to get away at 17 and rarely spent time with the family, while she was always there, living by their rules and now inspite of what happened to you, here you are waltzing back in to the family home and have the life of riley..
Of course you don't have the life of riley at all but this could be the picture your sister sees and is resenting you for it.

You may not like her and it does sound like she is a spoilt mare but being the more mature of you both, would it be out of the question to just sit down and talk to her face to face and discuss all this hostility?

She is your sister at the end of the day and heaven forbid if anything happened to her, would you really feel at ease about this whole situation?

Of course it takes two people to have a conversation but if you ask to talk to her and see where it goes, you both may be able to put this all behind you.

As to what went on last year.. Scratch it off and forget it if you want to move forward with your family otherwise you will never move on and just harbour bad feelings that aren't good for you.

Congratulations on getting back to full health, it's inspiring to hear someone make such a great comeback from what you went through. I really admire you for that!
Take care.

Maple

I'm in 100% agreement with slowmoe on this one.

There was a pair of you in that argument, you have to take responsibility for your own actions.

I can't believe that you still feel you were the victim in all of this. And that you feel you should be applauded for shaking her boyfriend's hand.

You go into such detail as to paint her as a horrible person and make excuses for your own equally disgraceful behavior.

Your 14 yr old sister texting you in her family home, where she lives and where you hadn't lived for many years and by your own admission hadn't visited much either, was perfectly within her rights to point out the house rules to you.

I sincerely doubt that you were mild and polite the following morning to her, it sounds like the 23 yr old came in to protect her 14 yr old sister.

You paint yourself out to be the poor sorry put upon victim, in my estimation the reality is probably very far from the truth.

LegacyUser

I do not care if you believe me or not Maple - I spoke very calmly to my sister initially. You try being at you lowest ebb, absolute rock bottom, and being blindsided by someone shouting pure, hurtful, hateful, vitriol at you some day and see if you don't lose control for just a moment. I have no reason to lie anonymously to you about something that happened a year ago. My purpose here was to give the context and get opinions on what I do from here on with regard to explaining and dealing with the estrangement down the road.

I do not need people to get up on their high horses about something you did not witness. You either take my word for it or you don't. Because I guarantee you, if you knew me, you would know that what I did was incredibly out of character. I seek advice, not chastisement.

Would I have handled it differently if I'd known how the situation would explode within seconds? Absolutely. Should I have assailed my sister? No (just because I think she deserved it doesn't mean I think it should have been done). I shouldn't have gone near her. But it happened. You can't expect to try to break someone and not expect a backlash. Not justifiable, but not exactly something you can't expect either.

Do I feel like a big man for shaking her bf's hand? No! I did it because my mother asked me to greet him. I would not have bothered at all otherwise.

I am not seeking advice on how to make amends with my sister, as that will never happen. I just want to know how to handle estrangement.

I thank the other posters who have commented. Clearly some of them know that family life isn't always like seventh heaven, and that sometimes, people snap from extreme mental stress. I was almost suicidal. Not like I was exactly in control of everything. Also, clearly some of you don't know what it's like to have an incredibly malicious sibling. She has been known as a bully in secondary school and she frequently cuts ties with her "friends" if they do well for themselves, moving on to new dupes afterwards. She's not a pleasant person.

UrbanSea

I'll go against the grain.

I think she deserved it. Not that I advocate violence,but it's clear from the post that she's some scheming,manipulative and condescending that it is genuinely beyond belief. There's someone like that in my family who we don't talk to and it's sheer jealousy(that's another story),but some people are just like it.

OP I wouldn't worry personally about people asking you about it. Just say 'We aren't particularly close' or something along those lines. It's not everyone's business why ye don't talk, but that doesn't mean ye'd have to play happy families either.

Kidchameleon

OP,

I would treat her boyfriend like a normal person, don't just be civil for your mothers sake. He's not your sister...

UrbanSea

slowmoe wrote: »

I'm sorry op but i think your family are being soft on you because of what you've been through.

Nobody deserved a thump in this situation. You openly admit that you threw her across the room and she shrilled in fear????

And at the end you've said you agree with everyone else that she deserved it? Imo thats disgraceful. I'm actually shocked that you can't understand why she wouldn't be nice to you after all that.

As for before this incident yes she should have been more caring and considerate towards you when you were in a hard time. But she wasn't. Not everyone in our lives stands up to our own moral code unfortunately. Throwing her across the room is seriously not on. You should have approached that situation like an adult and asked her to talk it out and then spoke about it to your parents.

You seem like you really think you're the bigger man for shaking her bfs hand. My bf would never shake the hand of any man that hit me even if that man was related to me.

Honestly reading your posts to me they seem well written to show how evil you feel the sister is, there is a lot of detail aout how malevolent her actions were, spat at you, poisonous etc ut not as equally well written to the point where you are horrified at your own actions.


From your post I look back on it and I think she deserved it

Seriously op have a read through this thread and really think about why she wouldn't feel wonderful towards you. Whatever reason she had for her behaviour before doesn't matter-you've given her a very very good reason to hate you now

And it seems in your head that you're still the victim?

Good luck with this!

Also where did the OP say he thumped her? Big difference in throwing her onto the bed and punching her.

LegacyUser

Correct, I did not hit her or leave any mark on her body. My friend who was staying over said that she thought my sister deserved a thump after she heard what went on, but I did not actually strike or beat or punch or hit her.

slowmoe

siblinghatred wrote: »

My friend said she heard everything my sister had said to me, and said she deserved a thump.

Here you go...i never said he thumped her, i said nobody deserved a thump

implausible

anonano wrote: »

Sounds like your sister is jealous of you. It may be due to the fact you were able to get away at 17 and rarely spent time with the family, while she was always there, living by their rules and now in spite of what happened to you, here you are waltzing back in to the family home and have the life of riley..

+1 on this. If you were away for years, your sister probably feels like the oldest and was probably very apprehensive and resentful about you moving back in. The first night you were back, she was presented with a situation that gave her the excuse to kick off. Might your sister have been told in the past that her boyfriend couldn't stay? That would explain both of your sisters' reactions, that the 'golden boy' was allowed to bend the rules. You don't know how your parents speak about you when you're not there and it's quite possible that you are held up as the success story to aspire to, perhaps she feels that you being back showed her up as a failure or not being good enough.

As for throwing her across the room, it does sound like she deserves it and going back to the family home has the amazing effect of reverting you to the status of a child, though I doubt that's the way she sees it.

What should you do? Be civil, for your parents' sake, until she grows up and has some life experience.

Mighty_Mouse

I suppose I've always been an intellectual sort. None of the rest of my family are, and they all love rural life and GAA

they tolderate me and I them

It's not the fact you're smart or have intellectual pursuits that bothers your sisters.
It's the fact that you perceive yourself to be above your family.
You place high value on your intellectual capacity, you're hobbies & interests reflect this.
You have different interests which your family have embraced completely. But you choose to isolate yourself within these parameters.
How many of your family's interest have you embraced. How many x-factor conversations have you sat through with your sisters?
The secret to human interaction is common ground. You must have huge common ground with each family member, which I'm thinking you've neglected, in order to hide behind a curtain of self-validation.

We never got along, and I always felt, for some reason, based on the look on her face

You have always presumed she hates you?
Bad starting point for any relationship don't you think?
Did you leave home when she was 13 and never call her?
That look may not be hatred, but it's more likely rejection by you to her.
I take it you can understand rejection now?

I eschew the cultural norms of the local community (e.g. I don't attend mass, I don't like GAA or the local club,

I'm from the country. I know plenty of people who don't go to mass, don't drink, don't like gaa, ........own flying baloons,organic farmers, into greyhounds, or horseriding, stamp collecting, or heritage associates which trace history & clean-up graveyards.
But all these non-gaa alternative people still know how to shoot-the-**** with their neighbours. You have done zero personal development with regard to overcoming the things that made you uncomfortable at 17.
You're the same awkward boy, except now you know more "stuff".
It's your perception of yourself that stands you apart, not your intellectual pursuits.

interests in things she considers 'weird' such as astronomy, geology and history

You consider them weird compared to your direct social circle. She just has no interest. Why should she? They're your personal private hobbies.

Ten mins later I received a text from my little sister, who was now in her bedroom, accusing me of bringing home a woman, breaking the rules, and taking advantage of our mother's absence (my Dad was asleep in bed remember). I was shocked at the txt, but ignored it

It's not the most outlandish assumption for a person to make though?

I started to speak to her diplomatically too.

Do you relax? How do you speak in private to your close mates?
Are you always diplomatic to the ent degree?
Usually people are relaxed when speaking to siblings. But you participate in an oxford debate ".................
A normal response would of been something like "listen sis/dickhead, before you say anything, I'm not riding a girl my 1st night home, this friend took the time to deliver my stuff, believe what you want, but can we talk about this later as I don't want to embarrass her."

My friend said she heard everything my sister had said to me, and said she deserved a thump

Again, everybody seeks reassurance for their actions in the opinion of others. (hint: its the reason you are posting here)
She probably deserved retaliation but my own personal rule is to meet verbals with verbals & violence with violence.
You responded to a verbal attack by physically assaulting your sister on your 1st morning home.
You followed this up by not speaking to her for a year. She may be 23 but at 13 she was probably highly influence by you before you left for a decade.

said other things calculated to hurt a person who's already down.

It was a row, things were said in the heat of the moment.
Why do you use the word "calculate"?

The thing is, everyone else in the family must see that we are estranged, yet they say nothing.

What are they meant to say? You've made home life awkward for everybody.
You're parents love you both equally & completely no matter how different ye all are.

but what happens in the future when she's getting married and I don't want to go? Or when I get married and I don't want to invite her?

What kind of outer space nonsensical illogical crap is this?
You've taken a future hypotethical based on nothing presently to get advice/approval on a course of action which you took a year ago.?
You have purposely narrowed the parameters of this discussion in order to narrow the range of response from others.
Either you are willing to deal with all background issues or not.

She is a skilled manipulator

So are you.

and is closer to the rest of my family than I am

You left.

I'm a little at a loss as to how to handle this when it eventually happens.

Really?
You want to know how to RSVP an imaginary wedding in the future?

My advice is blood is important. Family is one of the most complicated beautiful relationships existing in the human experience. You can choose to "eschew" this opportunity because of your self-imposed intellectual excile or you can fix it.

Fact is you cannot resolve this situation through 1 conversation.
The damage is extensive. In order to repair things both you and your sister need to change. You need to develop a relationship based on common ground.

Remember, that when the life you built for yourself fell apart, you came home. Home is important. You need to properly appreciate the fact you came from a good 1.

Mighty_Mouse

I certainly feel now that it was calculated by my 23-yr-old sister to make me feel unwelcome in the house. That morning she spat at me that, because I had become violent with her

Why does she hate you?
Most familys include children who are radically different.
Each child strikes out for independance in different ways.
My guess is she doesn't hate you because you are different.
What have you done to make her resent you?

By the way, I should say at Christmas, as per my mother's request, I shook my sister's boyfriend's hand when he came to the house. I'd never met him before, but for my mother's sake, I greeted him nicely,

At Christmas you had to be coaxed to welcome a stranger into your home?
You hold the fact that your sister called her partner after being physical attacked by you against him?

I had thought that my gesture here would open the door to her reproaching me, but she is as icy

Wtf!!!
You shook her bf's hand & you expect this tiny gesture to calm the hurricane thats has been out of control for a year!!

and I always felt, for some reason, based on the look on her face

She views me

unspeakably malevolent look in her eyes all the while while saying these things to me. This look convinced me that she meant all the things she was saying

no one ever looked at me with such pure hatred

but we never even make eye contact.

evil-minded to me as ever. Her body language doesn't lie.

Have you never had a blazing, crazy row before?
Is this your first time properly falling out with anybody?
I'm guessing you've little experience with conflict. It's a pity because it's a basic life skill.
People fall out, get crazy, say things they don't mean..........................it's normal, its a healthy letting off of steam.

You were shocked and frightened by this?

There's a sense of paranoia in terms of how you view people's body landguage. You refer to calculating evil minds somehow believing your perception is always correct.

Relax a little. Perception is important, but the actions a person takes more so. Judge people on what they say and do, not what you believe they believe. Assume goodwill until otherwise is expressed.

Not justifiable, but not exactly something you can't expect either.

explain.

You try being at you lowest ebb, absolute rock bottom

Everyone has. The best of us handle with dignity.

Because I guarantee you, if you knew me, you would know that what I did was incredibly out of character.

You are what you do

Do I feel like a big man for shaking her bf's hand? No! I did it because my mother asked me to greet him. I would not have bothered at all otherwise.

This is odd behaviour.

I seek advice, not chastisement.

again narrowing the parameters.

I am not seeking advice on how to make amends with my sister, as that will never happen. I just want to know how to handle estrangement.

again narrowing the parameters.

This hypotetical "estrangement handling" questions is nonsense. You wouldn't of bothered giving the full story is so.
You are seeking validation for your actions so you will not continue to feel like a asshole.

Clearly some of them know that family life isn't always like seventh heaven

It's not but you truely don't appreciate that.

people snap from extreme mental stress. I was almost suicidal.

Whatever.
You cannot abstractly seek understanding for your mental state from people who you have no relationship with i.e. your sister.
She can only react to you at face value. At face value she witnessed you with a girl in the house @ 2am.
I trust you have learned how to handle grief like an adult.

So the woman left you. So what. The problem is ageless.
Listen to some blues, dust yerself down & get back on with life.
Learn how handle the horrible things life throws at you without shutting down into a prolonged mess of self-absorption.

Also, clearly some of you don't know what it's like to have an incredibly malicious sibling.

Maybe this young 23 year old is more malicious than usual. But there is a reason for it.

She has been known as a bully in secondary school and she frequently cuts ties with her "friends" if they do well for themselves,

Really.
Either this is nonsensical validation or your sister is displaying some personality problems.
Possibly due to being previously abandoned by someone who moved on and done well for themselves?

Correct, I did not hit her or leave any mark on her body..

I'd say you frightened her ****less. I'd say the crazy look of her own brother attacking her is the "mark".
A black eye is sorted with an ice-pack. Fear is a different animal.

My friend who was staying over said that she thought my sister deserved a thump after she heard what went on,

Again with the outside validation of something you know was wrong.
Who is this friend and why does here view count?
It's the only thing you can use to reduce the anxiety you feel towards your actions.
You know it was wrong. It felt wrong at the time.
It still feels wrong. It's been gnawing at you for a year.

but I did not actually strike or beat or punch or hit her

Again you contextualise, fudge the topic, seek reassurance.......
........ie. at least I didn't mark her, beat her, hit her with closed fist, beat her with a pick-axe handle..............etc etc
wtf man?
wtf?
wtf?
You're an intelligent guy. Tell me wtf?
I don't care if you did the Michael Flately on her head.
You attacked her. You frightened her and her sister. She is afraid of you.

LegacyUser

Your posts have a very disdainful tone, you took several quotations out of context, and you have drawn some extremely spurious conclusions about my social skills. Yet there are some nuggets of gold in what you've written. Thanks for those. Sadly there's absolutely no common ground between us. Never was. As to what I did to her in the past to make her loathe me, nothing. You're right though - I have neglected her. That's what happens when you can't relate to someone, or them to you. It's a two-way thing. Also, you clearly don't understand what depression is, or what can cause it, if you think "the best of us just get on with it" or whatever way you put it. Hopefully you'll never be stricken by it, or if you have been, it's a shame you didn't learn some empathy along the way.

LegacyUser

Mighty Mouse,

I've thought about much of your post. And it reminded me of something. Anyway, I have decided that sometime soon, when she is home next and there is no one else around, I'm going to knock on her door. If she lets me in, I will apologise to her very sincerely, I'll apologise for being a bad brother to her all these years, and I'll tell her I'm going to work at being better. I won't even wait for her to answer. I'll just say that, leave a box of chocolates on her bed, and exit the room... I hope that will be a start.

AdmiralRazor

I think the OP has more than enough proof to suspect hatred on his sister's part.

She sounds like a duplicitous and manipulative creature, to say the least.

LegacyUser

I honestly think you seem like a very nice guy but there is a lot of self justification going on with you - probably a bit too much. I was in a similar situation to you - I hated my brother who was younger by six years. I know that our not speaking it caused my mother a lot of pain. She died nearly six years ago with me still hating him. It's a regret I will have for the rest of my life knowing that I made little or no effort with him while she was alive. Im glad that you're taking the first step. At least you will know that you tried.

Mighty_Mouse

Your posts have a very disdainful tone

Apologies. I considered "softening" some comments afterwards, but figured best to leave as is.

Sadly there's absolutely no common ground between us.

You live in the same house, have the same neighbours, family relations, buy milk in the same shop, drink in the same pubs in town or whatever.
I'm not saying ye take up physics together.
I'm saying that normal,everyday conversational common ground exists.

As to what I did to her in the past to make her loathe me, nothing. You're right though - I have neglected her.

I suspect your neglect of the relationship is the problem.
She was very young when you left. Did you send her b'day cards? Presents? Did you call her regularly directly to say hello? Did you make the effort to have some alone time together on the few times you did visit home?

Note that I agree with you;
Her present day behaviour is not acceptable, but there is a reason for it.
The relationship may be permanently broken.

I won't even wait for her to answer. I'll just say that, leave a box of chocolates on her bed, and exit the room

So you want to make a gesture and not give her a chance to respond?
I cannot fathom your logic.
You are prepared to accept that the breakdown of the relationship is partly your fault but in order to repair it you make a begrudging dramatic gesture & immediately turn you back?

Do you sincerely wish to repair this relationship?
If you are not sincere, do not bother wasting time with this.
I would suggest that the failed relationship you have with your sister has a part to play in your overall anxiety.
You need to work towards resolving the situation.

IMO you do the above and state "I want to have a relationship with you. I would like for us to eventually be friends. If you have nothing to say now I can leave & we can talk about it when you are ready."

Also, you clearly don't understand what depression is, or what can cause it, if you think "the best of us just get on with it" or whatever way you put it.

Fair nuff, I'm not a doctor.

Amtmann

Mighty_Mouse wrote: »

I'm not a doctor. But I know the difference between proper clinical depression & "life is ****" depression.
I heard somewhere suicide described as the ultimate hissy fit, and I agree with it.

I have had periods where my life has collapsed around me & I felt worthless.
I was down/depressed for a period of time.
But guess what, everybody has.
You take your kicking and get back up each time.
I know now that my "depression"/trouble is not resolved magically over-night by my mood lifting.

Its sorted through actively re-engaging with the parts of your life from which you derive self-worth.
It's about setting the goals for who you want to be & working towards them
It's supported through talking with a small trusted group of friends.
After a period of grief, you pick up the pieces, you re-build,

When you don't rebuild, when you don't move forward, when you don't aim for progress, have aspirations, look to the future, when you stagnate in life, the blackness comes calling.

I expect life to be a tough hard mean slog.
When it turns out that way, I'm not surprised.
I embrace life as constantly challenging

Based on the above, you do not have an understanding of depression, and your take on it is not only misinformed, but potentially dangerous for any depressed person who might be reading this. Depression is a real medical problem that goes far beyond the "oh-woe-is-me"-type self-pity which you seem to think it is. It's been described by top psychiatrists as the breaking of the brain by mental stresses, much like a bone can be broken by physical stress. What will trigger it for one person is NOT what might trigger it in another. It is extremely probable that the OP was depressed and, as such, in an extremely vulnerable position at the time. Telling someone to just get on with it is no advice at all.

I am a friend

siblinghatred wrote: »

I have decided that sometime soon, when she is home next and there is no one else around, I'm going to knock on her door. If she lets me in, I will apologise to her very sincerely, I'll apologise for being a bad brother to her all these years, and I'll tell her I'm going to work at being better. I won't even wait for her to answer. I'll just say that, leave a box of chocolates on her bed, and exit the room... I hope that will be a start.

Op please do this... I was always rowing with my only other sibling (two spolit brats I think ) and earlier in the year they die unexpectedly. I am now alone, our last words were a row and I would do ANYTHING to have another chance.
The small details of 'i said, she said' etc DO NOT MATTER - its just hot air.

Take your chance to make up and best of luck...