Burning BIFFO Farmers

Sonnenblumen

Driving along the M6 motorway yesterday, I couldn't believe the amount of smoke from fires raging throughout much of Co Offaly. Why do local farmers insist on burning heathers and gorse.

They're causing enormous expense and risking significant risks to public health and property.

Unbelievable.

cocoshovel

Farmers. Enough said.

suitseir

Sonnenblumen wrote: »

Driving along the M6 motorway yesterday, I couldn't believe the amount of smoke from fires raging throughout much of Co Offaly. Why do local farmers insist on burning heathers and gorse.

They're causing enormous expense and risking significant risks to public health and property.

Unbelievable.

I agree.....pure ignorance that's what it is! AND they have been getting away with it for years and years. The mind boggles! Maybe if the EU stopped their "cheque in the post" they might wake up and take notice! It is the same when it comes to cutting silage....you come on them on the national routes, going at 10mph and over laden trailers with the stuff and it landing on the side of the road. And don't talk to me about the slurry tanks and the sh****t that they leave on the roads! PURE IGNORANCE!!!!:mad:

easyeason3

Prove they started it.
Who's to say it wasn't a few messers with a lighter & some petrol?

Seloth

cocoshovel wrote: »

Farmers. Enough said.

No..no...Please explain how "farmers" is enough said.

The mind boggles! Maybe if the EU stopped their "cheque in the post" they might wake up and take notice! It is the same when it comes to cutting silage....you come on them on the national routes, going at 10mph and over laden trailers with the stuff and it landing on the side of the road. And don't talk to me about the slurry tanks and the sh****t that they leave on the roads! PURE IGNORANCE!!

I'm sorry but that is pure ignorance.

Firstly 70% of Farmers have yet to receive these grants from the EU SINCE 2009.Most of the time they get these grants as of EU or Irish state regulations.And there are no longer slurry tanks,Infact a grant many famers were mean to get was for the tank which replaces slurry pits...which most farmers have yet to get since 2009 which I can inform you costs a **** load(Pun intended and by no means is fair to inforce it in such short time with such high costs.

And cutting silage is done once a year..You get more problems with Cyclists,Sunday drivers, Truckers and Jcb's each day.

suitseir

easyeason3 wrote: »

Prove they started it.
Who's to say it wasn't a few messers with a lighter & some petrol?

More to the point, prove they DIDN'T.....it is that time of the year!!! Those messers you refer to go for the EASY target....they don't climb the sides of hills and mountains...they target seats in parks, cars etc. or anything on their path after sinking many cans of cider, usually late at night!:rolleyes:

easyeason3

suitseir wrote: »

More to the point, prove they DIDN'T.....it is that time of the year!!! Those messers you refer to go for the EASY target....they don't climb the sides of hills and mountains...they target seats in parks, cars etc. or anything on their path after sinking many cans of cider, usually late at night!:rolleyes:

Great argument there :rolleyes:

suitseir

Seloth wrote: »

No..no...Please explain how "farmers" is enough said.




I'm sorry but that is pure ignorance.

Firstly 70% of Farmers have yet to receive these grants from the EU SINCE 2009.Most of the time they get these grants as of EU or Irish state regulations.And there are no longer slurry tanks,Infact a grant many famers were mean to get was for the tank which replaces slurry pits...which most farmers have yet to get since 2009 which I can inform you costs a **** load(Pun intended and by no means is fair to inforce it in such short time with such high costs.

And cutting silage is done once a year..You get more problems with Cyclists,Sunday drivers, Truckers and Jcb's each day.

70% ...........Jeez, I rest my case!!!!!!!!! AND where I LIVE, there are tanks.....I have been STUCK behind them on many an occasion!!!!

danbohan

Sonnenblumen wrote: »

Driving along the M6 motorway yesterday, I couldn't believe the amount of smoke from fires raging throughout much of Co Offaly. Why do local farmers insist on burning heathers and gorse.

They're causing enormous expense and risking significant risks to public health and property.

Unbelievable.

why dont you stay in your urban heven , then you wont be bothered by the smoke or the smells ?

Seloth

suitseir wrote: »

70% ...........Jeez, I rest my case!!!!!!!!! AND where I LIVE, there are tanks.....I have been STUCK behind them on many an occasion!!!!

Care to explain more on the 70 % part.

And these tanks are buried into the ground :rolleyes:

WindSock

Doesn't burning not make it come back worse?

jdooley28

Serious wind around offaly last nite any small fire on any of the bogs would have spread very quickly

johngalway

Sonnenblumen wrote: »

Driving along the M6 motorway yesterday, I couldn't believe the amount of smoke from fires raging throughout much of Co Offaly. Why do local farmers insist on burning heathers and gorse.

They're causing enormous expense and risking significant risks to public health and property.

Unbelievable.

Where is your proof that farmers are starting these fires? Or do you make unfounded allegations based on personal bias as a habit?

--Kaiser--

WindSock wrote: »

Doesn't burning not make it come back worse?

The purpose of gorse burning (not implying that farmers started the fires) is that the ash from the gorse fire is a fertilizer and makes for great grazing grass (accidental alliteration)

Seloth

When ever these fires start its mostly young teenagers -13-15 that started them.

And thats not stereotyping teens either,as for one being 19 myself its the last thing I want to do,and two when ever large bush fires started in my before locality when ever we found out who it was it was always someone that age(Twice being idiotic friends of mine :rolleyes:).Infact quite recently a large bush fire started in the area and it was a group of 13 year olds.

syklops

WindSock wrote: »

Doesn't burning not make it come back worse?

No thats facial hair your thinking of.

WindSock

Oh.

*puts down lighter*

mconigol

suitseir wrote: »

70% ...........Jeez, I rest my case!!!!!!!!! AND where I LIVE, there are tanks.....I have been STUCK behind them on many an occasion!!!!

Do you eat food by any chance??

Where the **** do you think it comes from?

I still don't understand why people move down the country and then complain about country life!

goose2005

johngalway wrote: »

Where is your proof that farmers are starting these fires? Or do you make unfounded allegations based on personal bias as a habit?

Who else benefits from these fires?

Seloth

goose2005 wrote: »

Who else benefits from these fires?

Again younger teenagers messing with fire.

ejmaztec

Seloth wrote: »

When ever these fires start its mostly young teenagers -13-15 that started them.

And thats not stereotyping teens either,as for one being 19 myself its the last thing I want to do,and two when ever large bush fires started in my before locality when ever we found out who it was it was always someone that age(Twice being idiotic friends of mine :rolleyes:).Infact quite recently a large bush fire started in the area and it was a group of 13 year olds.

I saw someone starting a fire in a field as I was driving through Cork a couple of weeks ago, and it looked like he could have been 13, although he would have celebrated his 13th birthday in about 1941.

Seloth

ejmaztec wrote: »

I saw someone starting a fire in a field as I was driving through Cork a couple of weeks ago, and it looked like he could have been 13, although he would have celebrated his 13th birthday in about 1941.

Benjamin Button?

ejmaztec

Seloth wrote: »

Benjamin Button?

Well, If he's an octogenarian arsonist farmer from Cork, then anything's possible.:p

the groutch

probably Biffo himself burning his correspondance with the IMF

mikom

Sonnenblumen wrote: »

Driving along the M6 motorway yesterday, I couldn't believe the amount of smoke from fires raging throughout much of Co Offaly.

Sorry, I'm sure they'll use smokeless fuel the next time you decide to venture outside the pale on on one of your daytrips to the west and the like.

Phill Ewinn

Silage is cut twice a year. Slurry is still held in tanks and spread before rain. Farmers recieve grants and gorse is burnt by idiots and lazy fvckers. This thread is turning into a pissing contest.

stee.mc79

Do they not do it to get rid of the dead old stuff and bring on new growth. Also it was forcast to rain so it should have put out the fires, instead there was strong winds at weekend which has made it worse. I am not a land owner and am only guessing that's the reason.

Gizmoisgiddy

they where burning the bog,
the burn the top of the bog before they start cutting, happens every year in offaly around this time.
was a bit of a pain though, got ash all over the garden and my freshly washed car

johngalway

goose2005 wrote: »

Who else benefits from these fires?

No one has to benefit Goose, A forestry block was lit near me recently. It had been tried a few weeks before but didn't set the trees alight. This time it did. No farmer farms the land around the block which is fenced in. Part of my own farm which was over grown with gorse was lit on me last Spring, it's beside a road. A woman and her mother/mother in law saw young lads start a fire but never thought anything of it so didn't take a reg number :rolleyes: I'm a farmer and I carry a spade and shovel in the car all the time this time of year. Put out one bog fire alone last year, friend of mine put out two.

There are people out there who get kicks from causing this kind of destruction. They know all the locals will be taking about them, they know the fire brigade and Gardai will want to know who they are. They get a thrill out of their actions being on the radio and TV.

I am not saying that no fire has/is/will never be started by a farmer. But, if a charge is to be made, then it should rely on a bit more of smoke and a rant online in all fairness.

Not only is it irresponsible to burn during such a dry spell, it's also illegal as it's the nesting season, it's also stupid as if someone is caught they will lose part or possibly all their payments. I don't see much benefit in that kind of risk.

Logical Fallacy

suitseir wrote: »

70% ...........Jeez, I rest my case!!!!!!!!! AND where I LIVE, there are tanks.....I have been STUCK behind them on many an occasion!!!!

I'm getting the feeling you don't actually know what a slurry tank is.

Sonnenblumen

johngalway wrote: »

Where is your proof that farmers are starting these fires? Or do you make unfounded allegations based on personal bias as a habit?

Personal Bias? What bias? There's been plenty of proof, even in Galway area, where farmers use fire to clear scrub, burn gorse etc. Or are you living in a remote bubble of denial?

Farmers also regularly burning domestic waste which is also illegal.

johnmcdnl

Sonnenblumen wrote: »

Farmers also regularly burning domestic waste which is also illegal.

got any proof of that either :rolleyes:

brandish every farmer in the country with the one stick why don't you

city/town people regularly dump domestic waste along rural roads which is also illegal too yano... lets brandish all townies as people who break the law when we're at it

Sonnenblumen

Not all farmers are reckless, but.................

Reckless farmers and fly-tippers in the line of fire

Read more: http://www.irishexaminer.com/opinion/columnists/donal-hickey/reckless-farmers-and-fly-tippers-in-the-line-of-fire-146746.html#ixzz1LL1bcPBQ

Farmers risk losing Single Farm Payment over illegal gorse fires
http://www.sligochampion.ie/premium/lifestyle/farmers-risk-losing-single-farm-payment-over-illegal-gorse-fires-2602637.html

THE HEAD of the National Parks and Wildlife Service in Co Donegal has been highly critical of farmers over the recent deaths of protected birds by poison.

He has also blamed irresponsible action by some farmers for gorse fires which have damaged the landscape.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/0511/1224270129662.html

Wednesday, May 4, 2011
JOBS CARS PROPERTY DATING
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Illegal gorse fires still burning issue

By Donal Hickey

Monday, April 11, 2011

IN spite of a promise of long-awaited action by state agencies and farming organisations against illegal burning on mountains and upland areas, such burning is continuing unabated.


Fire services in western counties, including Cork and Kerry, have been called to gorse fires, usually started by farmers seeking to burn off old vegetation.

Read more: http://www.examiner.ie/opinion/columnists/donal-hickey/illegal-gorse-fires-still-burning-issue-151009.html#ixzz1LL3chUi9
http://www.examiner.ie/opinion/columnists/donal-hickey/illegal-gorse-fires-still-burning-issue-151009.html

tonydude

Typical moaning from city folk, cant wait for those water charges to come in.

And if you moaning about vacuum tanks and tractors on the roads, you know there a part of country life so get over it. Leave early, arrive early, thats my moto

ScumLord

suitseir wrote: »

70% ...........Jeez, I rest my case!!!!!!!!! AND where I LIVE, there are tanks.....I have been STUCK behind them on many an occasion!!!!

:eek: Afghanistan farming forum is that away>>>

johngalway

Sonnenblumen wrote: »

Personal Bias? What bias? There's been plenty of proof, even in Galway area, where farmers use fire to clear scrub, burn gorse etc. Or are you living in a remote bubble of denial?

Farmers also regularly burning domestic waste which is also illegal.

I asked you a specific question relating to the opening post/rant of this thread.

Would you please answer it.

Noreen1

I have no idea who started any of these fires.
I'm reluctant to believe that it was farmers, since they tend to have better sense than to start fires and walk away.

When I was a child, I'm pretty sure it was an offense for farmers not to burn bracken - presumably to prevent weeds, gorse, etc. spreading to neighbouring farmland.

Does anyone know what the legal situation is now?

ejmaztec

Noreen1 wrote: »

I have no idea who started any of these fires.
I'm reluctant to believe that it was farmers, since they tend to have better sense than to start fires and walk away.

When I was a child, I'm pretty sure it was an offense for farmers not to burn bracken - presumably to prevent weeds, gorse, etc. spreading to neighbouring farmland.

Does anyone know what the legal situation is now?

I think it's still illegal, but the farmers are still burning it.

Noreen1

???

I meant, the farmers were legally obliged to burn the bracken.

The question is: If there is a legal obligation to burn bracken, but it's illegal to start fires - then the farmers are in an unenviable position.............

mikemac

cocoshovel wrote: »

Farmers. Enough said.

Maybe it was locals from the nearest town.
They just love to dump waste and go fly tipping on farmers land and possibly they decided to burn it

See....we can both generalize

Sonnenblumen

johngalway wrote: »

I asked you a specific question relating to the opening post/rant of this thread.

Would you please answer it.

Cop yourself on, there's plenty of evidence that the majority of gorse fires are started deliberately by FARMERS. According to various Statutory/Regulatory bodies approx 2/3 of all fires are started by farmers. This kind of maverick indiscriminate vandalism must be stopped.

You must be stuck in some Tolkien hole? Plenty of proof on record and throughout the countryside about gorse fires.

What does an attitude of denial not surprise me, afterall Irish farmers have a long history of being dragged by the ears into compliance.

And no diversionary crap, some fires (1/3) are started by minors etc with malicious intent. The point is why are farmers doing it? Only last year a farmer died as a result of a fire he himself started.

BTW, where's the rant, this is about irresponsible farmers, and not all farmers are irresponsible. Nothing worse than denial and trying to pass can.

Off you go and open your eyes and mind to the reality of the problem.

mikom

Fag butts thrown from the passing cars of daytrippers from Dublin.
Same amount of proof as farmers.

Sonnenblumen

johnmcdnl wrote: »

got any proof of that either :rolleyes:

brandish every farmer in the country with the one stick why don't you

city/town people regularly dump domestic waste along rural roads which is also illegal too yano... lets brandish all townies as people who break the law when we're at it

Another genius who cannot read? Where did I say ALL farmers? Anyone who breaks the law should be punished. How's that?

Any farmer who deliberately destroys the landscape, wildlife and poses serious threat to public wellbeing etc should be punished severely.

No responsible farmer would support the indiscriminate destruction caused by gorse fires.

Off you go, plough another furrow.

Sonnenblumen

mikom wrote: »

Fag butts thrown from the passing cars of daytrippers from Dublin.
Same amount of proof as farmers.

A case of won't read or can't read?

mikom

Sonnenblumen wrote: »

A case of won't read or can't read?

http://www.irishexaminer.com/opinion/columnists/donal-hickey/reckless-farmers-and-fly-tippers-in-the-line-of-fire-146746.html#ixzz1LL1bcPBQ

http://www.examiner.ie/opinion/columnists/donal-hickey/illegal-gorse-fires-still-burning-issue-151009.html#ixzz1LL3chUi9

http://www.examiner.ie/opinion/columnists/donal-hickey/illegal-gorse-fires-still-burning-issue-151009.html

Opinion, opinion, opinion.
Worth about as much as a daytrippers opinion.

Sonnenblumen

mikom wrote: »

http://www.irishexaminer.com/opinion/columnists/donal-hickey/reckless-farmers-and-fly-tippers-in-the-line-of-fire-146746.html#ixzz1LL1bcPBQ

http://www.examiner.ie/opinion/columnists/donal-hickey/illegal-gorse-fires-still-burning-issue-151009.html#ixzz1LL3chUi9

http://www.examiner.ie/opinion/columnists/donal-hickey/illegal-gorse-fires-still-burning-issue-151009.html

Opinion, opinion, opinion.
Worth about as much as a daytrippers opinion.

Ah the lamp in the bog.

mikom

Sonnenblumen wrote: »

Ah the lamp in the bog.

Keepin' it lookin' well for the tourists.
Just like we've done for hundreds of years.
No charge.

Voodoo_rasher

gorse to Lanesboro powerstation where it can be of some commercial value. then there would be less inferno s all over the country!! Hell knows the heat from it is immense.

no innovation + no means = no incentive for landowners.

johngalway

Sonnenblumen wrote: »

Cop yourself on, there's plenty of evidence that the majority of gorse fires are started deliberately by FARMERS. According to various Statutory/Regulatory bodies approx 2/3 of all fires are started by farmers. This kind of maverick indiscriminate vandalism must be stopped.

You must be stuck in some Tolkien hole? Plenty of proof on record and throughout the countryside about gorse fires.

What does an attitude of denial not surprise me, afterall Irish farmers have a long history of being dragged by the ears into compliance.

And no diversionary crap, some fires (1/3) are started by minors etc with malicious intent. The point is why are farmers doing it? Only last year a farmer died as a result of a fire he himself started.

BTW, where's the rant, this is about irresponsible farmers, and not all farmers are irresponsible. Nothing worse than denial and trying to pass can.

Off you go and open your eyes and mind to the reality of the problem.

You are still ranting, and you are still refusing to provide any evidence to back up the specific charges you have made against farmers in Offaly, along the N/M6 was it?

Basically you have no argument, only a rant. You can provide nothing with which other posters can independently look up and verify for themselves.

Sounds like a biased rant to me.

AckwelFoley

The amount of ignorant, uninformed nonsense in this thread being stated as fact overwhelms me.


Im going to have a shyte now.

There will be more fact displaced out my arse than there is in this entire thread, bar the few informed souls

Noreen1

So much opinion being posted as fact!:(

I can't say anything about the fires in Offaly, for the very simple reason that I am unfamiliar with the area in question.

On the other hand - I'm very familiar with both the Dungloe/Glenties areas in Donegal, and also the area around Muckish in Donegal.

I stated earlier that I had no idea how these fires started.
I can however, describe the areas, (both very similar) and let you draw your own conclusions.

Both areas are comprised of large tracts of bogland, much of which is commonage. Both are traditionally used for grazing sheep, and at this time of year, many local farmers have turf cut, and nearly ready for harvesting.

This being the case - why would said farmers put their own livestock, and those of their neighbours at risk?

Why would they choose to risk burning their own source of heating for the winter?

It's true that burning scrubland was an accepted practice at one time. I remember watching scrubland being burnt as a child.
The thing is - the burning was carried out in a very controlled fashion, with care being taken to drive any wildlife out of the area first, due regard being paid to the weather (the general practice at the time was to choose a time when the scrub was dry enough to burn, but when rain was expected - just in case the fire might prove difficult to control.)
Then around 20 or 30 men would be on hand to cut firebreaks, and beat out any sparks that might get blown outside the designated "burn" area.
That's how it was done traditionally.

So, I find it hard to believe that such careful land management in the past by farmers has degenerated into the deliberate starting of wildfires in one generation.
It's possible of course - but, personally, I'll reserve judgement on who started these fires until there has been a successful prosecution...........