Which band member is normally the biggest douche???? MOD WARNING IN FIRST POST

TheoBoone

Having played in a number of bands with all sorts of people, I have noticed certain trends and am familiar with all the common conceptions about different musicians(drummers being retarded, etc), and I'm just wondering if anyone feels that there's any truth to them or what their own personal experiences are.

Obviously we don't name names here, but I'm jusgt curious about some of the worst(or best) experiences you've had working with other musicians???

Have at it......



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MilanPan!c

Obv the worst is either singers... Or drummers... Or guitarists... Or bassists! Or keyboard players! Or...

Rigsby

It's a matter of personality. The instrument you play does ( or should ) not make a difference. Having said that, I seem to remember a similar type of thread a while ago, where lots of people were having reliability problems with bassists. Could be just coincidence, who is to say ? I am a bassist myself, so I have no axe to grind here. In my own experience, the biggest problem I have encountered is the same problem...reliability. This is with players of all instruments. Sometimes it shows itself even before you meet ( or in trying to meet ), when you are searching for a band member. If you get past this first obstacle, and the person joins the band, this unreliability usually raises it's ugly head later, when he/she gives a lame excuse (if you are lucky enough to be notified at all) for not showing up for band practice etc.

Melion

The irish person who uses the term "douche"!

Rigsby

Melion wrote: »

The irish person who uses the term "douche"!

How do you know he/she is Irish ?

TheoBoone

Melion wrote: »

The irish person who uses the term "douche"!

I was going to use another word, but Boards.ie tends to frown on vulgarity. Sorry if I have offended your delicate sensibilities!

Malice

TheoBoone wrote: »

Boards.ie tends to frown on vulgarity.

We also tend to frown on threads that are unlikely to result in a meaningful discussion (in this forum at least).

Now, your first post is asking two questions which are quite different.

Which band member is normally the biggest douche????

This isn't going to get us very far because eventually someone will post something like "the guitarist/drummer/Polynesian nose flautist is the biggest douche." and then someone else will take offence and rather than getting a useful discussion, the rest of us will have to read an argument.

I'm jusgt curious about some of the worst(or best) experiences you've had working with other musicians???

This on the other hand is much better.

TheoBoone

My apologies Malice, I always thought 'meaningful' was a subjective term. I didn't realise that my thread would not conform to your exact definition of the word. I strongly advise you get rid of it if you feel it has the potential to cause harm. If having a bit of a laugh(in this forum at least) is frowned upon, then I shall endeavour to make sure that any future posts shall preside over matters of the uppermost gravity with relation to...playing in a band.

Forest Master

Usually the singer though, isn't it?

Fred Durst
Puddle of Mudd guy
Linken Park rapping douche
Liam Gallagher
Babylon Zoo
Kings of Leon guy
Bono
Eddie Vedder
Axl Rose
Kurt Cobain
Jim Morrison
Morrissey


etc, etc, etc.

I'm a fan of the bands in bold, but that doesn't mean the singers aren't pretentious douches a lot of the time.

roast

TheoBoone wrote: »

My apologies Malice, I always thought 'meaningful' was a subjective term. I didn't realise that my thread would not conform to your exact definition of the word. I strongly advise you get rid of it if you feel it has the potential to cause harm. If having a bit of a laugh(in this forum at least) is frowned upon, then I shall endeavour to make sure that any future posts shall preside over matters of the uppermost gravity with relation to...playing in a band.

In fairness, there's having a laugh and there's potentially starting a flame war. :pac:

Malice

TheoBoone wrote: »

My apologies Malice, I always thought 'meaningful' was a subjective term. I didn't realise that my thread would not conform to your exact definition of the word.

Hmm, did I provide an exact definition for the word meaningful? I don't believe I did. What I did write was this:

We also tend to frown on threads that are unlikely to result in a meaningful discussion

Do you really need me to explain the difference between what I wrote and what you seem to think I wrote?

TheoBoone wrote:

I strongly advise you get rid of it if you feel it has the potential to cause harm.

No need to advise me. If I wanted to remove the thread I would have done so already.

TheoBoone wrote:

If having a bit of a laugh(in this forum at least) is frowned upon, then I shall endeavour to make sure that any future posts shall preside over matters of the uppermost gravity with relation to...playing in a band.

There you go again mis-interpreting what I wrote. Did I write that having a laugh is frowned upon?

Rigsby

TheoBoone wrote: »

If having a bit of a laugh(in this forum at least) is frowned upon

Where is the comedy in a thread that has the potential to slag people off, quite apart from whether they deserve it or not ?

TheoBoone

Okay!!! Fine!!! I get it!!! This thread was obviously a terrible idea!!! If it's so bad I really don't see why your leaving it up though? Just take the thing down. I mean, if it has the potential to offend people then why not? Isn't that what your terms of use say? No posting 'offensive' or 'harmful' material?
Also, if your trying to avoid arguments then it's probably best to avoid arguing with me!
And to be fair Malice, you stated that this thread was not likely to result in a meaningful discussion. By implication, you have defined to some extent what it is(by defining what it isn't!).

drumdrum

Ok just for the larf of it all!!

Singer - douche....

Guitarist - EGO-maniac

Drummer - Insane, Retarded, or just Bat **** Odd....its fine line!

Bassists - Stoners / Hippies / The "Mellow" One.....must be all those low frequencies!

Keyboardists and Backing singers - Groupies.....usually the expendable ones!!!

Of course, YMMV! :pac::pac::pac:

Fandango

Cant beat these overly defensive new posters. Also, arguing with the mods never ends with a good result. Well, it does for everyone but the person arguing.

Anyway, ive known players of almost every instrument that have been "douches". As someone else pointed out, the biggest problem is reliability. There is usually at least 1 member of almost every up and coming band that thinks they can coast through it and expect everyone else to do their job and they are usually the very weak link in the chain, either through ego or laziness. So id say the douche is the unreliable one which can be any member really.

TheoBoone

Just in case the last post didn't make it clear. I'm standing down here!!! I don't think I understood the real purpose of this forum when I made that post. I'm actually going to apologise here and now to anyone who's been offended...

*sorry

...and once again recommend that the thread just be removed.

I'm also going to ASSUME that no moderator on this site would be bated into a petty argument with anyone on boards(let alone some overly defensive newcomer punk kid rookie novice beginner who's only been a member for a couple of days).

tom thum

i find it a bit sad that the moderator would air his grievances on here , when one private message to the poster explaining his/her position probably would have sufficed!

Malice

TheoBoone wrote: »

Okay!!! Fine!!! I get it!!! This thread was obviously a terrible idea!!! If it's so bad I really don't see why your leaving it up though? Just take the thing down. I mean, if it has the potential to offend people then why not? Isn't that what your terms of use say? No posting 'offensive' or 'harmful' material?

All threads have the potential to offend people though. I'm not a fan of deleting threads unless there is no benefit to them remaining listed e.g. if they're a duplicate of something already posted or someone is trolling for a reaction (which I don't believe you are doing).

TheoBoone wrote:

Also, if your trying to avoid arguments then it's probably best to avoid arguing with me!

I'm assuming that's directed at me but even if it's not, no one is arguing here. It's more like we're having a robust debate .

TheoBoone wrote:

And to be fair Malice, you stated that this thread was not likely to result in a meaningful discussion. By implication, you have defined to some extent what it is(by defining what it isn't!).

That's true but it's about context which can, as you pointed out, be subjective. I used meaningful as an adjective to the word discussion thereby offering a definition of sorts for the phrase "meaningful discussion" as opposed to the word meaningful by itself.

TheoBoone wrote: »

Just in case the last post didn't make it clear. I'm standing down here!!! I don't think I understood the real purpose of this forum when I made that post. I'm actually going to apologise here and now to anyone who's been offended...

*sorry

...and once again recommend that the thread just be removed.

Just to be clear since it seems to have been missed in my first post: You asked two questions in your first post. One of which would have been a far better thread starter than the other. As for the real purpose of this forum, there is a certain amount of crossover between this forum and others in the Music category. Yes, there are mostly threads here consisting of people looking to join or form bands but there's also threads on other subjects e.g. Rigsby's recent thread on warming up which could just as easily have gone in the Playing Techniques forum. A lot of people would tend to read both forums though so I didn't think there was any need to move the thread.

As for people being offended, there's been nothing posted so far that could offend anyone so there's no need to apologise. In terms of direct answers to your first question I think Forest Master's post summed it up pretty well. Singers, due to the fact that they are generally the focal point of the band and tend to have extroverted personalities, do tend to be the biggest douches in my experience.

TheoBoone wrote:

I'm also going to ASSUME that no moderator on this site would be bated into a petty argument with anyone on boards(let alone some overly defensive newcomer punk kid rookie novice beginner who's only been a member for a couple of days).

You'd be surprised . Us moderators are people too after all. Again let me reiterate that I don't believe anyone is arguing on this thread. For what it's worth, welcome to Boards. If you happen to have any questions related to any of forums the Music category then feel free to PM me.

Malice

tom thum wrote: »

i find it a bit sad that the moderator would air his grievances on here , when one private message to the poster explaining his/her position probably would have sufficed!

I find it bit sad that you think I have a grievance when I clearly don't and that you feel the need to drag the thread even further off-topic to say your piece when you could have just sent a private message to me. You have also been warned before about keeping things on-topic. Hopefully you will heed this warning.

windowgobo

i find that singers sometimes let it go to their head

tom thum

windowgobo wrote: »

i find that singers sometimes let it go to their head

a singer alone should never be emplyed. what do they do? nothing. They should at least play one instrument.

Forest Master

tom thum wrote: »

a singer alone should never be emplyed. what do they do? nothing. They should at least play one instrument.

:rolleyes:

tom thum

Forest Master wrote: »

:rolleyes:

??

tom thum

Malice wrote: »

You have also been warned before about keeping things on-topic. Hopefully you will heed this warning.

It was my opinion and in fairness i havent posted here in 4 weeks. Come now, at least let the people have their opinion and thn we can have a constructive debate.

TheoBoone

Okay, it seems that this thing is going to keep going for a little bit longer. As has already been pointed out, I did ask two questions in my initial post. Lets disregard the first one (and agree that most people so far don't have an overwhelming amount of love for frontmen) and move onto the second part.

What's the craziest sh*t you've ever had to deal with from another band member. Most musicians tend to be a little mentally ill (thats being charitable to some of the one's I've worked with), so it's only natural that every so often they do something batsh*t insane. What's the best you've got???

Mine is an old drummer I used to play with, that crashed his car into a ditch while on LSD because he thought the glade airfreshner (ya know the ones shaped like trees) in his car was a real tree!

roast

TheoBoone wrote: »

Mine is an old drummer I used to play with, that crashed his car into a ditch while on LSD because he thought the glade airfreshner (ya know the ones shaped like trees) in his car was a real tree!

While he may be a drummer, hes also a fúcking idiot.
How has that got anything to do with being a "douche" band member?

TheoBoone

roast wrote: »

While he may be a drummer, hes also a fúcking idiot.
How has that got anything to do with being a "douche" band member?

I'm just going to assume you opened this thread and then read the last post that I made. I suggest you start from the first post, and then work your way through them in chronological order. If you still have any questions, then I suggest that you start from the first post AGAIN, and then work your way through them in chronological order, and if you still have any questions....maybe think about the colour yellow for a little while and then go take a nap!

Garf

The "biggest douche" is usually the front person, which is usually the singer/vocalist.

What happens is, the front person is desired to exhibit a behaviour of confidence, to effectively play the part during performances.

However (and especially because music is seen as such an artistic, lifestyle sort of thing), soon (or it always was, but maybe hidden) the performance extends to off stage.

Also, many successful front persons are INFJs. This is both because INFJs gravitate towards such a roll, and it sometimes takes one to get the drive and connection with the audience required to get a band successful. Like all personality types, INFJs have pitfalls (see "Potential Problem Areas").


For the record, I'm an (aspiring) vocalist (and an INFJ) myself.

TheoBoone

"INFJs are gentle, caring, complex and highly intuitive individuals. Artistic and creative, they live in a world of hidden meanings and possibilities. Only one percent of the population has an INFJ Personality Type, making it the most rare of all the types."

Got that from the link, you posted. Do you actually have to be diagnosed with that? or is it something that you just figure out yourself?
To be honest, I'd hate to live in a world of hidden meanings and possibilities. Sounds like a lot of work!!

Garf

One can take Internet or "official" MBTI questionnaire tests, but I'll tell you now that they can be very inaccurate. People who are serious about the whole personality type thing usually do a mix of test results and understanding the theory to take a best guess at their type.

(My method of "typing" people is is based on physiological cues, and is much more deterministic. I don't want to get into it here; anyone feel free to send me a pm if you're interested.)

It's all about energy. People just get different kicks out of different kinds of mental activity.

Also, INFJs aren't actually rare. Stereotypical ones, which the archetypes describe, are rare, but most INFJs develop differently because they aren't validated so much by society.

roast

TheoBoone wrote: »

I'm just going to assume you opened this thread and then read the last post that I made. I suggest you start from the first post, and then work your way through them in chronological order. If you still have any questions, then I suggest that you start from the first post AGAIN, and then work your way through them in chronological order, and if you still have any questions....maybe think about the colour yellow for a little while and then go take a nap!

Bad assumption. Because if you read through your own thread, you might notice that I've already posted in it.

TheoBoone

roast wrote: »

Bad assumption. Because if you read through your own thread, you might notice that I've already posted in it.

Which makes it even worse. The initial post contained two questions. One concerned which band member is normally the biggest douche?, and the other was asking about any funny experiences you've had with people you've played in bands with. I'm trying to focus on the second question, while you seem to be dwelling on the first.

Malice

I was hoping there wouldn't be a need for further moderation on this but it appears there is.

tom thum: Don't question moderator decisions on-thread. We will discuss this further by PM. Consider this your final warning on posting off-topic in this thread.

roast: Note that TheoBoone was addressing his second question in this post so there is no need for you to dwell on or argue about his first question like you did here.

NukaCola

Worst thread ever! :pac:

Malice

tom thum wrote: »

a singer alone should never be emplyed. what do they do? nothing. They should at least play one instrument.

Do you mean a singer alone shouldn't be implied (as in it should be a singer/guitarist) or do you mean a singer alone shouldn't be employed? Sometimes a quick proofread really helps with clarity.

Rigsby

tom thum wrote: »

a singer alone should never be emplyed. what do they do? nothing. They should at least play one instrument.

They do !!! What do you think their voice is ?

tom thum

Rigsby wrote: »

They do !!! What do you think their voice is ?

sorry , i should have made it more clear for you. I dont believe someone should be in a band with their voice as their only instrument. if that was the case, would a singer/guitarist get paid more than a singer on his/her own, because the singer /guitarist can play two instruments?

Should a person who plays two insruments in a band get paid more than a person who only plays one?

NukaCola

tom thum wrote: »

sorry , i should have made it more clear for you. I dont believe someone should be in a band with their voice as their only instrument. if that was the case, would a singer/guitarist get paid more than a singer on his/her own, because the singer /guitarist can play two instruments?

Should a person who plays two insruments in a band get paid more than a person who only plays one?

Should a drummer get paid the same as a vocalist who writes the lyrics to songs etc....those kinds of scenarios just get messy. Everyone should get paid the same.

As for your point about a vocalist having to play an instrument, its quiet laughable TBH. I wont elaborate, just look at some of the great bands in history....

Blackhorse Slim

tom thum wrote: »

sorry , i should have made it more clear for you. I dont believe someone should be in a band with their voice as their only instrument. if that was the case, would a singer/guitarist get paid more than a singer on his/her own, because the singer /guitarist can play two instruments?

Should a person who plays two insruments in a band get paid more than a person who only plays one?

Better to have a great singer than a crap singer who is also a crap guitarist imo.

TheoBoone

NukaCola wrote: »

Worst thread ever! :pac:

If this is as bad as it gets then I'm happy.

pappyodaniel

tom thum wrote: »

a singer alone should never be emplyed. what do they do? nothing. They should at least play one instrument.

this guy

TheoBoone

The singer from Jethro Tull gets it for me. Anyone who can flail about the stage for half the song and then bust into a bitchin flute solo is a legend. I think most singers do actually play something, but they might not be to a high enough standard to go out and play it with the other members of the band. Axl ROse used to write some of GnR's songs on guitar, but once he had the chords and melody sorted out, he's take it to Slash and Izzy (or whoever he had playing guitar for him) and let them play it live. The same goes for Bono. As far as I know, one of the only frontmen who cannot actually play anything at all, is the singer from Red Hot Chili Peppers.

Garf

For reference, Axl Rose and Anthony Kiedis (singer of RHCP) are INFJs, and Bono is an ENFJ (similar to INFJ - a little less about the vision and a little more about the connection).

Forest Master

Garf wrote: »

For reference, Axl Rose and Anthony Kiedis (singer of RHCP) are INFJs, and Bono is an ENFJ (similar to INFJ - a little less about the vision and a little more about the connection).

Nobody cares about those lame personality tests; they hold no water whatsoever. To say that there are only 16 (or whatever it is) types of people in the world is inherently flawed & a stupid concept to begin with (almost as stupid as horoscopes) and renders that whole "OMG loike, what type are you?!" discussion moot. If you're so into it, just stick to Now and Hello magazines.

NukaCola

TheoBoone wrote: »

If this is as bad as it gets then I'm happy.

Easily amused?

NukaCola

Forest Master wrote: »

Nobody cares about those lame personality tests; they hold no water whatsoever. To say that there are only 16 (or whatever it is) types of people in the world is inherently flawed & a stupid concept to begin with (almost as stupid as horoscopes) and renders that whole "OMG loike, what type are you?!" discussion moot. If you're so into it, just stick to Now and Hello magazines.

Well, apparantly Garf does

NukaCola

TheoBoone wrote: »

The singer from Jethro Tull gets it for me. Anyone who can flail about the stage for half the song and then bust into a bitchin flute solo is a legend. I think most singers do actually play something, but they might not be to a high enough standard to go out and play it with the other members of the band. Axl ROse used to write some of GnR's songs on guitar, but once he had the chords and melody sorted out, he's take it to Slash and Izzy (or whoever he had playing guitar for him) and let them play it live. The same goes for Bono. As far as I know, one of the only frontmen who cannot actually play anything at all, is the singer from Red Hot Chili Peppers.

I'm sure theres a few more TBH

Garf

Forest Master wrote: »

Nobody cares about those lame personality tests; they hold no water whatsoever. To say that there are only 16 (or whatever it is) types of people in the world is inherently flawed & a stupid concept to begin with (almost as stupid as horoscopes) and renders that whole "OMG loike, what type are you?!" discussion moot. If you're so into it, just stick to Now and Hello magazines.

There are two discrete sexes - the idea of such isn't inherently flawed & a stupid, but I'll agree that it may be unwise to presume it's true without proof.

So the issue here is the proof. I can actually show the proof to anyone who's willing but it takes time and effort (and an open-mind), unfortunately. "Very convenient" some would say.

The reason why it seems that personality types don't exist is because there is an infinite spectrum of possible development within each type.


I'd actually agree that the tests are pretty lame - they can't actually detect the discrete types so well, and take a guess at one's spectrum of development.


Let's leave it at that though. Just pretend I said "a lot of (successful) front persons have a huge drive and vision, and have a knack to manipulate* the audience to some degree - sometimes these people let their vision get over their head, and by then they are equipped with that manipulative power."

(*= Which can be done in a positive or negative way.)

pappyodaniel

Imagine watching the Rolling Stones in their pomp and Mick Jagger holding a guitar onstage. All the hip shaking, scissor kicks etc. are out. And while we are at it, sack Keith, Mick's on lead guitar.

Rigsby

tom thum wrote: »

I dont believe someone should be in a band with their voice as their only instrument.

Why ?? Many guitarists, drummers and bassists have just those instruments as their one and only voice in a band. So why cant a singer have his/her voice as their only instrument. If they are contributing positively and fully to the over all sound of the band, then what's the problem ? What a band member is paid, is a different kettle of fish altogether.

Rigsby

Blackhorse Slim wrote: »

Better to have a great singer than a crap singer who is also a crap guitarist imo.

Good point. No good being a jack of all trades and master of none !