Setting up a take-away (advice needed)

goz83

Hi there, I cant seem to find the right information anywhere for this subject.

I am thinking about opening a Thai food take-away with a friend from Thailand who is a great chef. There is a local premises (empty shell) near me. If the numbers stack up, I am hoping to make a go of it, as there is no local take-away in the immediate area.

Problem is, I don't know what's needed. Permission from the council, licenses, certificates etc etc etc. A quick breakdown would be much appreciated, especially from someone in the business. My friend is an amazing chef and the food is really healthy, so i would love to set this up with him and hopefully steal a few customers from the local McDonalds. If you know what costs are attached to the various permissions and/or licenses, that would also be great.

tombull82

goz83 wrote: »

Hi there, I cant seem to find the right information anywhere for this subject.

I am thinking about opening a Thai food take-away with a friend from Thailand who is a greta chef. There is a local premises (empty shell) near me. If the numbers stack up, I am hoping to make a go of it, as there is no local take-away in the immediate area.

Problem is, I don't know what's needed. Permission from the council, licenses, certificates etc etc etc. A quick breakdown would be much appreciated, especially from someone in the business. My friend is an amazing chef and the food is really healthy, so i would love to set this up with him and hopefully steal a few customers from the local McDonalds. If you know what costs are attached to the various permissions and/or licenses, that would also be great.

TBH your better off setting up a meeting with your local council offices, I believe requirement can be different depending on your location.
Also talk to your local Enterprise Ireland as they should be well able to direct you on this sort of business.

IIsoleeII

I'm chinese and my family is running a Chinese takeaway,
I'll let you know, its really tough at the beginning, but it works out great, especially as you mentioned there isnt any nearby in your targeted area.

Your chef should definitally have haccp cert, also, make sure that everything is working, clean tidy, your business needs to be immaculate!
Also your restrooms for your staff needs to be clean, the whole premises must be extremely clean, im emphasising on this because health inspectors are out more and more these days, I'm glad my dad is a clean freak because I heard of a lot of business's being shut down recently. But even my dad was asked to change the colour of his light bulbs, they can be really picky about everything, including shelving for your woks, we have seperate woks, like my father has to throw out some old one because the handles were broken, but he stored them in a seperate unit to have them thrown out, even though they were packed away in a seperate shelf near a closed rice bag, they told my dd he has to move them into the office, which made no sense, but anytime you get a vist, no matter how safe of clean, they'll always/usually tell you to change something.

I also recommend checking different suppliers for prices, ask around from other owners about their services, like if they usually forget something or whatever, we usually order from 'so kee', like some special oils or sauces or whatever, but the can forget something maybe 20% of the time, but they'll send it to you the next time or deduct it.
But we often have to shop ourselves to the bigger asia markets if we are running low on some other items, usually 1-2 week. You cant depend 100% on companies to deliver to you.

Also with meat, although beef from other countries are cheaper, usually same or better quality than Irish, I recommend paying the little bit extra for the Irish beef, because Irish customers are really worried about foreign meat, also you should display the origin of the beef in your store. You can also get your Irish supplier to give you a letter to put in your store to re-assure cutomers. Its the same with your can drinks, if you get cola from say UK or northen Ireland, some customers may complain about them not being from the republic. So we immidiately changed over, you will get a better reception. Just make sure you check, because once our supplier told us it was from the Republic, we checked the cans and it said north, so he exchanged immidiately because my dad said he was going to change supplier. It makes no sense, but it will be a little more expensive to buy the refreshments from the republic of Ireland as opposed to the UK.

Thats all I can think of now. If you need any more advice you can PM me

goz83

Thanks Tom, I will contact the local council to see what the deal is. I might contact the local TD to see if anything can be done there.

@ IIsoleeII: Thank you very much for your response. It is very encouraging and will be helpful. I myself am Irish, so I am very aware of the concerns for Irish produce (especially meat). I would be purchasing Irish goods as much as possible and I would display this fact after reading your post.

I have a building and maintenance company, which I own, so I would be able to save a fortune on fitting out the shop and any maintenance needing to be carried out. I knew the health inspectors were fussy, but I did not know they were that fussy. Light bulb colour? Woks in closed bag? Maybe he thought your dad was hiding broken equipment? But the bulbs is just mad, unless the lighting was too blue? I keep fish and I am also a photographer, so i know different types of light can show, or hide different things.

I will definitely get back in touch to pick your brain. If you need advice with building, photography, or website marketing, I will be happy to return the favour.

Where is your shop?

antoinolachtnai

That stuff about health and sourcing above is really really good, but I think that before you get that far, you also need to look hard at the market and understand it deeply.

You need to know what else is around. If there is a McDonald's, for example, I'm sure there's something else, although it may be a bit hidden away. It's not a business I know well, but home delivery can make the catchment of a good take away restaurant seem much bigger than it actually is.

You also need to know a lot about food and what people like. Just because you like your friend's food, it doesn't mean that the general market will. It is not that you don't have good taste, it's just that you need food that the market will accept, not just food that you like personally.

This thing where a buidling/interior fitting company opens a restaurant - this can work as Mick Wallace demonstrates, but there is a cafe not far from me, which is a joint venture between an Irish guy (builder/interior fitter) and a person who cooks. It is heavy weather for them, for a couple of reasons. 1. Neither owner understands the operations and service required to operate in this local market. 2. They got their sizing wrong at the very beginning, because neither of them really understood the business, and now the operation is really too small to ever really make much money.

IIsoleeII

goz83 wrote: »

Thanks Tom, I will contact the local council to see what the deal is. I might contact the local TD to see if anything can be done there.

@ IIsoleeII: Thank you very much for your response. It is very encouraging and will be helpful. I myself am Irish, so I am very aware of the concerns for Irish produce (especially meat). I would be purchasing Irish goods as much as possible and I would display this fact after reading your post.

I have a building and maintenance company, which I own, so I would be able to save a fortune on fitting out the shop and any maintenance needing to be carried out. I knew the health inspectors were fussy, but I did not know they were that fussy. Light bulb colour? Woks in closed bag? Maybe he thought your dad was hiding broken equipment? But the bulbs is just mad, unless the lighting was too blue? I keep fish and I am also a photographer, so i know different types of light can show, or hide different things.

I will definitely get back in touch to pick your brain. If you need advice with building, photography, or website marketing, I will be happy to return the favour.

Where is your shop?

Haha go away! I'm studying photography. Maybe i'll get back to you about it kkk.
Good thing you're in building, you can make it more efficient. Shelving and everything is so important, including with health & safety regulations. They'll aslo be really picky with containers for your spices etc.
The bulbs were yellow, but my dad put in white bulbs after,
We had seperate shelving for the broken equipment, but they were stored in boxes aswell as the shelving units.
Our shop is in Dublin near Clondalkin.

goz83

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

That stuff about health and sourcing above is really really good, but I think that before you get that far, you also need to look hard at the market and understand it deeply.

You need to know what else is around. If there is a McDonald's, for example, I'm sure there's something else, although it may be a bit hidden away. It's not a business I know well, but home delivery can make the catchment of a good take away restaurant seem much bigger than it actually is.

You also need to know a lot about food and what people like. Just because you like your friend's food, it doesn't mean that the general market will. It is not that you don't have good taste, it's just that you need food that the market will accept, not just food that you like personally.

This thing where a buidling/interior fitting company opens a restaurant - this can work as Mick Wallace demonstrates, but there is a cafe not far from me, which is a joint venture between an Irish guy (builder/interior fitter) and a person who cooks. It is heavy weather for them, for a couple of reasons. 1. Neither owner understands the operations and service required to operate in this local market. 2. They got their sizing wrong at the very beginning, because neither of them really understood the business, and now the operation is really too small to ever really make much money.

I have lived in the area for 25 years and there is no other takeaway in the town, which has a well established and known shopping centre. There is a popular pub there too and a mobile chipper van is only there on the weekends to catch the outgoing customers from the pub. The population would be in the high tens of thousands in my town and is populated by working and middle class folk, both would be targeted.

McDonalds is right there, but it's a completely different type of food and it closes at 11pm, where i would hope to be open until 11:30, or midnight to take full advantage of the jolly old tipsy people. Considering we wouldn't be open from 6am, I think we would likely be allowed to open an hour past McDonalds closing time, fitting in with most of the other take-aways. Some open until 1am on weekends.

There are atleast 4 burger bars (chippers), 1 Indian and atleast a dozen Chinese takeaways that will deliver to the catchment area, but it's not the same as being on location, beside a pub and a lot of footfall from the shopping centre. If I couldn't open up shop where I am looking at, I probably wouldn't open up at all. I honestly believe this type of take-away will add value to the area, with a focus on healthier fast-food, which is very hard to achieve. Hopefully it will add value to our bank balances too

It's not just me who likes my friends cooking, it's everyone. When he moved here a few years ago he had a talent for excellent food (this comes from someone who sticks with spuds and pork chops). He then started training here as a Chef. His sister in Thailand is head Chef in a 5 star hotel, so good cooking runs in the family. The focus would be good Thai food, but we would also make sure to include a good Chinese selection too, so as to not scare away those who like their chicken balls and curry.

I am pretty creative, I love to learn and I am not afraid to do the dirty work either, so I think if the location works out and my friend and his wife and kids move a bit closer to the big smoke, it could be a really worthy business. His wife would be very helpful too, because she has some good ideas and is also being trained into accounting by her mother. My own wife i'm sure would be doing plenty of the whip cracking too. She is a natural at bossing people around

@ IIsoleeII: Maybe you could take some good shots of your dads shop to give me ideas? I have only ever seen the waiting area of a chinese take-away. We had an idea of opening up the kitchen area for the punters to see the kitchen and the cooks. I wonder if this would be an issue with health and safety, or anything else. I dont really like the tiny door in the wall the food is normally passed through.

IIsoleeII

Hiya, I cant really go in to take photos, but I can draw the floor plan out on PS if you want me to send it to you.

Well I have seen a few places, mainly South East Asian restaurants with open kitchens.
It sounds like a great idea, however, you need to think about your clients, not only that, but as you said there is a pub, some customers get a bit 'rowdy' near closing time and can cause troubles. We have a pub across the road, and it aint easy at time dealing with customers since we stay open till 1am.
If it was a restaurant, thats a different story because you can look after your clients in a more controlled environment. My friend is running a open kitchen Mongol restuarant, and it looks really lovely, but for takeaways it is different.
Also at summer, the kitchen gets more warm, and more flys going around, so a open kitchen would be very difficult, also it may be too warm for the customers with the heat from the cookers.

Also although Thai food is very wonderful, I know many vietnamese and HK chinese etc. They all say Chicken curry is the number one seller, for me aswell, these type of dishes are a necessity. I guarantee, if you sell Chicken curry, it will make up most of sales, no joke. Also its handy because not many ingredients and very quick to cook. Make sure all the dishes you will provide will be easy and quick to cook, because orders tend to pile up. Preperation for the food before the day starts is extremely necessary, if you are running a fairly busy business, you need atleast 3 chefs in a hour before it starts up. Things like fan extractors etc, should be tended to ideally, once a week, or you'll regret it if you let them clog up!

goz83

Again, great advice. Good point with the heat for customers and the flies in the kitchen. I was just thinking it's great when you can see whats going on in the background. I suppose a glass wall is an optional compromise there, depending on the cost. The premises I am looking at is maybe 100 square metres, so maybe just the right size for a take-away. My friend would love to have a restaurant, but i've convinced him that a take away is where the business is. Smaller overheads and all that. My business may also be diversifying into the security industry, so I could put a static guard on the door to deal with trouble if it becomes an issue on the weekend. It's also a good idea and easy to keep the local Gardai sweet by giving them a free meal when they stop by. They are far more likely to throw an eye in your direction at busy times if they smell trouble and good food at the same time.

A floor plan would be excellent. thanks. I'll PM my email address. I am hoping to get a look at the place next week. It is not exactly rectangular; from what I can see through the dirty windows outside, the unit gets narrower from one end to the other. Its also already let out, but the tenant is only using half of the building on the ground floor. The landlord makes the final decision, but the tenant has permission to sub-let. If they ask for a very high rent, they can shove it. On principle, I won't get ripped off, even if there is great money to be made. I believe in fairness. Not a common courtesy in business, i know, but I stick by it.

Oh, and chicken curry will definitely be on the menu. REAL CHIPS will also be on the menu. Can you tell me why every chinese take-away has inferior chips? There must be a reason for serving those thin, grease sticks. I think chunky chips, that you would get from a burger bar would go down much better.

The location is a long way from Clondalkin, so we won't have anyone comparing our dishes

IIsoleeII

goz83 wrote: »

Again, great advice. Good point with the heat for customers and the flies in the kitchen. I was just thinking it's great when you can see whats going on in the background. I suppose a glass wall is an optional compromise there, depending on the cost. The premises I am looking at is maybe 100 square metres, so maybe just the right size for a take-away. My friend would love to have a restaurant, but i've convinced him that a take away is where the business is. Smaller overheads and all that. My business may also be diversifying into the security industry, so I could put a static guard on the door to deal with trouble if it becomes an issue on the weekend. It's also a good idea and easy to keep the local Gardai sweet by giving them a free meal when they stop by. They are far more likely to throw an eye in your direction at busy times if they smell trouble and good food at the same time.

A floor plan would be excellent. thanks. I'll PM my email address. I am hoping to get a look at the place next week. It is not exactly rectangular; from what I can see through the dirty windows outside, the unit gets narrower from one end to the other. Its also already let out, but the tenant is only using half of the building on the ground floor. The landlord makes the final decision, but the tenant has permission to sub-let. If they ask for a very high rent, they can shove it. On principle, I won't get ripped off, even if there is great money to be made. I believe in fairness. Not a common courtesy in business, i know, but I stick by it.

Oh, and chicken curry will definitely be on the menu. REAL CHIPS will also be on the menu. Can you tell me why every chinese take-away has inferior chips? There must be a reason for serving those thin, grease sticks. I think chunky chips, that you would get from a burger bar would go down much better.

The location is a long way from Clondalkin, so we won't have anyone comparing our dishes

Hmm i'll Email you more info about that to try explain more about Takeaway business.