Could join as an officer but want to join as an "other rank"

effluent

Could there be anything said for a person who could join as an officer ( is a Graduate and has qualitites/experience ect) but wants to joins as an other rank, purley just to do more soldiering and more time on the ground?

What puts me off is when I finish up my service and look for employment, potiential emloyers will look at my cv and wonder "what the heck is this guy doing joining as an other rank when he could have joined as an officer, maybe he isn't ambitious and can't handle the pressure". Would I be right in thinking this?

Is it unusual for graduates to join as other rank or is this daft and something I could regret further down the line?

Any thoughts?

Nuttzz

I dont see a platoon commader (i.e. an lt) sending much less time on the ground compared to a private, sure the lt wouldnt be leading in the first assault, but someone still has to command & direct things on the ground

If you going at a other rank, as a private you will be "paid from the neck down" so you could find yourself frustrated if you feel you can achieve more but cant as you are too low down the scale

As for post army employment I dont think many employers will know how much activities "on the ground" an officer will do, as an officer you will have access to more specialised courses (e.g. database administration in the CIS corps for example) that will be of more use to you if you leave the army then if you were a other rank

If you can be an officer, then there is no reason you shouldnt apply for it imo

ChunkyLover_53

effluent wrote: »

Could there be anything said for a person who could join as an officer ( is a Graduate and has qualitites/experience ect) but wants to joins as an other rank, purley just to do more soldiering and more time on the ground?

What puts me off is when I finish up my service and look for employment, potiential emloyers will look at my cv and wonder "what the heck is this guy doing joining as an other rank when he could have joined as an officer, maybe he isn't ambitious and can't handle the pressure". Would I be right in thinking this?

Is it unusual for graduates to join as other rank or is this daft and something I could regret further down the line?

Any thoughts?

Big difference between Officers & Other ranks = Pay & Conditions

But are joining for the money or the experience?

I know a good few troops in the DF with degrees & diplomas and I know there are plenty with Junior Cert qualifications too.

If you get pissed off with the Army after 5 years at least you can leave & have that degree there to fall back on.

If you make a career of the any Army and leave as an NCO, and if you let some Civvie question your ambitions, your loyalty or your ability to act under pressure and are unable to rattle off a list of experiences & situations in which your interviewer would have sh1t his/her pants then you're doing it wrong.

effluent

ChunkyLover_53 wrote: »

Big difference between Officers & Other ranks = Pay & Conditions

But are joining for the money or the experience?

I know a good few troops in the DF with degrees & diplomas and I know there are plenty with Junior Cert qualifications too.

If you get pissed off with the Army after 5 years at least you can leave & have that degree there to fall back on.

If you make a career of the any Army and leave as an NCO, and if you let some Civvie question your ambitions, your loyalty or your ability to act under pressure and are unable to rattle off a list of experiences & situations in which your interviewer would have sh1t his/her pants then you're doing it wrong.

Without sounding too brass, money is the last thing on my mind. It really is for the experience I'm in it for.

The way I see it is if I want to go on to become an officer after real life military I could still apply to do so or at least have good promotion prospects having a degree.

Just for arguments sake lets say an Irish bloke could join the BA or PDF as an officer or join the FFL or the RM's as an other rank, but is more inclined to join the lather. Would it be unusual for someone to do so with a degree

ChunkyLover_53

Promotion in Other Ranks will rarely come down to education, it will mostly be based on merit, range of experience & ability.

There are schemes in place in various military organisations to promote Other Ranks into the officer Corp but again these are based on experience & ability rather than education. Some of the best NCOs I know only qualified at InterCert Level & on the flip side there are some pretty dumb people with Degrees & Diplomas.

If you want to join the FFL as a Legionairre with a Degree then I'm sure you won't be the first nor the last, there are a couple of FFL forums on the net you should ask there about promotion prospects but I'd take a stab at saying they'll be based on merit, ability and experience.

discus

effluent wrote: »

Just for arguments sake lets say an Irish bloke could join the BA or PDF as an officer or join the FFL or the RM's as an other rank, but is more inclined to join the lather. Would it be unusual for someone to do so with a degree

Unusual? Depends on the degree. They pushed me into going for officer selection after going for soldier selection, based on... potential. In reality, I'm better suited for being a soldier than an officer imo.

edit: I've gone off the point. Basically, go for what you want. If you get offered an opening, then feel free to crack on as you wish. But if you want to be a soldier, then go for it.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Be an officer is my advice, as someone said 'pay and conditions'.

If you go enlisted and repeat this 'I could have been an officer', its a tag which will follow you throughout your career, and trust me, when your getting the sh*tty end of the stick sometime it'll blurt out.

dodgydes

I agree, It's an officers army. Better conditions, defined career path. I wouldn't worry about not being out on the ground as an officer, the cadet school will knock that out of you.;)

If you join as an enlisted soldier when you had a chance at the cadets you will always regret it.

You can apply for the cadets even if you are an enlisted soldier, provided you meet the criteria.

Poccington

effluent wrote: »

Is it unusual for graduates to join as other rank or is this daft and something I could regret further down the line?

As an Officer, you won't be out on the ground as much as enlisted personnel.

I know of a few lads who went down the General Enlistment route as graduates.

As lads have rightly pointed out, the DF is an Officer's army. However, I'd never tell anyone who was joining the DF to soldier, rather than just joining for a job, to avoid going for General Enlistment. Most lads you'll hear cribbing about life in the enlisted ranks, are usually the ones who joined the DF in the "I just wanted a job" mindset rather than the "I want to be a soldier" mindset. If you really want to do the proper army stuff, the possibilites are endless for enlisted folk.

There's still plenty of opportunities for enlisted personnel. For example, one of the graduates I know who went down the enlisted personnel route completed the PSBC with the British Army last year. If you were to go down the ARW route, as an enlisted man you'll spend a hell of a lot more time in the Unit than an Officer would. As an NCO, assuming you're good enough, you'll still have a chance at training Recruits, training Cadets, instructing in the NCOTW, the IWW etc.

As for lads saying that as a Private you'll be paid from the neck down, well as an Officer you'll have to get very quickly used to becoming a yes man. There's ups and downs to both sides of the coin.

voter1983

Without meaning to sound patronising maybe you'd be better off just taking whatever position ya can. Especially in light of recruitment bans and embargoes.

newby.204

join as an other rank if thats what you really want, but if i could do it again, id join as an officer in a heartbeat, well id at least attempt to!!!!

goldie fish

Join as an other rank, Nothing stopping you from applying for a cadetship once you are a private, and you probably have a better chance of getting one compared to applying as a civvy.

neilled

goldie fish wrote: »

Join as an other rank, Nothing stopping you from applying for a cadetship once you are a private, and you probably have a better chance of getting one compared to applying as a civvy.

The of enlisted that get cadetships is quite low. The last commissioned class had three members with previous pdf service and thats a relatively high number for cadet classes as of late.

Milk & Honey

I heard a PDF officer complain a few years ago that recruits were now too well educated. Private soldiers are too well aware of their "rights" and question everything.
One of the problems with enlisting is that even if you are eventually commissioned you will have lost valuable time. Success in the higher ranks comes much more easily to those who are young when commissioned and have the right domestic and overseas range of experience. Going through the ranks means being older than average for officers of the same rank and being assigned low profile admin posts. Only one ex-rank who was not a cadet or DE has reached the rank of Lt. Col in recent times.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Milk & Honey wrote: »

I heard a PDF officer complain a few years ago that recruits were now too well educated. Private soldiers are too well aware of their "rights" and question everything.
One of the problems with enlisting is that even if you are eventually commissioned you will have lost valuable time. Success in the higher ranks comes much more easily to those who are young when commissioned and have the right domestic and overseas range of experience. Going through the ranks means being older than average for officers of the same rank and being assigned low profile admin posts. Only one ex-rank who was not a cadet or DE has reached the rank of Lt. Col in recent times.

+1.

Plus your never truely 'one of them, or one of us'.

When I applied for the army I also applied for AGS, if I could turn back the clock I'd have waited for the guards.

I believed at the time, and still do to an extent, that a Ballymun boy would never get accepted as a cadet.

OP, as an infantry, arty, cav officer you'll be on the ground a lot so don't let that put you off. You won't be oversea's as much as an enlisted man, but when you do you'll be calling the shots, you'll be the one waited on, you'll have your morning news papers and Galtee rashers on a Sunday

Seriously, if your in with a chance go for the cadets.