Any plans to do something about fuel prices?

Dannyboy83

Haven't been paying much attention to the media lately.
Just wondering if there are talks of any plans to do something about fuel prices as was suggested in the UK? e.g. reducing vat or fuel duty?

Petrol was €1.55 per litre at the Texaco on the South Douglas Road in Cork City yesterday and €1.54 at the Topaz in Cork Airport.
It'll probably be €1.60 before the end of April at this rate.

A funny thing occurred to me yesterday, I misread a sign and thought petrol was €1.41 per litre - thinking to myself - WOW! That's cheap!
3 months ago, that would have seemed as obscene as €1.55 seems today tho.

====

Side note; but I see they're planning to toll the N20 and the Jack Lynch Tunnel in Cork: http://www.independent.ie/national-news/motorists-face-new-charges-as-number-of-toll-roads-to-double-2622183.html

Anybody actually seen the state of the roads in Cork these days?
I predict a boom in hovercraft research in Cork!

ardmacha

Fuel in Ireland in on the lower end of European prices when most other products aren't and the State needs the revenue. There is no justification for reducing duty.

gurramok

High fuel prices are an obstacle in a depressed economy. Keeping excise duty high is hitting consumers in the pocket hard and that means less spending in the shops for example to sustain jobs. High diesel prices are also feeding inflation in the price of goods as goods are mostly shipped by road diesel vehicles.

RichardAnd

If it were my call, I'd keep fuel costs as low as possible to keep money in peoples' pockets. Of course, if it were my call, we wouldn't be spending money we didn't have either...

ei.sdraob

ardmacha wrote: »

Fuel in Ireland in on the lower end of European prices when most other products aren't and the State needs the revenue. There is no justification for reducing duty.

Money extracted via fuel taxes (excise,carbon,vat) is tax money (Mainly VAT) lost in people cutting back on spending which leads to job losses (loss of income tax etc)

I am suprised no one has yet posted the usual "we deserve high prices since motorvehicles are the work of the devil which will lead to a global warming armaggedon" :rolleyes: excuse

OMD

gurramok wrote: »

High fuel prices are an obstacle in a depressed economy. Keeping excise duty high is hitting consumers in the pocket hard and that means less spending in the shops for example to sustain jobs. High diesel prices are also feeding inflation in the price of goods as goods are mostly shipped by road diesel vehicles.

Thank God we don't have high fuel prices then

macannrb

i think we should increase tax on petrol and diesel, and remove car tax and forget about more tolls.

If we did that on a "cost neutral" basis, we would bring in the same amount of money, and reduce the cost of bringing it in.

Business would be able to claim back part of the higher costs through Vat reclaims, and so not to penalise them too much, give them a rebate maybe. It would be far simpler, and would avoid the costs of running the car tax system. Police could use the time they spend on chasing car tax evaders, to investigate serious crime

hinault

By way of comparison here are fuel prices in Germany.
(location, diesel price, super 10 price, superplus price).


Ort Diesel Super E10 Superplus
Bundesweit 1,429 Euro 1,553 Euro 1,672 Euro
Aachen 1,421 Euro (64) 1,556 Euro (85) 1,720 Euro (124)
Aalen 1,429 Euro (74) 1,529 Euro (15) 1,664 Euro (55)
Aschaffenburg 1,418 Euro (59) 1,538 Euro (32) 1,620 Euro (11)
Augsburg 1,435 Euro (90) 1,571 Euro (120) 1,686 Euro (92)
Bamberg 1,453 Euro (116) 1,582 Euro (129) 1,677 Euro (78)
Bayreuth 1,415 Euro (47) 1,537 Euro (31) 1,644 Euro (33)
Bensheim 1,442 Euro (103) 1,567 Euro (112) 1,647 Euro (35)
Bergisch Gladbach 1,389 Euro (11) 1,533 Euro (22) 1,671 Euro (63)
Berlin 1,431 Euro (83) 1,540 Euro (39) 1,653 Euro (43)
Biberach 1,437 Euro (94) 1,563 Euro (103) 1,673 Euro (74)
Bielefeld 1,405 Euro (36) 1,530 Euro (20) 1,673 Euro (75)
Böblingen 1,419 Euro (60) 1,559 Euro (94) 1,694 Euro (109)
Bocholt 1,464 Euro (127) 1,584 Euro (130) 1,654 Euro (44)
Bochum 1,409 Euro (38) 1,551 Euro (70) 1,658 Euro (47)
Bonn 1,425 Euro (70) 1,550 Euro (66) 1,701 Euro (114)
Bottrop 1,393 Euro (16) 1,551 Euro (69) 1,651 Euro (40)
Braunschweig 1,453 Euro (117) 1,565 Euro (111) 1,740 Euro (132)
Bremen 1,411 Euro (41) 1,539 Euro (34) 1,667 Euro (58)
Bremerhaven 1,416 Euro (51) 1,546 Euro (57) 1,606 Euro (7)
Celle 1,437 Euro (95) 1,541 Euro (41) 1,679 Euro (81)
Chemnitz 1,407 Euro (37) 1,527 Euro (13) 1,617 Euro (10)
Coburg 1,444 Euro (106) 1,564 Euro (108) 1,672 Euro (65)
Cottbus 1,450 Euro (113) 1,562 Euro (101) 1,679 Euro (80)
Darmstadt 1,428 Euro (72) 1,544 Euro (49) 1,633 Euro (21)
Dessau 1,382 Euro (7) 1,537 Euro (30) 1,672 Euro (64)
Dortmund 1,396 Euro (20) 1,538 Euro (33) 1,670 Euro (62)
Dresden 1,465 Euro (128) 1,580 Euro (128) 1,660 Euro (49)
Duisburg 1,438 Euro (96) 1,559 Euro (96) 1,686 Euro (91)
Düren 1,442 Euro (102) 1,544 Euro (50) 1,584 Euro (4)
Düsseldorf 1,423 Euro (66) 1,540 Euro (40) 1,701 Euro (113)
Eisenach 1,444 Euro (105) 1,534 Euro (24) 1,639 Euro (25)
Erfurt 1,430 Euro (82) 1,563 Euro (102) 1,667 Euro (59)
Erkrath 1,466 Euro (129) 1,579 Euro (127) 1,689 Euro (100)
Erlangen 1,416 Euro (52) 1,549 Euro (63) 1,645 Euro (34)
Essen 1,390 Euro (12) 1,555 Euro (81) 1,687 Euro (93)
Flensburg 1,405 Euro (35) 1,544 Euro (51) 1,700 Euro (112)
Frankfurt am Main 1,429 Euro (73) 1,545 Euro (56) 1,673 Euro (73)
Freiburg 1,401 Euro (26) 1,559 Euro (95) 1,677 Euro (79)
Freising 1,452 Euro (115) 1,556 Euro (86) 1,636 Euro (24)
Friedrichshafen 1,372 Euro (5) 1,516 Euro (7) 1,632 Euro (20)
Fürth 1,399 Euro (24) 1,543 Euro (47) 1,648 Euro (37)
Gelsenkirchen 1,392 Euro (15) 1,541 Euro (42) 1,647 Euro (36)
Gera 1,424 Euro (67) 1,546 Euro (58) 1,657 Euro (46)
Göppingen 1,412 Euro (43) 1,541 Euro (43) 1,641 Euro (28)
Göttingen 1,457 Euro (122) 1,557 Euro (87) 1,682 Euro (88)
Greifswald 1,471 Euro (133) 1,567 Euro (113) 1,691 Euro (104)
Hagen 1,418 Euro (58) 1,560 Euro (97) 1,687 Euro (94)
Halle 1,414 Euro (46) 1,542 Euro (45) 1,692 Euro (105)
Hamburg 1,416 Euro (53) 1,548 Euro (60) 1,683 Euro (89)
Hamm 1,383 Euro (8) 1,505 Euro (5) 1,625 Euro (15)
Hanau 1,411 Euro (42) 1,547 Euro (59) 1,626 Euro (16)
Hannover 1,434 Euro (89) 1,533 Euro (23) 1,695 Euro (110)
Hattingen 1,394 Euro (17) 1,554 Euro (80) 1,689 Euro (99)
Heidelberg 1,424 Euro (68) 1,544 Euro (48) 1,624 Euro (14)
Heilbronn 1,426 Euro (71) 1,585 Euro (132) 1,726 Euro (128)
Herne 1,384 Euro (10) 1,527 Euro (12) 1,622 Euro (13)
Hilden 1,439 Euro (98) 1,559 Euro (93) 1,679 Euro (82)
Hildesheim 1,429 Euro (75) 1,519 Euro (8) 1,669 Euro (61)
Hof 1,474 Euro (134) 1,564 Euro (109) 1,672 Euro (66)
Ingolstadt 1,463 Euro (126) 1,565 Euro (110) 1,711 Euro (118)
Jena 1,458 Euro (123) 1,570 Euro (119) 1,669 Euro (60)
Kaiserslautern 1,443 Euro (104) 1,568 Euro (118) 1,663 Euro (50)
Karlsruhe 1,391 Euro (13) 1,542 Euro (46) 1,626 Euro (17)
Kassel 1,432 Euro (85) 1,550 Euro (68) 1,710 Euro (117)
Kerpen 1,383 Euro (9) 1,528 Euro (14) 1,593 Euro (6)
Kiel 1,418 Euro (57) 1,549 Euro (61) 1,688 Euro (97)
Koblenz 1,453 Euro (118) 1,587 Euro (133) 1,703 Euro (115)
Köln 1,405 Euro (34) 1,550 Euro (67) 1,694 Euro (108)
Krefeld 1,429 Euro (76) 1,549 Euro (62) 1,715 Euro (119)
Kulmbach 1,402 Euro (27) 1,472 Euro (2) 1,586 Euro (5)
Landshut 1,436 Euro (93) 1,572 Euro (121) 1,689 Euro (98)
Leipzig 1,419 Euro (61) 1,558 Euro (88) 1,621 Euro (12)
Leonberg 1,364 Euro (3) 1,514 Euro (6) 1,649 Euro (38)
Leverkusen 1,439 Euro (97) 1,554 Euro (76) 1,744 Euro (133)
Lübeck 1,431 Euro (84) 1,554 Euro (77) 1,718 Euro (123)
Lüdenscheid 1,451 Euro (114) 1,567 Euro (115) 1,722 Euro (127)
Ludwigsburg 1,415 Euro (49) 1,537 Euro (27) 1,640 Euro (27)
Lüneburg 1,429 Euro (79) 1,579 Euro (126) 1,639 Euro (26)
Lünen 1,397 Euro (21) 1,537 Euro (28) 1,667 Euro (57)
Magdeburg 1,429 Euro (80) 1,536 Euro (26) 1,682 Euro (86)
Mainz 1,400 Euro (25) 1,539 Euro (36) 1,634 Euro (22)
Mannheim 1,416 Euro (50) 1,545 Euro (55) 1,644 Euro (32)
Moers 1,399 Euro (22) 1,524 Euro (11) 1,682 Euro (87)
Mönchengladbach 1,418 Euro (55) 1,541 Euro (44) 1,694 Euro (107)
Mülheim an der Ruhr 1,404 Euro (33) 1,563 Euro (105) 1,672 Euro (67)
München 1,439 Euro (99) 1,564 Euro (106) 1,681 Euro (85)
Münster 1,432 Euro (87) 1,561 Euro (99) 1,751 Euro (135)
Neubrandenburg 1,447 Euro (107) 1,558 Euro (89) 1,679 Euro (83)
Neuss 1,415 Euro (48) 1,549 Euro (64) 1,687 Euro (95)
Nürnberg 1,391 Euro (14) 1,520 Euro (9) 1,634 Euro (23)
Oberhausen 1,410 Euro (39) 1,559 Euro (90) 1,717 Euro (120)
Offenbach 1,418 Euro (56) 1,552 Euro (74) 1,663 Euro (52)
Offenburg 1,432 Euro (86) 1,556 Euro (84) 1,709 Euro (116)
Oldenburg 1,395 Euro (18) 1,540 Euro (37) 1,673 Euro (72)
Osnabrück 1,414 Euro (45) 1,552 Euro (73) 1,718 Euro (122)
Paderborn 1,442 Euro (101) 1,562 Euro (100) 1,734 Euro (130)
Passau 1,483 Euro (136) 1,603 Euro (137) 1,765 Euro (136)
Pforzheim 1,420 Euro (62) 1,568 Euro (117) 1,672 Euro (69)
Plauen 1,480 Euro (135) 1,590 Euro (135) 1,688 Euro (96)
Potsdam 1,402 Euro (28) 1,522 Euro (10) 1,632 Euro (19)
Ratingen 1,417 Euro (54) 1,553 Euro (75) 1,673 Euro (71)
Regensburg 1,454 Euro (120) 1,568 Euro (116) 1,677 Euro (77)
Remscheid 1,404 Euro (31) 1,539 Euro (35) 1,697 Euro (111)
Reutlingen 1,395 Euro (19) 1,530 Euro (19) 1,626 Euro (18)
Rosenheim 1,453 Euro (119) 1,593 Euro (136) 1,717 Euro (121)

Saarbrücken 1,448 Euro (109) 1,563 Euro (104) 1,652 Euro (42)
Salzgitter 1,429 Euro (78) 1,559 Euro (91) 1,749 Euro (134)
Schweinfurt 1,449 Euro (110) 1,537 Euro (29) 1,672 Euro (68)
Schwerin 1,402 Euro (29) 1,552 Euro (72) 1,607 Euro (8)
Siegen 1,471 Euro (132) 1,529 Euro (17) 1,665 Euro (56)
Soest 1,434 Euro (88) 1,544 Euro (53) 1,642 Euro (29)
Solingen 1,457 Euro (121) 1,572 Euro (122) 1,729 Euro (129)
Speyer 1,471 Euro (131) 1,584 Euro (131) 1,664 Euro (54)
Stade 1,422 Euro (65) 1,532 Euro (21) 1,689 Euro (102)
Stendal 1,459 Euro (124) 1,554 Euro (78) 1,689 Euro (103)
Stralsund 1,364 Euro (2) 1,459 Euro (1) 1,529 Euro (1)
Straubing 1,349 Euro (1) 1,504 Euro (4) 1,564 Euro (2)
Stuttgart 1,403 Euro (30) 1,540 Euro (38) 1,664 Euro (53)
Teltow 1,379 Euro (6) 1,499 Euro (3) 1,579 Euro (3)
Trier 1,501 Euro (137) 1,577 Euro (123) 1,767 Euro (137)
Tübingen 1,367 Euro (4) 1,529 Euro (16) 1,609 Euro (9)
Ulm 1,436 Euro (92) 1,556 Euro (83) 1,672 Euro (70)
Unna 1,399 Euro (23) 1,529 Euro (18) 1,676 Euro (76)
Unterschleißheim 1,469 Euro (130) 1,589 Euro (134) 1,692 Euro (106)
Viersen 1,424 Euro (69) 1,554 Euro (79) 1,679 Euro (84)
Villingen-Schwenningen 1,447 Euro (108) 1,567 Euro (114) 1,721 Euro (125)
Weiterstadt 1,441 Euro (100) 1,559 Euro (92) 1,642 Euro (30)
Wesel 1,459 Euro (125) 1,579 Euro (125) 1,649 Euro (39)
Wiesbaden 1,413 Euro (44) 1,536 Euro (25) 1,642 Euro (31)
Wilhelmshaven 1,429 Euro (77) 1,577 Euro (124) 1,721 Euro (126)
Witten 1,404 Euro (32) 1,564 Euro (107) 1,689 Euro (101)
Wolfsburg 1,449 Euro (111) 1,549 Euro (65) 1,739 Euro (131)
Worms 1,450 Euro (112) 1,560 Euro (98) 1,656 Euro (45)
Wuppertal 1,410 Euro (40) 1,545 Euro (54) 1,685 Euro (90)
Würzburg 1,430 Euro (81) 1,552 Euro (71) 1,659 Euro (48)
Zwickau 1,435 Euro (91) 1,555 Euro (82) 1,663 Euro (51)

gurramok

OMD wrote: »

Thank God we don't have high fuel prices then

Some anecdotes from boardsies, crazy amount of money spent on fuel, like mini-mortgages. Multiply that by the many hundreds of thousands that actually have jobs hence less disposable income to spend on consumer goods & services for example.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056242397

ei.sdraob

hinault wrote: »

By way of comparison here are fuel prices in Germany.

Where are the Irish autobahns? Oh yes :cool:

OMD

hinault wrote: »

By way of comparison here are fuel prices in Germany.
(location, diesel price, super 10 price, superplus price).


Ort Diesel Super E10 Superplus
Bundesweit 1,429 Euro 1,553 Euro 1,672 Euro
Aachen 1,421 Euro (64) 1,556 Euro (85) 1,720 Euro (124)
Aalen 1,429 Euro (74) 1,529 Euro (15)

Here is how we compare internationally based on Country Currency Unleaded Diesel Unleaded Diesel
Austria Euro 1.35 1.35 117.67 116.89
Belgium Euro 1.51 1.37 131.05 119.15
Czech Republic Czech Koruna 34.50 33.40 122.67 118.76
Denmark Danish Krone 12.41 11.39 144.51 132.63
Finland Euro 1.60 1.37 139.05 118.71
France Euro 1.58 1.46 136.87 126.45
Germany Euro 1.61 1.44 140.09 125.23
Greece Euro 1.59 1.39 138.44 120.88
Netherlands Euro 1.69 1.41 145.92 122.22
Hungary Forint 375.00 372.00 118.93 117.97
Ireland Euro 1.45 1.39 125.58 120.36
Italy Euro 1.53 1.42 133.05 123.49
Luxembourg Euro 1.31 1.20 113.93 104.11
Estonia Euro 1.25 1.31 108.80 113.58
Norway
Norwegian
Krone 14.29 13.69 157.26 150.66
Latvia Lats 0.89 0.90 109.66 110.89
Lithuania Litas 4.60 4.36 115.70 109.66
Poland Zloty 5.02 4.95 106.72 105.23
Slovakia Euro 1.38 1.26 119.93 109.50
Slovenia Euro 1.28 1.24 111.15 107.50
Portugal Euro 1.53 1.38 133.14 119.49
Spain Euro 1.32 1.30 114.71 112.98
Sweden Swedish Krona 13.93 14.19 134.16 136.66
Switzerland Swiss Francs 1.78 1.91 122.25 131.18
United States of
America US Dollars 0.9424 1.03 58.37 63.95
Malta Euro 1.31 1.21 113.84 105.15
Bulgaria Leva 2.46 2.55 109.24 113.24

Dannyboy83

OMD wrote: »

Here is how we compare internationally based on
Ireland Euro 1.45 1.39 125.58 120.36

I can't find a single listing in Cork for petrol at €1.45 on http://pumps.ie/

They say the avg price is €1.52, which seems correct, with €1.56 being the highest I've seen yet (give it a day, lol).

gurramok

OMD, can you provide prices for countries where most of the oil actually comes from? I've heard its alot cheaper.

The high tax/excise/motor tax(call what you want) European model is hurting alot of European countries economies.

OMD

gurramok wrote: »

OMD, can you provide prices for countries where most of the oil actually comes from? I've heard its alot cheaper.

The high tax/excise/motor tax(call what you want) European model is hurting alot of European countries economies.

Well Norway produces a lot of oil and petrol is substantially higher there (25% higher).

OMD

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

I can't find a single listing in Cork for petrol at €1.45 on http://pumps.ie/

They say the avg price is €1.52, which seems correct, with €1.56 being the highest I've seen yet (give it a day, lol).

I should have mentioned these prices are average prices for March 2011. They are not up to the minute

Cookie_Monster

Its ~67% tax remember and petrol is also being used to subside diesel because although it (diesel) has a better energy density and so should be taxed more its a lot cheaper than petrol unlike a lot of places (UK for example)

gurramok

OMD wrote: »

Well Norway produces a lot of oil and petrol is substantially higher there (25% higher).

The Middle East and you know well what I meant

Has there been any indications from the new govt to do something about high fuel prices?

Dannyboy83

OMD wrote: »

I should have mentioned these prices are average prices for March 2011. They are not up to the minute

The average price of a litre has increased by 7c in less than a month.
At that rate, it'll will easily break €1.60 in May and ought to be nearing €1.70 per litre by the middle of June.

I was speaking with some British friends earlier today who said they love it here, and would love to go more often but it's too bloody expensive - granted they're from the North of England, but this is bloody Cork!
We are still totally out of sync

OMD

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

The average price of a litre has increased by 7c in less than a month.
At that rate, it'll will easily break €1.60 in May and ought to be nearing €1.70 per litre by the middle of June.

I was speaking with some British friends earlier today who said they love it here, and would love to go more often but it's too bloody expensive - granted they're from the North of England, but this is bloody Cork!
We are still totally out of sync

But petrol here is cheaper than in UK

Cookie_Monster

OMD wrote: »

But petrol here is cheaper than in UK

No, it's not now.
Sainsbury in Norwich was £1.33.9 at the weekend, €1.52.49
Esso in Cabinteely is €1.53.9 this morning so much of a muchness now.

Diesel is still a good bit cheaper here.

OMD

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

No, it's not now.
Sainsbury in Norwich was £1.33.9 at the weekend, €1.52.49
Esso in Cabinteely is €1.53.9 this morning so much of a muchness now.

Diesel is still a good bit cheaper here.

But you get my point. You are not going to decide where you are goin g on holiday based on 1c a litre of petrol. The UK prices are only improving relatively due to the recent weakness of sterling compared to the Euro.

By the way 150-152 a litre is standard around me.

Dannyboy83

OMD wrote: »

But petrol here is cheaper than in UK

They seemed aghast at the thought of €1.55 per litre anyway, they had planned to rent a car for 2 weeks in the summer but they're cutting it back to 1 week.

Of course, I seriously doubt that is due to petrol costs alone, but due to overall costs.

HivemindXX

ei.sdraob wrote: »

I am suprised no one has yet posted the usual "we deserve high prices since motorvehicles are the work of the devil which will lead to a global warming armaggedon" :rolleyes: excuse

I don't think you're really suprised. That's just cover for you to toss out your straw man. Roll your eyes at that.

jacko1

start driving at a constant 80/85 kmph - you'll save approx 2 litres (€3) for every 100km travelled

Cookie_Monster

jacko1 wrote: »

start driving at a constant 80/85 kmph - you'll save approx 2 litres (€3) for every 100km travelled

100km @ 120kph is 50 mins
100km @ 80kph is 75 mins

my 25 mins is worth more than €3 thanks
Drive fast, have fun, save time

danbohan

ei.sdraob wrote: »

Money extracted via fuel taxes (excise,carbon,vat) is tax money (Mainly VAT) lost in people cutting back on spending which leads to job losses (loss of income tax etc)

I am suprised no one has yet posted the usual "we deserve high prices since motorvehicles are the work of the devil which will lead to a global warming armaggedon" :rolleyes: excuse

strange , while we may have low to average fuel prices by European standards ,and change is not justified apparently , but have high to very high public sector wages by European standards brother ardmacha will state change is not justified there either . meanwhile in the real world business are closing down every day and many transport companies among them , but of course thats ok , its justified!

hinault

Europe's public transport system is far better than our public transport system.
Hence our reliance on car usage is higher than many Europeans.

vdubber9411

OMD wrote: »

But petrol here is cheaper than in UK

Fuel is slightly cheaper in Ireland to the UK! But Irish Road Tax is absolutely ridiculous! The cost can not be justified!

In the UK for example a Citroen Xsara 2.0 HDI would cost you around £110 to tax for the year, this is a low carbon vehicle. €600+ in Ireland. Buy a certain new Mini in the UK and road fund licence is free as the emissions are so low. The Irish Government in its wisdom decided the bigger the engine the more you should pay which is utter nonsence.

I agree with earlier comments, put the road fund tax on fuel, you then pay as you use. Why should a commercial vehicle pay less than private car? Most if not all vans do!

Why should a little old dear that lives on her own out in the country pay crazy annual road tax price to do a few miles to the shops each week. It is an unfare system.

Scrap road tax, put it on fuel. Which brings us to the cost of fuel! We as the public should have brought the roads to a standstill when fuel went over €1.20. We only have ourselves to blame for letting them get away with it. We're on the whole a rural country and we need our vehicles, it is not an unecessary pleasure.

Squall19

RichardAnd wrote: »

If it were my call, I'd keep fuel costs as low as possible to keep money in peoples' pockets. Of course, if it were my call, we wouldn't be spending money we didn't have either...

Exactly!

If petrol was a reasonable price like 1.10 euro or something, I might actually get into the car and go to Killarney.Bring the dog, girlfriend and who knows maybe I would even get an ice-cream, bottle of coke and spend some money in the shops in town.Its a great evening

No I will stay at home for the evening, spare my money, because I cant bare putting in petrol at 1.52 a litre, **** that.

erictheviking1

Squall19 wrote: »

Exactly!

If petrol was a reasonable price like 1.10 euro or something, I might actually get into the car and go to Killarney.Bring the dog, girlfriend and who knows maybe I would even get an ice-cream, bottle of coke and spend some money in the shops in town.Its a great evening

No I will stay at home for the evening, spare my money, because I cant bare putting in petrol at 1.52 a litre, **** that.

Agree with this. Since the last budget the only driving I do is to work and back:(.
Petrol/Diesel is too expensive .end of. The so called "carbon tax" is the biggest f***ing rip off in history. I wouldn't mind if we had decent public transport:mad:
The government should kop the f***on! Motoring is a necessity in most parts of the country, not a luxury!
Oh, and BTW, the Greens can f*** off too!:D

Vizzy

danbohan wrote: »

strange , while we may have low to average fuel prices by European standards ,and change is not justified apparently , but have high to very high public sector wages by European standards brother ardmacha will state change is not justified there either . meanwhile in the real world business are closing down every day and many transport companies among them , but of course thats ok , its justified!

I was wondering when somebody would bring in some PS bashing to the argument.
Thanks for ending my wait.
Now all we need is Gigino to sign in !

oppenheimer1

erictheviking1 wrote: »

Agree with this. Since the last budget the only driving I do is to work and back:(.
Petrol/Diesel is too expensive .end of. The so called "carbon tax" is the biggest f***ing rip off in history. I wouldn't mind if we had decent public transport:mad:
The government should kop the f***on! Motoring is a necessity in most parts of the country, not a luxury!
Oh, and BTW, the Greens can f*** off too!:D

Well why is motoring a necessity? Its because many many people decided in their infinite wisdom that building a one off house in the back arse of nowhere was a good idea. They did this despite the warnings that fuel prices would rapidly outpace any growth in wages in the future. No Ireland has a thinly spread population where a high quality public transport network is not viable.


Why blame the government? It isn't their fault that the limited supply of world oil has now got a bigger demand considering the increasing richness of countries like China and India.

For those who want to see a scary version of the future of energy supply, watch a film called Collapse (2009).

ei.sdraob

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Well why is motoring a necessity?

The loaf of bread in your shop did not grow on the shelf
The ingridients to make the bread did not magically appear at the bakery
The wheat did not harvest itself
The soil used to grow the wheat did not fertilise itself
and so on

Just because you might have cycled to the shop to get the bread does not mean motoring is not essential to a modern economy

oppenheimer1

ei.sdraob wrote: »

The loaf of bread in your shop did not grow on the shelf
The ingridients to make the bread did not magically appear at the bakery
The wheat did not harvest itself
The soil used to grow the wheat did not fertilise itself
and so on

Just because you might have cycled to the shop to get the bread does not mean motoring is not essential to a modern economy

People would be complaining here about the price of food if thats what they were upset about. However you actually see its the price of petrol they're complaining about or the cost of the final leg in the loaf of breads journey. Fuel costs can be minimised if the journeys travelled are minimised.


People knew prices were always going to rise, and rise quite rapidly. Like the housing bubble when things happen that have long been predicted its not a surprise.

phkk

ei.sdraob wrote: »

The loaf of bread in your shop did not grow on the shelf
The ingridients to make the bread did not magically appear at the bakery
The wheat did not harvest itself
The soil used to grow the wheat did not fertilise itself
and so on

Just because you might have cycled to the shop to get the bread does not mean motoring is not essential to a modern economy

+1 to that,sick of all these people giving out about us living in the countryside Well why is motoring a necessity? Its because many many people decided in their infinite wisdom that building a one off house in the back arse of nowhere was a good idea

ardmacha

Why didn't Oppenheimer invent a usable form of nuclear power? Then we could all drive around.

ei.sdraob

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

People would be complaining here about the price of food if thats what they were upset about. However you actually see its the price of petrol they're complaining about or the cost of the final leg in the loaf of breads journey. Fuel costs can be minimised if the journeys travelled are minimised.


People knew prices were always going to rise, and rise quite rapidly. Like the housing bubble when things happen that have long been predicted its not a surprise.

house oil prices always go up

hmm where have we heard that before...

oppenheimer1

ei.sdraob wrote: »

house oil prices always go up

hmm where have we heard that before...

As long as our economic system is based on an infinite supply of energy, currently derived from oil, the price of oil is only going to go in one direction. The days of $20 a barrel are long over. Those days will never return unless we can find an alternative source of limitless energy or somehow kill demand.

Tayla

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Well why is motoring a necessity? Its because many many people decided in their infinite wisdom that building a one off house in the back arse of nowhere was a good idea.

Ok well not everyone built a one off house in the middle of nowhere, there are plenty of large villages around with an awful lot of houses, I suppose they should be happy with the one bus a week which brings them to the local time, motoring is a necessity whether you want to believe it or not.

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

No Ireland has a thinly spread population where a high quality public transport network is not viable.

I agree with this, we can't and should never expect to have a high quality transport network because there are simply not enough people to use it which is why people living in the countryside need a car, bizarrely you seem to think that there should be no public transport for these people nor should they have transport so they should all move to towns then should they??

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Why blame the government? It isn't their fault that the limited supply of world oil has now got a bigger demand considering the increasing richness of countries like China and India.

The government should at least be looking at ideas for what to do, to see if reducing tax on petrol would help in any way.

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

For those who want to see a scary version of the future of energy supply, watch a film called Collapse (2009).

I watched that film and terrified myself but then I did some more research and realised that whole movie was just scaremongering.

ei.sdraob

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

As long as our economic system is based on an infinite supply of energy, currently derived from oil, the price of oil is only going to go in one direction. The days of $20 a barrel are long over. Those days will never return unless we can find an alternative source of limitless energy or somehow kill demand.

"They dont make any more land, you know" was also used during the bubble as an excuse :rolleyes: mind you they do print plenty of dollars out of thin air which makes some commodities appear to go up in price as dollar is devalued

We live in a universe and planet surrounded by huge amounts of energy, with matter containing even more energy which can be released via nuclear reactions. The world will not come to an end, if oil gets too expensive alternatives will replace it.

What is it with oilpeakists and global warmists preaching the end of the world and armaggeddon, jeez its starting to resemble a cult. @oppenheimer if you believe that this will be the case then put your life savings into oil price rising bet and see how you get on.

Dannyboy83

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

Petrol was €1.55 per litre at the Texaco on the South Douglas Road in Cork City yesterday and €1.54 at the Topaz in Cork Airport.
It'll probably be €1.60 before the end of April at this rate.

The Cork Airport Topaz always had looney prices, Texaco on South Douglas road used to be remotely competitive. I filled up for €1.499 at Maxol on Pouladuff Road last night, traditionally a station with looney high prices but of late priced below average.

Raskolnikov

RichardAnd wrote: »

If it were my call, I'd keep fuel costs as low as possible to keep money in peoples' pockets. Of course, if it were my call, we wouldn't be spending money we didn't have either...

A bit tricky considering that we'll be soon spending 25% of the tax take just satisfying the interest on our national debt.

If anything, we need to find ways of adding further levies to fuel to pay the IMF and Europe.

Dannyboy83

Raskolnikov wrote: »

A bit tricky considering that we'll be soon spending 25% of the tax take just satisfying the interest on our national debt.

If anything, we need to find ways of adding further levies to fuel to pay the IMF and Europe.

They're doing that anyway, see the end of my OP:

Side note; but I see they're planning to toll the N20 and the Jack Lynch Tunnel in Cork: http://www.independent.ie/national-n...e-2622183.html

Dannyboy83

RoverJames wrote: »

The Cork Airport Topaz always had looney prices, Texaco on South Douglas road used to be remotely competitive.

I don't disagree, but they still keep in line with the trend, just they get there before everyone else I guess, lol.
I'm not commenting on these specific stations, but on the overall trend of relentless (and rapid) fuel price increases.

I was speaking with a friend in Athens yday, who told me petrol in Athens is 1.69 Euros/lt, and up to 1.90/lt in other areas of Greece!!
And their avg industrial wage is about 1/3 of ours!

Can you imagine what it's going to be like in Ireland when that happens here?
FUUUUUUUUUUUUU

OMD

erictheviking1 wrote: »

Agree with this. Since the last budget the only driving I do is to work and back:(.
Petrol/Diesel is too expensive .end of. The so called "carbon tax" is the biggest f***ing rip off in history. I wouldn't mind if we had decent public transport:mad:
The government should kop the f***on! Motoring is a necessity in most parts of the country, not a luxury!
Oh, and BTW, the Greens can f*** off too!:D

Motoring may be a necessity in some parts of the country but every journey isn't. You yourself have cut all journeys except going to work so while the car may be a necessity getting to work it wasn't a necessity for any other journey you made.

Raskolnikov

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

I don't disagree, but they still keep in line with the trend, just they get there before everyone else I guess, lol.
I'm not commenting on these specific stations, but on the overall trend of relentless (and rapid) fuel price increases.

I was speaking with a friend in Athens yday, who told me petrol in Athens is 1.69 Euros/lt, and up to 1.90/lt in other areas of Greece!!
And their avg industrial wage is about 1/3 of ours!

Can you imagine what it's going to be like in Ireland when that happens here?
FUUUUUUUUUUUUU

Only a matter of time before we see those prices here. People have to drive and it costs nothing for the government to collect the fuel duty.

Raskolnikov

As for a realistic solution for fuel prices - maybe we should consider adopting LPG in our cars? I know in the UK - LPG is nearly half the price of diesel because the tax on it is much less. Obviously, if it gained mass adoption - the government would tax it too.

robd

ei.sdraob wrote: »

The loaf of bread in your shop did not grow on the shelf
The ingridients to make the bread did not magically appear at the bakery
The wheat did not harvest itself
The soil used to grow the wheat did not fertilise itself
and so on

Just because you might have cycled to the shop to get the bread does not mean motoring is not essential to a modern economy

Tractors and other farm machinery use green diesel at a much lower rate of tax. So it's just the transport costs as Ireland cannot control the wholesale cost of a barrel of oil. Wonder what it will do to supply chains, which pretty much swept away the concept of "buy local" over the last decade.

robd

ei.sdraob wrote: »

"They dont make any more land, you know" was also used during the bubble as an excuse :rolleyes: mind you they do print plenty of dollars out of thin air which makes some commodities appear to go up in price as dollar is devalued

We live in a universe and planet surrounded by huge amounts of energy, with matter containing even more energy which can be released via nuclear reactions. The world will not come to an end, if oil gets too expensive alternatives will replace it.

What is it with oilpeakists and global warmists preaching the end of the world and armaggeddon, jeez its starting to resemble a cult. @oppenheimer if you believe that this will be the case then put your life savings into oil price rising bet and see how you get on.

The peak oil argument is about an end to cheap fuel/energy, not an end to energy itself. Nuclear is a great energy source, but only makes economic sense when oil is expensive The rate of economic expansion over the last 40 years has largely been due to cheap oil. Adjusting to this change (expensive energy) is a massive thing, hence why the US and Europe have resorted to the printing presses.

Ultimately the printing presses will fail, and then what? Realistically we are going to have to get used to expensive energy, as a proportion of our earnings. Driving the kids to school, living in the midlands and driving to work in Dublin may become distant memories. Investment in public transport and building higher density, more sustainable dwellings and offices, close to transport links may become the norm, god forbid.

So it's nothing to do with availability of replacements or not, it's about the economics of expensive energy.

ei.sdraob

robd wrote: »

The peak oil argument is about an end to cheap fuel/energy, not an end to energy itself. Nuclear is a great energy source, but only makes economic sense when oil is expensive The rate of economic expansion over the last 40 years has largely been due to cheap oil. Adjusting to this change (expensive energy) is a massive thing, hence why the US and Europe have resorted to the printing presses.

Ultimately the printing presses will fail, and then what? Realistically we are going to have to get used to expensive energy, as a proportion of our earnings. Driving the kids to school, living in the midlands and driving to work in Dublin may become distant memories. Investment in public transport and building higher density, more sustainable dwellings and offices, close to transport links may become the norm, god forbid.

So it's nothing to do with availability of replacements or not, it's about the economics of expensive energy.

There is plenty of cheap energy out there, nuclear fission alone with uranium, plutonium and thorium using breeding and reprocessing could power the world for thousands of years. Thats enough time for commercial fusion to come along surely :P. So far the decision to continue to burn fossil fuel and not use more nuclear has been purely politicial driven by electorates who think nuclear technologies are the work of devil while putting a blind eye on damage being caused by coal burning.

RichardAnd

Raskolnikov wrote: »

As for a realistic solution for fuel prices - maybe we should consider adopting LPG in our cars? I know in the UK - LPG is nearly half the price of diesel because the tax on it is much less. Obviously, if it gained mass adoption - the government would tax it too.

It's possible to run diesel engines on filtered deep fryer oil but again, even if this were viable (and it's not for many reasons) it would just be taxed like anything else.

Even if we had cars that ran on water, and that's not something from science fiction, we'd be taxed.