Astronomical Wages

d.pop

This was in 'West Australian' Monday and a similar article in yesterdays edition about the government stepping in to cap wages, thought it was interesting and a bit daft at the same time but there is def some truth in it. Was at a training course yesterday and 2 of the other 4 guys at my table had been flown in to Perth earlier that morning from Europe by their respective bosses to fill positions within their companies that couldn't be filled here.
Reminds me of Dubai 10 years ago....hope it doesn't end the same way!
Resource chiefs are warning of an astronomical wages blowout in the booming liquefied natural gas sector with some skilled fly-in fly-out workers asking for well over $400,000 a year for six months work.
It is understood the Australian Manufacturing Workers Union is demanding $425,000 for welders on one WA offshore project for 28 weeks work. The same workers were paid $300,000 for 30 weeks' work on other projects two years ago.
Unions claim the high wages compensate workers for tough conditions but companies say they are near breaking point.
The unprecedented tightening of the construction labour market from massive demands in the LNG sector in WA and Queensland has left firms in bidding wars for workers.
The companies say some projects may be delayed or postponed unless the wages explosion is countered.
Woodside Petroleum chief executive Don Voelte said fly-in fly-out workers deserved "top-line" pay for enduring heat and humidity in remote areas and working 12-hour shifts for extended periods away from their families and homes.
"But there's a point between top-line, fantastic wages and over-the-top, just outrageous wages," he said.
Mr Voelte said a 36 per cent increase in maritime wages from the start of Woodside's Pluto project in August 2007 suggested the system was broken. He said baseline wages struck by Woodside for the project, of between $130,000 and $190,000 for lesser-skilled onshore workers, served as an example of fair wages.
Woodside, like other companies, had struggled to find specialised welders and had looked to the US for welders.
"I think the (Federal) ministers and the Opposition are on to it in saying this can't continue," Mr Voelte said.
Resources Minister Martin Ferguson said recent wage increases, particularly in the offshore construction industry, were unsustainable.
AMWU WA secretary Steve McCartney confirmed his union was negotiating offshore project agreements with several companies.
For Raymond Loly, 19, a second-year apprentice with the Apprentice and Traineeship Company, becoming a qualified welder will open up opportunities to work overseas and within WA's resources sector.
"Because there's a skill shortage, there are more work opportunities for me," he said.
Mr Loly said the thought of a six-figure salary was another attractive aspect.
Before you ask, no i'm not a welder....unfortunately!
Just thought it was interesting, if you have the skills and the necessary clearances to work off-shore while floating on a piece of steel in the Indian ocean, welding pipes together then WA seems to be the place to be.

ellaq

I used to work for Woodside and they always paid above average wages, the golden handcuff we used to call it. Unfortunately, they don't like women who get pregnant. But that is another story. I am not sure about those wages, I saw another article in the paper where a welder claimed he was getting $425000 for 4 weeks on 4 weeks off. My husband's friend, who has worked in the mining industry for years, tried to get a job in oil and gas but was laughed out of it. I guess those jobs are for the very lucky few. When I worked for Woodside a lot of the guys doing the offshore rigs were british, guessing they have the experience from the UK.

jank

Those jobs are rare...very rare. I would imagine one would be need to be an experienced welder with 15+ years experience with rigs and mining. How many Irish people have those skills? Probably as many as the fingers I have on my hands. Men from the US,Canada and so on would be also in line for these positions.

Just want to note this as this is definitely not the norm in OZ. I read the financial review most days and there is always articles on wage pressures in the resource industry and the govt are looking into ways to relieve this with more short term visa's. Good money to be made of course but you must a) have the skills b) be in the right place in the right time c) be lucky

mandrake04

I agree with Jank ....so rare that it's practically mythical.

d.pop

I Have no doubt there is a liberal sprinkling of literay licence in the newspaper...
Was chatting about this to mate over a bottle of crown an hour ago, he's a welder, was on FIFO on an offshore rig in 2007, earned $200k in 9 months but said it was horrific stuff, plus 48c tax on dollar.
He had an interesting view on it though, bit of a conspiracy theory, he has his own company now and reckons "Big Business" are feeding this frenzy in an effort to get the state government to release more 457 visa's as no workers available etc...this means then the company can outsource the work to non resident workers on much reduced terms. Might be a grain of truth who knows?
I do worry about the kind of frenzy this causes back home, by the time the news reaches home, it ends up something like...."Wanted, 30,000 persons for immediate positions in Australia, skilled tradesmen, salaries in region of $425,000 etc". thats all you need when you're struggling to pay bills at home is a huge imaginary carrot dangling in front of you.

ellaq

Totally agree about them trying to get those visas released. So many people I know would love to get a job in the mines but they won't employ local tradies, they just want the ready made experienced guys from overseas. The cost of training, I think, would be outwayed by the cost of bringing people from overseas. Really wish they would give local people a chance.
My friend's husband does oil and gas, and while I am a little envious of the $500k (he is management consultancy overseas) I am not jealous of the 4 weeks on 4 weeks off. But my husband does 2 weeks on 1 week off, how bad can it be??

mandrake04

d.pop wrote: »

Was chatting about this to mate over a bottle of crown an hour ago, he's a welder, was on FIFO on an offshore rig in 2007, earned $200k in 9 months but said it was horrific stuff, plus 48c tax on dollar.
He had an interesting view on it though, bit of a conspiracy theory, he has his own company now and reckons "Big Business" are feeding this frenzy in an effort to get the state government to release more 457 visa's as no workers available etc...this means then the company can outsource the work to non resident workers on much reduced terms. Might be a grain of truth who knows?

Doubt there is any truth in that, there is no cap on 457 visa's. Industry can have as many 457 visa as it wants and I don't see any point to 'Big Business' feeding a frenzy to get the government to release more 457 visas when the number is currently infinite.

Unlike permanent skilled visas which is capped at 113,850 for the 2010/2011 fiscal year

d.pop wrote: »

I do worry about the kind of frenzy this causes back home, by the time the news reaches home, it ends up something like...."Wanted, 30,000 persons for immediate positions in Australia, skilled tradesmen, salaries in region of $425,000 etc". thats all you need when you're struggling to pay bills at home is a huge imaginary carrot dangling in front of you.

Why do you have to be skilled to get such money? why not be unskilled and get the same money washing laundry?

http://www.news.com.au/business/laundry-staff-can-earn-more-than-420k-a-year-on-offshore-construction-projects/story-e6frfm1i-1226027838552#ixzz1HYqq6IHL

It all makes good reading (or sales) in newspapers or news websites.

or

maybe the mining industry is hoping that the sector will over saturate with money-hungry workers and eventually drive wages down.

ellaq

Have to pass that escaping from the helicopter in the water test to work offshore. No way would I be able to do that, not even for that crazy money.

uglyjohn

is it just me or is the general consensus on boards now that anyone can just come to WA and straight away get a job in the mines making stupid money and everything will be fantastic?
because in reality its not that simple.
Sure wages can be very high but to get those wages you need the qualifications and experience and even still the vast majority of people here make nowhere near 450,000 washing dishes. like mandrake says " it makes good reading in newpapers " its also worth noting that the hourly rate is generally not that high. 30 or 40 something per hour. The real reason people make big money is the hours. 84 hours per week and it adds up.

in summary: the work is hard, the hours are long, the pay isnt as good as everyone thinks, the locations are remote, conditions harsh and you need the qualifications, Visa & experience to get a job.

d.pop

uglyjohn wrote: »

is it just me or is the general consensus on boards now that anyone can just come to WA and straight away get a job in the mines making stupid money and everything will be fantastic?
because in reality its not that simple.
Sure wages can be very high but to get those wages you need the qualifications and experience and even still the vast majority of people here make nowhere near 450,000 washing dishes. like mandrake says " it makes good reading in newpapers " its also worth noting that the hourly rate is generally not that high. 30 or 40 something per hour. The real reason people make big money is the hours. 84 hours per week and it adds up.

in summary: the work is hard, the hours are long, the pay isnt as good as everyone thinks, the locations are remote, conditions harsh and you need the qualifications, Visa & experience to get a job.

I agree 100% with you, i think articles like this in newspapers are feeding this incorrect belief that WA is the answer to all problems. Over the last 12 months i've noticed a big swing on boards away from "intelligent" visa/life in Oz questions to daft queries like "i want a job in the mines earning $250,000p.a., when can i start? oh yeah i have no experience or visa is that a problem? what's a mine"
I suppose it is born out of desperation, nothing to lose at home and believing everything heard down the pub about 1000's of jobs going unfilled over here.
Would love to be able to reach into computer and shake some posters and shout "come on!.. are you serious...?"
Still, takes all sorts i suppose, thats what keeps life interesting...

mandrake04

was talking to a young guy that used to work for me in Sydney who decided to move out west 8 months ago looking for a change of scenery and get something big paying in the mines or rigs, he just got himself a job fixing geophysical electronics systems on planes & helicopters said he is getting $100K+ and he says they can help him get his pilots licence done cheap as well. (although he has to pay that himself)

Wasn't really the big pay day he was expecting but I think he is happy enough doing this for a few years anyway.

augustus gloop

a couple of years back, i was working in fitzroy crossing, the hottest inhabited place on earth(fact), carpenters were collecting 1200$ a day, pretty crazy, it made drinking 12 litres of water a day a little more bareable:D

Mellor

augustus gloop wrote: »

i was working in fitzroy crossing, the hottest inhabited place on earth(fact),

No it isn't.
It's prob damn hot, but not the hottest inhabited place on earth.

augustus gloop

Mellor wrote: »

No it isn't.
It's prob damn hot, but not the hottest inhabited place on earth.

It may not experience the hottest temperatures on Earth (that record goes to Al 'Aziziyah), but Fitzroy Crossing, Australia has consistently high temperatures throughout the year making it one of the hottest inhabited places on Earth. The annual average maximum temperature is 35.6°C (96.1°F). The hottest month is November with an average maximum temperature of 39.4°C (102.9°F), and the 'coolest months' of June and July have an average maximum of 31.2°C (86.4°F). In 1946, Fitzroy recorded 333 consecutive days of temperatures over 32°C (90°F)!

hussey

Mod Back on track lads, nothing to do with wages

Mellor

got an email about a job, hourly rate up to $85 per hour.
I can't see that being accurate

mandrake04

was listening to talkback radio during the week and Ross Greenwood of 2GB was interviewing Joe Powell MD of seek.com.au about mining jobs wages, anyway Joe said that the average wage in the mining sector is $129,000. Thought I would Google and it's on the seek website.

"Of the 8,700 mining industry jobs currently advertised on SEEK, half are in Western Australia which shows why that state has driven growth in the jobs market this year. The mining industry is a key driver of the Australian economy and with an average job ad salary on SEEK of $129,000, workers in that industry are the highest paid on average in the country. They are closely followed by workers in engineering and construction whose average salaries also sit above the $100,000 mark."

mandrake04

Mellor wrote: »

got an email about a job, hourly rate up to $85 per hour.
I can't see that being accurate

My flat rate for after 6pm is $105 ph and for after midnight $120 ph.


also I know one of the other posters on this forum who told me he was getting $85 ph casual contracting for IT

Mellor

That's call out stuff right?
Which is what i would expect.

My post was referign toa 3-6 month position, 40 hours a week.
I don't believe $85/hr is what they'll actually pay somebody who is basically a temp

hussey

Mellor wrote: »

That's call out stuff right?
Which is what i would expect.

My post was referign toa 3-6 month position, 40 hours a week.
I don't believe $85/hr is what they'll actually pay somebody who is basically a temp

I can't speak for trade work, but IT contractor would be someone who comes in for specific work for a short term, some of them charge a huge amount mainly as they are so specialised.

Our company takes on a fair few contractors and it will all depend on what's happening, e.g. we could have a big project coming up with 6 months worth of work, and then after that quiet for 3months, so we'd hire people for 5-6 months, then when it's quiet we get rid of them - they get paid a big amount - 80-120p/h.

Also it's so hard to know of people are good, I remember one guy and his CV was amazing, been working for 10years he was charging $110p/h and he was absolutely rubbish, he struggled with the basics, if would have taken him on full time, we could be stuck with him for years and would have been an even more costly mistake

mandrake04

Mellor wrote: »

That's call out stuff right?
Which is what i would expect.

My post was referign toa 3-6 month position, 40 hours a week.
I don't believe $85/hr is what they'll actually pay somebody who is basically a temp

Well its an hourly rate after 6pm and weekends plus an extra $15 per hour between midnight and 6am, wether its a late call out or just working late and I might have maybe a few hours drive home in my own time.

Once it goes past 6 its just over double time per hour plus super because thats what the industry pays, why do you think I spend so myuch time on here... I'm standing around bored sh*tless waiting for these Instruments and machines to initalise and pass Quality Controls.

Like I said there is a poster on here who I met up with at the pub and he told me he was getting $85 ph casual rate for IT, I wouldnt want to name him with out permission but I am sure he would confirm it.

Mellor

Not a bad hourly rate there guys
Getting salary instead of an hourly rate has it benefits but lack of over-time is annoying