Do you have to dress against your will in your workplace?

Freiheit

Was watching the BBC a few nights ago where six young people were looking for work. An aspiring dental nursue had bright red hair and piercings and she was told to shed that look to improve her prospects. I remember in my mid 20's being told to grow up in terms of my dress cpde and really it was other people's prejudice that deemed me 'not grown up' . I was perfectly grown up and felt like I was selling my soul.

I've also encountered many ridiculous workplace rules on appearance. Really I feel as a result of old fashioned, prejudicial and backward views. So I'm glad to see Luke Ming Flanagan and that Wexford lad refusing to wear suits in the Dail and dress as they want, Ming said it's bullying.

Look I'm not saying that their doesn't need to be some regulation in some roles, especially in relation to hygiene, but am I the only one who finds a lot this antiquated and that people shouldn't really have to conform to these attitudes today?

Things are changing and as I'm self employed it isn't an issue for me now.

But do others here conform against their will in terms of appearance? any amusing stories on workplace dress code regulation?.

How do others feel on the topic?.

Alles gutes
F

PrivateEye

Walking tours now, I wear what I want providing it's smart and unoffensive. Used to work in a pub, nothing worse than that.

Black shirt, black trousers, black shoes. We looked like a terrible band.

dudara

I actually like to dress for the job - wearing a suit and/or smart clothing feels nice. There really aren't many people that a suit doesn't make look better. The trick is to find a way of expressing your own personality while still dressing smartly. I love bright colours and I own pink & red suits.

I don't know about wearing a suit to the Dáil, but I do think that the T.D.s should dress neatly and smartly. They are our public representatives after all. That doesn't rule out jeans and pink shirts, it just means that they should be tidy.

Too many people equate a suit with dull & boring. It's not the case at all. And to be honest, if I am dealing with someone in a work context who isn't neatly dressed, I will wonder if they care at all. Just like if I saw someone dropping litter or dropping cigarette ends on the ground, then coming into work. Everything you do expresses your personality & mentality.

gigawatt

I agree with you op. I cant understand how prejudiced people can be on the basis of appearances, I do find it to be very outdated.tho that said i never minded having a uniform as it took the hassel out of having to find something suitable to wear to work! although I think that scruffiness is a different thing altogether and there is a difference between someone who who is clean and well groomed while wearing their own personal style of clothing and someone who looks like they just fell out of bed.

the_syco

PrivateEye wrote: »

Black shirt, black trousers, black shoes. We looked like a terrible band.

Could have been worse. When I worked in a pub, it was black shoes, black slacks, and a friggin bright yellow t-shirt...

=-=

IMO, unless your area of work allows it, you must look like a sheep to get a job, and not turn into a parrot unitl after you pass your 6 months probationary...

baby and crumble

I kinda flip-flop on this topic. Part of me says "yeah, stick it the MAN! Wear whatever you want!!!" the other part of me says- "well, sometimes that's not appropriate".

In the case of those TD's you mention. I'll be honest and say I think they look embarrassing. I really do. They look unprofessional. That's not to say they are- far from it. But there are some roles in which, if you want to be taken seriously, you need to dress the part.

Unfortunately, most people don't see the difference in dressing to your individual taste, and dressing sloppily. I'd much rather some one who looks like they take themselves seriously to be running the country. I'm not saying that means a suit, I'm saying that baggy, crumpled shirts and ill fitting jeans do not put forward the image of someone I'd trust to make major decisions. Biased? yes, no doubt. But it's how I am.

there are social rules that we have to play by if we want to succeed in most spheres of life. That's just the way life is.

On a personal note, I'm lucky in that I'm on a career path which is pretty casual, however, I'm starting to change to wearing more 'grown up' clothes, in order to be taken seriously. No-one wants to trust a researcher who wears nothing but jeans and hoodies.

Freiheit

Social rules are constantly changing and they only do so because people dare to challenge them...sadly conformity is rewarded in most cases. You know it's only socially acceptable for a woman to wear a trousers the past 50/60 years.

I'm not advocating anyone look scruffy, dirty or have bad hygiene but trusting someone more simply because they wear a suit, while understandable, doesn't make sense.

baby and crumble

I'm not advocating anyone look scruffy, dirty or have bad hygiene but trusting someone more simply because they wear a suit, while understandable, doesn't make sense.

Actually, I agreed with you in my post. but certainly in Ireland, and in particular men seem to be the worst (or perhaps the most obvious, I don't know) offenders on the inability to look neat & tidy unless it's 'dressing up', and even then most people don't do that. it's like there's some major aversion to being neat.

it doesn't scream "hey, look at me, I'm super casual and devil-may-care, but I can still do my job" it just looks... juvenile and sloppy. Would you want someone sloppy working for you, especially if you are employing them on a one-off basis, that looked to you like hey didn't give a crap? Someone I am employing to be my accountant, for example, turning up in baggy jeans and a crumpled shirt is a no-no, while if they turned up looking like this I wouldn't have a problem.



he's wearing jeans and shirt, not suit, and definitely no tie.

It's about looking like you respect who you're working for, I suppose. You don't have to do that in a suit, or a dress, or whatever. It's just that that's probably the easiest thing for most people.

Azureus

I really want to be someone who advocated dressing how you like in work because it really irritated me when I had to take out barely visible piercings for my job. But in the case of the TDs mentioned, I really think more of an effort could be made. They are representing Ireland and its politics, and scruffy unkempt appearance just isnt good enough. Yes, wear jeans, wear a rainbow shirt if you want, but for gods sake look presentable!!! Brush your hair, look tidy, it doesnt take away from your personal style as such but it really makes so much of a difference in how seriously people take you.

boomkatalog

The material that your pants are made out of, be it Levi's denim or an Armani cashmere suit pants, has no bearing on the type of worker that you are and it's a shame that people don't take you seriously when you get the dress code wrong. It's not right that other members of the Dáil laughed at him though, his opinions are no less valid than anyone elses because he's a little quirky.

I do wonder though if some people purposefully dress as they like for the anarchy of it, more to cause trouble than to make a point?

Either way, when it's so difficult to get a job these days, none of us can afford to make a point of it and show up in something that screams "wacky individual".

Malari

I agree with much of what Zoegh has already said. It's not so much about what you wear but about how you wear it. You can make a bad impression in crumpled, mismatching suit with tide marks on your collar, or you can look smart in well-cut jeans, a nice shirt and jacket.

I wear jeans and a casual top in work most days. I don't have to face the public a whole lot. Yesterday I got soaked on the way in so I sat in my spare tracky legs and ancient fleece at the desk while my clothes dried . No-one cared. If I'm going to meet a customer, or deal with supplier I will wear nice pants/skirt/dress, make sure my hair and make-up is tidy.

I'm doing the same work, but it's really not about that. It's about what the customer will think when they see me. Interestingly, many of the people I visit just wear casuals, so I think there's a lot of "the customer is always right" in this.

Similarly working in a coffee shop or restaurant you have to expect to remove prominant or unusual piercings and maybe keep tattoos covered. It's not generally about the stuffy, conservative boss, but about how his customers might view you.

Personally, I don't care what my barista looks like as long as he can make a decent coffee, but I know my dad, who's in his 60s, would be disgusted if he was served by someone clearly covered in tattoos and piercings in a cafe. So maybe things are changing.

espinolman

I am not allowed to wear a skirt to work and have to wear trousers .:rolleyes:
Horrible itchy uncomforable trousers , i hate them .

Freiheit

are you a man or a woman espinolman:)?

espinolman

Freiheit wrote: »

are you a man or a woman espinolman:)?

Male , but why would you be asking !

alexa5x5

Where I work is uber casual (but very conservative if that makes sense), if I wear anything other than jeans/casual tops I get weird looks. I actually prefer to dress a bit more smartly, I’d like to wear more dresses/skirts but Id stick out like a sore thumb. Nothing would be said to me if I turned up tomorrow with piercing and covered in tattoos, but I would be made feel uncomfortable.

Pythia

espinolman wrote: »

Male , but why would you be asking !

I think it's obvious why they are asking.

I would like to dress a little more casually in work but I think I have it pretty good. I certainly don't feel the real me is being oppressed or anything. I always make sure my hair and make up are very well done, even if the rest of the outfit is effectively a black skirt and black cardi.

the_syco

In the current job, and the job before this, I'd wear jeans, and flavor of day t-shirt. In other words, anything but a football t-shirt, or a t-shirt saying "jesus is a c**t". I work purely on the phones, with no interaction with the public.

In any job that I had interaction with the public, I'd ensure that my (work) uniform which I'd be wearing was clean, and I'd have my face shaved, or at least the parts I wasn't growing a beard with.

It depends on the company. One phones job that I did in the past, I would always wear a short sleeved tartan shirt, and jeans, as the dress code was strictly business casual. Wore the same clothes when doing a data input job. Both jobs were in the financial sector.

=-=

On a side note, does anyone know where I would be able to get plain short sleeved shirts, in either black, blue, or green? Cheapish if possible.

espinolman

Pythia wrote: »

I think it's obvious why they are asking.

I would be wondering are they trying to insinuate that i wear womens clothes and if they were i would be very pissed off and would want to meet them both personnaly about it . :mad:

Northern Monkey

espinolman wrote: »

I am not allowed to wear a skirt to work and have to wear trousers .:rolleyes:
Horrible itchy uncomforable trousers , i hate them .

espinolman wrote: »

I would be wondering are they trying to insinuate that i wear womens clothes and if they were i would be very pissed off and would want to meet them both personnaly about it . :mad:

Why would they think such a thing?

Toto Wolfcastle

When I asked about the dress code when I got my current job I was told that anything is fine apart from belly tops. There have been members of staff with pink hair. Some women wear nice trousers and blouses and others wear jeans and a hoody. Some men wear trousers and a tie and others wear jeans and a jumper. I go between skinny jeans and dresses. The members of staff who wear hoodies are good at what they do and them wearing hoodies makes no difference to that. There are plenty of other workplaces like mine where they don't have such a relaxed attitude to clothing though.

However, in an office/business environment where you are going to be meeting with customers it's important that you look smart. That doesn't mean you have to wear a suit. It's possible to look smart and well put together in something other than a suit.

espinolman

Northern Monkey wrote: »

Why would they think such a thing?

I can't believe i was asked was i male or female , why would freheit ask !
Some people are just stuck back in the twentieth century .
They never moved on into the twenty first century .

Tayla

Luckily I work from home and so can wear whatever I want, I like to wear things like this though http://www.axparis.co.uk/Shop/View/All_Products/Dresses/Lace_Detail_Contrast_Dress_2060 and http://www.axparis.co.uk/Shop/View/All_Products/Dresses/Cross_Front_Frill_Trim_Dress_2069

which if I worked somewhere else I could never wear as they are soooo short on me but the OH loves them when he gets home

I wear them with slippers during the day and stick on the heels for when he's home :rolleyes:

Freiheit

I 'cross dress' all the time, I don't view it as crossdressing though, clothes are just clothes, whoever like's them wears them:)

the_syco

espinolman wrote: »

I can't believe i was asked was i male or female , why would freheit ask !

You could be a muslim man who is accustomed to wearing a Bisht. Every male in the world doesn't wear trousers...

Chuchoter

I think as long as everyone turns up looking smart and professional it shouldn't be a problem, whatever you want to wear beyond that, this turning up to the dail in crumply pink shirts and jeans is ridiculous.

One thing I find weird though is how inappropriate some women's idea of smart clothes is though, like the level of teachers I've come across with plunging necklines and super tight pencil skirts is hilarious.

espinolman

Freiheit wrote: »

I 'cross dress' all the time, I don't view it as crossdressing though, clothes are just clothes, whoever like's them wears them:)

I have heard of men who wear womens jeans , ok , thats cross dressing , there also are men who wear a skirt tailored for a man , thats not cross dressing , its just not , because the skirt is made specifically for a man .

Mens skirts are really very comfortable and also can look great , for men not to be allowed to wear skirts to work is an in-equality between men and women , if women are allowed to wear their skirts .

RxQueen

Dont see the public face to face so I have piercings and stuff, doesnt matter where i am.

But when I was in a public facing job I had to hid them. I have also lost out on one job because of cetain modifications I have (tattoos) and was told this... but shur hey its only a job at the end of the day.

squeakyduck

I like dressing for a job. I would like a job where I would have to wear smarter work clothes but hey I can't win them all..

At the moment I wear a polo shirt with black slacks and shoes to work. Our uniform top (polo shirt) changes a few times a year to different colours. I used to wear a black blouse and slacks. I liked the all black professional look, I much prefer it to the polo shirts that is for sure!

I used to work in a bar and also some jobs with food, again all in black. I also used to work in a bookies, I had a lovely blouse with a neckerchief with black slacks. It was a nice uniform, one of my favorites in fact!

I would feel self conscious if I was under dressed in a professional environment.

Seraphina

Funny this has come up, as just today in work we received the new uniform blouses that it's been decided we would wear. They were HIDEOUS!

Thankfully the bosses saw sense and we're sending them back for something else, but I find the idea that we need a uniform very unpleasant. I've been at the job 6 months now and gotten used to wearing what I like (obviously within reason)

I am always smart and tidy, appropriately covered etc. Once I was asked not to wear shorts (they were nicely tailored tweedy style, but I said fair enough, no problem and haven't worn them since). I work in a doctors surgery behind a desk so it's not like I need a uniform for people to know who I am. I find it frustrating because to me, uniforms are very dehumanising. Only the lowest types of jobs generally require a uniform (think fast food, etc), and I work with a girl in her late thirties, early fifties, and mid sixties (I'm 26) so getting a shape / style / colour that we all like and is flattering for everyone is bloody impossible.

I have a sneaky suspicion that they find my style a bit too 'colourful' or something, which is why they have decided to bring in the uniform blouse. I'm really annoyed at that because I would have had no problem conforming to any reasonable requests they had regarding my attire (i.e. treating me like an adult) but instead, we are being put in uniforms like a bunch of school children.

Freiheit

I used to hate the red t-shirts in Tk Maxx even though I love red in general, that particular style made me feel like a child....lot's of men were in trouble over facial hair growth there.

Any chance of a photo Seraphina?.

Seraphina

something like this. it was so unbelievably unflattering on. i got a size ten, which i put on over the dress i was wearing. it was very large, ill fitting and general unpleasant. the colour looks all right in the photos but in reality seemed surprisingly dull. i breathed a sigh of relief when everyone agreed we should change them!

Corruptedmorals

Ah I wouldn't agree that jobs requiring uniforms are the lowest types of jobs..what about hospital staff? Childcare/creche workers? Dental staff? I'm sure there are others.

Personally, the only job I've had so far had a uniform and it was retail. SOOO handy just throwing it on, was so easy to wash and didn't have to be ironed. Of course the downside was...it was the dreaded Dunnes girls shirt, which really is particularly unflattering. I never copped how bad it was until seeing it on people in different shopping centres...wearing it was grand!

Seraphina

Corruptedmorals wrote: »

Ah I wouldn't agree that jobs requiring uniforms are the lowest types of jobs..what about hospital staff? Childcare/creche workers? Dental staff? I'm sure there are others.

I wouldn't see what those in the healthcare profession wear as uniforms, rather as practical, work specific clothes for hygiene reasons or whatever. obviously a certain aspect is the uniformity, but i would more view it as a builder wears boots or a hard hat for safety, you know?

Doug89

I currently LIVE in that dreaded Dunnes girls shirt, it really is awful! Something about how it hangs alongside the pattern. And, oh god, the gillet.

I'm so jealous of the boys, those sweatshirts look mad warm and comfy.

Coming from Schuh I think that Dunnes are so bloody conservative, but I guess it is food afterall Girls also get away with a lot more - piercings etc, so I guess that's a bit of a win for me!

Corruptedmorals wrote: »

Personally, the only job I've had so far had a uniform and it was retail. SOOO handy just throwing it on, was so easy to wash and didn't have to be ironed. Of course the downside was...it was the dreaded Dunnes girls shirt, which really is particularly unflattering. I never copped how bad it was until seeing it on people in different shopping centres...wearing it was grand!

snickerpuss

I work part-time in a healthcare setting (residential not hospital) and so the unofficial uniform is jeans/trackies and a t-shirt. Basically, nothing you mind getting wreaked!

Even though most people would be happy with casual jeans and tees I'm not because I would normally wear dresses everyday. Hate wearing trousers of any description. As soon as I can I change back into a dress. Lovely.

boomkatalog

Seraphina wrote: »

http://www.simonjersey.com/PagesPublic/ProductBrowse/product.aspx?group1=Beauty&group2=Shirts%20blouses%20and%20t&group3=Multibuy&group4=P

something like this. it was so unbelievably unflattering on. i got a size ten, which i put on over the dress i was wearing. it was very large, ill fitting and general unpleasant. the colour looks all right in the photos but in reality seemed surprisingly dull. i breathed a sigh of relief when everyone agreed we should change them!

Seraphina your link is giving my computer a warning :eek:

CK2010

im required to wear clothes from the store but i can choose which ones, within reason.
but i also have bright pink/red hair and multiple ear piercings, including small tunnels. store manager told me its grand as long as im neatly dressed. since i started two people have also dyed their hair a really bright colour.
but thats in retail, which allows for some 'fashion/trends', if i were to go for a job within my 'career' id tone down the hair!

chocgirl

I have to wear a uniform for work at the minute which I love. I mean I hate the uniform but it's just so flattering and handy. I do believe people should make an effort to look the part at work though, dress to impress and all that. I'm in healthcare though so have additional worries like infection control which makes uniform essential at times.

Corruptedmorals

CK2010 wrote: »

but thats in retail, which allows for some 'fashion/trends', if i were to go for a job within my 'career' id tone down the hair!

Ahh not all retail! You should check out a certain large Irish retailers handbook. Piercings allowed are one in each ear, hair must be tied back (only observed in grocery though and even then not so much), and of conservative style and colour (observed RELIGIOUSLY- people who refused to dye their hair back would be sent to the stockroom in case someone from head office came in). Guys who were not clean shaven were sent home, or told to buy shaving gear and get to it in the toilets- often. Girls are supposed to wear black tops only under the shirt- I frequently got into trouble for that one. Shoes must be black, neither open-toed or heeled. No runners or casual footwear allowed. Depends on the type of retailer I suppose.

CK2010

oh i know that alot of retail jobs dont allow for it but i mean that within retail you'll find alot more employers allowing for trends/fashion than say a solicitors office or something like that.

Aoifums

I'd hate a uniform for work. I'm only just out of a school uniform and I would hate to think of being forced back into one.

My brother works in a call center and they are so strict. It has to be shirt, pants and a tie and my brother has been called up for not wearing a suit before :rolleyes: He has never seen a single customer, so I have no idea why he is meant to be wearing a suit.

I did work experience in a creche. Their uniform made a lot of sense. Black shows up less stains and there was nothing that could fall off and the kids could choke on.

Acoshla

I hate having work uniforms, I like suggested clothing (all black for example, so handy) but at the same time clothing retail where you have to buy the clothes from the shop and wear ONLY them is ridiculous, a uniform would be better than all your wages going back to the stupid shop.

I did have one good uniform though, I was a Vet's Assistant so it was scrubs and a work hoody, so great to just throw it on in the morning and fire them in the work washing machine in the evening, only thing was though I have really long legs and all but two of the scrub pants were too short for me, so if by some hideous chance they both wound up in the wash in one day (the joys of working with animal bodily fluids!) I would have a short pair the next day, sigh.

I haven't had a uniform now in 3 years, thank God the last place I worked didn't have a uniform, wearing nice clothes was the only decent part of the job, at least I got to look nice while I was miserable. I work for myself now and am generally a messy worker so don't wear nice things, unless dealing with the public

rainbow kirby

Aoifums wrote: »

My brother works in a call center and they are so strict. It has to be shirt, pants and a tie and my brother has been called up for not wearing a suit before :rolleyes: He has never seen a single customer, so I have no idea why he is meant to be wearing a suit.

I used to work in a call centre when I was on my year out from college and wore band t-shirts and jeans most days :eek: That's nuts about wearing a suit for that sort of work...

Freiheit

I remember shopping in Heatons and saw a staff member reprimanded for the short length of his tie!....should have been longer....amazingly he' s still there a year on...would drive me mad!:rolleyes:

dazey

I am really struggling with this at the moment ...I have just been accepted for a secondary school teaching course and will be on placement throughout the year.

None of my teachers wore suits but they were a mixed bag. Most women wore suit trousers and a fairly casual top. There was one that was quite left of field in relation to the others ...doc martins, visible tattoo etc.

I really want to communicate to these kids that I am quite close to their generation and appear that bit more approachable than a fully suited up teacher. At the same time how can you expect your students to wear a shirt and tie into school each day while you rock up in a pair of jeans??

Suprisingly this is a big worry for me. Your clothes are part of your identity.

Toto Wolfcastle

dazey wrote: »

I really want to communicate to these kids that I am quite close to their generation and appear that bit more approachable than a fully suited up teacher.

Bad idea. And it wont work anyway. They will still think that you are 40. Anyway, how you act will tell them how 'approachable' you are. A fully suited up teacher can be approachable.

Wear nice trousers or a skirt and a nice top or else a nice dress. Don't wear jeans as a student teacher until you are in the school long enough to find out whether it's okay or not. It's one year, or less than a year really, so just dress in a professional way while you are a student teacher. You'll have the rest of your career to experiment with different looks.

Freiheit

I used to hate wearing a shirt and tie, short back and sides as a student teacher...while I passed my exams, I didn't make it as a teacher.:rolleyes:

jenizzle

I had bright pink hair working in Penneys, that was the exception rather than the rule though. I now get to wear jeans and t-shirt, and the odd time I can wear the casual side of dresses and skirts. I go around fixing computers so I can't really do that in a suit and heels - it suits me down to the ground! I do think that those working in-house and not with the public should be allowed dress down though.

dazey

Bobblehead Panda wrote: »

Bad idea. And it wont work anyway. They will still think that you are 40. Anyway, how you act will tell them how 'approachable' you are. A fully suited up teacher can be approachable.

Wear nice trousers or a skirt and a nice top or else a nice dress. Don't wear jeans as a student teacher until you are in the school long enough to find out whether it's okay or not. It's one year, or less than a year really, so just dress in a professional way while you are a student teacher. You'll have the rest of your career to experiment with different looks.

I'm twenty and I am aware that you should create some form of professional distance. At the same time, if I walk in wearing a suit I think I will look like a child playing dress up.

Toto Wolfcastle

dazey wrote: »

I'm twenty and I am aware that you should create some form of professional distance. At the same time, if I walk in wearing a suit I think I will look like a child playing dress up.

Yes, and I didn't say that you should wear a sit. Nice trousers and a nice top, a nice skirt and a nice top, a dress. Easy.

Best of luck with the TP regardless of what you wear. It's a tough year but it's worth it.

espinolman

This thread got me thinking , so i am ordering a couple casual kilts from scotland for work .
Trousers are a garment of servitude , thats why they came into the mainstream at the start of the industrial revolution , the slave masters want us all to wear trousers .