Record numbers of Irish people are joining the British army.

Run_to_da_hills

"Record numbers of Irish people are joining the British armed forces, with the levels increasing by upwards of 10pc each year for the past six years.

It is now estimated that 4,000 Irish citizens are in the Royal Navy, Royal Air Force or the British army".

I would say most of this is down to the recession and cut backs in the defense forces here taking on recruits. You couldn't get a better training than being with British Army at the moment, ie being sent out to Afganistan, Iraq and now Libya.

A mate of mine joined the RAF as a pilot in the 1980's, he had to keep his mouth shut everytime he took leave to return home. Things are a lot different now to the better.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/record-numbers-of-irish-recruits-join-british-army-2597027.html

Manach

This seems to be a return to historical trends. For instance during the Peninsular war, about a third of Wellington's men were Irish.

Trooperboyo

There'll soon be more Irish in the British Military than the PDF

KeithAFC

Interesting. Can't say im surprised.

RMD

During 2008 14% of recruits in Northern Irish offices were from the Republic, I'd say with the way things are now I wouldn't be surprised if it's up around 20%. Plan on joining myself when I'm older, thankfully Ireland is now a country where I could return and not be wary of saying I'm in the BA.

mikemac

Good post Manach, yes during the Napoleonic Wars up to one third of the army was Irish. I suppose if we went through history you'd see recruitment goes up as unemployment increases.
Offtopic, the Richard Sharpe books are fiction of course but I enjoyed them greatly

I think I read (probably here) if you contact them for recruitment material it's strictly plain envelopes and no identifying marks

pablomakaveli

It's not suprising really. With the low numbers being taken on in the Defence Forces and recession and high unemployment it's inevitable.

Funnily enough when i was in Portadown to do my Barb last month, i was chatting to a guy working in the B&B who was telling me that they used to get lads up from the south almost everyday who were going doing interviews or their barb test but that there wasn't many coming up in the last few months. So maybe the numbers applying there at least are down recently for some reason.

xflyer

Maybe it's down in the North because people are joining in England. So many have emigrated recently.

cyrusdvirus

Or alternatively with the improved road network it MIGHT (not saying it is) be possible to do a bounce trip in the one day with out the need for an overnight....

gizmo555

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xa566QvOpWE

Toora loora loora loo,
They're looking for monkeys up in the zoo,
And says I if I had a face like you,
I'd join the British Army . . .

RMD

gizmo555 wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xa566QvOpWE

Toora loora loora loo,
They're looking for monkeys up in the zoo,
And says I if I had a face like you,
I'd join the British Army . . .

Well though out post, well done. If you've nothing constructive to add, whether positive or negative, why bother posting at all?

Panda General

Can't say am surprised i know of 2 or 3 that are gone to join the BAF

cyrusdvirus

Panda General wrote: »

Can't say am surprised i know of 2 or 3 that are gone to join the BAF

British Armed Forces?

Panda General

gatecrash wrote: »

British Armed Forces?

Yea British Armed Forces, am very lazy sometimes

PatsytheNazi

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

"Record numbers of Irish people are joining the British armed forces, with the levels increasing by upwards of 10pc each year for the past six years.

It is now estimated that 4,000 Irish citizens are in the Royal Navy, Royal Air Force or the British army".

I would say most of this is down to the recession and cut backs in the defense forces here taking on recruits. You couldn't get a better training than being with British Army at the moment, ie being sent out to Afganistan, Iraq and now Libya.

A mate of mine joined the RAF as a pilot in the 1980's, he had to keep his mouth shut everytime he took leave to return home. Things are a lot different now to the better.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/record-numbers-of-irish-recruits-join-british-army-2597027.html

" It is now estimated that 4,000 Irish citizens are in the Royal Navy, Royal Air Force or the British army". Well you know what they say about paper never refusing ink. Besides how many of them are 'Irish' under the granny rule and how many of those 'Irish' people are from nationalist families either side of the border ?

PatsytheNazi

Trooperboyo wrote: »

There'll soon be more Irish in the British Military than the PDF

Maybe if these people are 'Irish' under the granny rule

" Name ! " - Mulligan sir, Micheal.

" You from OIreland young man " - No, sir, grandparents were.

" Well your OIrish now, off to the Irish Guards with ya "

PatsytheNazi

Manach wrote: »

This seems to be a return to historical trends. For instance during the Peninsular war, about a third of Wellington's men were Irish.

The vast majority of them were economic conscripts. Before that under the Penal Laws Catholics, who would have been 80% or more of the population in Ireland, were banned from been in the British army or navy or owning a firearm until the 1780's.

shaneybaby

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

The vast majority of them were economic conscripts. Before that under the Penal Laws Catholics, who would have been 80% or more of the population in Ireland, were banned from been in the British army or navy or owning a firearm until the 1780's.

Conscripts? Never heard of conscription in ireland.

PatsytheNazi

shaneybaby wrote: »

Conscripts? Never heard of conscription in ireland.

D'oooh..... " The vast majority of them were economic conscripts. "

shaneybaby

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

D'oooh..... " The vast majority of them were economic conscripts. "

?? because they were poor so. Not because they were conscripts. so they joined of their own free will. as in not conscripted. doooh.

cyrusdvirus

shaneybaby wrote: »

?? because they were poor so. Not because they were conscripts. so they joined of their own free will. as in not conscripted. doooh.

Much as i hate agreeing with Patsy, and i have no proof of it, but surely there were incidents of press ganging by the RN of old in Ireland?

Utrinque Paratus

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

The vast majority of them were economic conscripts. Before that under the Penal Laws Catholics, who would have been 80% or more of the population in Ireland, were banned from been in the British army or navy or owning a firearm until the 1780's.

Thats not true, the Penal laws existed throughout the British isles. Catholics were only banned from being officers.

Dogwatch

gatecrash wrote: »

Much as i hate agreeing with Patsy, and i have no proof of it, but surely there were incidents of press ganging by the RN of old in Ireland?

Press Gangs did not discriminate. They recruited all over Britian and Ireland.
They usually operated in the cities where they were based. Out side of these areas, you were generally fairly safe.

cyrusdvirus

Dogwatch wrote: »

Press Gangs did not discriminate. They recruited all over Britian and Ireland.
They usually operated in the cities where they were based. Out side of these areas, you were generally fairly safe.

Which is how it could be considered conscription

PatsytheNazi

Utrinque Paratus wrote: »

Thats not true, the Penal laws existed throughout the British isles. Catholics were only banned from being officers.

Yes Fred, the Penal laws were indeed enforced by Britain on Ireland, a country that had 80% plus of it's population Catholic. Catholics were barred under the Penal Laws from serving in all ranks of Britain's armed forces until it was rescinded by the Militia Act of 1793 due to the need for manpower against the threat of revolutionary France.

Fratton Fred

Dogwatch wrote: »

Press Gangs did not discriminate. They recruited all over Britian and Ireland.
They usually operated in the cities where they were based. Out side of these areas, you were generally fairly safe.

They only operated in ports because they could only (supposedly) impress a man that was a seafairer. Typically the navy would press merchant seamen as opposed to just dragging people out of a pub.

cyrusdvirus

Patsy, this editing threads after they've been responded to is really childish.

if you think of another point to make, either add a new post or add it on at the end of your original post.

Utrinque Paratus

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

Yes Fred, the Penal laws were indeed enforced by Britain on Ireland, a country that had 80% plus of it's population Catholic. Catholics were barred under the Penal Laws from serving in all ranks of Britain's armed forces until it was rescinded by the Militia Act of 1793 due to the need for manpower against the threat of revolutionary France.

Why are you calling me Fred ?

http://www.doyle.com.au/irish_soldiers_of_the_british_ar.htm

When the Stuarts were driven in to exile in France in 1652 the bulk of the British Army was Irish. This, for the most part, was from the 20,000 Irishmen, the remains of the Irish Confederate forces that had elected to leave Ireland when Cromwell was victorious there. In April 1656, Charles, the Prince of Wales (later Charles II), with his brother James, signed a treaty with the Spanish Crown and took their army to the Spanish Netherlands to fight France. The Ormonde Regiment was formed of 700 men: The Duke of York's Regiment, The Duke of Gloucester's Regiment (under Lord Taffe), the Muskerry Regiment, and finally an Irish unit under Colonel Farrell. The Irish Regiments again found themselves fighting Cromwell's new model army when allied to France. Elements arrived to fight the Spanish. In May 1660, Charles was restored to Britain as King Charles II. he immediately abandoned his Irish troops, leaving them to rot in Northern France till eventually they were sent to garrison his new Queen's dowry: Tangiers in North Africa.

PatsytheNazi

Utrinque Paratus wrote: »

Why are you calling me Fred ?

http://www.doyle.com.au/irish_soldiers_of_the_british_ar.htm

When the Stuarts were driven in to exile in France in 1652 the bulk of the British Army was Irish. This, for the most part, was from the 20,000 Irishmen, the remains of the Irish Confederate forces that had elected to leave Ireland when Cromwell was victorious there. In April 1656, Charles, the Prince of Wales (later Charles II), with his brother James, signed a treaty with the Spanish Crown and took their army to the Spanish Netherlands to fight France. The Ormonde Regiment was formed of 700 men: The Duke of York's Regiment, The Duke of Gloucester's Regiment (under Lord Taffe), the Muskerry Regiment, and finally an Irish unit under Colonel Farrell. The Irish Regiments again found themselves fighting Cromwell's new model army when allied to France. Elements arrived to fight the Spanish. In May 1660, Charles was restored to Britain as King Charles II. he immediately abandoned his Irish troops, leaving them to rot in Northern France till eventually they were sent to garrison his new Queen's dowry: Tangiers in North Africa.

Your quite well aware of the Penal Laws Fred :rolleyes:

Snickers Man

shaneybaby wrote: »

Conscripts? Never heard of conscription in ireland.

Figure of speech mate. Like "Golf Widow" or "pub orphans".

Daddy isn't really dead. He's just doing something preferable to being wiht you all the time.

cyrusdvirus

I think Patsy considers you what we call on another forum i frequent a munm

Multi User Name Mockery...

Sits back, opens popcorn and awaits the arrival of mighty manic

Fratton Fred

gatecrash wrote: »

I think Patsy considers you what we call on another forum i frequent a munm

Multi User Name Mockery...

Sits back, opens popcorn and awaits the arrival of mighty manic

I think that's the case. Our internet ninja doesn't even have the cajones to make a direct accusation.

PatsytheNazi

Fratton Fred wrote: »

I think that's the case. Our internet ninja doesn't even have the cajones to make a direct accusation.

Well we're going off topic so let's end it now Paddy

Fratton Fred

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

Your quite well aware of the Penal Laws Fred :rolleyes:

You're just making a fool of yourself bud.

PatsytheNazi

gatecrash wrote: »

Much as i hate agreeing with Patsy, and i have no proof of it, but surely there were incidents of press ganging by the RN of old in Ireland?

Again a bit off topic, but I'd agree with you there. Black guys from Jamica etc were pressed ganged also I'm sure. I guess you could say that the press gangs were equal oppurtunity employers

danbohan

Fratton Fred wrote: »

You're just making a fool of yourself bud.

got caught out did you freddie ? , tut tut

cyrusdvirus

ok, back on topic then please.

Utrinque Paratus

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

Your quite well aware of the Penal Laws Fred :rolleyes:

Why do you keep calling me Fred ?

Are you some sort of imbecile ?

Perhaps a mod will confirm myself and Fratton Fred are not the same user.

PatsytheNazi

I suppose in this day and age with cable TV, internet etc it's has only a small effect, but isn't it illegal for the British army, or indeed any foreign army, to advertise to recruit in this state ??

RMD

Are they advertising on Irish channels? I remember there was the big scandal on FAS in Limerick recommending the BA or something along those lines, but if it's being advertised on British TV transmitted here (Sky, BBC, Comedy Central etc) I'd assume it's fine.

Any info I've gathered on joining the BA was solely through the internet website and books, haven't seen anything on TV in recent years.

Poccington

I can confirm what all the regular users of the Mil Forum already now, Pat and Fred are not the same person.

One more bit of trolling out of you Patsy and I'll be following up on Manic's promise of a one month holiday.

Now, back on topic we go...

neilled

PatsytheNazi wrote: »

Maybe if these people are 'Irish' under the granny rule

" Name ! " - Mulligan sir, Micheal.

" You from OIreland young man " - No, sir, grandparents were.

" Well your OIrish now, off to the Irish Guards with ya "

No, there's actually a place on the form that deals with citizenship and a number of different options are given such as british, british/dualcitizenship, commonwealth, irish etc. If they are quoting numbers then its those that have stated they are Irish and produced the paperwork to back it up.

No granny rule in play, although no doubt the ranks of the Irish Guards are swollen with 2nd and 3rd gen irish as well as those of no direct connection to Ireland. Much in the same manner that the "Fighting 69th" of New York are still known as an "Irish" regiment yet many in its ranks would have little connection to Ireland.

g5fd6ow0hseima

I remember coming across some statistic saying that at the time of the American Civil War, 42% of the British armed forces were Irish born. As this was post-famine, I found it hard to believe.

Can anyone put me right?

Oh_Noes

I agree withe Bill and Fred tbh, joining the British Army is completely unpatriotic and not even excusable on financial grounds.

Not only are you joining the same organisation that opened fire on a civil rights march in Derry in 1972 (not the only undesirable thing they did up there), you're also putting yourself in a position where you could be asked to head to somewhere like Iraq/Libya to kill people without the opportunity to even ask why.

OP says:

A mate of mine joined the RAF as a pilot in the 1980's, he had to keep his mouth shut everytime he took leave to return home. Things are a lot different now to the better.

From what I've seen, not very much has changed in people's attitudes, and that's for the better.

shaneybaby

Oh_Noes wrote: »

From what I've seen, not very much has changed in people's attitudes, and that's for the better.

How is it for the better? Surely those in the GPO etc died to give irish men and women the right to chose what they want to do with their lives!

LondonIrish90

Oh_Noes wrote: »

I agree withe Bill and Fred tbh, joining the British Army is completely unpatriotic and not even excusable on financial grounds.

Not only are you joining the same organisation that opened fire on a civil rights march in Derry in 1972 (not the only undesirable thing they did up there), you're also putting yourself in a position where you could be asked to head to somewhere like Iraq/Libya to kill people without the opportunity to even ask why.

That is the way just about every military in the world works. You do not generally get to pick and choose where you want to go and fight. I highly doubt you will be asked to go to Iraq either, seeing as British forces left the country a couple of years ago.

Patriotism is a dying thing in the west nowadays. People realise they do not owe their services to the land of their birth and do not have to live their lives in accordance to what their "people" expect. If someone from Ireland wants to join the British Armed Forces then being "excusable" has nothing to do with it. Its nothing to do with people like you or anybody else with similar, archaic views.

Oh_Noes

LondonIrish90 wrote: »

That is the way just about every military in the world works. You do not generally get to pick and choose where you want to go and fight.

In the case of the UK, it's where America wants you to go and fight, and in many cases, including Iraq, it has been morally unjustifiable and in contradiction with international law.

LondonIrish90 wrote: »

I highly doubt you will be asked to go to Iraq either, seeing as British forces left the country a couple of years ago.

And they left because their ragbag army wasn't able to control Basra and the Americans wanted to take over.

LondonIrish90 wrote: »

Patriotism is a dying thing in the west nowadays.

What basis have you got for this view? If anything, I think the opposite is the case. Just look at the overwhelming frustration of the Irish public at the over-involvment of the E.U. in our affairs.

Have Americans suddenly stopped being patriotic? The French? Have you seen the British media coverage of their national sports teams?

LondonIrish90 wrote: »

People realise they do not owe their services to the land of their birth and do not have to live their lives in accordance to what their "people" expect. If someone from Ireland wants to join the British Armed Forces then being "excusable" has nothing to do with it. Its nothing to do with people like you or anybody else with similar, archaic views.

I like to think that people are still grateful to their ancestors, only a few generations back that gave their lives so we could found our own state, and build infrastructure and institutions to improve it. I certainly am, and I don't think that's in any way an archaic view.

A popular ideology recently seems to be "to hell with this country, the bankers took all the money, therefore the country is a dump and I have to go somewhere that has more money so I can get more money, at any cost." This attitude, to me, is far more regressive and archaic than having a little bit of pride in your nationality and country's history.

Utrinque Paratus

LondonIrish90 dont waste your time, this guy is just another barstool republican with a very big chip.

p1akuw47h5r3it

Oh_Noes wrote: »

From what I've seen, not very much has changed in people's attitudes, and that's for the better.

I think this would be mainly an older generations view. Many people my age wouldn't care if a person joined the BA or not. I think this is a good thing as a country we will never move on unless we get over this whole hating the Brits/BA thing.

LondonIrish90

Oh_Noes wrote: »

In the case of the UK, it's where America wants you to go and fight, and in many cases, including Iraq, it has been morally unjustifiable and in contradiction with international law.


And they left because their ragbag army wasn't able to control Basra and the Americans wanted to take over.

This comment shows in abundance your levels of ignorance, hatred, and cowardice.

The British couldn't control Basra with their "ragbag" army? Do you have any idea of the situation you talk of or do you just have a vague recollection of a war in Iraq? Rather funny how for the 3 and a half years prior to the British withdrawal in 2009, the task being completed was the training of the newly formed Iraqi army and police force. Not really an indication that control of the city was slipping away from them, when maintaining a stronghold wasn't even the primary objective of British troops in the region.

Also, rather strange how your countrymen (who no doubt would be ashamed to have any association with a complete idiot like you) are rushing in their droves to join the British Armed Forces isn't it? There are already half as many Irishman serving Britain as there are in the whole Irish Army. I also would suggest that the amount of fighting the British have been apart of this century, would suggest that they are one of the most adapted, experienced and able fighting forces in the world at the moment.

Manic Moran

Oh_Noes wrote: »

Not only are you joining the same organisation that opened fire on a civil rights march in Derry in 1972 (not the only undesirable thing they did up there),

Seriously, is there anyone still in the British Army who was around in 1972? You might as well say that one shouldn't join the Irish Army as they are responsible for the Ballyseedy Massacre.

NTM