The Time Is Now: Let's Leave The European Union!

UsernameInUse

As much as some hate to admit it, Europe is not working for us anymore.

In 2011, they want our blood. Our "friends" ask for an interest rate on a loan they know we cannot repay - then they blackmail us into accepting a Corporate Tax hike that would spell the end of our foreign investment. France and Germany couldn't give one damn about this country or our people.

The Lisbon Treaty was not in our interest. We refused and then they stuck it down our throats by force. That is an act of aggression! As much as we should remain friends with them, we can't go on playing by their rules. Look at the regulation on trade. Too much restrictions and tariffs on exports/imports is damaging our products and services in the global market.

We don't need them - other countries that haven't entered i.e - the Swiss, are among the most wealthiest and prosperous nations in the world. CAPs are bogus - for every cent our producers get, Europe gets two. And this ludicrous Euro legislation permitting us to pay people who have left the country is absurd.

Just admit it - we'd be better off on our own. The time for debate is over - the very existance of our sovereign Ireland is at breaking point.

ScumLord

No we just need to fix Europe.

RichieC

I was very pro europe for the longest time, but I'm starting to agree with you.

tonycascarino

It's mainly for the big boys - France & Germany. Always thought the EU had far too much control over us anyway.

Dunjohn

The Swiss were already among the wealthiest nations on Earth. We weren't.

UsernameInUse

ScumLord wrote: »

No we just need to fix Europe.

Normally, I'd agree but how can we do anything remotely different? We're too small a nation with too little an influence. The big guns like the Germans and the French have an agenda. Cameron didn't want the Lisbon treaty - he's trying to change Europe but with no inroads. What chance have we got?

--Kaiser--

Conspiracy Theories forum

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Saadyst

UsernameInUse wrote: »

In 2011, they want our blood. Our "friends" ask for an interest rate on a loan they know we cannot repay - then they blackmail us into accepting a Corporate Tax hike that would spell the end of our foreign investment. France and Germany couldn't give one damn about this country or our people.

Wait, what? Did I miss something? The Corporation Tax has gone up?

Also - what would Ireland be doing without that loan btw?

RichieC

--Kaiser-- wrote: »

Conspiracy Theories forum

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:rolleyes:

Fratton Fred

No EU, no loan, no ability for MNCs to fully exploit Ireland's low CTR.

Ireland needs the EU more than ever.

squod

Democracy is a method whereby you vote for people who govern you and if you don't like what they do, you can get rid of them.

Fuhken stupid Europeans haven't grasped that yet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNDKzqZh768

--Kaiser--

RichieC wrote: »

:rolleyes:

Roll eyes forum --->

Regulations for trade would get alot worse if we left. And no foreign investment would goto a country not in the EU.. That's the only reason there was foreign investment, a gateway to Europe.

RichieC

Saadyst wrote: »

Also - what would Ireland be doing without that loan btw?

We'd of burned the bond holders rather than give them billions and have joe soap pay it back.

BuzzFish

UsernameInUse wrote: »

Just admit it

No

squod

Saadyst wrote: »

Also - what would Ireland be doing without that loan btw?

Not pay up for a bunch of career criminals!

Saadyst

squod wrote: »

Not pay up for a bunch of career criminals!

Yeah but it's done now, so...

squod

Saadyst wrote: »

Yeah but it's done now, so...

hence the reason we need democracy, nothing is done yet. Aside from that €440m the government illegally paid over to the Anglo bondholders everything is up for change. Enda is in touch with Europe ''renegotiating'' the loan etc.....

UsernameInUse

Saadyst wrote: »

Yeah but it's done now, so...

It's far from over....

fontanalis

RichieC wrote: »

We'd of burned the bond holders rather than give them billions and have joe soap pay it back.

But where would Ireland get money to pay for like stuff?

RichieC

RichieC wrote: »

We'd of burned the bond holders rather than give them billions and have joe soap pay it back.

Yea that would have been an entertaining day in world news..

"Today, the Irish just realised that their pensions and any investment funds were bondholders and are now counting the costs. The nation is now researching what the term actually means and are realising that most of them are said bondholders".



Go read a book OP. Seriously, learn about what you're talking about.. Without bondholders, we can't even pay public sector staff each month. And half of the country are already bondholders through pensions etc. It's painful to read such ignorance. And the IMF is giving us a much much better interest rate than what we'd get on the market.. Our yield over Germany was 5% or something crazy.

fontanalis

Deleted User wrote: »

Yea that would have been an entertaining day in world news..

"Today, the Irish just realised that their pensions and any investment funds were bondholders and are now counting the costs. The nation is now researching what the term actually means and are realising that most of them are said bondholders".



Go read a book OP. Seriously, learn about what you're talking about.. Without bondholders, we can't even pay public sector staff each month. And half of the country are already bondholders through pensions etc. It's painful to read such ignorance. And the IMF is giving us a much much better interest rate than what we'd get on the market.. Our yield over Germany was 5% or something crazy.

Hooray for the kowledge economy.

dilallio

UsernameInUse wrote: »

As much as some hate to admit it, Europe is not working for us anymore.

In 2011, they want our blood. Our "friends" ask for an interest rate on a loan they know we cannot repay - then they blackmail us into accepting a Corporate Tax hike that would spell the end of our foreign investment. France and Germany couldn't give one damn about this country or our people.

The Lisbon Treaty was not in our interest. We refused and then they stuck it down our throats by force. That is an act of aggression! As much as we should remain friends with them, we can't go on playing by their rules. Look at the regulation on trade. Too much restrictions and tariffs on exports/imports is damaging our products and services in the global market.

We don't need them - other countries that haven't entered i.e - the Swiss, are among the most wealthiest and prosperous nations in the world. CAPs are bogus - for every cent our producers get, Europe gets two. And this ludicrous Euro legislation permitting us to pay people who have left the country is absurd.

Just admit it - we'd be better off on our own. The time for debate is over - the very existance of our sovereign Ireland is at breaking point.

If only economics were this simple

Our "friends" ask for an interest rate on a loan they know we cannot repay - then they blackmail us into accepting a Corporate Tax hike that would spell the end of our foreign investment.

The bond markets at the time were offering an interest rate of 11% - much higher than the bail out. We didn't have much of a choice.

then they blackmail us into accepting a Corporate Tax hike that would spell the end of our foreign investment

We haven't agreed anything of the sort.

Too much restrictions and tariffs on exports/imports is damaging our products and services in the global market.

These tariffs / restrictions would increase if Ireland left the EU.

the Swiss, are among the most wealthiest and prosperous nations in the world.

As another poster stated, Switzerland were always one of the richest countries.
Stating that Switzerland is rich because they are not in the EU is like stating that if A is not equal to B, and B is not equal to C, then A is definately equal to C.

fontanalis

dilallio wrote: »

As another poster stated, Switzerland were always one of the richest countries.
Stating that Switzerland is rich because they are not in the EU is like stating that if A is not equal to B, and B is not equal to C, then A is definately equal to C.

Wasn't Ireland prosperous before joining the EU?

squod

We've borrowed from the markets before :rolleyes:


Show me the fool who will invest in a bankrupt country? Where is our future now were in hock so deep to the IMF that we may never pay that loan back. It's the old perpetual debt trick. If Portugal won't even agree to pay back their' soveriegn debts, why the fuck would we volunteer to take on the bad debts of banks.

fontanalis

fontanalis wrote: »

Wasn't Ireland prosperous before joining the EU?

I just choked on my imaginary food.

ejmaztec

Deleted User wrote: »

I just choked on my imaginary food.

We didn't even have that, we were so poor.:(

LAVADUDE

Leave but don't leave, we need to look at the EU and take what we want i.e. free movement of goods and people, but leave the **** we don't want/need anymore i.e. The European Court of do what we tell you to do, we don't care about your culture of customs, as long as its french or german Justice and take back our own decision making powe

dilallio

ejmaztec wrote: »

We didn't even have that, we were so poor.:(

You were poor?

Before joining the EU, our local leisure-centre consisted of 14 sheep tied to a pole in the middle of the village

Fratton Fred

dilallio wrote: »

You were poor?

Before joining the EU, our local leisure-centre consisted of 14 sheep tied to a pole in the middle of the village

And now its 14 poles

ejmaztec

dilallio wrote: »

You were poor?

Before joining the EU, our local leisure-centre consisted of 14 sheep tied to a pole in the middle of the village

The only thing that's changed in our local village is that Pole's called Lech.

professore

fontanalis wrote: »

Wasn't Ireland prosperous before joining the EU?

Is this the comedy forum?

UsernameInUse

It seems peoples main argument is "Oh, well they've done so much for us" - yes, of course they have....no one is disputing that. The situation is now, in the present - are they any use for our aspirations going forward.

I.S.T.

--Kaiser-- wrote: »

Conspiracy Theories forum

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This is the response you get on boards if you dare to use your own mind instead of following the flock of lemmings marching off the cliff.

Saadyst

UsernameInUse wrote: »

It seems peoples main argument is "Oh, well they've done so much for us" - yes, of course they have....no one is disputing that. The situation is now, in the present - are they any use for our aspirations going forward.

I think the main argument is that Ireland shafted itself well enough without EU help. Stop blaming others?

Iwasfrozen

professore wrote: »

Is this the comedy forum?

Psst, we was being sarcastic.

ejmaztec

UsernameInUse wrote: »

It seems peoples main argument is "Oh, well they've done so much for us" - yes, of course they have....no one is disputing that. The situation is now, in the present - are they any use for our aspirations going forward.

It's best to stick with the EU, because it's the only game in town that's going to get us out of the sh1t.

Fratton Fred

UsernameInUse wrote: »

It seems peoples main argument is "Oh, well they've done so much for us" - yes, of course they have....no one is disputing that. The situation is now, in the present - are they any use for our aspirations going forward.

that depends on what you mean by aspirations I suppose. If they include avoiding the total bankruptcy of a country, Zimbabwe style, then I would say the EU would be quite useful.

Tigger

fontanalis wrote: »

Wasn't Ireland prosperous before joining the EU?

lol
no

vampire of kilmainham

dont give a sh1t anymore i just enjoy life yahheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee:D:D:D

Dionysus

I voted 'No - we need them' but I don't support the EU because "we need them" but rather because the alternative is to go back to the days when the vast majority of the population of this island lived in the shadow of Britain. The EU has been liberating in freeing Irish people from that psychological inferiority complex.

I also think the metric system is incomparably smarter than the imperial system. I think we can learn much more from EU legislation than we could from following British legislation. I admire the environmental agenda and I feel our membership of the EU overall affirms our independence, even if presently the British tabloids and British nationalists make it seem like we are under EU occupation. Some Irish people seem to be overly influenced by the anglocentric ideas from that quarter. Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

dotsman

squod wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNDKzqZh768

Why can't our Ceann Comhairle look like that?

IrishSpeedTraps

IrishSpeedTraps wrote: »

This is the response you get on boards if you dare to use your own mind instead of following the flock of lemmings marching off the cliff.

Jim, is that you?

How's the three sisters?

Dionysus

fontanalis wrote: »

Wasn't Ireland prosperous before joining the EU?

Deleted User wrote: »

I just choked on my imaginary food.

hehe.

Cool_CM

Dunjohn wrote: »

The Swiss were already among the wealthiest nations on Earth. We weren't.

That's because the Swiss generally know how to handle their money.
We don't.

meglome

IrishSpeedTraps wrote: »

This is the response you get on boards if you dare to use your own mind instead of following the flock of lemmings marching off the cliff.

The bastard in me wants to see us leave the EU and do what some people want just to show them how much worse it could get.

UsernameInUse

Cool_CM wrote: »

That's because the Swiss generally know how to handle their money.
We don't.

A very relevant point.

How can we expect to get our finance in order when we have two primary school teachers running the country?!

Europe isn't the problem, it's the parasitic banking sector that has bled some Euro members dry and is now bleeding several others dry as we speak!

Like a leech it won't die until it has bled germany dry, I thing the Germans have copped on, that's why they are opposed to bailouts.

rossie1977

Deleted User wrote: »

And no foreign investment would goto a country not in the EU.

thats why they are all moving to switzerland

its amazing a country with less than 1/10th our population can tell the imf, uk and germany to go stick it up their ass while we take it up the ass, ah the irish

K-9

squod wrote: »

hence the reason we need democracy, nothing is done yet. Aside from that €440m the government illegally paid over to the Anglo bondholders everything is up for change. Enda is in touch with Europe ''renegotiating'' the loan etc.....

Think it came out that the £440 Million was covered under a guarantee. Unjust but it wasn't illegal.

Surprised nobody has mentioned the trillions of oil reserves yet.

And they stole our Billions of fish.

As for the Euro, Multi Nationals have used it to great effect, making it our largest export market by far, unfortunately many indigenous companies haven't.

That's the opportunity cost of the property bubble that you never hear about, we just sold houses to each other rather than use capital to produce stuff and export it.

We'd a great chance to build on the growth from 87-00/01 with the Euro. We ballsed it up.

The bail out fund is too expensive and shows the major weakness of the Euro. Nobody dreamt of the bad times when it was designed. The problem is, like we had to fund Greece, countries are borrowing from markets to lend it to Ireland and the markets know there's big risk of us defaulting.

Tigger

rossie1977 wrote: »

thats why they are all moving to switzerland

its amazing a country with less than 1/10th our population can tell the imf, uk and germany to go stick it up their ass while we take it up the ass, ah the irish

Population I'd Switzerland is in or around 8 million

Either I'm confused or. .::::