Denis O' Brien, Michael and big Ben. stitched up or wha?

ArtSmart

Here are the main points from Moriarty the report:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/0322/moriartymainpoints.html

EM, 6 VOTING STITCHED UP SO....

wrote:

RE: POLL. TO CLARIFY THE TOP ONE MEANS YOU THINK THEY ARE INNOCENT, THE BOTTOM ONE MEANS YOU THINK THEY'RE GUILTY

wrote:

It is 'beyond doubt' that Michael Lowry imparted substantive information to Denis O'Brien which was 'of significant value and assistance to him in securing the licence'.
-Mr Lowry deprived the Government of its decision-making function. The Tribunal's report describes Mr Lowry has having a 'strategy' of depriving Government of an opportunity to scrutinise and review the result of the process.
-Mr Lowry bypassed consideration by his Cabinet colleagues and thereby not only influenced, but delivered the result for Esat Digifone.
-Mr O'Brien made or facilitated payments to Mr Lowry of £147,000 Sterling, £300,000 Sterling and a benefit equivalent to a payment in the form of Mr O'Brien's support for a loan of £420,000 Sterling.
-In advance of the closing date of the competition, Esat Digifone had available to it confidential information regarding the weighting matrix adopted by the project group that it was not entitled to have.
-The report refers to Mr Lowry's 'cynical and venal abuse of office' and his brazen refusal to acknowledge the impropriety of his financial arrangements with Mr O'Brien and Ben Dunne.
-Mr Lowry used a 'groundless rumour' relating to the Persona consortium to his advantage and displayed an appreciable interest in the process and had irregular interactions with interested parties at its most sensitive stages.
-The 'most pervasive and abusive instance' of Mr Lowry's influence was his action in withdrawing time from the Project Group, when it had requested an extension to its work because it was not convinced that Esat Digifone should be nominated as the winner.
-Mr Lowry 'misled' the party leaders as to the clarity and certainty of the result that he had recommended.
-Mr Lowry sought to overreach his own party leader, John Bruton, by 'intimating that the Government should have no discretion' in the matter.
-The $50,000 donation to Fine Gael was made through Telenor on behalf of Esat Digifone.
-The Tribunal report criticises the Fine Gael party for not revealing the clandestine nature of the €50,000 donation made by Mr O'Brien after his company won the mobile phone licence.
-The report finds that Mr Lowry displayed qualities 'similar in nature' to Charles Haughey and says Mr Lowry's actions have cast a 'further shadow' over this country's public life.

Denis, Micheal Ben and Dermot have thus far dismissed the report, Denis claims they were stitched up by the judicary.

well?

stupidusername

wha?

admiralofthefleet

are those my feet

PeterIanStaker

What I believe the OP is trying to say is "Denis O'Brien, Michael Lowry and Ben Dunne will now have to face the consequences of their actions"

The answer to that is of course, no.

They, the Elite are untouchable, whereas if you or I so much as stole a sliced pan we'd be behind bars. And it took a huge amount of taxpayers money to tell us that which we are painfully aware of.

AskMyChocolate

I'm surprised to see Dermot Desmond ally himself with this scum. Not that I thought for one second that he was any better than them, I just thought he was smarter.

ArtSmart

PeterIanStaker wrote: »

What I believe the OP is trying to say is "Denis O'Brien, Michael Lowry and Ben Dunne will now have to face the consequences of their actions"

The answer to that is of course, no.

They, the Elite are untouchable, whereas if you or I so much as stole a sliced pan we'd be behind bars. And it took a huge amount of taxpayers money to tell us that which we are painfully aware of.

he's also wondering about public opinion, only for research reasons (honest)

ok, i'm fascinated to see how many side with Mr O' Brien.

he gave some performance on rte. utterly amazing.

PeterIanStaker

ArtSmart wrote: »

he's also wondering about public opinion, only for research reasons (honest)

ok, i'm fascinated to see how many side with Mr O' Brien.

he gave some performance on rte. utterly amazing.

If anyone thinks that these men have been "stiched up" they're either a Sindo hack or living in a cave. Its just taxpayers' money being pissed down the drain. At least in America guys like Madoff go to jail. In Ireland they'll have a few drinks and a round of golf with the judge afterward. Its that kind of mentality that has the country in the sorry state its in.

The Waltzing Consumer

Yeah my bad, I think I picked the wrong answer. Was not paying attention. So if you are wondering who the one person who believes Denis, Michael and Ben, then that is my bad.

Cheap Thrills!

You forgot the third option

• the Irish taxpayer got rode in the ass stitched up :mad:

ArtSmart

it's on prime time now. cant wait til Vinny. he he

PeterIanStaker

Cheap Thrills! wrote: »

You forgot the third option truth

• the Irish taxpayer got rode in the ass :mad:

fyp:mad:

Sir Oxman

ArtSmart wrote: »

it's on prime time now. cant wait til Vinny. he he

Hope he has that witch Sara Carey on - O'Brien's chief cheerleader and FG insider.

ArtSmart

gambiaman wrote: »

Hope he has that witch Sara Carey on - O'Brien's chief cheerleader and FG insider.

well i assume that's her on now defending him so.

ascanbe

PeterIanStaker wrote: »

What I believe the OP is trying to say is "Denis O'Brien, Michael Lowry and Ben Dunne will now have to face the consequences of their actions"

The answer to that is of course, no.

They, the Elite are untouchable, whereas if you or I so much as stole a sliced pan we'd be behind bars. And it took a huge amount of taxpayers money to tell us that which we are painfully aware of.

Self-fulfilling prophecy. This will continue as long as people keep saying this, believing it and accepting it.

ArtSmart

gambiaman wrote: »

Hope he has that witch Sara Carey on - O'Brien's chief cheerleader and FG insider.

wow. she's something else all right.

ascanbe

gambiaman wrote: »

Hope he has that witch Sara Carey on - O'Brien's chief cheerleader and FG insider.

What you see on Prime Time is just Carey/Denis O'Brien v Smyth/Tony O'Reilly; as usual, it's about vested interests and has nothing to do with the public interest.

PeterIanStaker

ascanbe wrote: »

Self-fulfilling prophecy. This will continue as long as people keep saying this, believing it and accepting it.

Well I sure as f*** don't accept it, but plenty of people, (the same mentality of the FF voter and the massgoer) sadly do.

The Pontiac

Lowry topped the pole in North Tipperary only a few weeks ago. We'll all knew he was a gangster of the highest order. The awarding of the mobile phone license was the biggest private commercial deal since the formation of the state. Moriarty founded that he made hundreds of thousands of sterling from the deal. I believe him.

We all knew Fianna Fáil were corrupt since the Haughey era. We all knew Bertie was a gangster, yet he was re-elected for a third time in 2007.

We've only ourselves to blame really (for being bankrupt etc.). I include myself in that. I didn't vote for FF, but maybe I should have protested harder. At least FG got rid of Lowry. Well done North Tipp!!

Sir Oxman

In a normal country, Carey would be immediately sacked by her employers the IT. She's basically branded herself a liar, I wonder what would make her do that? (I'm assuming she's not fcking thick)
Following on from O Brien's performance on 6.1 the weasels are squirming.

Also, look at independent.ie , not a bit about the biggest scandal since eh, the last one.
Their current 'headline' (not even a headline, is "Moriarty Tribunal brands rent deal corrupt")

What a joke of a country!

mikemac

<Ollie> wrote: »

Well done North Tipp!!

No problem
And it's North Tipp-South Offaly these days
Let the good people of Offaly get the credit too

Only 8 candidates ran and four were no hopers.
Must have been on the least contested areas around, Wicklow had over 20

ilovesleep

<Ollie> wrote: »

Lowry topped the pole in North Tipperary only a few weeks ago. We'll all knew he was a gangster of the highest order. The awarding of the mobile phone license was the biggest private commercial deal since the formation of the state. Moriarty founded that he made hundreds of thousands of sterling from the deal. I believe him.

We all knew Fianna Fáil were corrupt since the Haughey era. We all knew Bertie was a gangster, yet he was re-elected for a third time in 2007.

We've only ourselves to blame really (for being bankrupt etc.). I include myself in that. I didn't vote for FF, but maybe I should have protested harder. At least FG got rid of Lowry. Well done North Tipp!!

Speak for yourself if you are going to blame yourself. For many, including myself, woke too late and everything is coming together like a complex jigsaw puzzle.

The Pontiac

gambiaman wrote: »

Also, look at independent.ie , not a bit about the biggest scandal since eh, the last one.
Their current 'headline' (not even a headline, is "Moriarty Tribunal brands rent deal corrupt")

What a joke of a country!

Dennis O'Brien owns most of Independent News and Media. They also own Today FM. The coverage on The Last Word today was diabolical.

Sir Oxman

<Ollie> wrote: »

Dennis O'Brien owns most of Independent News and Media. They also own Today FM. The coverage on The Last Word today was diabolical.

And Newstalk which itself was a disgrace today in toadying to him.

And this from an IT journalist on Primetime tonight:

"I leaked some information about a donation [DOB] made to the [PDs] & I denied that to the Tribunal" Sarah Carey, in her own words.

She laughed while she said it.
These fcukers know nothing will touch them - deny everything till your final breath, attack the messenger and it'll alll blow over.

General General

Poll fail. No 'Motorola Star TAC' option.

ascanbe

Loathe as i am to provide a link from the Independent, especially since Tony O'Reilly has a vested interest in this case and was the main-shareholder, i believe, when this piece was published, this seems a fairly good, factual article. At least it's by Gene Kerrigan who, as far as i'm aware, has a reputation of managing to remain a relatively independent, free-thinking journalist:

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/analysis/a-costly-round-of-lunches--golf-classics-and-race-days-505550.html

Cheap Thrills!

Vincent Browne extended programme now.

ArtSmart

I see it's 54 guilty and 6 innocent.

reckon the 6 were my fault for not been clear enough with the options.

least i hope that's the reason...

Rubik.

gambiaman wrote: »

In a normal country, Carey would be immediately sacked by her employers the IT. She's basically branded herself a liar, I wonder what would make her do that? (I'm assuming she's not fcking thick)

She has more than one employer ... http://www.newstalk.ie/tag/sarah-carey/

ArtSmart

7 now. very funny. should a kept me gob shut

Sir Oxman

Rubik. wrote: »

She has more than one employer ... http://www.newstalk.ie/tag/sarah-carey/

Not surprising, is it? She was Marketing Director with Esat during their Lowry-aided successful bid for the mobile licence in the 90s
http://www.sarahcarey.ie/about-me/
GUBU indeed.

Despite her hanging herself with her smug, mocking attitude last night she will be well looked after.
She also deliberately misled viewers in saying Moriarty found no corruption in the Lowry/OBrien fixup knowing that was not in the terms of reference and he couldn't explicitly say that.
Useless O'Callaghan didn't even bother to pull her up on that.

The inbreeding in Irish media has been well and truly exposed - what an awful little ****hole.

thomas.browne

Is no one going to question Moriarty in this at all? I don't ally myself with O Brien, Lowry or any of those kind but this tribunal has taken 14 years to date, wasted millions of our taxes, and in the end has produced a report that is utterly worthless.

Surely the point of this was to get to the facts, which we still haven't done. Justice PM decided that he knew what was said at the meeting on all ireland final day 95 and ignored what he was told was said (probably correctly) by two people independently. However, while I don't totally disagree with him ignoring what they said happened, how can he decide that he thinks he knows what really happened. That isn't facts of any sort.

This whole thing was a complete and utter waste of time, ink, and taxpayers money, and the only people that are benefitting out of it are the lawyers, who have now got another few rounds of payment coming along from appeals, from sueing the state for not having a fair chance for the licence, counter appeals...

the groutch

thomas.browne wrote: »

Is no one going to question Moriarty in this at all? I don't ally myself with O Brien, Lowry or any of those kind but this tribunal has taken 14 years to date, wasted millions of our taxes, and in the end has produced a report that is utterly worthless.

Surely the point of this was to get to the facts, which we still haven't done. Justice PM decided that he knew what was said at the meeting on all ireland final day 95 and ignored what he was told was said (probably correctly) by two people independently. However, while I don't totally disagree with him ignoring what they said happened, how can he decide that he thinks he knows what really happened. That isn't facts of any sort.

This whole thing was a complete and utter waste of time, ink, and taxpayers money, and the only people that are benefitting out of it are the lawyers, who have now got another few rounds of payment coming along from appeals, from sueing the state for not having a fair chance for the licence, counter appeals...

are you any relation of Vincent?

thomas.browne

the groutch wrote: »

are you any relation of Vincent?

If I was I would have left Ireland long ago...

tricky D

ascanbe wrote: »

At least it's by Gene Kerrigan who, as far as i'm aware, has a reputation of managing to remain a relatively independent, free-thinking journalist:

Gene Kerrigan an Pat Brennan wrote a nice little book back 1999 called This Great Little Nation: An A-Z of Irish Scandals which has about a hundred tales of classic Irish scandals and stroke politics including this one.

Product Description
From Ansbacher to Zoe, from Locke to Lowry, from a sex/murder scandal of the 1920s to the banking scandals of the 1990s. AIB, NIB, Littlejohn, Lenihan, Mary Robinson and Russell Murphy. Magdalen laundries and clerical sex abuse, ministerial pensions and mature recollections. From the Great Tampon Scandal of 1944 to the Arms Crisis of 1970. From Taca to Tuffy to Traynor: tax dodging, insurance churning, money laundering, pick-me-ups, heavy gangs and thundering disgraces. McCracken, Moriarty, Flood, Telecom, planning, Haughey, Burke, Bertie and Bruton. And the secrets of the PD skip. As the bank manager said to Charlie, "it's a great little nation." Other books by Gene Kerrigan Another Country Hard Cases Never Make a Promise You Can't Break.

Pick it up if you can, it's great jacks reading which will make you both laugh and cry.

gbee

and put them on spikes at the city gates so as to deter anyone else from doing the same

Deise Tom

Will those that were involved in the government of the day and are still around today be offering to resign. They all knew what was going on whether they admit to it or not. Many of these people were the same that called for the heads of Haughy, Ahearne and Cowan in the last number of years.

wyndham

Dr Quirkey can wave bye bye to his Las Two Mile Borris Casino dream now hopefully. Everyone will be trying to distance themselves from the corrupt scumbag Lowry.

sjunger

You know ,when you have a feeling about someone?..In my case it is michael lowry..I have no loyalty to any party,but from the first day I saw him on tv,I thought that,I don't trust you.You are like like a dog with his head hanging down,waiting to bite you and wagging his tail at the same time..Sneaky c**t..Hope they hang you out to dry.Amazing why I can't get through your website when I tried to get to,I wonder why ??

walshb

It never surprises me that you will always get some people who will defend the indefensible. The dogs on the street know about Lowry. He's been bent for many a year now. Ah, but he serves the local community, doesn't he. Isn't that all that matters?:rolleyes:
No ****ing scruples.

walshb

As for O'Brien and his Haiti crusade; I wasn't falling for that ego trip. Chancer! A guy like that, charitable?:rolleyes:

missingtime

Cheap Thrills! wrote: »

You forgot the third option

• the Irish taxpayer got rode in the ass :mad:

And cannot afford to get it stitched up :mad:

CoalBucket

AskMyChocolate wrote: »

I'm surprised to see Dermot Desmond ally himself with this scum.

Why ? He bought into celtic didn't he ?













Obvious trolling is obvious

The Waltzing Consumer

Deise Tom wrote: »

Will those that were involved in the government of the day and are still around today be offering to resign. They all knew what was going on whether they admit to it or not. Many of these people were the same that called for the heads of Haughy, Ahearne and Cowan in the last number of years.

I would hope, as a FG voter, that if this report has shown current FG TDs engaged in corrupt practices, helping this ass**** Lowry, then yeah they should resign.

Problem is, the report does not say any such thing or allege any such thing about any current FG TD. FG do try and have a few standards;), only people who would do business with the likes of Lowry is FF :rolleyes:

But sure when you have no standards like FF, who will suck Lowry off, go down on Cooper-Flynns and mount Haely-Raes, it is easy to get shocked when a political party finds corruption and expels it (do they have morals? )

Nevermind_

It will be very interesting to see what happens to the white elephant, state license to print money, Supercasino in two mile borris.
Lowry is the chief advisor/cheerleader for this scheme, its going to look incredibly bad for FG if they change the laws on gambling just to enrich Mr lowrys already wealthy friends.

We give away oil, gas, phone licenses, casino licenses to private interests and what does the taxpayer get in return? Sweet FA (or very little)

FlutterinBantam

walshb wrote: »

It never surprises me that you will always get some people who will defend the indefensible. The dogs on the street know about Lowry. He's been bent for many a year now. Ah, but he serves the local community, doesn't he. Isn't that all that matters?:rolleyes:
No ****ing scruples.

Steady up there lad.

If the dogs in the street know about Lowry, why hasn't he been taken to court and charged.?

You have three people basically, Lowry Ben Dunne and O'Brien all denying point blank the findings of the 14 fcuking year tribunal.

Dunne put it up to the state ..prove it and jail me!!!

I'm no admirer of Lowry, but as I see it nothing has been legally pinned on him...... after 14 years.

WTF

The Waltzing Consumer

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Steady up there lad.

If the dogs in the street know about Lowry, why hasn't he been taken to court and charged.?

You have three people basically, Lowry Ben Dunne and O'Brien all denying point blank the findings of the 14 fcuking year tribunal.

Dunne put it up to the state ..prove it and jail me!!!

I'm no admirer of Lowry, but as I see it nothing has been legally pinned on him...... after 14 years.

WTF

Maybe he is the Clay Davis of Ireland?:cool:

Paparazzo

The Waltzing Consumer wrote: »

Maybe he is the Clay Davis of Ireland?:cool:

That's exactly what I thought of when he was on the radio today basically saying it's all lies and a huge conspiracy against him

FlutterinBantam

Paparazzo wrote: »

That's exactly what I thought of when he was on the radio today basically saying it's all lies and a huge conspiracy against him

He very well could be, but until something is actually proved against these goons in a court of law I can't make up my mind fully.


I know what I think to be true, but why the fcuk hasn't this been proved conclusively?


Surely it should be possible to sort this out

StudentDad

Well I haven't read the report so all I have to go on are reports in the media. From what I've heard, this crew have alot of questions to answer.

What surprises me is the fact that even after Lowry was turfed out of the Fine Gael party he still got elected as an independent. This says a whole lot about Irish society in my opinion.

This has to be sorted. I do think Lowry should step down as this report has cast a long shadow over his actions over the past number of years.

If he and the other individuals named in the report have broken the law they should be tried and either convicted or acquitted.

The idea that an individual or groups of individuals can somehow avoid the law because it's inconvenient or somehow does not apply to them is frankly repugnant.

"Not only must Justice be done; it must also be seen to be done." [1923] All ER 233

SD

poppyvalley

Why dosent at least one of them sue the state for all the "lies" & character assassination in the Moriarty Tribunal. I know a judge was never sued but there must be some recourse to restore their good name

FlutterinBantam

StudentDad wrote: »

Well I haven't read the report so all I have to go on are reports in the media. From what I've heard, this crew have alot of questions to answer.

What surprises me is the fact that even after Lowry was turfed out of the Fine Gael party he still got elected as an independent. This says a whole lot about Irish society in my opinion.

This has to be sorted. I do think Lowry should step down as this report has cast a long shadow over his actions over the past number of years.

If he and the other individuals named in the report have broken the law they should be tried and either convicted or acquitted.

The idea that an individual or groups of individuals can somehow avoid the law because it's inconvenient or somehow does not apply to them is frankly repugnant.

"Not only must Justice be done; it must also be seen to be done." [1923] All ER 233

SD

Questions to answer.:eek:... this shit has been going on for FOURTEEN YEARS!

How could stuff be going on for fourteen years and these people have still questions to answer??

They have all stated categorically that the findings of the tribunal are wrong.

Fourteen years and millions of John Qs tax eurons later, we are still none the wiser?


WTF