Should i accept this job offer

bualadh bos

I had a job interview last week for a small accounting firm in dublin city centre, i was offered the job but im still unsure whether to accept the job offer or keep looking...
i have been offered the training contract starting 20,000pa but the exams fees are not included, i can start in june for before i start the training contract on 18,000..

my friend got offered a job in another small accounting firm for 19,000pa with exam fees paid for.

i have found it really difficult to find a job, i have been applying for jobs since last october and had only one job interview before this, but i am having serious cash flow problems right now,struggling to get through my final year of college, i have a loan of 15,000 to repay so i feel i may not be able to live on my wages, pay my rent and food, bills, tablets etc..

so the fact i now have to pay for €3060 cap2 exams and Fae exam fees of €4185 on top of that , makes me wonder if i should accept the offer...

SBWife

Even without the loan I'd say living in Dublin for under €1000 per month (which when you account for the fees and the USC is what they are asking) is impossible unless one can live at home. I'm assuming that they won't pay overtime. I'd go back to them say that you'd love to take the position but simply cannot afford to, run through some numbers if possible. My other concern is that if they are that stingy in regard to exam fees what else do they nickel and dime their employees on?

They probably won't budge on the offer and someone who lives with their parents will eventually take the position but the truth is you simply cannot afford that job.

LAVADUDE

Negotiate, although I doubt they will give it to you, ask them if the pay is negotiable and try to get a raise or ask them if they'll help pay for your exams, it highly unlikely they'll remove your job offer if you ask.
"if you don't ask you don't get"

A few other points I have, €20,000 is a standard salary for starting off in a medium sized firm, so you won't get a better deal by going elsewhere.
Think in the long run, a job in Dublin city centre will look good on your CV, rather than one in the middle of no-where.
Also think of the quality of life you'll have in Dublin compared with elsewhere.
Ask to talk to the other trainees they have, to find out about rent, cost of living etc.

smcgiff

I thought the fees were paid for under a CAI contract.

greendom

LAVADUDE wrote: »

Think in the long run, a job in Dublin city centre will look good on your CV, rather than one in the middle of no-where.

Surely the reputation of the company should count for more than where it is based, even if it is in the middle of nowhere ?

RachaelVO

All sound advice in relation to your salary and what you can afford to live on. Trying to negotiate is not going to get you very far IMO. If you are living at home, accept it. It's unlikely you will do that much better, and even though your fees aren't included, someone earning a thousand more is not really going to have that much more take home pay at the end of the month.

There is one particular thing you need to think about though whether you are living at home or not, if you are in receipt of any type social welfare payment and they find out you turned the job down, they WILL come down on you like a tonne of bricks. It could even be the case that the company themselves report you!

LAVADUDE

smcgiff wrote: »

I thought the fees were paid for under a CAI contract.

Although my fees are paid, my training contract has a clause in it that runs along the lines of, if there is conflict between my contract and the CAI guideline, the company get the final say.
I'm sure they could use this to get out of paying my fees

EDIT
and back to the original question, take the job. I know you would of thought of this long and hard but the alternative is unemployment and considering your previous application record, a job offer is unlikely to come by again for awhile. Also consider the implications of not repaying your loan i.e. bad credit record and the legal fees if the bank takes you to court.

smcgiff

LAVADUDE wrote: »

Although my fees are paid, my training contract has a clause in it that runs along the lines of, if there is conflict between my contract and the CAI guideline, the company get the final say.
I'm sure they could use this to get out of paying my fees

Hopefully someone with CAI experience will jump in here.

My understanding (stand to be corrected) was that the firm pays the trainee's fees as part of the training contract. I would have thought the CAI would take a dim view of the firm not paying the fees.

However, I'm not an expert on the CAI contract and as I found out a few days ago I'm out of date with ACCA student progression rules also

I'm sure a CAI will be able to give more definitive advice.

Good luck

edanto

As you say yourself, job offers have been thin on the ground for you, and you might regret letting this one pass you.

Use your accounting skills to do up a cash flow for yourself for the next year, cut all your expenditure back as much as possible and see if you can afford to take this job.

Then do a similar cash flow on the social welfare and see if you afford to keep looking.

I'm not being sarcastic, I really think you should do up that cash flow and show it to them as you negotiate for either them to pay your exam fees or a slightly higher salary. If I was hiring an accountant and they came in with something like that, I would certainly see them in a different light.

Legend100

i remember when i started my training contract it was a stipulation in the CAI contract that exam fees and training costs (first time, not repeat) must be paid by the employer

I signed that contract 5 years ago so i don't know if it is still the same now

LAVADUDE

Legend100 wrote: »

i remember when i started my training contract it was a stipulation in the CAI contract that exam fees and training costs (first time, not repeat) must be paid by the employer

I signed that contract 5 years ago so i don't know if it is still the same now

Your right (from my interpretation anyway), just read up on guidelines on http://www.charteredaccountants.ie/Students/Training-Organisations/Useful-Downloads/
in the training package for firms 2010 download pdf

3. Registration & Exam Fees
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]In response to feedback from training organisations that Chartered Accountants Ireland should simplify its procedures, a major review of the payment structure of student fees took place in 2008. There is now one composite payment per annum replacing 3+ payments per annum.
As separate fees for exemptions, courses, exams etc do not exist under the new fee structure; the training organisation is required to pay Chartered Accountants Ireland 100% of all student fees due. However, to accommodate those training organisations that traditionally did not pay for exemption or student registration fees, training organisations are entitled to reclaim 15% of the fee directly from their students each year.
[/FONT][/FONT]

tenchi-fan

Are you going the chartered route?

If not, forget about the training contract. it doesn't count for anything.

look at the €20k as a starting salary. it won't be fun working for that money in dublin, but I know people working in dundalk with a lot more experience than you for €12k (in fact, i know a newly qualified accountant who continued in practice on 18k)

it's a foot on the ladder and in days of wpp's it's better than nothing.

bualadh bos

thanks everyone for your advice !

LAVADUDE wrote: »

Your right (from my interpretation anyway), just read up on guidelines on http://www.charteredaccountants.ie/Students/Training-Organisations/Useful-Downloads/
in the training package for firms 2010 download pdf

3. Registration & Exam Fees
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]In response to feedback from training organisations that Chartered Accountants Ireland should simplify its procedures, a major review of the payment structure of student fees took place in 2008. There is now one composite payment per annum replacing 3+ payments per annum.
As separate fees for exemptions, courses, exams etc do not exist under the new fee structure; the training organisation is required to pay Chartered Accountants Ireland 100% of all student fees due. However, to accommodate those training organisations that traditionally did not pay for exemption or student registration fees, training organisations are entitled to reclaim 15% of the fee directly from their students each year.
[/FONT][/FONT]

thanks for the link, i was told in the interview that they would pay the fees but not the exams so im still confused as to what the firm is paying and what i will pay...
i have decided to accept the job offer, as like everyone else here has said job offers are very thin on the ground, hopefully things will all work out..
thanks again!

LAVADUDE

I wish you the best of luck

okiss

I would take the job. In regards to the fees that you have to pay you may get a tax allowance of 20% of the cost - I would contact the tax office in regards to this.
I would look up www.hookhead.com for the tax calculator so you can find out what you would be earning a week or month after tax.
If you look up the website itsyourmoney.ie they have a budget planner.
The jobs market is poor at the moment. You could be waiting a long time to get experience you need when both doing accounting exams and for job hunting later. Good luck with everything.