LPC v. FE-1s

LawStudent23

I'm a final year law student at UCD, hoping to get some advice on qualifying here in Ireland, or in the UK.

I applied to the top five last October but didn't so much as secure one interview! Although I haven't applied to any small or mid-sized firms as of yet, I have been told on good authority that should I chose to do so and manage to secure a training contract, I will be funding Blackhall fees myself unless I get extremely lucky.

I haven't yet applied to any UK firms, but I believe some reimburse your LPC costs should you secure an apprenticeship with them. Weighing up my options, it seems it would cost me no more to self-fund the LPC than it would to pay my own Blackhall fees.

I ultimately want to know would it be easier to secure a training contract in the UK than in Ireland. Also, would the probability of being kept on after qualifying be higher in the UK.

If anyone has any experience with the LPC or advice on this I would really appreciate it.

TheObserver00

Yep, I'm pretty much in the same boat as you..

Solicitor training in this country has, and always will, cost an arm and a leg.

What makes it even more off putting is the high likelihood of not finding a training contract after all the money and effort that has been put into it.. The whole process is far too if-ey in my opinion.. unless of course, you have the luxury of being able to rely on good ol' fashioned nepotism! which unfortunately, I don't.

Which is exactly the reason why I'm looking further a field to the Aberystwyth University in Wales, they do a LPC for £8500.. which is pretty pricy, but includes the course materials and is no worse than here.. and I also read that the uni itself helps to secure the training contracts and a lot of them are paid too! Definite plus there, I haven't heard of anyone that got paid during their solicitor training here! Maybe it happened during the boom years but i highly doubt anything like that goes on nowadays..

From the "digging around" I've done so far I would say you're much more likely to secure a training contract in England than here.. Well, it sure seems far more likely, its a much bigger place than here and they haven't been as badly affected by the recession as us. Apart from all that, its all about networking, build contacts, impress them with your work ethic and you're sure to do well!

I do have a question though, is it possible to go straight onto the LPC with an Irish law degree or is there some other additional training to be done beforehand??

Any feedback appreciated!

234

Irish law degrees are generaly requires if you have taken English Land Law and English Administrative Law. Some colleges teach english admin law as part of the general admin law course but english land law is always a discrete subject. If you don't have these then I think you can just take a year and pass them in an English university.

TheObserver00

234 wrote: »

Irish law degrees are generaly requires if you have taken English Land Law and English Administrative Law. Some colleges teach english admin law as part of the general admin law course but english land law is always a discrete subject. If you don't have these then I think you can just take a year and pass them in an English university.

Well I have studied land law and admin, and there is definitely more English case law in it than Irish.. Hopefully this is taken into account!

234

Have you studied English Land Law specifically? It's doubtful that it was included in your land law course even if there was referenece to lots of English cases. The English system has some significant differences to our own. Ask yourself, do I know how the English system differs from the Irish system and if you don't then you need to study it either in Ireland or England. It is a requirement, as far as I know, and I don't think they would ever made an exception to something as essential to the LPC as that.

whydoibother?

It has to be English Land Law specifically. If you don't have it, you can take it with most of the GDL providers in the UK as an exemption student. The GDL is a conversion course that non-law graduates do. Being an exemption student means that you just do the subjects that the others do. The downside is you have to take a year to do this. Fees just over £1000 usually for this.

I agree that it is easier to get a training contract in the UK. But please also consider the quality of the training contract. This might be a controversial view, but imo not every training contract is worth doing. I think that a complete career change would be preferable to some of the worst training contracts, though a lot of people think that any training contract is the final step towards getting qualified and therefore positive. At the top end of the scale you have the madness of people being paid £40,000-£60,000 in training before they are even qualified and a good chance of being kept on on even more after. At the other end of the scale I've seen people paid the law society minimum wage for training, which mightn't be unacceptable to a trainee, but then offered £20,000 post qualification positions in places where there was little prospect of any significant increase for several years. When you factor in the costs of living in London, this is not too great at all. People with the latter type of training contracts are in all likelihood forking out for their own LPC as well - £13,000ish. Of course there is a whole range in between.

While obviously career choices shouldn't be made solely or even primarily on earning potential for most people, by the time you have completed your degree, GDL subjects, LPC, training contract etc., you will have invested a lot of time. You have to have a cold, hard look at your CV, get some advice if possible, and try to estimate what sort of training contract you might get. Then you have to be really honest with yourself about whether you would be happy with it.

pandas

English Land Law is a specific subject aside from land law itself.. and as far as I am aware you need both English Land Law and Admin Law to do LPC otherwise you must do them the year before the LPC; now this could be wrong.

I am in the same boat as ye guys, the only difference being I have spent a lot of money and time on doing my FE-1s and now a Masters and still no training contract..I am already up to my eyeballs in debt from the Masters with accommodation costs in Dublin and the cost of the Masters itself so the UK is not an option for me as I have invested too much here but if I was in your position again I would definitely be going for the LPC.

whydoibother?

pandas wrote: »

English Land Law is a specific subject aside from land law itself.. and as far as I am aware you need both English Land Law and Admin Law to do LPC otherwise you must do them the year before the LPC; now this could be wrong.

You are right. There are certain "foundation subjects" that a person must have before they can do the LPC. If you are missing any you must do them before you can get onto the LPC. The solicitors regulation authority provide the list somewhere on their website. There is English land, Admin ... and I think about 5 more (from memory) but the others don't tend to be an issue because they would be taught as standard in any Irish law degree.

Jev/N

TheObserver00 wrote: »

Well I have studied land law and admin, and there is definitely more English case law in it than Irish.. Hopefully this is taken into account!

English land law is a separate module in UCD; it's optional

linola_c

Optional in NUI Galway as well.

Applied to 6 firms in London last year not all maginc circle. Didn't get one interview and applied here and interviewed for 2 of the big 4!

One of my friends is working for a legal recruitment consultancy in London. App, London is just as flooded with law graduates as Ireland - obviously more Universities..more graduates. She has told me that they want to see some link to London? As in, why would they train you up so in a few years you will go home to Ireland.

Also, trainees often appear to be older in the UK. Many have worked as paralegals and have solid legal experience!