Ryanair - Not really a discount airline anymore

ToxicPaddy

I was wondering if any other Boardsies have noticed this lately..

I have been looking at a few trips, long weekends and stuff to do over the next 6 months or so.. so to try and save a few quid, I've been checking flights well in advance with the usual suspects and one thing that seems to be common across the board is that Ryanair's prices are creeping up and up and getting closer to the standard flagship carriers especially if you're looking at checking in a bag, sometimes even without that.

I was comparing the prices and "extras" that they are so fond but not extras in the traditional sense as you have no choice but to pay them, such as the €12 online check in fee.

Now before the usual comments of "Oh heres another Ryanair hating thread", its far from it, I usually fly at least half a dozen times a year and yes I know you get what you pay for..

But if what you're paying for is the same or sometimes more than the flagship carriers, how can they still class themselves as a discount/low fares airline??

Add to that the cost of the transport into the city as they rarely land in the main airports so you're adding another €15 or more per person each way.

Is it now that they have people in the mindset that Ryanair will always be cheaper to fly with so people dont even check anymore and just assume it?

Tox

undo

My take on this is that Ryanair are simply very smart about the way they do business. They have dirt cheap tickets on some routes all the time, reinforcing the impression that they are truly a budget airline. If you are very flexible, you can still get ~€10 return flights without any hassle.

But on top of that, they are keeping very good track of what routes are in demand at what time of the year and adjusting prices accordingly. If there are enough people willing to pay a higher price, Ryanair will bump the price. If the route is not very popular, Ryanair will fill seats by lowering the price. Makes perfect sense.

A lot of the extras are then sold to people looking for extra convenience, such as checked bags, priority check-in, overpriced car rental, scratch cards for dinner. Other than the ckeck-in fee, all of those extras are truly optional and you choose whether you want to pay them. I am sure the prices for all those extras are chosen based on market research. If they were cheaper, more people would book them but the revenue per booking would be lower. If they were dearer, the revenue per booking would be higher but fewer people would book them. The current prices are bound to be at the revenue sweet spot.

So really, Ryanair are tapping into all markets and revenue sources. And on top of that, by being so controversial, they are stimulating constant discussion about Ryanair, keeping the airline in the news all the time... and leading to lots of threads on boards, also increasing their visibility .

ToxicPaddy

undo wrote: »

My take on this is that Ryanair are simply very smart about the way they do business. They have dirt cheap tickets on some routes all the time, reinforcing the impression that they are truly a budget airline. If you are very flexible, you can still get ~€10 return flights without any hassle.

But on top of that, they are keeping very good track of what routes are in demand at what time of the year and adjusting prices accordingly. If there are enough people willing to pay a higher price, Ryanair will bump the price. If the route is not very popular, Ryanair will fill seats by lowering the price. Makes perfect sense.

A lot of the extras are then sold to people looking for extra convenience, such as checked bags, priority check-in, overpriced car rental, scratch cards for dinner. Other than the ckeck-in fee, all of those extras are truly optional and you choose whether you want to pay them. I am sure the prices for all those extras are chosen based on market research. If they were cheaper, more people would book them but the revenue per booking would be lower. If they were dearer, the revenue per booking would be higher but fewer people would book them. The current prices are bound to be at the revenue sweet spot.

So really, Ryanair are tapping into all markets and revenue sources. And on top of that, by being so controversial, they are stimulating constant discussion about Ryanair, keeping the airline in the news all the time... and leading to lots of threads on boards, also increasing their visibility .

Yes you're right about the constant press coverage etc, they do have very clever marketing people and a CEO who's not exactly a shrinking violet and makes sure he's always in the public eye..

Another extra I'm talking about that you can't avoid is the charge when you try to pay online.. So the cost of the online booking and the credit card charge adds €32 to the cost of a return flight per person.. Then there is the indirect charges such as bus charges to get to where you actually want to go.. These can be fairy hefty too..

I agree the check in bags etc are all optional.. but if you need checked in bags say if going on a longer trip then the cost goes up considerably so much so that I and a few people I know are starting to look elsewhere for cheaper flights to more convenient airports and saving more money as a result. And these tend to be on the more popular routes as you mentioned that they are cashing in on.. so maybe by doing what they are doing is actually shooting themselves in the foot and biting the hands that feeds them especially in the current climate.

But who knows..

dory

I've thought this for a while. I've never really got cheap flights with Ryanair as I don't travel to the UK and everywhere else seems fairly pricey. I paid €250 return to Budapest and I booked well in advance which is more than Malev who include some food and 23kg baggage!

undo

ToxicPaddy wrote: »

Another extra I'm talking about that you can't avoid is the charge when you try to pay online

That's optional. Get a Dublin City Gift Card or any other Mastercard Prepaid and pay €0 in fees.

Then there is the indirect charges such as bus charges to get to where you actually want to go.. These can be fairy hefty too..

Very true. Right now, you may be trying to get a flight to Frankfurt, book a flight to Frankfurt with Ryanair - and then find yourself in a village named Hahn with a two hour bus journey ahead of you.

Fortunately though, Ryanair are being forced slowly to state more clearly where they are actually flying. So they are stating more and more clearly that their destinations are Hahn, Weeze, Skavsta and not Frankfurt, Düsseldorf, Stockholm.

Once this is made perfectly clear, IMHO the problem goes away. Ryanair then no longer sell you a ticket to Frankfurt but one to Hahn. If Hahn does not happen to be your intended destination, you need to book an additional transfer. But this is in line with any other airline - it is not a hidden cost anymore.

And there very much is a case for actually visiting the cities Ryanair fly to. For example, I enjoyed both Bergamo and Girona a lot. Ryanair currently sell those as Milan and Barcelona, requiring you to take a bus/train from the airport. But if you see them as what they are, Bergamo and Girona, they are great destinations without expensive transfers.

but if you need checked in bags say if going on a longer trip then the cost goes up considerably so much so that I and a few people I know are starting to look elsewhere for cheaper flights to more convenient airports and saving more money as a result.

As they well should. I think there is no disagreement here or on any other travel forum that you should always, always compare prices. Shop around. Check all the offers. Ryanair may come out on top. Or they may not. I recently booked some flights with Lufthansa. You would think they would be the dearest legacy carrier ever... but at €60 return, with snack and luggage, from proper large airports, I found their offer to be best.

On popular routes, I think the amount of business present is bound to make prices very similar across airlines. At first, budget tickets are cheaper. When the first few tickets have been sold, the remaining Ryanair seats go up and reach the price of legacy carriers. So, as you say, people book legacy carriers with free checked luggage and so on. Of course, once enough seats have been sold, the legacy carrier price goes up as well. Suddenly, Ryanair is cheaper again and people book Ryanair. Rather, rinse, repeat. It always seems to me that the prices for a particular set of cities go up roughly in sync across the airlines.

undo

dory wrote: »

I've never really got cheap flights with Ryanair as I don't travel to the UK and everywhere else seems fairly pricey.

I travel to the UK very, very little. Yet, I have booked several dozen very cheap Ryanair flights. A few years back, when €0.01 flights still existed, I got many such flights to the continent. And even these days, I rarely pay more than €10 for a Ryanair flight.

steve9859

Its great for flying to the UK - the cheapest carrier by a mile. If you do short trips and dont check bags you can fly for practically free. I dont know how they manage to do it, but they sell a lot of flights with no tax if you book far enough in advance - I havent seen any other airline do that. Also often there is no on-line check in fee. So if you are in any way flexible, you can often fly to the UK for €20 all in. And with mastercard prepay there are no additional fees

I fly to London Gatwick every week at peak times - monday morning to friday evening - typically book around a month in advance, and despite checking bags I have never paid more than €100, and often closer to €50.

If you are flying to europe with bags, then there are probably cheaper flights, but ryanair are actively trying to fly people with no bags. In hid ideal world Michael O'Leary would ban bags completelty!! And it is working - flights are invariably full, and yet the luggage carousels are empty compared to the other airlines. Just a different business model to the other airlines. It will suit some people, wont suit others

mikedragon32

My most recent trip was to Germany a few weeks ago. As I had some travelling to do whatever airport I used I shopped around. For my wife, daughter and me I could have travelled on Aer Lingus for €293 into Frankfurt, or €320 on Lufthansa. Into Hahn with Ryanair was €160 including check in fee, a suitcase and the credit card fee. It meant that the money saved on flying with them paid for the hire car for the trip.

Added bonus was a later morning flight than Aer Lingus offer on the way out and a late afternoon flight back instead of a night time flight.

So, in short, they still do bargains:

slave1

Of course you need to shop around and as previous posters have said the cr card fee is avoidable, you do however need to get over being hung up on this charge and that charge etc, just get to the last screen and that's your costs, who cares how it's made up.
Still the cheapest by far for my routes.
5 return flights to Tenerife for the last two weeks of August for €560, where the hell could you beat that.
Tips are as always, sit on the website for early release of flights, be flexible on travelling mid week/funny hours, get a wirecard/etc to avoid the cr card charges and go with carry-on luggage only.

BenShermin

I think the OP is right, I've found it harder and harder to secure low fares with Ryanair compared with 2009 lets say. Even Ryanair themselves are admitting fare hikes:

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/finance/2011/0201/1224288694847.html

Ryanair’s average fare rose by 15 per cent to €34 in quarter three while the average revenue per passenger was up by the same percentage to €44.
Ryanair finance director Howard Millar told The Irish Times yesterday that its average fare would probably rise to €39 by end of the year.
“Our plan is to slow down our growth rate and push up average fares,” he added.

Personally, I've flown many times last year to/from the UK on Aer Lingus flights that were cheaper than their nearest Ryanair equivalent. I especially find this when it comes to "last minute" bookings.

To give an example, I've just gone into the booking system of both airlines to get a price on flights for this Friday; here's the pricing.

2000hrs Dublin to Gatwick with Ryanair costs: €126.47
2030hrs Dublin to Gatwick with A Lingus costs: €106.47

I think people really need to shop around, and I do believe there's large consumer grouping that will ALWAYS book Ryanair because they're under the impression that it's ALWAYS cheaper. Such a grouping will mean that Ryanair's new fare hike policy will be a success.

Aishae

absolutely shop around - ryanair arent really 'budget' travel unless youre one of the lucky first few to get the cheap seats on a flight. other than that the prices are on a par with other airlines.
ive flown to the uk many times in the last 5 years - flown to alicante twice

i havent flown with ryanair at all in that time. i checked their prices for each - just like i checked aer lingus and ebookers etc. but it was always cheaper to go elsewhere.

even flew out of belfast to alicant there last year - with easyjet - as it saved my friend and myself a hundred each to do so. ryanair was the dearest option - aerlingus fell between the two. moral of the story - shop around, dont settle for the first fare you come across even if the website says its having a sale - check out your options

Random

generally find that ryanair are still very cheap on a number of routes. they do up the prices for big events (like sports events and stuff) but otherwise ryanair have allowed me a lot of very cheap travel over the last few years and even in the last 6 months.

jarmstrong001

Anyone else having bother booking flights with a prepaid mastercard lately?
I have a "wirecard" which worked grand last month but trying to book flights the last couple of days it keeps giving me an error saying problem with payment type try again later. When I try again later all that has happened is that the price has gone up :mad:

Edit: This is the error

An unknown error has occured with the form of payment you have chosen.
You have not been charged, but due to system failure we cannot accept this form of payment at this time.
Please try another form of payment or try again at a later time.

Trampas

I managed to get return flights to gatwick for €26 ret with cc fee and that was flying over the school mid term break and lunch time flights.

right time it is all about.

why AL don't drop the fees for a couple of seats is beyond me

Savman

Show me another airline offering London/Paris/Rome/Venice/Barcelona/Madrid for under €45pp return

Not their biggest fan, you don't have to be to use their service btw, however they are clearly significantly cheaper and 'discounted' compared to other airlines on a fairly regular basis.

zagmund

I posted this up on the Winter Sports forum I think, but during the mid term week, Ryanair could get you to Salzburg (really busy with ski holidayers that week) for about €1,000 for a family of 4. This was booking the day before the flight. With Aer Lingus I don't remember the exact amount, but it was about €2,000.

I have never seen *really* discounted flights on Aer Lingus, unlike the Ryanair sales where you can get to London for the same price of the aircoach to the airport.

When we go with Ryanair we now 'treat' ourselves to a coffee, pringles, etc . . . on the flight. Slightly over priced (but compared to the DAA shops not really) but in the context of the entire weekends expenditure not a whole heap. Sure, when you get to a city like London, Barcelona, Berlin you could easily spend more than your entire flights on a light lunch somewhere.

z

steve9859

Anyone understand how ryanair can sell seats to UK with no tax?? Not complaining though!!

Aishae

steve9859 wrote: »

Anyone understand how ryanair can sell seats to UK with no tax?? Not complaining though!!

ive been wondering that myself.
any time i've checked out ryanair the taxes etc added on was huge - there was no way id get a ticket for 20 euro with tax included

dubal

They cant, they just subsidise them to get the load factor up.

no taxes = YOU dont pay

Regards
Dubal

ps - I got 4 return peak time flights in January for €32 all in so there are bargains, just less of them

sh7289

If you have one of those Dundrum gift cards, it takes a nice bit off the price of a Ryanair flight.

Dodge

A few things on Ryanair.

1) Someone above said they want a flight without checked baggage. They don’t. They want to make as much money off the flight as possible. If that includes charging €20 per bag, then they’re happy to do it
2) Are people seriously that attached to Ryanair that they wouldn’t look elsewhere? This astonishes me. I could imagine people willing to IGNORE them on grounds of snootiness (or whatever) but I couldn’t imagine not even considering other airlines
3) Whatever way the price is framed, “tax free” “ half price” “€0.01” doesn’t matter. The bottom line is how much you actually pay for your flights
4) Ryanair (or other airlines) don’t ‘up their prices’ for Sporting events (etc). They just sell out the cheaper seats quicker. We all know their pricing model is based on searches as well as purchases

I’ve flown dozens of times with them and never had a real problem. I’d prefer to fly with AL or pretty much any other airline but as long as the prices are competitive I’ll always look at Ryanair’s website. If it’s a better package (price, times, transfers), then I’ll go with them.

irish_goat

BenShermin wrote: »

To give an example, I've just gone into the booking system of both airlines to get a price on flights for this Friday; here's the pricing.

2000hrs Dublin to Gatwick with Ryanair costs: €126.47
2030hrs Dublin to Gatwick with A Lingus costs: €106.47

Ryanair will still be cheaper...

Ryanair's ‘Double the Difference’ Fare Guarantee ensures that on these rare occasions when a passenger finds a lower air fare on a competitors flight to the same route at the same date/time then that passenger will be repaid double the fare difference between the Ryanair and competitors ticket price as long as they book to travel on Ryanair.

Aishae

Dodge wrote: »

3) Whatever way the price is framed, “tax free” “ half price” “€0.01” doesn’t matter. The bottom line is how much you actually pay for your flights

this is what i've wondered (it's the same as the 'how is a ticket just 20 euro? thought) if the seat costs 10 each way so you pay 20 - then thats not the whole cost, for me the cost includes any taxes and compulsory add ons. and usually baggage - with the liquid restrictions in place, most people only get away with hand luggage if theyre travelling for a weekend or to stay with a relative for example (who will have liquids in their place)

i realise some people just get lucky with the first couple of seats on a flight, which tend to be REALLY cheap.

i dont pay attention to ads claiming 27.99 flights with taxes - each way. 500 to new york incl. taxes etc. anymore - not just from ryanair but aer lingus and any other airline. because in the past when i see ads like that, it doesn't seem to translate on their website booking. so i check the website and then do a test booking (without getting to the book and pay stage) to see what i'd be charged. the proof is at the bottom of the screen as it were!

BenShermin

irish_goat wrote: »

Ryanair will still be cheaper...

Tut, tut. Somebody didn't read all of the terms and conditions;).

To quote article 9 of the lowest fare guarantee:

Where Ryanair have more than two flights between a city pair (e.g. Dublin to London Stansted; Dublin to London Gatwick) and price guarantee claim will need to be made versus the cheapest available Ryanair fare on offer on the applicable routes.

imo, there's a huge difference between London Gatwick and London Stansted. For a start the rail fares from Gatwick to central London are much cheaper than from Stansted.

AngryLips

You also need to know Ryanair's approach to promotional fares. It's pointless booking more than 3 months in advance because they don't promote fares any earlier than this. I find the best time to book is 3-2 months in advance of travel date.

Seamonster

Be careful with baggage details - my check in bag was 2KG over the maximum weight (It was checked in online as 15 but was actually 17) and I had to pay 80 Euro! Fuggers. Ryanair can be cheap if you book in advance but any mistake you make (Forget to print boarding pass, incorrect details, bags slightly heavy) they really rip you off big time.

Dodge

They didn't rip you off. You didn't keep to the terms of the deal, and they punished you.

No one's fault but you

steve9859

Seamonster wrote: »

Be careful with baggage details - my check in bag was 2KG over the maximum weight (It was checked in online as 15 but was actually 17) and I had to pay 80 Euro! Fuggers. Ryanair can be cheap if you book in advance but any mistake you make (Forget to print boarding pass, incorrect details, bags slightly heavy) they really rip you off big time.

Hang on, thats not my definition of 'ripped off'.

That is just not adhering to the rules!! Im sure you could have worn 2kg of extra clothes - Ive often walked onto a ryanair flight wearing 2 coats and 2 sweaters! And im sure they cant stop you getting on a plabe for wearing 2 pairs of trousers! No sympathy for the people who get caught out because their bags dont fit in the 'check the size' thing that the staff at the gate have. Ive seen people shouting and giving out at Ryanair staff - being really abusive - as their bags are being taken off them and checked in at extra cost.

Its not difficult to print a boarding card, and pack a bag properly. So dont understand how people make 'mistakes'!!

DoesNotCompute

Seamonster wrote: »

Be careful with baggage details - my check in bag was 2KG over the maximum weight (It was checked in online as 15 but was actually 17) and I had to pay 80 Euro! Fuggers. Ryanair can be cheap if you book in advance but any mistake you make (Forget to print boarding pass, incorrect details, bags slightly heavy) they really rip you off big time.

Here, here. Low Fares Airline me hole.

I live in the UK and often fly home from Heathrow. I've often found that BMI are consistently cheaper than Aer Lingus and Ryanair, and they don't charge you for "extras", like checking in, booking by credit card, priority boarding, etc. I don't have any brand loyalty, and I always look for the cheapest airline, using a screenscraper like www.kayak.co.uk. Having said that, Aer Lingus appear to be getting cheaper than BMI lately.

Savman

:rolleyes:

It's fairly basic logic folks, price check all carriers on the route you want and choose the cheapest/best match.

More often than not you will end up on the Ryanair site.

BMI are a good airline, but LHR is a dog of an airport so even if it was cheap I still would avoid it where possible. Gatwick has cheaper trains into London, Heathrow you have that endless tube journey which can be painful. All food for thought.

Anytime I look at alternatives to Ryanair, the price seems to be considerably higher with other airlines, sometimes even double the price flying into the same airport.

cson

I'll add to this; comfort and price factors aside, in my experience one of the other main benefits is the reliability and punctuality of them. I've rarely if ever had a cancelled, delayed or late flight. Whereas with other carriers I've encountered a good few repeat offenders.

Maybe I'm just lucky but its a factor for me tbh.

johnfás

I travel regularly with Ryanair and have since the late 1980s! Everybody knows you don't pay for the comfort but particularly flying to the UK they bring me precisely where I want to go - that is to airports actually located near major cities - and they are extremely punctual. Of course it helps that flight times of 50 mins are scheduled for 1 hour 20 minutes but nevertheless arriving almost always on time is extremely helpful.

The era of true low cost flights is over for the moment because of oil prices. However, I am going for a leisure weekend at the end of August flying into Birmingham. A very long time away but I booked it this evening on Ryanair for 33 euro. The Aer Lingus equivalent was 80 euro. Flights across the board are increasing in price at the minute and at times Ryanair can be expensive. However, in most instances you are still saving almost half on flights booked in good time to Britain and this is on a flight of 50 minutes duration when comfort isn't an issue. In any case I find Ryanair planes to be fairly comfortable.

undo

johnfás wrote: »

The era of true low cost flights is over for the moment because of oil prices.

We just booked a weekend in Girona for May. €10 per person return, all-in. I would not say the era of true low cost flights is over at all...

Savman

johnfás wrote: »

The era of true low cost flights is over for the moment because of oil prices.

Not really, Ryanair will always give away a few dirt cheap seats on every flight. Unfortunately it's the mugs paying the full inflated fares that will end up footing the bill for any increased operational cost. Tis the way they are, give a little away for nothing and hammer the rest so that passenger X ends up paying most passenger Y's fare.

What ya gonna do.

undo

Savman wrote: »

Tis the way they are, give a little away for nothing and hammer the rest so that passenger X ends up paying most passenger Y's fare.

That's how all airline operate. Nothing special about Ryanair here.

steve9859

Savman wrote: »

Not really, Ryanair will always give away a few dirt cheap seats on every flight. Unfortunately it's the mugs paying the full inflated fares that will end up footing the bill for any increased operational cost. Tis the way they are, give a little away for nothing and hammer the rest so that passenger X ends up paying most passenger Y's fare.

What ya gonna do.

You make sure you play the game Ryanair's way. Let those that dont subsidise you. Then you fly for practically nothing.

nitromaster

www.skyscanner.ie comes in really handy

I always use it before booking, sometimes aer lingus is cheaper...sometimes ryanair :P

Aishae

its funny - ive used it but ive check the websites skyscanner checks - once i find the cheapest on skyscanner - and then i usually get the ticket cheaper on the website (say they found tickets and aer lingus was cheapest - so i check the aer lingus site and then its usually a bit cheaper there) - odd.

RachaelVO

jarmstrong001 wrote: »

Anyone else having bother booking flights with a prepaid mastercard lately?
I have a "wirecard" which worked grand last month but trying to book flights the last couple of days it keeps giving me an error saying problem with payment type try again later. When I try again later all that has happened is that the price has gone up :mad:

Edit: This is the error

An unknown error has occured with the form of payment you have chosen.
You have not been charged, but due to system failure we cannot accept this form of payment at this time.
Please try another form of payment or try again at a later time.

That pretty much means that the wire card is considered by Ryanair as a voucher card and they won't accept them as the prepaid option anymore. It (in most cases) needs to be a prepaid card with your name on etc;

Back to the original topic. Ryanair are cheaper than the mainstream airlines. You just have to know when to book the flights. Booking too far in advance can also be more expensive. I booked to go to a wedding in december, I check in august and the price was going to be 195 each return, then in October I check again and it was 58e return for two of us (no check in luggage). So it's all a matter of timing!