Ireland sought Libyan bailout.

My name is URL

THE Irish government attempted to secure a multi-billion euro bailout for the country's struggling banks from Colonel Moamar Ghadafi's international investment fund in December but failed because Libya dismissed it as a low-level investment.

National Treasury Management Agency representatives went to the North African state in a bid to get cash to prop up the Bank of Ireland, Allied Irish Banks or Anglo Irish Bank - the latter two of which were nationalized due to disastrous property loans - by selling an equity stake in one or more of them, according to British newspaper "The Sunday Times".

Bank of Ireland is now seeking to tap investors for STG2 billion ($2.75 billion) to stave off full nationalisation.

But negotiations crumbled after the Libyan Investment Authority, which controls more than $64 billion of assets, said the banks were too small for it to consider.

The amount of money sought by the Irish delegation was unclear, though it was believed that some advisers - who feared public outrage would be triggered by financial links to a country accused of arming the Irish Republican Army during the 1970s and 1980s - thought that any amount would be too high.

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I know that FF stooped to new levels over the last few years but surely this is taking the biscuit. I wonder if it'll be reported on RTE now that the story's out.

Not sure what's worse.. the fact that they went looking for money from Libya or the fact that Libya saw Ireland as 'too low-level' to invest in.

Run_to_da_hills

Like Minds Think Alike

One corrupt government trying to deal with another.

Richard tea

I was reading about this yesterday. I regard it as major news but the irish media dont seem to have an interest in the story. I wonder what other skeletons will come out of the closet:eek:

CrazyRabbit

If anyone thinks that FG, GP, SF etc wouldn't do the same, then they are delusional.

There's little difference between all these politicians.

Cookie_Monster

Probably would have been a good deal looking at it now. Reasonable chance of something in Libya causing the funds collapse or "disappearance" and us walking away with lots of free money

Phill Ewinn

suprised it's been posted in a public forum in this country. G'daffi has been propped up for years by the same crooks who are ''lending'' us money through the IMF. That penpushing queer won't fair any better negotiating with the fvckers.

listermint

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

Probably would have been a good deal looking at it now. Reasonable chance of something in Libya causing the funds collapse or "disappear" and us walking away with lots of free money

could have been the end to all our troubles.

pragmatic1

With the state of our economy, I wouldnt have cared if they got a bailout from Hitler.

My name is URL

pragmatic1 wrote: »

With the state of our economy, I wouldnt have cared if they got a bailout from Hitler.

The rest of the world might, though. We'd always be known for accepting money from a murderous regime. As if Ireland's past links with Libya weren't bad enough.

Jimmy the Wheel

My name is URL wrote: »

We'd always be known for accepting money from a murderous regime..

Yet, we still took 8 billion from the UK....

mathie

Didn't Doc Brown borrow plutonium from the Libyans?

My name is URL

Jimmy the Wheel wrote: »

Yet, we still took 8 billion from the UK....

heh.. they're not in the process of killing their own civilians at the minute! And at least people were made aware of the fact that those negotiations were taking place. The fact that this isn't being picked up by the Irish media is what I find odd, more than anything.

bonerm

mathie wrote: »

Didn't Doc Brown borrow plutonium from the Libyans?

He sure did. The original draft of BTTF had PLO (or maybe Iran? .... either way someone the US was unhappy with at the time) but into production there was instructions to change it to Libya.

CreepingDeath

pragmatic1 wrote: »

With the state of our economy, I wouldnt have cared if they got a bailout from Hitler.

We did get a bailout from ze Germans.

minidazzler

Let's invade? They have 64 billion worth of assets and hate their leader, so we invade, oust him, hold elections for the people and get a good deal of stuff from them in return....what could go wrong?

Johro

minidazzler wrote: »

Let's invade? They have 64 billion worth of assets and hate their leader, so we invade, oust him, hold elections for the people and get a good deal of stuff from them in return....what could go wrong?

Nothing. Nothing at all. Let's do it.

Snakeblood

minidazzler wrote: »

Let's invade? They have 64 billion worth of assets and hate their leader, so we invade, oust him, hold elections for the people and get a good deal of stuff from them in return....what could go wrong?

It would have been alright if they'd lent us the money, along comes the regime change here and there, then the Libyans can come looking for a refund and we can tell them to take it up with Gadaffi.

My name is URL

Snakeblood wrote: »

It would have been alright if they'd lent us the money, along comes the regime change here and there, then the Libyans can come looking for a refund and we can tell them to take it up with Gadaffi.

Dunno about that.. it's a legitimate fund and they already own huge shares in some big businesses. http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/3f3502e0-3df2-11e0-99ac-00144feabdc0.html

Maybe it's not as big a deal as I thought it was when I first read about this.. I still find it shocking that our government can attempt to secure loans from nations such as Libya without breathing a word about it to the public.

Jimmy the Wheel

My name is URL wrote: »

Maybe it's not as big a deal as I thought it was when I first read about this.. I still find it shocking that our government can attempt to secure loans from nations such as Libya without breathing a word about it to the public.

Didn't they kind of do that with the EU/IMF deal, denying it till the last minute, and then only admitting it after the deal was struck?

A deal which is still against the constitution, AFAIK.

dsmythy

My name is URL wrote: »

The rest of the world might, though. We'd always be known for accepting money from a murderous regime. As if Ireland's past links with Libya weren't bad enough.

Not to mention the fact that our loan would now be frozen.

PeterIanStaker

Shame they didn't get Gadaffi to run for FF in Louth, would have been interesting.

Einhard

My name is URL wrote: »

More...

I know that FF stooped to new levels over the last few years but surely this is taking the biscuit. I wonder if it'll be reported on RTE now that the story's out.

Not sure what's worse.. the fact that they went looking for money from Libya or the fact that Libya saw Ireland as 'too low-level' to invest in.

So it's alright to take their oil, but not to take their money?

I don't see the big deal here; every Western country does business with Libya. The Brits released a convicted terrorist in order to appease Gadaffi and get favourable commercial deals. Ireland also does business with Saudi Arabia, Syria, China etc- should we halt all commercial contact there too? Become the only nation in the world to adopt an entirely ethical approach to internation trade, only deal economically with the good guys?

My name is URL

Jimmy the Wheel wrote: »

Didn't they kind of do that with the EU/IMF deal, denying it till the last minute, and then only admitting it after the deal was struck?

A deal which is still against the constitution, AFAIK.

I remember reading that it was constitutional because it was not considered to be an "international agreement" which is what's mentioned in the constitution. Either way, it was approved by the Dáil in the end so I think that allows it.

Einhard wrote: »

So it's alright to take their oil, but not to take their money?

Nice straw man

I don't see the big deal here; every Western country does business with Libya. The Brits released a convicted terrorist in order to appease Gadaffi and get favourable commercial deals. Ireland also does business with Saudi Arabia, Syria, China etc- should we halt all commercial contact there too? Become the only nation in the world to adopt an entirely ethical approach to internation trade, only deal economically with the good guys?

The Irish government is not a commercial entity.

hmmm

My name is URL wrote: »

Not sure what's worse.. the fact that they went looking for money from Libya or the fact that Libya saw Ireland as 'too low-level' to invest in.

Where would you like them to get money? The bank of happiness and bunnies doesn't exist. The other countries with big sovereign wealth funds include such havens of democracy as China and various despotic Middle East countries. The Norwegians would split themselves laughing if we had turned up at their door.

Red Hand

minidazzler wrote: »

Let's invade? They have 64 billion worth of assets and hate their leader, so we invade, oust him, hold elections for the people and get a good deal of stuff from them in return....what could go wrong?

Hmmmm...the Irish Defence Forces invading Libya. Interesting.

Actually, that reminds of a member of the Irish Defence Forces who thought it would be a good idea to stick a photo of himself up on Know your Nerds thread. He was smoking a joint in Amsterdam and wearing sunglasses as a disguise...though he'd already stuck of few pictures of himself without sunglasses beforehand.

At least they might attempt to be Hashasheens before being slaughtered without mercy.

jumpguy

My name is URL wrote: »

The Irish government is not a commercial entity.

We trade money with other countries in return for their goods, I think that's what he means. I agree, it's a bit two-faced of people to be horrified by the thought of getting money from the Libyans, but we'll see what they'll say when oil prices rise because Libya is no longer stable enough to produce it.

grenache

CrazyRabbit wrote: »

If anyone thinks that FG, GP, SF etc wouldn't do the same, then they are delusional.

There's little difference between all these politicians.

if you actually think that any other party is as corrupt and cynical as Fianna Fáil then YOU are delusional. They have been in power for such a length of time that cronyism and me-féinism is endemic within the party. Fine Gael and Labour are lots of things, but they would never dream of dealing with Gaddaffi. Enda Kenny and Eamon Gilmore are actually honest individuals. Something that the Bertie brigade could never be.

Not all politicians are the same, and to make sweeping statements claiming they are, is naive in the least.

My name is URL

jumpguy wrote: »

We trade money with other countries in return for their goods, I think that's what he means. I agree, it's a bit two-faced of people to be horrified by the thought of getting money from the Libyans, but we'll see what they'll say when oil prices rise because Libya is no longer stable enough to produce it.

Are you for real? Do you think that being indebted for the purpose of propping up banks is in any way comparable to free public trade?

indough

grenache wrote: »

Enda Kenny and Eamon Gilmore are actually honest individuals.

roflchopper

galwayrush

Libya might have offered asylum to Bertie, Cowen, Lennie if we had an uprising...

edit, silly idea, Libya couldn't afford their pension expectations...

Einhard

My name is URL wrote: »

Nice straw man

How on earth is it a straw man? WE trade with Libya and other such autocracies all the time. Why should this be any different?

The Irish government is not a commercial entity.

Obviously. But commercial activity drives this and every other activity. We trade with regimes as bad, if not worse, than the Libyan regime. Should we cancel economic relations with Saudi Arabia and Syria too?

jumpguy

My name is URL wrote: »

Are you for real? Do you think that being indebted for the purpose of propping up banks is in any way comparable to free public trade?

We give them money for their oil, thus supporting the Gaddafi regime.

We give them money for their money, thus supporting the Gaddafi regime.

There's little difference in that respect, and either way, we needed the money, whether it came from Libya, North Korea or, as it did, the EU/IMF. If Libya gave us a better deal than the EU/IMF did, well, we'd be in a better situation, wouldn't we?

My name is URL

jumpguy wrote: »

If Libya gave us a better deal than the EU/IMF did, well, we'd be in a better situation, wouldn't we?

No

Michael 09

My name is URL wrote: »

No

You're bamboozling this argument with FT quotes, nicely played

jumpguy

My name is URL wrote: »

No

The US froze Libyan assets, yes. If we were to freeze Libyan assets (which might've occured due to US pressure), does that not mean we wouldn't have to be paying back our loan for the time being?

My name is URL

Michael 09 wrote: »

You're bamboozling this argument with FT quotes, nicely played

Bamboozling?! I posted two links which both happened to be from the FT, and relevant to the points I was replying to.

grenache

indough wrote: »

roflchopper

So i'm taking it that you know Kenny and Gilmore well then?


Because if you're putting them in the same bracket as Bertie and haughey then its laughable.