Hi need help im a crap fighter and want to learn self Defence PLEASE HELP

Gigilowgonewild

Hi, i've gottin bullied since i was in secondry school and to this day i still cant fight for fools gold its embarrasing and i really want to learn to defend myself incase i get into a situation, im 19 and have tried tai kwa( but my trainer for that was useless) and i also did kickboxing but i didn't really like it, im really tall and slim build, and looking for a good self defence sport maybe wing chun, but i cant seem to find a professional place in my area im from kilkenny and have no way of travelling anywhere else out of the county. if you know a good place please write the number and place below thanks alot P.S please only post if there proper trainers dont want any cowboys thanks.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Gigilowgonewild wrote: »

Hi, i've gottin bullied since i was in secondry school and to this day i still cant fight for fools gold its embarrasing and i really want to learn to defend myself incase i get into a situation, im 19 and have tried tai kwa( but my trainer for that was useless) and i also did kickboxing but i didn't really like it, im really tall and slim build, and looking for a good self defence sport maybe wing chun, but i cant seem to find a professional place in my area im from kilkenny and have no way of travelling anywhere else out of the county. if you know a good place please write the number and place below thanks alot P.S please only post if there proper trainers dont want any cowboys thanks.

Well if you go through the club stickies thread you might find contact details for Kilkenny Judo Club.

If your interested in MMA then I'd suggestion you try Top Pro in Kilkenny.

Best of luck.

aidan13

Gigilowgonewild wrote: »

Hi, i've gottin bullied since i was in secondry school and to this day i still cant fight for fools gold its embarrasing and i really want to learn to defend myself incase i get into a situation, im 19 and have tried tai kwa( but my trainer for that was useless) and i also did kickboxing but i didn't really like it, im really tall and slim build, and looking for a good self defence sport maybe wing chun, but i cant seem to find a professional place in my area im from kilkenny and have no way of travelling anywhere else out of the county. if you know a good place please write the number and place below thanks alot P.S please only post if there proper trainers dont want any cowboys thanks.

Theres a brilliant Wing Chun club in Carlow, is there anyway you could make it to that?

Personally Wing Chun is the best form of self defence as its designed for a smaller person to be able to deal with a bigger attacker.

The guy who teaches it doesn't come any better. He got accepted into the American Black Belt hall of fame a few months ago for Wing Chun.

He also won a huge award ther after Christmas, he recieved "International Sifu of the year award."

It would be great if you could make it up for that. PM me if you have any questions or need any details.

simon-king

aidan13 wrote: »

Personally Wing Chun is the best form of self defence as its designed for a smaller person to be able to deal with a bigger attacker.

Just be careful not to get caught up in some of the mysticism that surrounds martial arts in relation to self defence .. I don't know why you disliked kickboxing .. but try out other disiplines that allow you to train live with drills and sparring with what you have learned .. as always, no steet situation can ever be fully prepared for as there are so many potential unknown environmental elements such as glass bottles, knives etc etc so avoid if at all possible (all been covered here before) .. best of luck with it

Doug Cartel

aidan13 wrote: »

Personally Wing Chun is the best form of self defence as its designed for a smaller person to be able to deal with a bigger attacker.

So much better than those other arts designed to allow a larger person defeat a smaller opponent.

simon-king

Doug Cartel wrote: »

So much better than those other arts designed to allow a larger person defeat a smaller opponent.

Secrets of the fatty fat arts .. I'm a black belt ..

paganist

I was never bullied myself, I always wanted to be the guy who got bullied and then one day out of nowhere beat the **** out of the bullies because of some super secret training.
But realistically this wouldn't happen. It would take a period of time to become proficient enough to lay down a beating on someone.
If you take up a traditional style martial art be careful of getting too much confidence in your newfound abilities.
I would recommend boxing for the longterm results.

Hanley

I still think training in "self defence" leaves you MORE LIKELY to end up in a fight, because all of a sudden you know how to handle yourself, or think you do, and get over confident in situations you'd usually back away from. And just end up getting smashed.

Baggio...

Unfortunately there's no such thing as "magic pill" no matter what anyone tells you. It's about training, training and more training...And even then, there's still no guarantees.

Try a few different clubs, and then pick the one you like best.

Peetrik

Hanley wrote: »

I still think training in "self defence" leaves you MORE LIKELY to end up in a fight, because all of a sudden you know how to handle yourself, or think you do, and get over confident in situations you'd usually back away from. And just end up getting smashed.

I think this can be quite true IF your not doing full contact non complient sparring. If your doing full contact sparring then this doesnt happen as if your crap... you get knocked around. Its unplesant but IMO the only real way to learn. You need to get caught with a right hook a few dozen times before you learn to keep your guard hand up etc etc...

As Baggio said, there is no magic pill, find somewhere to trian hard, go at least 3 times a week, seek out spars with the bigger more skilled fighters. You will get knocked around, you will get hurt, you will learn how to fight.

Michael O Leary

Gigilowgonewild wrote: »

looking for a good self defence sport maybe wing chun, but i cant seem to find a professional place in my area im from kilkenny and have no way of travelling anywhere else out of the county.

Hi,

What about this place? They teach Wing Chun in Kilkenny.
http://www.schoolofchinesemartialarts.com/default.html

Regards,

Michael
www.wingtsun-blanchardstown.ie
www.wingtsun-sligo.ie
www.wingtsun-ni.com
www.wingtsunireland.com

Baggio...

As Peetrik has mentioned you've got to get your hands dirty...That is to say:

1) Work in a non-compliant environment.
2) Hit the heavy bag - get your Muay Thai or boxing mechanics down (DO NOT hit air, as it's totally useless for developing power and terrible for your joints).
3) Get used to being hit and hitting people (through full contact).
4) Lift some weights and get fit as you can.

If your interested in "self-defense" aspect - You should do a bit of research on how street attacks occur.
Then incorporate a few drills into your own training (whatever style it may be). That way, you can "pressure test" your skills and strategy to see how effective they are. Don't get suckered into believing that there are one or two "dirty shots" that will make an opponent magically fall down. In all likelihood you going to have to knock a guy out - Real fighting is not as easy at it looks in the martial arts books or mags. Personally, I would also avoid any "weekend courses" that make unsubstantiated, but yet very bold claims - that guarantee your personal protection, etc...,etc....

Make sure your looking at drills that involve FULL CONTACT:

1) Opponent's that use deception - most crims wont want you to see it coming in the first place.
2) Multiple opponents - unfortunately, they may have mates to even up the odds.
3) Weapons - while weapon attacks are very rare it has to be said - it can happen.
4) Start looking at the psychology of fear/violence, etc.

As I've said earlier... it's all about training and more training. John Kavanagh made a great point a while ago (I'm paraphrasing it here), that If your only training for "self-defense" you'll probably just give up in the end, if your not really enjoying your training.

I totally relate to that...While I train for "self-protection" purposes, I train because I love to do it. If I just did it for the "self-defense" aspect, but wasn't really enjoying teaching or training, it would have then become just another chore, and I'd probably just give up long ago.

Best advice is to make sure your not there in the first place - use common sense when your out and about, and don't let yourself get baited into a scrap . Avoidance and escape is the best strategy you can have. The physical option should always be your last resort. All physical contact, even if you prevail will have negative consequences (police, Come backs, injury - the list goes on and on).

OLDMAN1

aidan13 wrote: »

Theres a brilliant Wing Chun club in Carlow, is there anyway you could make it to that?

Personally Wing Chun is the best form of self defence as its designed for a smaller person to be able to deal with a bigger attacker.

The guy who teaches it doesn't come any better. He got accepted into the American Black Belt hall of fame a few months ago for Wing Chun.

He also won a huge award ther after Christmas, he recieved "International Sifu of the year award."

It would be great if you could make it up for that. PM me if you have any questions or need any details.

Who is he?

Irish_Elect_Eng

Gigilowgonewild wrote: »

Hi, i've gottin bullied since i was in secondry school and to this day i still cant fight for fools gold its embarrasing and i really want to learn to defend myself incase i get into a situation, im 19 and have tried tai kwa( but my trainer for that was useless) and i also did kickboxing but i didn't really like it, im really tall and slim build, and looking for a good self defence sport maybe wing chun, but i cant seem to find a professional place in my area im from kilkenny and have no way of travelling anywhere else out of the county. if you know a good place please write the number and place below thanks alot P.S please only post if there proper trainers dont want any cowboys thanks.

To be honest, the most potent weapon to avoid bullying and intimidation is that hole between your ears :-) learn to use it well and you can disarm conflict in most situations. By the time you get to show them what a great fighter you have become you have already lost the battle i.e. you are in a fight, with all the problems that entails.

Learn a martial art by all means, as a method of building confidence in your abilities and yourself, but do not be fooled into believing that the combat skills will do anything to stop a bully actually picking on you if you behave like a victim.

paganist

Peetrik wrote: »

I think this can be quite true IF your not doing full contact non complient sparring.

Irish_Elect_Eng- To be honest, the most potent weapon to avoid bullying and intimidation is that hole between your ears :-)

both these guys say it best

Michael O Leary

OLDMAN1 wrote: »

Who is he?

Carlow - www.carlowmartialarts.org/content/

Wing Tsun/Chun in Ireland

Bangor - www.ebmas-wing-tzun.co.uk/
Belfast - www.wingtsun-ni.com
Belfast - www.niwckfa.org/
Blanchardstown - www.wingtsun-blanchardstown.ie
Cork - www.wingchunireland.com
Carlow - www.carlowmartialarts.org/content/
Dingle - www.wing-tsun.name/
Dublin City Centre - www.wingtsunireland.com
Dublin City Centre - www.wingtsun.webs.com
Dublin Dalkey - www.kungfudublin.com
Dublin Finglas - www.wingtsunireland.com
Dublin Finglas - www.kungfudublin.com
Dublin Shankill - www.kungfudublin.com
Galway - www.facebook.com/#!/pages/Wing-Chun-Kung-Fu-Club-Galway/183878558302872
Kilkenny - www.schoolofchinesemartialarts.com
Killarney - www.wing-tsun.name
Lisburn - www.chumsut.com
Listowel - www.wing-tsun.name
Meath - www.sanshouireland.webs.com/apps/blog/
Sligo - www.wingtsun-sligo.ie
Tralee - www.wing-tsun.name
Warrenpoint - www.fightingways.com/wpmu/

OLDMAN1

Michael O Leary wrote: »

Carlow - www.carlowmartialarts.org/content/


Bangor - www.ebmas-wing-tzun.co.uk/
Belfast - www.wingtsun-ni.com
Belfast - www.niwckfa.org/
Blanchardstown - www.wingtsun-blanchardstown.ie
Cork - www.wingchunireland.com
Carlow - www.carlowmartialarts.org/content/
Dingle - www.wing-tsun.name/
Dublin City Centre - www.wingtsunireland.com/dublin-city-center-school/
Dublin City Centre - www.wingtsun.webs.com
Dublin Dalkey - www.kungfudublin.com
Dublin Finglas - www.wingtsunireland.com/dublin-finglas-school/
Dublin Finglas - www.kungfudublin.com
Dublin Shankill - www.kungfudublin.com
Galway - www.facebook.com/#!/pages/Wing-Chun-Kung-Fu-Club-Galway/183878558302872
Kilkenny - www.schoolofchinesemartialarts.com
Killarney - www.wing-tsun.name
Lisburn - www.chumsut.com
Listowel - www.wing-tsun.name
Meath - http://sanshouireland.webs.com/apps/blog/
Sligo - www.wingtsun-sligo.ie
Tralee - www.wing-tsun.name
Warrenpoint - www.fightingways.com/wpmu/

Does he still teach Wing Chun, he is also listed as the instructor of the Naas Wado ryu karate club..

Disco Volante

Hi there,

You could think about the possibility of doing Traditional Japanese Jiu Jitsu in Dragons Lair and there is also MMA on offer great club and some of the most experienced instructors in town!

Facebook Linky!

slammer187

If your reasons are because of bullying,

Why not look into training in social dynamics as opposed to self defense?

Prevention is better than a cure

Rickson1

Get yourself back to that kickboxing gym and pound away at pads until you feel ready to spar.
Then get your arse down to your nearest BJJ gym. If there isn't one, go to judo as an alternative.
But for your 'problem', go to kickboxing. You ain't gonna be judo-throwing guys in the street. You will be punching, kicking and kneeing. So kickboxing it is my friend.

Doug Cartel

Rickson1 wrote: »

You ain't gonna be judo-throwing guys in the street.

As a judo guy, I'll admit I can't ever see myself throwing guys round the streets like rag-dolls, but one important thing that you learn while doing judo is how to stay on your feet while some aggressive eejit grabs you and does their best to shove you to the ground. I think that's a very important skill to have if you want to keep safe.

You will be punching, kicking and kneeing. So kickboxing it is my friend.

Possibly, but if the punches have started flying, then you're in a bad situation and luck is going to play as big a part as anything else. As has been said already, learning to recognise danger and diffuse situations would be your best bet.

Jokers

The School of Chinese Martial Arts in Kilkenny is excellent with a major focus on self defence. I used to train there but unfortunately had to quit training.

http://www.schoolofchinesemartialarts.com/

Chris Dowling

Hmmm hope I don't upset the people here by posting a Kilkenny Club on this Wing Chung Ireland Thread, opps wait this is a thread looking for a club in Kilkenny, guess I'm ok then


Dragons Lair is in Hebron come along have a look or try a class we do , Kickboxing, K1, Boxing, Jiu-Jitsu and MMA might have something to suit you if not no harm.

www.dragonslair.ie


Best of luck in your search

Peetrik

Chris Dowling wrote: »

Hmmm hope I don't upset the people here by posting a Kilkenny Club on this Wing Chung Ireland Thread

hahaha

Khannie

Rickson1 wrote: »

You ain't gonna be judo-throwing guys in the street. You will be punching, kicking and kneeing.

I almost certainly wouldn't kick anyone in a row on the street. You're in too much of an "unstable equilibrium" or whatever. The cost / benefit is highly in favour of punches and the occasional elbow / knee depending on proximity.

Peetrik

Khannie wrote: »

I almost certainly wouldn't kick anyone in a row on the street

From what Iv heard it took a lot of work to get you to kick someone in the ring too
Kidding of course Khannie, Iv seen you fight and your a monster in the ring.

What about low kicks however? plenty of striking arts (most even?) use a sideways stance leaving that lead leg ready to be hacked at.

Massimo Giorgianni

What about low kicks however?

I don't know about the side kick, but the front one in the balls works wonderfully; my attacker was still coming forward after my shot but after a second or two his face changed expression and he went down slowly slowly:D ..maybe I was lucky but i keep a good idea about this kind of kick

arybvtcw0eolkf

Doug Cartel wrote: »

As a judo guy, I'll admit I can't ever see myself throwing guys round the streets like rag-dolls, but one important thing that you learn while doing judo is how to stay on your feet while some aggressive eejit grabs you and does their best to shove you to the ground. I think that's a very important skill to have if you want to keep safe.


Possibly, but if the punches have started flying, then you're in a bad situation and luck is going to play as big a part as anything else. As has been said already, learning to recognise danger and diffuse situations would be your best bet.

Ok I originally come from a kickboxing background, and as a doorman with almost 20 years experience I can talk with the benefit of that experience.

I'll start of by saying I'm not a bully, and I've never been to court. However I've had to justify my actions to a cop more than once.

So ya, door work and KB. It used to be the case when the sh*t hit the fan I'd be up on my toes banging, its ugly and shocks people - and rightly so, people should never experience violence.

Then 10 years ago I worked with a Judoka, when a row would start he was straight down to business with his judo/grappling and always warning me "that kickboxing sh*t will put you in court"..

Roll on ten years, I'm still on the door. Stopped KB and took up Judo - whats the difference - well your right, your not going to do fancy throws or fancy foot sweeps. But once someone decides to be unco-operative they'll know they're in trouble from your grips & strength, you'll surprise yourself at how quickly you'll automatically (and easily) take someone down with Osoto Gari, Harai Goshi or an Ogoshi - and if you think about it, the beauty of these throws are they're throws you worked on your little buds as a child messing around tripping each other up!. (think about that one!).

One final thing, the RNC - probably the most efficient way of knocking someone out!.

Khannie

Peetrik wrote: »

From what Iv heard it took a lot of work to get you to kick someone in the ring too

Haha. Used to be alright. I've gotten over that hump thankfully.

peetrik wrote:

What about low kicks however? plenty of striking arts (most even?) use a sideways stance leaving that lead leg ready to be hacked at.

Yeah....I mean you could use them. From what I've seen of street fights though, they tend to be over before the damage you've inflicted from a leg kick would become telling enough. Honestly, I've never been in a random after the pub row on the street but the ones I've seen all seem to be about going for the big KO and people are messed up tired 30 seconds in if the fight is still going.

Niall Keane

Below I have posted the 48 Methods of Ba Gua Zhang, one of the Nei Jia (internal) Arts (Hsing I Chuan and Tai Chi Chuan being two other examples). Anyway Bagua has often concerned itself with "street fighting" one of its centers being Beijing. I guess some references will be obsecure unless you are used to Nei Jia jargon but perhaps there's some useful advice....

If you find them useful, you should search out the other Ba Gua, Hsing I and Tai Chi classics... stuff you can revisit forever!

1. Shen Fa -- The Body Method:

The body is like a swimming dragon, a wild goose soaring in the air. Zigzagging, curved and straight, it moves like a snake. Overturn, roll, revolve and turn are dominated by the waist. Move to the corners and side-to-side, advance and retreat, talking and laughing in the center.

2. Mu Ce - Range Estimation:

To resist the enemy when you cross hands, you must first estimate the range. If there is no movement, gaze at the man's shoulder. Calmly and carefully examine his posture. Seek out the way to go. Reconnoitre and reflect. Only the eyes look forward.

3. Yanming - Sharp Eyes:

The heart's emotions are reflected in the eyes like a mirror. See the situation create the emotion, then the posture responds. If you are very fearful and the mind is confused, your eyes will not follow. The hands will be occupied, the feet confused, and you will lose your cleverness

4. Xianxing - In Advance:

The eyes first seek out the enemy's condition. The four sides and eight directions need to be observed clearly. Allow your movement to change irregularly many times. What enters my eye, I instantly understand.

5. Shen Shi - Careful Posture:

The eyes watch the four directions, form and posture are understood. The ears hear in eight directions, movement and stillness are known. The feet tread the eight trigrams, walk the complete circle. Look ahead and behind, capture the enemy's emotion.

6. Bu Fa - Stepping Method:

If you wish to move the extrmeities, the root must move first. Quick hands are inferior to agile stepping. Turning, moving, entering, yeilding only require half a step. The outer boundary is peaceful, the whole form changes.

7. Ta Zong Men - Tread the Center Gate:

Stride forward like a tiger and with the aspect of a hero. Advance and retreat, look around, look for the enemy's trace. The feet tread the center gate and interlink with the enemy's path. The enemy has to defend against strikes to the center.

8. Xie Chu Cheng Ru - Diagonal Leaving, Straight Entering:

With footsteps firm and stable, seek adroit movement. By advancing, retreating, turning, and shifting, seek out the enemy's path. Walking follows the triangle. The toes grip the ground. Diagonal leaving, straight entering, is wonderful and unlimited.

9. Xu Jin - Continuous Advancing:

Develop an offensive posture, the enemy can not move back. Continue advancing with strikes that are difficult to evade. Step and advance the body, then step to the front. The hands, feet, and body must be one and arrive together.

10. Lian Zhui - Continuous Chasing:

I advance. If the enemy retreats, I must follow. One step or two steps, I am continuously stepping to follow. Closely press the enemy so there is no way for him to flee. Continuously advance, victory comes in one step.

11. Xu shi - Empty and Full:

For agile movement in the legs, empty and full need to be understood If you relax the rules then you will be double weighted and sluggish. With changing movements and turning movements the empty foot is agile. With the weight in the full foot, steadiness is preserved.

12. Jin-tui - Advance and Retreat:

The enemy retreats, I advance with my front foot first. The enemy advances, I retreat by moving with my rear foot. The stepping method of advancing and retreating must be agile, Turning, changing, and transforming in accordance with the enemy's emotion

13. Zhang Fa - Palm Method:

In attack and defence, both palms must be lively. The rear palm goes out and the front palm returns. The tiger's mouth and ox's tongue work together: "Follow the curve to arrive at the straight", understand the body's peril.

14. Gong Fang Xiang Ji - Mutual Attack and Defence:

In mutual attack and defence you must remember firmness. My hand goes out, and defends against the man's strike. Advance to attack, defend and ward-off, turn and transform quickly. When you can attack and be successful in defence, your skill starts to become high.

15. Gong Fang Huying - Attack and Defence Working Together:

The hands, going out and blocking, have to work together. Issuing is not correct and yet it is not presumptuous to issue. The postures of attack and defence change many times. Issuing is not the main thing. You must defend against the opponent's issuing.

16. Zhao Fa - Technique Method:

The front arm reaches straight, forming the tiger's mouth. The rear arm hides the ox tongue. Swallowing and spitting, opening and closing, flow with the enemy's emotion. Work together with change, close the enemy's posture.

17. Fa Jing - Issuing Energy:

Store up energy till plentiful, like a bent bow. Issue energy like an arrow, swiftly away from the bowstring. With a single purpose, in one direction, strength issues from the back. Have a sunk appearance, be relaxed completely, qi ought to be first.

18. Yin Shi Li Dao - Adroitly Guiding Action According to Circumstances:

If he is high, strike him low. If he is low, strike him high. With a fat man, strike at him from either corner. If you meet someone long and thin, press toward the inside. The old man cannot move to block.

19. Jie Zhao - Make Contact and Gesture:

The enemy man comes gesturing. Don't block or frame him. Flow with his incoming posture only once. Moving or still, quick or slow, you must close and slap. Follow curve, move toward the straight, multiply his defects.

20. Jie Na - Explaining Seizing:

Qin Na must use a double hand motion. Both hands seize, oneself is empty. No matter what, Qin Na flows with his motion. Pierce the nose or jab the eyeballs and the enemy's posture relaxes.

21. Jie Na - Explaining Seizing:

He seizes me and the flowing posture moves. The flowing posture moves and the seized posture is empty. Even if his Qin Na is very adroit, My movement follows the man and the seize has no skill.

22. Bu Zhong Qin Na - Do Not Stress Seizing:

The Bagua palm method does not stress seizing. If both your hands, seize you suffer a setback. You are only seizing the man and it is not like striking. Depress and bend the man over, many changes are not advisable.

23. Feng Bi - Seal and Close:

The issuing hand flows and follows the enemy's intention to move. To seal and close the enemy I need a lot of skill. If I can seal firmly the posture of the enemy, Victory employs having my hand in the center.

24. Feng Bi - Seal and Close:

Perhaps he has weapons in both hands and is quick like the wind. With one coming and one going, he displays remarkable skill. Close his left hand then his right hand is not used. Both hands coming at the same time is emptyness.

25. Huan Zhao - Returning Techniques:

Sealing and closing strongly is a technique for 'defending the body'. Vigorously seal the man's techniques and do a technique in return. Stick continuously, following and leading the enemy's techniques. Be neither too close nor too far, flow with the enemy's techniques.

26. Yi Gao Yi Zhao - High Skill of One Move:

The strong are victorious over the weak, and their strength shows off their ability. The quick strike the slow, and their skill is in their speed. In these cases the High Skill of One Move is very much needed. Bind their hands and bind their feet to control them.

27. Rangkai Gong Shi - Defend by Getting Out of the Way:

If the other party has the strength of 1000 pounds, issue quickly. If his incoming posture is as violent as a mountain slide, Get out of the way and attack, take advantage of his gaps. Be decisive and mobile, swiftly do a technique in return.

28. Xie Shan - Diagonal Dodging:

The enemy comes in straight and quick like an arrow. First issue to control the his brave and fierce posture. Only meet this emotion, it is not appropriate to retreat. Diagonally moving, dodge and yeild like a spirit.

29. Bu Lan Bu Jia - Don't Block, Don't Frame:

Even when the enemy's posture is ruthless, you have no fear. He strikes at you and you defend against him. Toe out on the diagonal, the way is close. Don't block, don't frame, only once.

30. You Di - Lead the Enemy:

When the enemy doesn't attack, I use motion to draw him out. When his attack comes, I walk to the empty space. I do not rely on hand methods, I rely on stepping methods. Enticed to advance, he falls into air and is subject to my control.

31. Hua Jie - Transformation Understood:

Vertical can understand horizontal, horizontal understands vertical. When a split comes from an oblique angle, I split him. When a leg comes, if the leg is understood, you understand and then attack. The hands and legs go out and steps turn many times.

32. Yuan Xing Hua Jie - Circular Transformation Understood:

He surrounds me and I surround him. With circular turning and walking he can onlyt attack air. Surround, surround one posture, the trail is not fixed. Completely rely on the stepping method and powerful walking.

33. Xie Zheng Huan Hua - Diagonal and True Transformed:

There is straightness within diagonal and diagonalness within straight. The diagonal/true transformation truly is wonderful. When you meet a strong enemy, a strong attack is demanded. Hide suprises within suprises, and the enemy falls into a trap.

34. Zhi Ren - Control the Man:

To control a man, one ought to pierce up towards his eyes. If both eyes suffer damage, then the enemy will be in a bind. The importance of the damage suffered, though small in degree, is not understood. A poke in the eyes is a victory of 1,000 techniques.

35. Dong Jie - Movement Understood:

Use stillness to control motion, leasurely await the work. Use motion to control stillness, rely on skill. The man doesn't know me, but I know the man. Meet strength with wisdom, seek the weak with flaunting techniques.

36. Kai He - Open and CLose:

If you desire to close, the correct form is to open first. Observe that open defends, and closed can know the power. Open is in the center of closed and closed is in the center of open. They can meet at the origin and instantly know minutia.

37. Qu Shou You Zhun - The Outgoing Hand Is the Standard:

It does not matter if he has 1,000 techniques and quickness in 1,000 things; If he is not able to be centered, his effort are in vain. Not stopping is important and not sending out hand. The outgoing hand must instantly be in the enemy's center.

38. Shulian: Skilled/practiced/proficient:

Attack and defend, advance and retreat, because the postures are different. 100 refinements make steel, bitter practice makes you complete. First aim towards being firm and solid, seek to be level and straight. Spiritual wonder is transformed, skill is created in the center.

39. Lingmin - Sensitive/keen/agile/acute:

If the mind is sensitive, its tranformations are inexhaustable. If the eyes are sharp, they can make out the enemy's emotion. If the stepping is agile, the mechanical power is adaptable. If the hand is keen, controling the enemy is the standard.

40. Tu Na - Giving and Receiving:

Inhaling and exhaling, giving and receiving, are controlled from the nose. First it flows throught the Du Mai. Then continues to the Ren Mai to complete the cycle. Qi moves through the body, the will directs its motion.

41. Lizheng Zhudong - Work Hard for the Initiative:

When fighting, you must be able to endure the enemy's atttack. First seek to be invincible, then return the attack. If the posture and surroundings are inferior, toe out and escape. The center having moved, strive for the initiative.

42. Ceshen - On Ones Side:

In the Snake Form Palm, the posture the body overturns to the side. The body must have a twisting movement to use the Snake Form. Both arms go out straight to protect the skull. Expanding and contracting, turning sideways, Snake Spits out its Tongue.

43. Niu Yao - Twist the Waist:

When the enemy attacks, I stick to his body. My hands and feet return to defend and transform him. Turning and revolving, left and right, the waist twists and turns. Take a turn for the better and be out of danger; defeat demands victory.

44. Dang Ji Ji Fa - Prompt Issuing:

The mind takes charge of life, the eyes gaze. The hands and feet coordinate for carefull attack and defence. Search for the man's gaps, strive for motion. Issue promptly, don't hesitate.

45. Bi Shi Ji Xu - Avoid the Enemy's Strength, Strike at his Weakness:

When the enemy punches at your face, Take the lower way and instantly open up. Take him by suprise, unprepared for the attack. Avoid his strength and attack his weak points, victory comes.

46. Ji Ting - Avoid Stopping:

The chaotic original one qi walks heaven's limits. Walking, but not walking too far, the feet change and transform. Bagua's functional movement consists of the walking movements. Standing fixed when convenient becomes fallen flowers.

47. Luo Kong Bu Wen - Fall into Emptyness No Disorder:

Stepping must be lively and the gestures must be accurate. Then, to use 'Falling into Emptiness', the mind must not be disorderly. Curves interlink with curves and are never used up. When there are circles within circles, transformation is created.

48. Li Yi Wei Xian - Ceremony and Righteousness take Precedence:

Esteem virtue, esteem ceremony, don't esteem strength. Esteem wisdom, esteem righteousness, don't esteem bravery. Esteem strength, esteem bravery, strength is the core of strength. When your skill is high, then with one touch, your enemy falls intno emptiness.

Dathai

I tried Wing Tsun, Taekwondo, kickboxing, Aikido and muay thai from ages 8 - 16. I was a fat kid that pretty much just wanted to lay into someone as quick as possible and protect myself if I was in a situation that required it.

By far the most practical martial arts were kickboxing and muay thai.
Both taught me good ways of defending myself (clinch, blocking punches and kicks, punching and kicking) and gave me the fitness to be actually able to run away if I was in a situation where fighting was not an option (ie: someone pulling out a knife).

I'll be trying to get back to muay thai soon, once I can get time (due to work and college).

Not to disrespect anyone that does WingTsun here, but I found it very impractical for self defence. I suppose when you are fighting someone else who does wing tsun or a similar martial art, it may be effective. But I couldn't see anything that I had learnt that would actually protect me if I was in a fight.

I felt the same about Aikido, as much as the throws and some of the locks were pretty good, I just felt what I had learnt wasn't going to serve me well if I had to defend myself outside of the class.

slammer187 wrote: »

If your reasons are because of bullying,

Why not look into training in social dynamics as opposed to self defense?

Prevention is better than a cure

Not sure if you're joking here or not, but I can't honestly see how this guy studying the emotional or socially dysfunctional reasons about the man who wants to punch him in the face repeatedly and take his phone / wallet is going to help him much. Common sense tells you to stay away from dodgy looking people and raising better children prevents them from becoming bullies.

whadabouchasir

Khannie wrote: »

I almost certainly wouldn't kick anyone in a row on the street. You're in too much of an "unstable equilibrium" or whatever. The cost / benefit is highly in favour of punches and the occasional elbow / knee depending on proximity.

I don't know the extra reach of a kick could be an advantage,the kick would of course have to be thrown very quickly,but I can see a teep or side kick being very useful.As you said you would be vulnerable whilst throwing the kick,but unless your a very novice kickboxer,mt or taekwondo fighter then an untrained person won't have a hope of catching that kick and you should be able to dodge them if they rush you.

Massimo Giorgianni

Dathai wrote: »

Not to disrespect anyone that does WingTsun here, but I found it very impractical for self defence. I suppose when you are fighting someone else who does wing tsun or a similar martial art, it may be effective. But I couldn't see anything that I had learnt that would actually protect me if I was in a fight.

I felt the same about Aikido, as much as the throws and some of the locks were pretty good, I just felt what I had learnt wasn't going to serve me well if I had to defend myself outside of the class.


I have trained in Thai, Kick, and few grappling styles and they are for sure good values. I would not throw away Wingtsun that fast though, as it has its ranges of punch/kicks/knees/elbow and clinches/grab too. It's true that it takes a bit longer to have results, but for having experienced my WT in sparrings with ring fighters and outside ( unfortunately ) I can tell it works good.

Ug Lee

Dathai wrote: »

I tried Wing Tsun, Taekwondo, kickboxing, Aikido and muay thai from ages 8 - 16.

Not to disrespect anyone that does WingTsun here, but I found it very impractical for self defence. I suppose when you are fighting someone else who does wing tsun or a similar martial art, it may be effective. But I couldn't see anything that I had learnt that would actually protect me if I was in a fight.

Don't know if I am reading this right but did you do Wing Tsun between 8 - 16? I think there was only one school teaching kids. This is what is now called EBMAS - Wing Tzun in Finglas. Is that the one? What grade did you get to?

Niall Keane

Really its not about arts, theres a Wing Tsun guy who posts here "Oldman" who has trained fighters to be successful in sanshou / kuoshu, and that involves kicks, punches, elbows, knees and throws. Throws are time limited to, depending on the competition, between 3 - 5 seconds, so very practical for self defence.

Neiter is it about coaches, I give two class types, one is sanshou orientated, I teach 3 times a week 2 hour classes, a senior student does another day 2hours, and they all meet up and train another 3-5 times a week, and we get results, with high achievements and rankings in international sanshou.
I also teach university students, they do a class a week with me, this is to increase to 2, some of them turn up to the occasional wudang sanshou class, but there is no comparison in skill, power or toughness terms, so same style, same teacher... worlds apart in ability!

Certainly if you turn up to do a "fun" class you cannot expect proper results! Becoming a skilled fighter is not an easy task, it demands serious time and sacrifice, during my college years I went out on the rip maybe 3 times a year!
Fighter classes are tough, well the ones that produce good fighters, there is no such thing as light sparring, or trying a few techniques, you train until you feel sick! pain and injury are constant reminders to get better! there wont be many people there, because fighters, real fighters are a rare breed, its not going to pay the bills if you are a coach! Take the Vos Gym famous for producing many Muay Thai and K1 fighters, one of my students trains there too. A fighter class has about 6-10 there, that's it, te public classes have 100's attending a few timesa week, that's what pays for the gym! and I guess the purses these days. Most coaches I know who tran fighters sub it with classes for kids, or general open classes, but the training is diametrically different they dont really want to smash up and scare off clients.
this is probably going to annoy some people, letting the cat out of the bag so to speak, after all the dream of becoming Bruce "dont f**k with me" Lee it what brings students through doors, but unfortunately like in "The Commitments" forming aa circle, turning to the right and patting each other on the back is what keeps most people paying and coming back!
put it this way, I warm up every fighter class with 1500 "rolling thunder" punches in 9 minutes, this is followed by another 40 minutes of high intensity bag and pad work, take downs and striking combos/ counters/ recoveries incorporating sound tactics for another 30 minutes and then 50 minutes of wrestling and sanshou heavy sparing. Most martial arts classes I've witnessed well the average student wouldn't throw 1500 punches in a month, maybe a year?

So yes you need the envirnoment, an effective art, a coach who knows what he's talking about and like minded b@st@rds to train with who are there to win, but all of this can be found in most styles, I teach Tai Chi Chuan, who would think given most of the Tai Chi out there is was of any use?
But mostly you have to step up and make yourself a fighter, if the desire is there, and the will is strong enough and you dont expect to be a master in 6 weeks, (kung Fu means time and effort) and you are willing to pay with injury and pain for such skills you will find a place that will meet your demands. If you are just looking for the image, and a stroy down the pub, I'm also pretty sure that there are those who'll more than happily empty your pockets for a few sashes etc...

Rickson1

Doug Cartel wrote: »

As a judo guy, I'll admit I can't ever see myself throwing guys round the streets like rag-dolls, but one important thing that you learn while doing judo is how to stay on your feet while some aggressive eejit grabs you and does their best to shove you to the ground. I think that's a very important skill to have if you want to keep safe.


Possibly, but if the punches have started flying, then you're in a bad situation and luck is going to play as big a part as anything else. As has been said already, learning to recognise danger and diffuse situations would be your best bet.

100% agree there with you. The level of balance you get from Judo is great and can be put to good use in a fight.
As you say, recognising the threat and avoiding it is best. Worst case scenario, you do the basic Gracie fight - clinch, outer reap, mount, punch and then when they tun their back choke them. Best formula for a street fight. Had to do it myself unfortunately and it worked perfect.

Dathai

Ug Lee wrote: »

Don't know if I am reading this right but did you do Wing Tsun between 8 - 16? I think there was only one school teaching kids. This is what is now called EBMAS - Wing Tzun in Finglas. Is that the one? What grade did you get to?

I didn't study all those martial arts at the same time. I did Wing Tsun when I was about 11 for about a year or so before moving on to Kickboxing. I never graded officially.

SorGan

Doug Cartel wrote: »

As a judo guy, I'll admit I can't ever see myself throwing guys round the streets like rag-dolls, but one important thing that you learn while doing judo is how to stay on your feet while some aggressive eejit grabs you and does their best to shove you to the ground. I think that's a very important skill to have if you want to keep safe.

why not? i would be under the impression an untrained guy vs a judoka would be a vast mismatch?

Doug Cartel

SorGan wrote: »

why not? i would be under the impression an untrained guy vs a judoka would be a vast mismatch?

Well first of all I'm not a very big guy, I'm not actually that great at judo and above all else things are always more likely to go wrong than to go right.