Does anyone have unemployment figures or figures on last years PGDEs?

Lord TSC

Just wondering if anyone has any of the following facts or figures?

* Current Teacher Unemployment Numbers.
* The number of PGDE students who did the course last year and are now unemployed.

Someone I know is abusing me, saying the reason I'm not teaching is cause I am a lazy bugger who is not looking for a job (obviously not true; sending out CVs constantly, scouring papers and websites, etc). Was hoping to find the real facts and figures though so I have a factual base to stand on :rolleyes:

peanuthead

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Just wondering if anyone has any of the following facts or figures?

* Current Teacher Unemployment Numbers.
* The number of PGDE students who did the course last year and are now unemployed.

Someone I know is abusing me, saying the reason I'm not teaching is cause I am a lazy bugger who is not looking for a job (obviously not true; sending out CVs constantly, scouring papers and websites, etc). Was hoping to find the real facts and figures though so I have a factual base to stand on :rolleyes:

TeamshadowClan, what are your subjects?

Have you registered with educationposts.ie?

I would say the only way to get those figures is if or when the uni's get in touch with the students of last year and ask each one of them.

But, what are your subjects?

tvnutz

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Someone I know is abusing me, saying the reason I'm not teaching is cause I am a lazy bugger who is not looking for a job (obviously not true; sending out CVs constantly, scouring papers and websites, etc). Was hoping to find the real facts and figures though so I have a factual base to stand on :rolleyes:

Obviously a clown,hate people like this. I did the dip last year,havn't gotten a job. In fairness my subjects are pretty shit for jobs,not really in demand (History and Religion). Have all the websites,sent out well over a hundred CVs,only got one interview. Willing to do anything at this point,that FAS thing if it ever came online.

Lord TSC

peanuthead wrote: »

TeamshadowClan, what are your subjects?

Have you registered with educationposts.ie?

I would say the only way to get those figures is if or when the uni's get in touch with the students of last year and ask each one of them.

But, what are your subjects?

English.

I did the CSPE methods in the PGDE but all I've got is English, which is probably the worst lone subject I can have. I know one person posted a little while back that the TC had said the worst combo to have was Eng/Geo, but at least someone with that has two subjects

I have registered. I'd be amazed if the Unis did conduct such a research tbh, since it would involve possibly proving a negative aspect of the way they currently run the course (taking in 1000 new student teachers every year, further saturating the job market).

niall3r

Im not trying to be offensive here but just out of curiosity why do people stay in Ireland unemployed when there are job prospects abroad? I had my mind made up that I was going to England this year (first after the dip) because of the job situation when my current position was offered to me.

A friend of mine counldnt find a job anywhere near where he, his wife and children are based. He was offered a position halfway across the country and so he now only gets to see them weekends.

Why do people not go to England or elsewhere)

(this really really isnt being judgemental, it is genuine curiosity.)

peanuthead

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

English.

I did the CSPE methods in the PGDE but all I've got is English, which is probably the worst lone subject I can have. I know one person posted a little while back that the TC had said the worst combo to have was Eng/Geo, but at least someone with that has two subjects

I have registered. I'd be amazed if the Unis did conduct such a research tbh, since it would involve possibly proving a negative aspect of the way they currently run the course (taking in 1000 new student teachers every year, further saturating the job market).

This is key, although I don't think it points out a negative aspect to the course in regards to how its run, rather the employment possibilities (or lack of) afterwards.

With English, yes you are at a disadvantage. I am English too, but it was my second subject, a language, that got me my job. However, I had resigned myself to the fact that if I didn't get a job that I would further develop myself as an English teacher.

Yes, English teachers are two a penny, so you have to make yourself stand out. Do drama courses, shakespeare/creative writing/poetry workshops, etc.. make yourself an expert in your field and don't waste your time at home.

Now I know I don't know you, maybe you are doing all of this. I also know that all that costs money, but volunteer to help out in a youth club or something. Because when jobs come available, those who were out doing something constructive with their year, rather than moping will be the first ones snapped up imo.

Not a lecture, just advice. I know how hard it is to find work and my heart goes out to you.

peanuthead

niall3r wrote: »

Im not trying to be offensive here but just out of curiosity why do people stay in Ireland unemployed when there are job prospects abroad? I had my mind made up that I was going to England this year (first after the dip) because of the job situation when my current position was offered to me.

A friend of mine counldnt find a job anywhere near where he, his wife and children are based. He was offered a position halfway across the country and so he now only gets to see them weekends.

Why do people not go to England or elsewhere)

(this really really isnt being judgemental, it is genuine curiosity.)

Well, niall, there are many reasons people don't do that.

Off the top of my head, I know some people in the following situations:

• Terminally ill family member
  
• Only subject is Irish - no good for teaching abroad, but admittedly could do other work
  
• Commitments here that means they can't go away such as a single person with a mortgage.

But I do agree that there are many who could go and just won't. And that is fine, but then there is no reason for complaining.

Lord TSC

niall3r wrote: »

Im not trying to be offensive here but just out of curiosity why do people stay in Ireland unemployed when there are job prospects abroad? I had my mind made up that I was going to England this year (first after the dip) because of the job situation when my current position was offered to me.

A friend of mine counldnt find a job anywhere near where he, his wife and children are based. He was offered a position halfway across the country and so he now only gets to see them weekends.

Why do people not go to England or elsewhere)

(this really really isnt being judgemental, it is genuine curiosity.)

For me, I hate the attitude in this country whereby when times get tough, youth are encouraged to emigrate. I don't have figures but I remember reading recently that despite the fact unemployment figures are higher in Italy and (iirc) Spain, the emigration rates are drastically lower than ours; that the idea of simply cutting all ties with your family and moving abroad is one they simply cannot grasp. I just hate the thought process that since things are bad here, we must abandon the country and look abroad. I hate the government for putting us into a position whereby moving abroad is such a strong option due to lack of others, and I hate that people just accept that it's one. I have no intentions of abandoning my family and friends and moving abroad.

There's every reason to complain about that. For people not to complain means they accept that it is ok for a country to **** over it's own youth by destroying the economy and failing to create jobs. I understand why some people feel the need to move abroad. I just think it's a horrible, horrible attitude that has been cultivated in our culture. Not taking shots at any individual mind. As I said, I just hate that it has to be considered as an option. For me, a move abroad should only be an absolutly desperate last option, not a first one. Luckily, I'm not desperate.

Yet.

This is key, although I don't think it points out a negative aspect to the course in regards to how its run, rather the employment possibilities (or lack of) afterwards.

With English, yes you are at a disadvantage. I am English too, but it was my second subject, a language, that got me my job. However, I had resigned myself to the fact that if I didn't get a job that I would further develop myself as an English teacher.

Yes, English teachers are two a penny, so you have to make yourself stand out. Do drama courses, shakespeare/creative writing/poetry workshops, etc.. make yourself an expert in your field and don't waste your time at home.

Now I know I don't know you, maybe you are doing all of this. I also know that all that costs money, but volunteer to help out in a youth club or something. Because when jobs come available, those who were out doing something constructive with their year, rather than moping will be the first ones snapped up imo.

Not a lecture, just advice. I know how hard it is to find work and my heart goes out to you.

Thanks for the reply and I'll certainly take it on board. I'm not sitting on my ass at home (thought it depends on your view). I'm actually taking the free time to write a book and try and get it published; I would love to try and make a name for myself in the literary world and this is the first time I've had the chance to do it. But I know where you're coming from and perhaps I should start seeing if there's any such activities within the Drogheda area...

And I meant negative in how they run the course in terms of the fact they take in so many people each year and have no qualms taking our money, knowing well the difficulty some (most?) people will have afterwards...

chippers

I was told by one of the tutors in UCD that over half of last years PGDE class in UCD are now working in the UK (that's half of 250 or so graduates!). I was quite surprised to hear this stat but that's the reality of it!

So to answer the original posters question - the percentage unemployed from last years PGDE is quite low.

Dionysus

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

English.

I did the CSPE methods in the PGDE but all I've got is English, which is probably the worst lone subject I can have. I know one person posted a little while back that the TC had said the worst combo to have was Eng/Geo, but at least someone with that has two subjects

I have registered. I'd be amazed if the Unis did conduct such a research tbh, since it would involve possibly proving a negative aspect of the way they currently run the course (taking in 1000 new student teachers every year, further saturating the job market).

Would you think about going back to college and getting another subject? I'm in a similar situation to yourself in that I have only one "real" subject. Consequently, I'm going back to pick up one of my 1st year subjects and bring it into 2nd Year of the (part-time) BA this September (you have to do the "part-time" BA, which in UCD has an application deadline in July, as you're adding a subject to your existing BA)

I'm currently fortunate enough to be teaching the full 22-hour week; one of my first year subjects is the basis of my second teaching subject here. I sent a gazillion cvs to a gazillion places before I got this, however. There's a good chance that, should I want it, I can hold on to this post next September. However, in the long-run I need to put a firmer grounding under my teaching career hence I'm going back to get another degree.

Dionysus

chippers wrote: »

I was told by one of the tutors in UCD that over half of last years PGDE class in UCD are now working in the UK (that's half of 250 or so graduates!). I was quite surprised to hear this stat but that's the reality of it!

I doubt the veracity of that based entirely on the fact that as one of last year's class nobody has asked me about my current employment status.

chippers

Dionysus wrote: »

I doubt the veracity of that based entirely on the fact that as one of last year's class nobody has asked me about my current employment status.

I agree i doubt the veracity of the statement, but i agree with the plauasbility.

Lord TSC

Would you think about going back to college and getting another subject? I'm in a similar situation to yourself in that I have only one "real" subject. Consequently, I'm going back to pick up one of my 1st year subjects and bring it into 2nd Year of the (part-time) BA this September (you have to do the "part-time" BA, which in UCD has an application deadline in July, as you're adding a subject to your existing BA)

I'd be lying if I said it hadn't crossed my mind, but I worry about how I'd finance such a return. I really relied on my grant through my Arts and Masters and doing the PGDE nearly killed me financially. If I hadn't been involved in a small car accident two years ago which gave me a nice payout, I simply would not have been able to do the course last year. At the moment, I'm saving up all the money I'm getting from benefits and so forth with the hopes of building up enough to return and get a second subject.

Also, what limits are on the subject choices if I did go back? I did Psychology in first year so if I did pick up another subject, it would be one I've not done since LC times. Could I just choose any subject I did for LC? I was pretty good at Geography and Maths back in the day and I'm sure with a bit of study, I could hold my own in the BA system again :P

Rosita

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Also, what limits are on the subject choices if I did go back? I did Psychology in first year so if I did pick up another subject, it would be one I've not done since LC times. Could I just choose any subject I did for LC? I was pretty good at Geography and Maths back in the day and I'm sure with a bit of study, I could hold my own in the BA system again :P

From what I can make out the subject choices in this course are now extremely limited.

For example at foundation level (level 1) there are just two subjects timetabled in 2010/11 - History and Greek & Roman Civilisation - which implies that only those subjects will be offered in second year in 2011-12.

I also know for a fact that evening History students are forced to take day modules to make up credits, so it seems to me that this evening programme is gradually being phased out.

There are just three subjects timetabled at level 2 which presumably means there'll be just three final year subjects next year. A few years back there was 25 subjects on offer at the various levels.

I would be wary of expecting anything bar an absolutely minimal choice in the coming year/years if current patterns are anything to go by.

dory

Don't do Geography. I know you should do what you love, but you won't be very employable (in Ireland anyway). I would go with Maths. And I believe the Maths in the Open University is recognised by the TC.

If I were you my plan would be:

Get a job in England (can't remember if you said you could go or not - even NI)
Do the Open University degree (as it's much cheaper when you're living in the UK)
After 3-4 years you have a second subject and experience and would be much better positioned to be hired in Ireland.

Just my €0.02.

Lord TSC

Rosita wrote: »

From what I can make out the subject choices in this course are now extremely limited.

For example at foundation level (level 1) there are just two subjects timetabled in 2010/11 - History and Greek & Roman Civilisation - which implies that only those subjects will be offered in second year in 2011-12.

I also know for a fact that evening History students are forced to take day modules to make up credits, so it seems to me that this evening programme is gradually being phased out.

There are just three subjects timetabled at level 2 which presumably means there'll be just three final year subjects next year. A few years back there was 25 subjects on offer at the various levels.

I would be wary of expecting anything bar an absolutely minimal choice in the coming year/years if current patterns are anything to go by.

Showing my ignorance here, but I always presumed the likes of NUIM may offer part time Arts degree courses for those wishing to top up, add subjects and what have you. Obviously thinking about it, and really thinking about it for the first time, that isn't the reality of how such an action is done. Guess I should have realised it wouldn't be that easy >_<

If I were you my plan would be:

Get a job in England (can't remember if you said you could go or not - even NI)
Do the Open University degree (as it's much cheaper when you're living in the UK)
After 3-4 years you have a second subject and experience and would be much better positioned to be hired in Ireland.

Just my €0.02.

While I genuinely appreciate the advice and help, I've already outlined my thoughts on having to look abroad for work...

dory

Yea, sorry I read what you wrote after I pressed 'post'.

Best of luck to you so.

Genuine inquiry: If the dole was cut to the British levels (€60/week or so), would you feel the same?

Rosita

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Showing my ignorance here, but I always presumed the likes of NUIM may offer part time Arts degree courses for those wishing to top up, add subjects and what have you. Obviously thinking about it, and really thinking about it for the first time, that isn't the reality of how such an action is done. Guess I should have realised it wouldn't be that easy >_<

I never heard of NUIM offering part-time general Arts degrees but your presumption is not unreasonable as UCD do so. But as I've outlined the UCD offering has seriously shrunk in recent years and options in future years seem to be diminishing all the time.

For example this year according to their timetable, final year Maths, Irish, English and History are available to part-time students, but none of the first three subjects are available at First Year level. Since first year is obviously a pre-requisite for second and third years the obvious assumption is that these subjects will no longer be available at any level after this year.

The Open University is certainly an option for many subjects.

Rosita

dory wrote: »

Yea, sorry I read what you wrote after I pressed 'post'.

Best of luck to you so.

Genuine inquiry: If the dole was cut to the British levels (€60/week or so), would you feel the same?

Why do you have to ruin your apology and good luck wishes with a question implying that there could not possibly be any other attraction/constraint keeping the OP in the country except the dole?

Lord TSC

Don't worry, it's a fair question.

dory wrote: »

Genuine inquiry: If the dole was cut to the British levels (€60/week or so), would you feel the same?

Probably. I'm in the lucky position where I don't drink and don't have much of a social life, so I'm not in a position where I desperatly need money. I'm still living at home and although I contribute in some ways (buying ingredients and cooking dinners, buying my own clothes, etc), I don't have to worry about bed or food to a huge extent. I'm getting 144 Euro a week at the moment and most of that's going into the bank, and I'm saving up for something like doing a course to help my prospects and so forth.

I'm lucky, I know. I have a mother who is good to me. As I said, I know there's some people who do need the money and thus have no choice but to move abroad. There's a lot of young people I know who either need or desperatly want money to feed their social lives. There's also people with commitments that requires them to find money quickly. I don't agree with the first and I sympathise with the second type of person, but I am neither. I happen to have a parent who values family very highly, a value I've also inherited, and thus there is zero motivation to (and actually a lot of resentment towards the attitude of) move abroad cause times are a bit rough...

dory

Rosita wrote: »

Why do you have to ruin your apology and good luck wishes with a question implying that there could not possibly be any other attraction/constraint keeping the OP in the country except the dole?

I didn't imply there was no other attraction - that's irrelevant to me as a taxpayer.

Anyway, the OP confirmed what I was thinking so not much point replying to your post.

Powerhouse

dory wrote: »

I didn't imply there was no other attraction - that's irrelevant to me as a taxpayer.

If you are going to wear your tax-payer's hat with all its concomitant self-righteousness then the question of 'Other attractions vs Dole' is extremely relevant to you.

Toto Wolfcastle

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

I'd be amazed if the Unis did conduct such a research tbh, since it would involve possibly proving a negative aspect of the way they currently run the course (taking in 1000 new student teachers every year, further saturating the job market).

I did my dip in 2007/2008 and I was contacted the following year by the university who were trying to find out how many of us were employed, so at least one of them has compiled the figures in the past.

Heydeldel

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Don't worry, it's a fair question.



Probably. I'm in the lucky position where I don't drink and don't have much of a social life, so I'm not in a position where I desperatly need money. I'm still living at home and although I contribute in some ways (buying ingredients and cooking dinners, buying my own clothes, etc), I don't have to worry about bed or food to a huge extent. I'm getting 144 Euro a week at the moment and most of that's going into the bank, and I'm saving up for something like doing a course to help my prospects and so forth.

I'm lucky, I know. I have a mother who is good to me. As I said, I know there's some people who do need the money and thus have no choice but to move abroad. There's a lot of young people I know who either need or desperatly want money to feed their social lives. There's also people with commitments that requires them to find money quickly. I don't agree with the first and I sympathise with the second type of person, but I am neither. I happen to have a parent who values family very highly, a value I've also inherited, and thus there is zero motivation to (and actually a lot of resentment towards the attitude of) move abroad cause times are a bit rough...

I agree. I live in a small town and so many friends and relatives have gone to Oz. Instead of getting involved in their area a lot of young people just don't bother. This year I decided to stop moaning about how little there is to do in our town and started a book club and got involved in a youth club and took up an old hobby again. I have to say the feeling of starting something and getting involved at a local level is great.

Also i've applied for this years Dip with English as my only subject. Am I wasting my time and hard earned cash doing the course? It's taken me almost two years to get enough money together what with only getting part - time work . :eek

Lord TSC

Heydeldel wrote: »

Also i've applied for this years Dip with English as my only subject. Am I wasting my time and hard earned cash doing the course? It's taken me almost two years to get enough money together what with only getting part - time work . :eek

Don't think there's an easy answer to that question tbh. As an optimistic person, I have to believe that things will turn around soon, and that teaching is one of those professions that can only grow in upcoming years. Ultimatly, if you want to teach, you need the PGDE in the long run, and it's not like there's any other field of employment which has not been hit badly. Only you can answer the question of if it will be worth it by answering the question of how much of a desire you have to be an english teacher.

Heydeldel

You're right Teamshadowclan, I'm letting the negativity about job prospects get to me, and i'm usually a sunshine girl! I should stop reading the negative posts. I think I would really enjoy the challenge and fast pace of teaching, so hopefully I have the aptitude for it. I have lots of ideas already for classes. I suppose i'm just hedging my bets in case I don't get accepted and have to have a rethink.Thanks for the reply.

Hope you're novel writing is going well.

UnLuckyAgain

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Showing my ignorance here, but I always presumed the likes of NUIM may offer part time Arts degree courses for those wishing to top up, add subjects and what have you.

There's no part-time Arts degree course, but you can study as an occasional student and take specific modules if its a case of topping up or adding a new subject to an existing degree. Fees are then paid on a modular basis. Obviously, these classes would be during the day so it wouldn't be an option for someone trying to study in the evenings.

Lord TSC

Heydeldel wrote: »

You're right Teamshadowclan, I'm letting the negativity about job prospects get to me, and i'm usually a sunshine girl! I should stop reading the negative posts. I think I would really enjoy the challenge and fast pace of teaching, so hopefully I have the aptitude for it. I have lots of ideas already for classes. I suppose i'm just hedging my bets in case I don't get accepted and have to have a rethink.Thanks for the reply.

Hope you're novel writing is going well.

I wouldn't say to stop reading the negative posts. One can be optamistic and realistic at the same time. But despite how much it is to do the course, I think I, personally, would rather do the year and know and then have the options than to not do it, wonder if you should have and not have the chance to continue. Even with the job market the way it is, I do not regret doing the PGDE one bit.

It's one hell of a rollercoaster of a year, I'll say that much though...

Heydeldel

I'd love to hear more about the year. A thread was started by some who are doing the nuim dip this year but all conversation has died on it. Maybe they are all too busy but i was looking forward to reading about their adventures into education.

Any tips or advice? ( i'm being optimistic that i do get a place)

Heydeldel

Sorry for the delay but thanks for the PM.