Advice needed - vet malpractice or inexperience?

madds

Looking for some advice here please. Apologies for the very long post but I needed to give all the details.

3 weeks ago our 11 y/o golden retriever became poorly one evening (lack of mobility, not eating, looked dehydrated). He had been losing weight since mid-November but we put that down to his age but his normal appetite remained and he was still mobile in that he would come running into the house for his dinner and did not look to be in discomfort.

The normal vet we have used since our dog was a pup was not available on the evening in question so we rang another local vet and explained the situation. I had tried to put our dog into the back of our car to bring to this particular vet's practice but our dog was in such pain/discomfort that he snapped at me which is something he never previously had done in all the years we had him. The vet said he could make a house call and take a look. The vet came down to our house and said he would need to take our dog away overnight to examine him, put him on a drip, and he could give his diagnosis the next morning. Fair enough we said.

We rang the next morning to be told that he although he had improved slightly, our dog was still poorly and the vet was no closer to understanding what was wrong. He thought it might be an infection but he wouldn't know until he examined him more closely. He suggested he take some x-rays and if they don't show anything he could take some blood tests and send them away for analysis. We agreed.

The vet called back the next day to say that the x-rays (he took 2, one of the chest area and the other of the abdominal area) were showing nothing that would indicate what was wrong with our dog.

He went onto say that the dog's testicles were mis-shaped, i.e. one was much larger than the other, and the other one was smaller then normal, and advised he should be neutered as this could be the source of the issue. Again, we took the vet's advice on board and agreed to this surgery.

After the surgery took place we visited the vet to take our dog home. The vet said he had removed the testicles and examined them but could find nothing abnormal other than they were not of normal size. He also had found a lump on our dog's neck and had removed that but on examination discovered the lump was just an abscess. He would send both samples (testicles and abscess) away for further analysis.

Our dog was brought out of the recovery room and although he looked a little better since the last time we had seen him 48 hours previous (i.e. a little more energetic, not as dehydrated) and was delighted to see us, he looked very, very shaken. Looking back now the 2 procedures carried out by the vet were a lot to put him through at his advanced age.

The vet charged us nearly €900 for the treatments he administered.

Over the course of the next 2 days at home our dog seemed to improve a little, he regained his old posture somewhat in that he was able to lift his head to shoulder height so that it wasn't hanging all the time. He also began to wag his tail and was eating much better. We put him on a high protein diet in an effort to get some weight back on.

Unfortunately, as the week went on our dog regressed to the point where he had to be led out the back door to have a pee. It also seemed as though his eyesight had gone as he was banging into objects, missing steps and falling, and also walking past the door when we called him in. He also went off his food.

We rang the vet who had treated him and told him what was happening. He told us he really didn't know what was wrong and suggested that maybe our dog had had a stroke. This really upset my wife and I as we couldn't bear to see our dog in pain and it began to dawn on us that we may have to make a difficult decision very soon (put him to sleep). What we had been told was probably just an infection was now looking like it may be something more serious.

My wife and I decided to get a second opinion as we owed that to our pet/friend we had had since July 1999. He was my wedding present to my wife. We went back to our usual vet to see what he thought.

When our usual vet saw our dog, and examined the invoice issued by the first vet (in order to see a breakdown of the treatments administered) his first words were "This is a mess" and "Why did vet A carry our treatment X and treatment Y?". Additionally he said "You have spent all this money and you still are no closer to understanding what the issue is?".

He continued by asking us if we had noticed if our dog had showed signs of wanting to be in the house all the time, not liking the cold, and sitting near the radiator. We immediately understood where this line of questioning was going (arthritis) and realized this was something the first vet had not done.

The vet asked us to see the first vet's diagnosis/notes and x-rays. I returned them to him within an hour after getting them from the first vet. Within 5 minutes of reviewing these materials I was called into the vet's room. He asked me to look at a chart which displayed two pictures - one of a dog who had a healthy spine, the other of a dog whose spine was arthritic. The arthritic spine had these peaks and troughs which were easily identifiable. The vet then asked me to turn to the opposite wall where the x-ray which the first had taken of our pet was displayed. It was plain to see our dog had spinal arthritis and in the vet's words "your dog has chronic arthritis and is in a lot of pain". This was the cause of all our dog's problems. The arthritis was further worsened by the fact that some of our dogs ribs were pushing up into his spine which must have been excruciating for him. (Finding it very hard to type at this stage). Jesus, I'm not a vet but it was obvious form the x-rays that there were issues with our dog's back.

The vet continued by saying that he was very angry that the first vet had not seen/diagnosed this condition and that there was no need to put our dog through all that surgery without first having ruled out the more common problems like arthritis, etc. He explained that our pet was in a lot of pain, he had given him two painkillers, and he was sleeping comfortably. He felt that the condition was not treatable but asked us to sleep on it and come back the next day to see how our pet was doing. Looking back I now know this over night delay was more for us to come to terms with the inevitable rather than the hope that our pet might have a chance of recovering.

We returned the next day to be told that our pal had had a great night's sleep, he was groggy, and in the vet's opinion we should look to do the right thing for him. It was ultimately our decision however. So we took the hardest decision we've ever had to make and asked the vet to take his pain away and let him sleep. I asked the vet would he give us a report of his findings and diagnosis and he said he would.

This was last Wednesday and although I have wanted to post here before now I have purposely not done so as my emotions were running high.

We are feeling very guilty/hurt/ashamed of the pain and suffering our dog had to go through in his last 2-3 weeks since he became ill. We put our faith and trust in the hands of a professional and we feel that by taking the advice he offered us we let our beloved pet down when he needed us most. Looking back the outcome would most likely have been the same but at least we could have taken him home, given him some strong painkillers, allowing him the respect and dignity he deserved in his final days, while we said goodbye to him. Everything just happened so quickly and we feel we were never afforded that opportunity of saying goodbye.

I would appreciate your thoughts/opinions on how our dog was treated and what we could/should do with regard to the first vet. Our worst nightmare would be for another family's pet & owners go through something similar with this vet. I know this is a very long post and I thank you for taking the time to read it.

Discodog

I would make a formal complaint to the VCI
http://www.vci.ie/Disciplinary

I would also insist on a paper copy of all the records held by your normal Vet in respect of the dog. Get your Vet to do a report or at least give you a letter now. Don't give him time to have second thoughts.

I would then write, or get a Solicitor to write, to the negligent Vet & give notice of possible legal action. You should be suing them for the total cost of treatment & compensation for your distress. I would also urge you to make a formal complaint. It can't bring your dog back but it can possible save other animals & owners. Even to a lay person the actions of the Vet were totally absurd.

I had a similar situation some years ago when a Vet diagnosed acute liver failure & recommended that a dog should be put down. It turn out that it had swallowed a wine cork & once it was removed the dog made a full recovery. When threatened with legal action the Vet paid a substantial sum in compensation. He also retired !.

luvdogs

Really feel for you, i`ve been there and done that too and 7 years later i still feel guilty for having listened to this vet!!
all i can say to you is that you were acting in what you thought were the best interests of your beloved pet and trusted the vet.....you had no reason not to!!
i would def look into taking it further if only for your peace of mind, in my case, it taught me never to take the vets word for granted if my own instincts and knowing my pet...told me otherwise...hard lesson to learn for me!
please dont feel that you let your pet down, you didnt, you did what you thought was the best thing at that time so no guilt! x

Larna

You poor, poor things. My eyes are welling up just reading your words.

My beloved house member of 17 years passed away a few months ago and it was without doubt the saddest, hardest event anyone in my family has had to go through.

I can't even imagine how much tougher it must be to have to deal with these vet issues on top of handling the loss of your pet.

I'll be thinking of you and your wife.

Personally, I'd be writing everything down, and sending the vet a letter with the help of your solicitor. At the very least, he ought to refund your 900 euro to you for unnecessary procedures. Everybody makes mistakes but this seems to have been an unnecessary one and hopefully you can prevent someone else from having to go through this in the future.

SophieSakura

That's so sad

Some vets are great, and some don't know what they're doing half the time . . .

Discodog

OP it could be very useful if you keep us updated on this especially if you make a formal complaint. Any of us could end up in the same situation & any previous experience/knowledge could be of benefit.

madds

Just an update on this for those of you who asked to be kept informed. Our usual vet gave us a report of his findings today, and also told us in no uncertain terms that if it were his dog, he would make a complaint to the VCI. He told us to go back to the first vet and demand the monies we paid him for 'looking after' our pet, but also demand the costs of putting him to sleep (a procedure which our normal vet carried out). He went onto say that vets practices are opening up all over the place and half of these guys aren't fit to practice.

Will let you know how it works out.

ppink

OP I am delighted your vet is helping you. I was afraid it would resemble our health service where it seems to me to be nigh on impossible to get one professional to take a stand against another even with blatent malpractice.
Best of Luck

Vojera

I know it won't bring your dog back, but I hope you get some sort of satisfaction from this. It's hard enough when your animals are sick without having to worry that they aren't getting the care they need.

jellybear

Madds I am so sorry for your loss. Im in tears after reading your post as have lost many pets but never under such dreadful circumstances. I hope you realise there is nothing more you could have done or nothing you could have done differently. Please dont beat yourself up over it as at the end of the day we all expect professionals be they vets or doctors etc to be just that-professionals! He should have known better and should have known the correct diagnosis not you so please dont blame yourself. I wish you and your wife all the best and hope you get the justice you deserve for your lovely dog.

Feargal as Luimneach

madds wrote: »

He went onto say that vets practices are opening up all over the place and half of these guys aren't fit to practice.

Your vet is not allowed to say that about other vets...........

Discodog

Feargal as Luimneach wrote: »

Your vet is not allowed to say that about other vets...........

He can say what he likes as I am sure that he said it in a personal capacity & is expressing a personal opinion. There is no question that the standards vary a great deal between different Vets.

A friend of mine recently paid a fortune for a Newfie pup. He took great care to research the breeder. The dog "passed" a supposedly thorough Vet check. The pup started experiencing breathing problems & I suggested that he take it to my Vet who quickly found a serious heart defect. My Vet is adamant that no one should of missed it but another Vet did.

mikemac

madds wrote: »

He continued by asking us if we had noticed if our dog had showed signs of wanting to be in the house all the time, not liking the cold, and sitting near the radiator. We immediately understood where this line of questioning was going (arthritis) and realized this was something the first vet had not done.

I'm no vet but this is incredibly common in Golden Retrievers when they get old. So common it's practically general knowledge.

I would have thought a vet would know this and it'd be the first thing they'd check. Especially as you mentioned lack of mobility

This first vet sounds like a charlatan.

Feargal as Luimneach

Discodog wrote: »

He can say what he likes as I am sure that he said it in a personal capacity & is expressing a personal opinion.

.

No he can't. If your a member of the veterinary or medical profession you can't go around saying that.

NY_972

Feargal as Luimneach wrote: »

No he can't. If your a member of the veterinary or medical profession you can't go around saying that.

This is true by the way. I can assure you this is not acceptable behaviour by the second vet in the eyes of the veterinary profession.
How and ever it's not really the point here.I am very sorry to hear about your dog, and you should certainly get onto the VCI if you wish to complain.

madds

Feargal as Luimneach wrote: »

No he can't. If your a member of the veterinary or medical profession you can't go around saying that.

I understand what you're saying and I think normally the vet would keep his personal feelings to himself but he was disgusted at how our dog was treated and felt he had to offer his thoughts. Tbh I'm happy he did this and chose not to hide behind some veterinary unwritten code of silence.

Feargal as Luimneach

madds wrote: »

I understand what you're saying and I think normally the vet would keep his personal feelings to himself but he was disgusted at how our dog was treated and felt he had to offer his thoughts. Tbh I'm happy he did this and chose not to hide behind some veterinary unwritten code of silence.

"He went onto say that vets practices are opening up all over the place and half of these guys aren't fit to practice."
That's a fairly loose comment he said:mad:

Groom!

I am so sorry about your dog. We lost one of ours last November and nothing can prepare you for it. The fact that your loss was under such awful circumstances has made it even harder for you.

I would take Vet No. 2's advice and write to the Veterinary Board straight away. That way you will be able to offload some of the worry of all of this.

Best of luck.

EGAR

Feargal as Luimneach wrote: »

"He went onto say that vets practices are opening up all over the place and half of these guys aren't fit to practice."

From experience I happen to agree with him.

Discodog

NY_972 wrote: »

This is true by the way. I can assure you this is not acceptable behaviour by the second vet in the eyes of the veterinary profession.

Well that just proves that the profession needs a kick up the proverbial. We want Vets & Doctors who are free to criticise rather than chained to some outdated protocol.

How outrageous that a Vet, who appears embarrassed at some in his profession, chooses to support & give honest advice to his client.

ppink

Absolutely! having had my life ruined by members of the medical profession it sickens me to think that they even have these rules:(
I dread to think how many people out there have have wrong diagnosis to detrimental effect on their lives and are left with little or no recourse as the medics will not challenge each other. This is the same for pets and humans!
years ago I would never have believed what I know now about some vets and some docs.