Cheating storm re-opened.......:O

gorfield

This is due to hit the papers tomorrow......:O


http://www.irishgolfdesk.com/news-files/2011/2/4/dont-mention-the-c-word.html?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=facebook

liam12989

who is the top amateur gortfield?
PM me if you dont want to say it public.

f22

liam12989 wrote: »

who is the top amateur gortfield?
PM me if you dont want to say it public.

Which one, there's been more than one suspended/banned in the last year!

gorfield

liam12989 wrote: »

who is the top amateur gortfield?
PM me if you dont want to say it public.

im not saying anything either public or private, its a pretty explosive article, and hopefully it might deter the cheats for this year anyway......

Russman

You'd like to think it would deter the cheats alright, but I reckon, and its only a guess, that some of them subconsciously don't even consider it cheating as such. Almost a "sure what harm am I doing, I'm not winning a prize" attitude (re the guys adjusting cards to not get 0.1).

Plus the GUI, like a lot of sporting bodies, don't want to grasp the nettle and actually deal with the problem - too many worms in the can that would be opened up methinks.

f22

The worst of it all is lack of consistency, for the exact same offense one individual got a 2 week ban whereas another got 6 months.

You can compare those offences to lads who were on international duty and caught on the piss, two got 6 months while another got 12 for being a repeat offender. There's some serious f**ked up logic there!

davo10

If this refers to the person I think it does its even worse than that. The cheat got a bit of s**t for what he did, but the young playing partner who's signature he forged and who reported the incident in the first place has been treated appallingly in the club by other members.

downthemiddle

Russman wrote: »

Plus the GUI, like a lot of sporting bodies, don't want to grasp the nettle and actually deal with the problem - too many worms in the can that would be opened up methinks.

In fairness to the Leinster Branch they used CCTV footage a club to help prove a case of cheating. Quite often it boils down to one person's word against another. There was a much decorated hurler, in the past, who was notorious. Eventually people refused to play with him. The only answer is to isolate the cheats.

sweetswing

These pricks should be named and shamed.

aster99

downthemiddle wrote: »

In fairness to the Leinster Branch they used CCTV footage a club to help prove a case of cheating. Quite often it boils down to one person's word against another. There was a much decorated hurler, in the past, who was notorious. Eventually people refused to play with him. The only answer is to isolate the cheats.

I'm wondering who the hurler is, would he be Leinster based?

Russman

downthemiddle wrote: »

In fairness to the Leinster Branch they used CCTV footage a club to help prove a case of cheating. Quite often it boils down to one person's word against another. There was a much decorated hurler, in the past, who was notorious. Eventually people refused to play with him. The only answer is to isolate the cheats.

Fair comment, and I'm all in favour of them doing stuff like that. But (and I don't know of the case mentioned) but my suspicion would be that if it were a high profile international would they be as vigorous in pursuing it ? Too often there have been "quiet words" had with a transgressor and the kid gloves approach taken. The old wink and a nod culture if you like.

I agree its usually one person's word against another and these cases are very difficult to prove, but in cases like forging a signature or a card it should be fairly clear IMO.

downthemiddle

Russman wrote: »

Fair comment, and I'm all in favour of them doing stuff like that. But (and I don't know of the case mentioned) but my suspicion would be that if it were a high profile international would they be as vigorous in pursuing it ? Too often there have been "quiet words" had with a transgressor and the kid gloves approach taken. The old wink and a nod culture if you like.

I agree its usually one person's word against another and these cases are very difficult to prove, but in cases like forging a signature or a card it should be fairly clear IMO.

They actually did use a hand writing expert as part of their case. While he wasnt a high profile international he had represented Ireland at underage level. One of the biggest issues seems to be the different approaches taken by the various provincial branches, there is no consistency. There is no way a golfer who cheats should be selected for international duty.

bourgeois

Wasn't there something on here about cheating last year as well? And OP brought it up then as well. Should do something about it instead of pi$$in and moanin on thinternet.

f22

bourgeois wrote: »

Wasn't there something on here about cheating last year as well? And OP brought it up then as well. Should do something about it instead of pi$$in and moanin on thinternet.

What exactly would you suggest the OP do exactly? All he's done is brought an article to peoples attention.

Myksyk

bourgeois wrote: »

Wasn't there something on here about cheating last year as well? And OP brought it up then as well. Should do something about it instead of pi$$in and moanin on thinternet.

Russman

f22 wrote: »

What exactly would you suggest the OP do exactly? All he's done is brought an article to peoples attention.

+1

soundsham

re-opened.......:O ???
when did it close......

from the op's 2 posts on same its obvious there is some cheating in this circle but is not being dealt with.........

no surprise,don't be naive golfers cheat,there are cheaters in all sports

the problem is not the cheatin its the punishments,or administrating same !!

proper punishment deters more cheating

Conman X1

I think theres a serious problem these days, especially in the amateur game, the GUI really need to put a document together and circulate it around. Lads are trying to get on panels which gets them grants, so the pressure is on to make sure handicaps are as low as possible, there are more and more cases of dishonesty...

f22

Interesting program on sky sports Monday night about Elliot Saltman and his ban for cheating on the European Tour. Starts at 7.30pm.

davo10

Saw him play last summer in a Europro Tour competition, fine golfer, very nice to my young kids who were with me, he gave my daughter his ball as he left the 18th green, but his reputation is in the bin and rightly so, a cheat is a cheat, you only have to listen to some of the comments about VJ, it follows you everywhere throughout your career.

f22

He is no doubt a fine player but he has always had a dodgy reputation even from his early amateur days. **** sticks and the smell lingers. His brother Lloyd played the finest round of golf I've ever seen when his shot 66 in royal dublin in a hurricane enroute to winning the Irish amateur a few years ago.

The program should be interesting.

bourgeois

OPs had a prob with the guy who is the subject of the article for a while now. Why doesn't OP withdraw his services from SC, BC, interpro, etc until the problem gets dealt with? Why not be a man, tell them you don't want to play with cheaters and make a stand?

Dero123

f22 wrote: »

Interesting program on sky sports Monday night about Elliot Saltman and his ban for cheating on the European Tour. Starts at 7.30pm.

This programme is on Sky Sports News channel 405

f22

bourgeois wrote: »

OPs had a prob with the guy who is the subject of the article for a while now. Why doesn't OP withdraw his services from SC, BC, interpro, etc until the problem gets dealt with? Why not be a man, tell them you don't want to play with cheaters and make a stand?

The individual mentioned in the article is someone completely different, someone who got banned for 6 months, reoffended and got 4 years. Scholarship gone, clubs sold, golf career finished.

Actually, I read the article arseways in hindsight, I'm referring to a slightly less profile case in Leinster. However, I fail to see how the OP refusing to play championships would make a blind big of difference, player committees would possibly make the GUI sit up and listen though.

pinkdoubleeagle

Anyone know whay paper this article was in?

AGC

It's easy to say they are only cheating themselves, they will never win or make it etc etc but for me the most annoying thing is how many of these blokes take up space in Championships that a lot of lads work hard and honestly to get into.

It doesn't take a genius to see scores consistantly in the 80's and missed cuts from the same guys in every championship but they always appear back the following year.

ShriekingSheet

I didn't see the article. Is it online?

bourgeois

AGC wrote: »

It's easy to say they are only cheating themselves, they will never win or make it etc etc but for me the most annoying thing is how many of these blokes take up space in Championships that a lot of lads work hard and honestly to get into.

It doesn't take a genius to see scores consistantly in the 80's and missed cuts from the same guys in every championship but they always appear back the following year.

I wholeheartedly endorse this comment. Cheaters such as guys changing scorecards or making up new ones will eventually get caught.

It's the sneaky cheaters minding handicaps that gets me-not returning cards, not finishing out a round, etc. If you enter a comp you should have to enter your score for the full 18 no matter what.

ssbob

bourgeois wrote: »

I wholeheartedly endorse this comment. Cheaters such as guys changing scorecards or making up new ones will eventually get caught.

It's the sneaky cheaters minding handicaps that gets me-not returning cards, not finishing out a round, etc. If you enter a comp you should have to enter your score for the full 18 no matter what.

+1 who are they fooling only themselves.

downthemiddle

bourgeois wrote: »

I wholeheartedly endorse this comment. Cheaters such as guys changing scorecards or making up new ones will eventually get caught.

It's the sneaky cheaters minding handicaps that gets me-not returning cards, not finishing out a round, etc. If you enter a comp you should have to enter your score for the full 18 no matter what.

Why not be a man and follow your own advice and logic by refusing to play in such competitions ! Surely if you take a stand and boycott these event things will change.

AGC

downthemiddle wrote: »

Why not be a man and follow your own advice and logic by refusing to play in such competitions ! Surely if you take a stand and boycott these event things will change.

There will always be people to take your place.

Problem is too many people do not know who the cheats are, we only have threads like these when it is discussed but people not in the 'know' are unaware who is cheating.

To go down the line you suggest the cheats should be named and will therefore not be allowed or to ashamed to play these events giving honest players a chance.

I am sure (well i hope) in events such as the East etc... that the majority of players are of an honest nature.