Payment for overnight supervision??

Rodar08

Just wondering if anybody can tell me where I stand here ... what am I entitled to ....

Was asked to take a group of 12 TY's on an overnight stay to an adventure place a few weeks ago. I had 12 students, was the only one away with them and was with them for a total of 32 hours. I didn't want to go but I'm a sub so felt I had no choice but to please them and say yes in the hope of staying in the good books to get more work (so thin on the ground it's not even worth staying on their good side). They paid me 3 teaching hours for my trouble.

Something seem not right here? Anybody know what way these situations work?

Thanks

Postgrad10

Hi Rodar08

I'm not an expert on this but I'm sure you need to be paid more for that. Secondly, I'm shocked you were asked to go anywhere alone with twelve kids. Don't ever do that again or feel pressurised to do as a sub. It's not safe for you or the kids.

spurious

I've never been paid for any overnights I did.

I'd never be solely responsible for any group bigger than 10 on a trip outside the classroom.

byhookorbycrook

I have never been paid for any tour or overnights that went outside of schooltime. I agree with the others though, you should not be the only adult.

implausible

The usual ratio is one to ten, isn't it?

And no, you won't get paid any extra, you'll only get paid for the hours you would've worked if you were in school, regardless of whether you're a sub or permanent. Welcome to the thankless world of extra-curricular activities!

rainbowtrout

I've never been paid for overnights or school tours etc outside normal teaching hours. More to the point, there should have been another teacher accompanying you. If something happens to one of the students and you have to go to hospital or something, there's no one to look after the rest. You shouldn't have been asked to go as the sub either.

gaeilgebeo

Same as the above posters, have never been paid for the many overnight trips I've been on.

niall3r

Im just going to reiterate what everyone else seems to be saying. It is unfortunatly the case that you just dont get paid for extra-curriculars. That said it is a good sign that as a sub you were trusted away with them so I wouldnt go in demanding more money. You seem to have your foot well in the door and you'd be first in line for something more permanent than subbing. At the very least you would probably be getting a good reference which will help you with searching for a job.

Also: one person supervising 12 kids. . . .its ever so slightly iffy. That said I would have described a sub supervising TY's overnight at all as iffy so that just shows what I know.

Good luck.

solerina

I cant believe a sub was asked to go away overnight in the first place, Id imagine thats a big insurance No No. There is no way that woudl happen in my school, there woudl be uproar, also I think from an Insurance perspective its 1/8 or 1/10. I have never been paid for the many overnights I have done but Im not a sub so its seen as a normal part of the job. You should never agree to doing it again unless they pay you by the hour

TheDriver

there should be nothing wrong with a sub but I would be a bit more concerned that you were on your own or more experienced teacher with you. Regarding payment, its bit like being asked to work late with a law firm etc, you just have to do it!

Rodar08

Thanks for your replies everybody. Was curious to know what peoples thoughts on the situation were. As far as going away on my own overnight, I agree with all of you. It was completely ridiculous that I was even asked and also that I did it. Felt really put on the spot tho as I said. I was called at about 3pm the afternoon before we were due to leave so hardly had time to even think. Have told them I was helping them out of a spot that one time but not to call me again for an overnight thing. The kids were unbelievably well behaved .. it wasn't that. I told them this just before we left to go on the trip that morning.

As for being thought well of and trusted enough and having a chance of hours??? Pff!! That's the way you'd THINK things would work but no! This is my 5th year in this school and I've never been offered even so much as 2 hours resource. There are 3 other subs who've been there 2 and 3 years longer than me and were given a maternity leave maybe once or twice. Na ... they were stuck for somebody so I got a call.

As far as payment .. yeah I agree that in the case of a permanent teacher not getting paid .. it's part of the job, comes with the territory etc. However a sub, I believe should be paid due to the fact they don't have the income from a permanent job. The responsibility of looking after kids on your own overnight is crazy but subs should def be paid for it. At least for half the hours but not 3 out of 32.

Thanks again all

2011abc

Scandalous treatment but sadly not surprising /rare...

Dahix

This post raises an interesting point...

Does anyone know the exact rules as regards to teacher-student ratio and overnight trips?? Is it 12-1? 10-1? And isnt it 8-1 on overseas trips..?

@OP that sounds like a tough position you were put in! Harsh!

Isotonic

I suppose talking 32 kids to a match on your own is not recommended either so..;) HAve often been asked to do it . On my own too ..

spurious

Isotonic wrote: »

I suppose talking 32 kids to a match on your own is not recommended either so..;) HAve often been asked to do it . On my own too ..

You can be sure if anything happened, there would be nobody who asked you to do it, they'd hang you out to dry.

Delphi91

Isotonic wrote: »

I suppose talking 32 kids to a match on your own is not recommended either so..;) HAve often been asked to do it . On my own too ..

What happens if one of the kids gets injured and you have to take them to hospital? Who looks after the others?

Be very careful about leaving yourself open in a situation like that.

thesimpsons

Delphi91 wrote: »

What happens if one of the kids gets injured and you have to take them to hospital? Who looks after the others?

Be very careful about leaving yourself open in a situation like that.

you are never supposed to be on your own with a child (apart from your own obviously) so be sure this doesn't happen you. I'm really shocked at the school permitting 12 - 1 ratio for overnight away trip. Its always your word against a childs and you'd have had no adult backup or supervision.

E.T.

Isotonic wrote: »

I suppose talking 32 kids to a match on your own is not recommended either so..;) HAve often been asked to do it . On my own too ..

One of our teams went to a match a couple of years ago, and one kid got a belt in the hand and had to be taken to hospital - luckily there were 2 teachers there. One went to the hospital with the child (not ideal safety wise, but had to be done) while the other rang the child's parents and went home with the rest of the team. Minimum 2 adults should be on any outing with kids, no matter how small the numbers.

thesimpsons

E.T. wrote: »

One of our teams went to a match a couple of years ago, and one kid got a belt in the hand and had to be taken to hospital - luckily there were 2 teachers there. One went to the hospital with the child (not ideal safety wise, but had to be done) while the other rang the child's parents and went home with the rest of the team. Minimum 2 adults should be on any outing with kids, no matter how small the numbers.

to avoid being on your own with the injured child we were told you should take 2 other kids with you too if no other adult is avail. That way if injured child is taken for xray or whatever, your still not on your own with just one child. I know it sounds like overkill, but it isthe recommended procedure we were given in Leader training with scouts/guides.

spurious

If no other adult is available, don't go.

I guarantee you if the brown stuff hits, you will be left out to dry, no matter how well intentioned you were.