Nama Seeks to Down grade Hotels Star Rating

Dempo1

Quite an extraordinary development this morning with NAMA now seeking to down grade Hotel star ratings, essentially claiming there are too many 5 & 4 star rated hotels in the Irish Market and further claiming these properties need to down grade because they can not sustain the costs associated with maintaining these ratings.

Whilst i agree with the premise of their argument, is it not the case there are too many hotels in the first place. Furthermore is it not evident no matter was star rating said properties are, they will continue to loose money. What there are essentially proposing is to further make it near impossible for established quality hotels compete with these toxic properties.

As it stands NAMA Now essentially runs 100 hotels (badly in my humble opinion). Standards are already rock bottom as most of these properties are now run by management companies with only one objective in mind "KEEP COSTS DOWN" & "GENERATE REVENUES AT ANY COST".

Already valuations on various hotels have decreased by 80%, the montrose in Dublin being a case in Point (And its closed)

WTF are NAMA up to, Close these properties immediately and stop with the pretense they can be returned to profitability, its complete madness.

Failte Ireland tell us Standards have improved? Its a Joke!

http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/nama-seeks-downgrade-for-hotels-to-boost-profits-2503472.html

keithclancy

Dempo1 wrote: »

Quite an extraordinary development this morning with NAMA now seeking to down grade Hotel star ratings, essentially claiming there are too many 5 & 4 star rated hotels in the Irish Market and further claiming these properties need to down grade because they can not sustain the costs associated with maintaining these ratings.

Whilst i agree with the premise of their argument, is it not the case there are too many hotels in the first place. Furthermore is it not evident no matter was star rating said properties are, they will continue to loose money. What there are essentially proposing is to further make it near impossible for established quality hotels compete with these toxic properties.

As it stands NAMA Now essentially runs 100 hotels (badly in my humble opinion). Standards are already rock bottom as most of these properties are now run by management companies with only one objective in mind "KEEP COSTS DOWN" & "GENERATE REVENUES AT ANY COST".

Already valuations on various hotels have decreased by 80%, the montrose in Dublin being a case in Point (And its closed)

WTF are NAMA up to, Close these properties immediately and stop with the pretense they can be returned to profitability, its complete madness.

Failte Ireland tell us Standards have improved? Its a Joke!

http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/nama-seeks-downgrade-for-hotels-to-boost-profits-2503472.html

Whenever I go to Ireland I never stay based on stars I stay based on reviews.

I'd seen a good few 4 and 5 star dumps and some absolutely cracking 2 stars.

beagle001

They can call these properties what they like but the public will Orr on price.
Majority of 5 star hotels in Ireland are already cutting costs internally too far but not reflecting this on the price of food/drink or rooms.
Short staffed and s-it service in the majority of 4-5 star establishments often not as a result of the employees but management cutting back and over working the employees.
Irish hotels in the luxury range do not come close to top class hotels in Paris like George 5th or London's Ritz yet they charge similar prices.
It flies back to the celtic tiger crap people thinking they can build these 5 star hotels when in reality they have a good 3 star no more.
Service is key here if you go to Asia in Any genuine 5 star you will get top service.
There needs to be plenty of staff,attention to detail and thus cannot be achieved in Ireland.
What Nama are trying to do is lower the fake star raring then lower the price and not bother with any of the decadence like fresh flowers daily or expensive maintenance.
They will cheapen them up and finally the public might get a better deal.

P. Breathnach

It looks to me to be very straightforward: if a hotel with 5 stars no longer provides the level of service expected for such a grading, then the grading (and prices) should be revised accordingly. That is a matter of being honest with customers.

syklops

^^ Agreed.

This is very good news IMO. Yes we do have an over abundance of Hotels, but 5 stars equates not just to service but also to facilities, and many so called 4 and 5 star hotels have nothing like the amenities you get from 3 star hotels on the continent and in the states.

I might be wrong in this, but someone told me that a lot of hotels in Ireland pick their own star rating, based on their own requirements, which is why there are so many 4 star B + Bs around. I am open to correction on that.

FreudianSlippers

I agree. I stayed in a place in Roscommon recently which was 4 star and it needed to be seriously re-evaluated.

Maybe a 4 star in the 70s, yeah.

Dempo1

keithclancy wrote: »

Whenever I go to Ireland I never stay based on stars I stay based on reviews.

I'd seen a good few 4 and 5 star dumps and some absolutely cracking 2 stars.

Just curious, do you use trip adviser? its the great scam to hit the INTERNET. Reviews are pretty much controlled by the Hotel operators and i suspect only a tiny percentage of reviews are the truth let alone factual.

Dempo1

OisinT wrote: »

I agree. I stayed in a place in Roscommon recently which was 4 star and it needed to be seriously re-evaluated.

Maybe a 4 star in the 70s, yeah.

The Star rating seems to be quite outdated as are some similar hotels mentioned above. It used to be based on Accommodation, food, Facilities and extra stars for leisure center's, swimming pools etc. Failte Ireland don't even do the ratings anymore, its contracted out. Working in the business i am at a loss as to how some hotels retain their ratings let alone achieve them.

mikemac

I always wondered how a B&B can get a 4*

No shortage of these out by Galway greyhound stadium.
And just assumed a hotel and a B&B are under different systems

Head The Wall

Dempo1 wrote: »

Just curious, do you use trip adviser? its the great scam to hit the INTERNET. Reviews are pretty much controlled by the Hotel operators and i suspect only a tiny percentage of reviews are the truth let alone factual.

I use it extensively and have done so for years. You need to read the reviews and check the reviewers other reviews. It has never let me down and has definitely enhanced any trip I have taken. I can't have gotten lucky every time so I don't buy your claim

Dempo1

feelingstressed wrote: »

I always wondered how a B&B can get a 4*

No shortage of these out by Galway greyhound stadium.
And just assumed a hotel and a B&B are under different systems

Yes B&B's are rated completely differently, primarily dealing with Accommodation issues, Room Size, Bathroom/shower facilities, Guest room amenities (Tea/coffee,TV etc), Breakfast and its service and any additional amenities. Hotels have many other services considered, right down to car parking facilities, room service etc. Actually a new ploy by these toxic loss making hotels in the new approach to car parking charges which are outrageous. God be with the days a visitor could expect their breakfast and car parking to be included!

Dempo1

Head The Wall wrote: »

I use it extensively and have done so for years. You need to read the reviews and check the reviewers other reviews. It has never let me down and has definitely enhanced any trip I have taken. I can't have gotten lucky every time so I don't buy your claim

Clearly you have bee lucky, most prominent case of review fixing was the Clare inn recently, Trip adviser were forced to put a read notice on this establishments review page. You only have to look around at some establishments receiving 100% positive reviews, quite an achievement and questionable at best. I have also come across reviews on hotels that are actually closed or had been closed seasonally at the time reviewers claimed to resident. The funniest reviews are those that compliment services that actually don't exist. But i do get a kick out of management responses, some quite tetchy and of course those aspiring to saint hood!

mikemac

Reminds me of the new restaurant which opened in our town.

"Award winning" was in the ad when they advertised their opening
And that wasn't for the chef they hired, I did check

Sofiztikated

Head The Wall wrote: »

I use it extensively and have done so for years. You need to read the reviews and check the reviewers other reviews. It has never let me down and has definitely enhanced any trip I have taken. I can't have gotten lucky every time so I don't buy your claim

True.

I use TripAdvisor myself. Hasn't steered my wrong either.

I also work in the hotel game, and we use it regularly for feedback. Of course there are times where we've gotten onto TripAdvisor to remove an outright slanderous comment, but other than that, it's all legit.

flutered

believe it or not lanzoroti has only one 5 star hotel end of story.

syklops

Dempo1 wrote: »

Clearly you have bee lucky, most prominent case of review fixing was the Clare inn recently, Trip adviser were forced to put a read notice on this establishments review page. You only have to look around at some establishments receiving 100% positive reviews, quite an achievement and questionable at best. I have also come across reviews on hotels that are actually closed or had been closed seasonally at the time reviewers claimed to resident. The funniest reviews are those that compliment services that actually don't exist. But i do get a kick out of management responses, some quite tetchy and of course those aspiring to saint hood!

I think what Head The Wall means that TripAdvisor is a really good tool, if you know how to use it effectively. For example:

100% good reviews = Seems unlikely, ignore that hotel.
Low number of reviews = May, also seems strange, ignore that hotel.
Large number of negative reviews by one person, about a specific hotel and specific problem = Someone is bitter, ignore reviewer.

And so on, over time, you can instantly see the good reviews from the bad reviews. and the good hotels from the bad hotels. A bit of experience, and you will see what i mean.

Its like daft.ie. After years of looking for accommodation on Daft at one time or another, I can now look at ads and almost instantly decide to bookmark or not. Sure, I maybe miss the odd really good place because it is poorly advertised, but it saves an awful lot of time.

Dempo1

Sofiztikated wrote: »

True.

I use TripAdvisor myself. Hasn't steered my wrong either.

I also work in the hotel game, and we use it regularly for feedback. Of course there are times where we've gotten onto TripAdvisor to remove an outright slanderous comment, but other than that, it's all legit.

Legit is stretching it a little, yes i agree there are Genuine reviews and equally some shocking and slanderous comments. My issue with trip adviser is its lack of control, it claims to have strict criteria for reviews and yet it permits not just appalling comments but its audit systems permit Hotel owners/managers post exaggerated reviews of their own establishments. It also begs the question why so often is there such extreme differing reviews for certain premises, who is lying who is telling the truth one wonders. What should be key to any customers decision on booking or not is surely the Hotels services, facilities etc.

Sofiztikated

Dempo1 wrote: »

Legit is stretching it a little, yes i agree there are Genuine reviews and equally some shocking and slanderous comments. My issue with trip adviser is its lack of control, it claims to have strict criteria for reviews and yet it permits not just appalling comments but its audit systems permit Hotel owners/managers post exaggerated reviews of their own establishments. It also begs the question why so often is there such extreme differing reviews for certain premises, who is lying who is telling the truth one wonders. What should be key to any customers decision on booking or not is surely the Hotels services, facilities etc.

Honestly, I've had occasions where I've had 2 seperate couples staying the exact same amount of time, pretty much the same itinerary, and one had the best time they could, and the other hated the place.

Dempo1

Sofiztikated wrote: »

Honestly, I've had occasions where I've had 2 separate couples staying the exact same amount of time, pretty much the same itinerary, and one had the best time they could, and the other hated the place.

Yes i do agree with you and i have experienced similar scenario's. I just get a sense Trip Adviser or its model just increases confusion rather than affording Hotels etc a reasonable right to reply.

keithclancy

Dempo1 wrote: »

Just curious, do you use trip adviser? its the great scam to hit the INTERNET. Reviews are pretty much controlled by the Hotel operators and i suspect only a tiny percentage of reviews are the truth let alone factual.

Sometimes, but I doubt Irish hotel operators would post reviews in Dutch or German

However overall across france, germany, spain, portugal, ireland Tripadvisor seems to be pretty accurate to me

There are pretty skewed reviews on it though, usually its an American complaining about service, or an English or Irish person complaining there was no rashers at breakfast and just a load of Jam and Bread.

Atilathehun

keithclancy wrote: »

Sometimes, but I doubt Irish hotel operators would post reviews in Dutch or German

However overall across france, germany, spain, portugal, ireland Tripadvisor seems to be pretty accurate to me

There are pretty skewed reviews on it though, usually its an American complaining about service, or an English or Irish person complaining there was no rashers at breakfast and just a load of Jam and Bread.

France eh! I just automatically assume all French hotels are crap, unless you can afford the top end of the market.:cool:
Iv'e been in some bean boxes, with sh1t service over there in my time.

femur61

Dempo1 wrote: »

Just curious, do you use trip adviser? its the great scam to hit the INTERNET. Reviews are pretty much controlled by the Hotel operators and i suspect only a tiny percentage of reviews are the truth let alone factual.

I always found it to be accurate especially in London and Paris. I found reviews from Americans different as they had different standards, higher.

Regards down grading of hotels, far too many here and quality can be questionable so no harm.