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Site Inspection quality/cost

  • 11-01-2011 10:51pm
    #1
    brendankelly
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 318 ✭✭


    This thread was started by Sinnerboy , by moving posts out from this thread

    The original posting starts below this line

    I heard of a builder that left out the DPM/Radon barrier to save costs. The builder saved 200 euros, the home owner is someplace without a paddle.

    .


Comments

  • #2
    bruschi
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 4,145 Mod ✭✭✭✭bruschi


    brendankelly wrote: »
    I heard of a builder that left out the DPM/Radon barrier to save costs. The builder saved 200 euros, the home owner is someplace without a paddle.

    I know of something similar, except on a much larger scale. at the end of it, as bad and lousy as it is by the builder, all work is to be signed off by architects/engineers, and whoever was working on it on behalf of the house owner should have made sure things were done right.


  • #3
    sinnerboy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,433 ✭✭✭sinnerboy


    bruschi wrote: »
    all work is to be signed off by architects/engineers, .

    ...only when appointed by the client. Some don't "see the need" for architects/engineers


  • #4
    bruschi
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 4,145 Mod ✭✭✭✭bruschi


    sinnerboy wrote: »
    ...only when appointed by the client. Some don't "see the need" for architects/engineers

    more fool them in that case. I thought though most banks require a signature from a certified architect/engineer to release mortgage funds?


  • #5
    galwaytt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,822 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    sinnerboy wrote: »
    ...only when appointed by the client. Some don't "see the need" for architects/engineers

    ....welllllllll, not entirely true. For bank finance purposes, the house has to be signed off not only for regulations purposes, but also planning compliance.

    Case in point: I know a single lady buying a relatively newly built house, secondhand. Her employed engineer has determined the following:
    1. Door access does not conform to Part M (ramp)
    2. Downstairs WC does not conform to Part M (it's barely the with of the cistern..)
    3. Roofing timbers are less than 50mm from the chimney (fire issue)

    Now, the seller has signed-off cert from his engineer, for when he bought the house, and the bank obviously passed money over at that time. So, what's changed ? Someone stolen a ramp, etc ? Don't think so.........there was a lot of 'rubber stamping' going on. For instance - when was the last time you heard of anyone getting a proper 'As Built' drawing set with, say, services on it ? (which this winter would have been very, very useful ! - how many people know where there water stopcock actually is ?)

    Sorry, mini-rant.

    Back on topic: just back after a few days in the UK with clients, and there's a letter on my desk this morning: All Rockwool products going up by 8% from 1st February 2011.

    This is yet another 'plank' that supports my earlier comments: we are currently at the bottom of the curve, price-wise. The value is here, now. If you can do, do.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • #6
    sinnerboy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,433 ✭✭✭sinnerboy


    galwaytt wrote: »
    For instance - when was the last time you heard of anyone getting a proper 'As Built' drawing set with, say, services on it ?

    When was the last time you met someone prepared to pay for this?


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  • #7
    galwaytt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,822 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    sinnerboy wrote: »
    When was the last time you met someone prepared to pay for this?

    ..why would it be extra ? I mean, why isn't included as standard ? I bet if you check your car there's a manual with it, telling you where the oil/water/fuses go..............why not in building ?? How would a regular homeowner know, for example, where his mains CW was (as so many found out this last two month's).......? It's not rocket science - and it's as much in the interest of the builder as client.......

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • #8
    sinnerboy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,433 ✭✭✭sinnerboy


    galwaytt wrote: »
    ..why would it be extra ? I mean, why isn't included as standard ? I bet if you check your car there's a manual with it, telling you where the oil/water/fuses go..............why not in building ?? How would a regular homeowner know, for example, where his mains CW was (as so many found out this last two month's).......? It's not rocket science - and it's as much in the interest of the builder as client.......

    Cars is an excellent example. You can opt for optional extras buying them.

    As to architectural services there are 2 threads in the last 7 days or so asking "do I need an architect" or words to that effect. Many appoint an architect only because they have to draw down the mortgage and so seek out the lowest possible price. This service falls below "the standard" you are implying above but it's all the client demands. Like you don't get a cup of tea with Ryanair - unless you pay for it.

    As built drawings including M+E services is what I'm accustomed to producing as it so happens. But I am also accustomed to being appointed on the basis of providing a full architectural service - with fee approximating 8-10% of build cost.


  • #9
    sinnerboy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,433 ✭✭✭sinnerboy


    galwaytt wrote: »
    Case in point: I know a single lady buying a relatively newly built house, secondhand. Her employed engineer has determined the following:
    1. Door access does not conform to Part M (ramp)
    2. Downstairs WC does not conform to Part M (it's barely the with of the cistern..)
    3. Roofing timbers are less than 50mm from the chimney (fire issue)

    Now, the seller has signed-off cert from his engineer, for when he bought the house, and the bank obviously passed money over at that time. So, what's changed ?

    Could have been a poor engineer ( the original one ). Or some engineers are careful to certify structural works only and some lenders have been careless enough to advance funds on this basis.

    There is a type of appointment for an architect/engineer that works something like this.
    Client requirement

    I have my planning permission obtained by pattern book / the same house my brother built. I will self build / use the brother in law / the town "good builder" . The works have started now footings rising walls and slab are all in and I need to draw the first part of the loan down. I don't want to hire you but I have to. What is your best price to get my draw downs . Don't be hassling the builder now or bring to my attention anything I don't want to here. Just "Show Me The Money" ( I don't want to show you much of course )

    Some accept this appointment.

    But get this My own opinion now -

    This type service is primarily to protect the bank - not the client. The certs effectively tell the bank if this punter defaults there is sufficient value in the works if the bank needs to re possess. More fool the client who appoints like this and thinks otherwise.

    .


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