How are murdered bodies ever found?

SuperInfinity

I don't understand how bodies like that are ever found. Surely its like searching for a needle in a haystack?

Sure you have the smell, but dig a hole five feet deep and who would ever know?

And yes I really am an axe murderer concerned about this. :cool:

starbelgrade

SuperInfinity wrote: »

I don't understand how bodies like that are ever found. Surely its like searching for a needle in a haystack?

Mobile phone tracking devices usually.

minidazzler

Upturned soil?

The Undead haunting?

Nosy people?

And some just aren't...those are my ones.

Cookie_Monster

they become zombies and go down to the nearest Garda station to complain before going on their brain eating rampage, duh.

af_thefragile

Every contact leaves a trace.


Its like the most basic and fundamental rule in forensics.

pavb2

To answer the question it's usually by someone walking their dog

af_thefragile

pavb2 wrote: »

usually by someone **** their dog

:eek::eek:

Oranage2

Microchip that is placed into your brain at birth for tracking and mind control

kerryman12

How many times have you heard this phrase on the news;
a man/woman out walking a dog found the body

MardiB

Sure it's always either people walking their dogs or people out hiking.

minidazzler

kerryman12 wrote: »

How many times have you heard this phrase on the news;
a man/woman out walking a dog found the body

That's just sloppy though, the killer just leaves the body covered with some leaves.

You gotta do some digging if you wanna win.

bonerm

pavb2 wrote: »

To answer the question it's usually by someone **** their dog

I just got a great idea for a new crime drama series starring Roy Keane.

El Horseboxo

Because a lot of murder body dumps are panicked, rushed and are carried out in the dark. So they might be putting it somewhere they think is concealed only to notice during the day it's a popular short cut or something used by locals. Not to mention smells and people out walking dogs etc and i doubt anyone turns up and digs a 6ft hole.

CrazyRabbit

Well they haven't found any of my victims.

Cheap Thrills!

Yeah, it wouldn't be too easy for the average Joe Soap to go 5 or 6 feet down. Especially in cold weather when the ground is hard and frozen.

I would imagine. :cool:

kerryman12

minidazzler wrote: »

That's just sloppy though, the killer just leaves the body covered with some leaves.

You gotta do some digging if you wanna win.

Kids these day.....eh, where's the commitment

Seosaimh77

I know people who say they are going out hunting for dead bodies when they take their dog for a walk down by the royal canal and places like that - they walk their dogs in remote places on purpose, hoping to find a corpse. But I bet they'd freak out if they ever actually found something themselves

amacca

bonerm wrote: »

I just got a great idea for a new crime drama series starring Roy Keane.

Poor Triggs!

af_thefragile

minidazzler wrote: »

That's just sloppy though, the killer just leaves the body covered with some leaves.

You gotta do some digging if you wanna win.

That's wrong.
This is how you dispose off a body properly!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Y-jDVaYnmM

figarofigaro

Imma start doing all my killins when I'm out walking the dog. The perfect crime.

Locust

Have you any idea how long it takes to dig a 5 foot deep hole long enough to fit a body into? Somewhere where there aren't rocks/clay to battle through and not be noticed by local, farmers, walkers, hunters etc... Never mind nosey local people writing down and reporting the reg of your seemingly abandoned car nearby? Whilse your digging that bleedin hole... And building up your alibi, contingency plans in case you get caught ...geesh... zombies etc etc.... It ain't all that easy you know!! I should stop.

dilallio

The mafia used to bury bodies in cemeteries in recently dug graves.

Son Of A Vidic

Are you talking about serial killers here? Or the run of the mill 'normal' murders that occur? Because most bodies are found...well because it's a body, so it can't go anywhere.

ejmaztec

El Horseboxo wrote: »

Because a lot of murder body dumps are panicked, rushed and are carried out in the dark. So they might be putting it somewhere they think is concealed only to notice during the day it's a popular short cut or something used by locals.

You'll know better next time. When are you up for parole?

javaboy

If I learned anything from Casino, it's that you dig the hole before you commit the murder.

SantryRed

How is it a murdered body if it's never found?

javaboy

SantryRed wrote: »

How is it a murdered body if it's never found?

Are you being "tree fall in a woods" philosophical? Or just defence lawyer slimey?

Nevyn

http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-a-cadaver-dog.htm

A cadaver dog or human remains dog is a special type of police dog which has been trained to search for cadavers and human remains. With the use of a cadaver dog, rescue crews can identify dead bodies in wreckage for future removal, and cadaver dogs can also be used by crime units to find areas where a cadaver might have been buried, stored, or dismembered. These canines may have macabre jobs, but they are very useful additions to the police forces in the areas where they are used, and they have some of the best noses in the business.

As human remains decay, they produce a variety of very distinct odors. While most of us would probably prefer to avoid ever experiencing such odors, for cadaver dogs, the odors are like a signature, because they appear nowhere else in nature. A cadaver dog can actually detect human remains through concrete, buried underground, or at the bottom of a body of water, using its extremely well-honed noses to search for faint traces of the chemicals emitted by the human body during decomposition.

leeroybrown

Seosaimh77 wrote: »

they walk their dogs in remote places on purpose, hoping to find a corpse.

Necrophilia is wrong!

ScumLord

What I do is just go down to the local graveyard, find a prepared grave, dig an extra two feet down dump the victim, fill in the bit I dug again and the next day the guys at the funeral fill in the rest for me and the best dog in the world isn't going to know the difference. :cool: At worst the mortician will get a bad reputation.

irish_goat

There's plenty of big deep forests in Donegal that could be used to stash a body or two. Ones beside main roads that don't facilitate walkers.

Failing that, take a trip down to the local marina at night and you'll find plenty of little wooden boats lying around...a quick row out to the middle of the lough and there'll be no scuba diving dogs to catch you out.

Opinicus

The Joggers, it's always the Joggers.

jill_valentine

Bear in mind that most murder victims are missed by somebody, so somebody will be looking for a body. Particularly if the deed itself was messy enough to leave clues that it was indeed a murder, rather than just a mysterious disappearance. Disposing of a body well isn't easy, and every step you take in doing so risks exposing yourself to discovery.

A decomposing body, as noted more scientifically above, honks something fierce. I don't know if you've ever been around a dead animal, but you can smell them from a very long way off and there is no mistaking it. I know of a case where a suicide victim was discovered after a few days because the odour could be detected from the road.

Most murderers act in haste, and don't have time to hide a body properly. They just want to buy enough time to leave the scene, and may discover later that returning to tidy up isn't possible. Digging a six foot hole is a huge undertaking, it takes a lot of labour and time. Roots, rocks, pipes etc get in your way a few feet down, and deeper than that you hit the hard pan, which is horrible. Not everybody has a decent shovel - nevermind a pickaxe and crowbar - to hand. If they don't, they have to buy some; right after somebody known to them has disappeared in suspicious circumstances.

Even if they do manage to dig the big hole, they leave behind a very suspicious looking patch of ground. Obviously, you don't want to bury it somewhere connected to you; the patio didn't work for the Jordaches and it sure as hell won't work for you. And digging in virgin soil is very hard work, as noted, it takes a long time, and it's not something you want to be discovered doing in the park or somewhere. There aren't many spaces in Ireland where you can spent the day digging a person-shaped hole uninterrupted, and those spaces are diminishing all the time. Anywhere easily accessible to you is easily accessible to somebody else, and you have a stiff, stinking, leaky cadaver to bring along too. Working at night might keep you hidden; or it can make it far more apparent, from quite a distance, that somebody is doing something weird by torchlight when they should be tucked up in their beds.

The IRA used to be fond of burying people on beaches, but this isn't risk free either. Any beach you can get to easily enough to bring a body to it is just as easily accessed by people with RC planes and fishing rods. The very nature of a seaside means the shoreline is changing all the time. What was six foot deep when you dug it might be a couple of feet closer to the surface after only a few tides - perfect for a curious dog or some very noisy birds to discover.

Dumping a body at sea, assuming you have boat handy, is a lot more haphazard than you might think too. Depending on the stage of it's decomposition, a human body - or at least parts of it - can be surprisingly bouyant, and currents can be stubbornly unpredictable. Feet in particular have a tendency to reappear, even miles and years away from the crime, and DNA identification means there's an ever-increasing chance that the foot's owner can be named at some stage.

Burning a body is very, very tricky because a human body has a high water content. Doing this takes an awful lot of fuel, and makes an awful lot of strinking smoke. You need to generate huge temperatures for a long time, even professional crematoria have to use grinders to deal with some of the more stubborn remains.

The moral of the story is that it's not as easy as you might think to hide a body well. It's even harder to keep it hidden when somebody's looking for it. It's possible to do both, but then, the really good ideas aren't going to be known for us to talk about, are they?

I hope this post helps you consider consulting a marriage counsellor.

MagicMarker

Bath + acid = win

the_syco

kerryman12 wrote: »

How many times have you heard this phrase on the news;
a man/woman out walking a dog found the body

Dear diary,
Hoomans brought me for a walk. Got peckish, but luckily I caught the whiff of something dead. A bit past its date, but by gawd, I hadn't eaten since the hoomans fed me last night! So I led the hoomans to it, but they wouldn't let me nyom nyom it They only let me have a quick sniff. Couldn't even mark it as mine. I just know the terrier will take it. Little f**ker is always taking my treats when I'm not looking.

Dog

dubtom

jill_valentine wrote: »

Bear in mind that most murder victims are missed by somebody, so somebody will be looking for a body. Particularly if the deed itself was messy enough to leave clues that it was indeed a murder, rather than just a mysterious disappearance. Disposing of a body well isn't easy, and every step you take in doing so risks exposing yourself to discovery.

A decomposing body, as noted more scientifically above, honks something fierce. I don't know if you've ever been around a dead animal, but you can smell them from a very long way off and there is no mistaking it. I know of a case where a suicide victim was discovered after a few days because the odour could be detected from the road.

Most murderers act in haste, and don't have time to hide a body properly. They just want to buy enough time to leave the scene, and may discover later that returning to tidy up isn't possible. Digging a six foot hole is a huge undertaking, it takes a lot of labour and time. Roots, rocks, pipes etc get in your way a few feet down, and deeper than that you hit the hard pan, which is horrible. Not everybody has a decent shovel - nevermind a pickaxe and crowbar - to hand. If they don't, they have to buy some; right after somebody known to them has disappeared in suspicious circumstances.

Even if they do manage to dig the big hole, they leave behind a very suspicious looking patch of ground. Obviously, you don't want to bury it somewhere connected to you; the patio didn't work for the Jordaches and it sure as hell won't work for you. And digging in virgin soil is very hard work, as noted, it takes a long time, and it's not something you want to be discovered doing in the park or somewhere. There aren't many spaces in Ireland where you can spent the day digging a person-shaped hole uninterrupted, and those spaces are diminishing all the time. Anywhere easily accessible to you is easily accessible to somebody else, and you have a stiff, stinking, leaky cadaver to bring along too. Working at night might keep you hidden; or it can make it far more apparent, from quite a distance, that somebody is doing something weird by torchlight when they should be tucked up in their beds.

The IRA used to be fond of burying people on beaches, but this isn't risk free either. Any beach you can get to easily enough to bring a body to it is just as easily accessed by people with RC planes and fishing rods. The very nature of a seaside means the shoreline is changing all the time. What was six foot deep when you dug it might be a couple of feet closer to the surface after only a few tides - perfect for a curious dog or some very noisy birds to discover.

Dumping a body at sea, assuming you have boat handy, is a lot more haphazard than you might think too. Depending on the stage of it's decomposition, a human body - or at least parts of it - can be surprisingly bouyant, and currents can be stubbornly unpredictable. Feet in particular have a tendency to reappear, even miles and years away from the crime, and DNA identification means there's an ever-increasing chance that the foot's owner can be named at some stage.

Burning a body is very, very tricky because a human body has a high water content. Doing this takes an awful lot of fuel, and makes an awful lot of strinking smoke. You need to generate huge temperatures for a long time, even professional crematoria have to use grinders to deal with some of the more stubborn remains.

The moral of the story is that it's not as easy as you might think to hide a body well. It's even harder to keep it hidden when somebody's looking for it. It's possible to do both, but then, the really good ideas aren't going to be known for us to talk about, are they?

I hope this post helps you consider consulting a marriage counsellor.

Tldr

ScumLord

MagicMarker wrote: »

Bath + acid = win

Depends how cheap the bath is. Could make things much worse.

Ickle Magoo

MagicMarker wrote: »

Bath + acid = win

Except if the acid is strong enough to break down bone - it's also strong enough to burn through the bath....not that I've thought about it loike....

<.<

>.>

talla10

javaboy wrote: »

If I learned anything from Casino, it's that you dig the hole before you commit the murder.

Unless some amataur stumbles across your freshly dug grave and places their victim instead!!Ya think its annoying having a car park space swiped??If only you knew how annoying it is, 4am on a cold tuesday, next to a body, full of blood, in work at 9am and you have to dig a whole new grave, from scratch, go home shower dispose of evidence shower and then go to work!!

Sometimes i almost wish i had just stayed in!!

jill_valentine

Getting hold of that much acid without raising a few eyebrows isn't easy, nor is keeping it all in one place while it does it's thing, and it certainly won't be safe.

CrazyRabbit

Feed the body to starving pigs. Crush the bones with sledgehammer. Also, if you leave bones in vinegar, they go soft & are easily cut up.

BTW, does anyone have any pigs for sale?

Guy:Incognito

"cadaver dogs can also be used by crime units to find areas where a cadaver might have been buried, stored, or dismembered"

ie, the boot of a Portugese rental car.

wyndham

Keep it in the freezer and eat a little bit every day. Wouldn't take too long unless you've killed a fat person. Could make some nice mince dishes. Fry the kidneys, liver and brains. Have the ribs in barbecue sauce.
Kebabs from the leg meat.

Mrmoe

A good deep bog hole is the only place to dump a body, no digging, isolated spot and no one is going to find it for a very long time. :cool:

ScumLord

CrazyRabbit wrote: »

Feed the body to starving pigs. Crush the bones with sledgehammer. Also, if you leave bones in vinegar, they go soft & are easily cut up.

BTW, does anyone have any pigs for sale?

I can sell you a pig in pieces that you can assemble yourself at your convenience..

irish_goat

jill_valentine wrote: »

Dumping a body at sea, assuming you have boat handy, is a lot more haphazard than you might think too. Depending on the stage of it's decomposition, a human body - or at least parts of it - can be surprisingly bouyant, and currents can be stubbornly unpredictable. Feet in particular have a tendency to reappear, even miles and years away from the crime, and DNA identification means there's an ever-increasing chance that the foot's owner can be named at some stage.

Big, thick canvas sack + weights in sack + holes in sack so fish can swim in and eat the evidence = Problem solved.

af_thefragile

irish_goat wrote: »

Big, thick canvas sack + weights in sack + holes in sack so fish can swim in and eat the evidence = Problem solved.

All of Dexter's bodies were found though. So I don't think it works too well...

Jesus Wept

MagicMarker wrote: »

Bath + acid = win

Takes a ridic amount of acid and time too.
That's if it wouldn't kill your bath and your pipes and leave a pretty obvious trail that something ****ed up was going on in your house.

CrazyRabbit wrote: »

Feed the body to starving pigs. Crush the bones with sledgehammer. Also, if you leave bones in vinegar, they go soft & are easily cut up.

BTW, does anyone have any pigs for sale?

That'd be fine for farmers with starving pigs. Not so easy for us city folk.

What about just cutting bits up and leaving it in various people's bins?

Or down a manhole.

....drain the blood, cut up small, drop in a manhole.

chicken fingers

Great post Jill Valentine, true mind of a serial killer here folks!

If I HAD to keep the body whole I would probably go with dumping it at sea.This is going to be difficult of course as you need access to a boat at night preferably.
It should not float if you wrap it up in heavy heavy chains really well.
If this was too difficult, I would probably wrap up the limbs, head, torso in bin bags and duct tape. Lay down plastic, and cut everything down to size with a hatchet or cleaver.
Its going to be easier to bury a bunch of limbs than a whole body. Also you can make 3 or 4 trips to the car from the scene of the crime with just smallish bags instead of lugging a corpse.
Then dig a hole, far away from trails etc. 4 feet is about half as difficult as 6 feet, and bags of arms and heads are going to be smaller than a whole corpse so the hole wont have to be too long either!
And definitely agree with "dig the hole before you kill the guy"!!

Or you could get a couple of strong duffel bags, load em up with rocks and the dismembered body and dump it out at sea.

Ickle Magoo

Messy though - bodies have a lot of fluids and the more you are in contact with the body parts, the more likely you are to leave forensic evidence. I think most bodies are dumped because the killer deems the body being found less important than the ever growing risk of them being connected to that body...and dumping bodies at sea, meh, they rot and seep and find a way onto a handy current...

Jesus Wept

With that many trips you are just increasing the chance of being seen massively, and it's pretty unlikely that you won't be seen regardless.

Also, who has access to a boat? If you hire one, then there is a record of you hiring a boat, if any suspicion falls on you whatsoever, they are going to be all over that.