Ration on Grit

johnbk

I see today that Donegal Co Co have revised their grit plan to ensure that Grit supplies are maintained.

http://www.donegalcoco.ie/services/roadstransport/WinterWeather/

Is the country running out of grit faster than we thought?

Have the councils monely left to pay the overtime?

Will the country close till after Christmas after the snow on Friday/Saturday?

Cookie_Monster

johnbk wrote: »

Is the country running out of grit faster than we thought?

Have the councils monely left to pay the overtime?

Will the country close till after Christmas after the snow on Friday/Saturday?

yes, unbelievably. despite lessons (not) learned from last ime

no

no, it won't, it'll just slow right down

Colm R

There is talks of the next shipments of Grit not arriving until the end of next week. This cold snap could be all over then. By which time, the economy of the country will have taken a huge hit because the country will have stopped functioning.

The last cold snap lasted about 12 days. Did we really only have enough supply for 12 days? I would say fair enough if we started running out of salt towards the end of Janurary!

I feel for anyone that works weekends or unsociable hours. It seems you are not important enough!

phill106

From what i heard before the current cold snap, we had loads, and it was being sent from nationwide depots so all counties would have enough. Then dublin had the odd snowflake and screamed for more salt. Dublin then was sent more salt from other counties allocations, lowering the amount available to them, which wasn't needed after all, as sure it doesn't snow outside dublin, and even if it did, won't they be grand, they can ride a horse to work or something.
Course then it started snowing nationwide, and now we only have 2 shake bottles of lo-salt and a half empty pack of salt and vinegar taytos left.

ardmacha

From what i heard before the current cold snap, we had loads, and it was being sent from nationwide depots so all counties would have enough. Then dublin had the odd snowflake and screamed for more salt. Dublin then was sent more salt from other counties allocations, lowering the amount available to them, which wasn't needed after all, as sure it doesn't snow outside dublin, and even if it did, won't they be grand, they can ride a horse to work or something.

This kind of nonsense isn't helpful. Some of the worst snow the last time was in the East and South East, so of course supplies of salt were sent there.

There isn't enough. So either the probability estimates of demand were wrong or these were correct and someone decided to take a chance. Either way we'll never see anyone take the blame.

they can ride a horse to work or something.

sure in some parts they even go to weddings on horses and try and pull bridesmaids.

Alun

ardmacha wrote: »

There isn't enough. So either the probability estimates of demand were wrong or these were correct and someone decided to take a chance. Either way we'll never see anyone take the blame.

There has also been unprecedented demand for the stuff from just across the Irish Sea where they've had more than just a smattering of snow as well. It doesn't dig itself out of the ground, and it's entirely possible that supplies are beginning to be strained causing delays in getting hold of it in sufficient quantities. Also, estimates are just that, estimates, and by very definition can be wrong, in either direction. You can also bet that if we'd stockpiled massive quantities of the stuff, just in case, the same voices would be calling for blood because we'd spent too much. Sometimes you just can't win.

Victor

johnbk wrote: »

I see today that Donegal Co Co have revised their grit plan to ensure that Grit supplies are maintained.

Grit can be bought from just about any commercial quarry - all it is is crushed stone.

The problem is salt, which has to be imported (a lot comes from a mine near Larne).

antoinolachtnai

What exactly is the big problem here? I can buy table salt, vacuum bagged, for 19c a kilo, retail. Why not just store 100,000 tonnes and keep it on hand in large bags? Even at retail prices it would only cost 19m.

AlekSmart

What exactly is the big problem here?

I rather suspect Antoin,that the problem has little to do mwith actual supplies of "Salt" and far more to do with the traditional Irish refusal to countenance proper planning and implimentation measures for anything.

In many Local Authority area`s the real issue is Overtime and the lack of money to pay staff to get out of bed at 0330 so as to adequately treat the roads.

Additionally,as can be observed throughout Eastern and Northern Europe,dealing with this type of weather event requires a great deal of constant Human Resource input.

Our tradition however,is to sit and wait for the Council to arrive with a lorry,even if we freeze to the spot waiting.

Earlier this week as I returned from a trip to Southampton via the Peak District and North Wales I was struck by the sheer numbers of plastic bunkers sitting on various strategic corners and junctions in resedential area`s....Incredible that I would see these and have a Eureaka moment !!

Our national administrative phsyche is focused on reactionary stuff,any form of planning or preparation tends to be frowned upon as inviting trouble upon yourself.

Even here in Dublin,we see major Public Transport locations such as Bus Garages bereft of any dedicated measures to allow their fleets to actually get out onto their routes.

Why ?....because nobody has the responsibility or the foresightedness to sit and think of the benefits of at least keeping a public-transport system running even if private motoring be curtailed..?

Bring on the Germans I say...or the Poles...Latvians...Swiss...Jamaicans.....;)

skelliser

if it doesnt happen in the pale it may as well have never happened.

Cookie_Monster

skelliser wrote: »

if it doesnt happen in the pale it may as well have never happened.

correct, sure its only bog out there, nothing happens in the bog :rolleyes:

ardmacha

You can also bet that if we'd stockpiled massive quantities of the stuff, just in case, the same voices would be calling for blood because we'd spent too much. Sometimes you just can't win.

I fully agree that somebody might be howling if there was too much. But there is the usual wing and a prayer approach to the whole thing. Yes, everyone in Europe wants it now, but if enough planning was done during the summer we would not be seeking last minute supplies. The problem is that too much or too little is not defined in any scientific way. There should be objectives and then the amount needed for these objectives can be estimated, objectives should include broader issues such as access to bus stations and the like. There is a real economic cost of not having roads clear, what is this cost? All this cannot be easily done over a weekend, but that's want the 8 months of no ice could have been used for.

foggy_lad

The maain problem is that the councils wont commit staff and resources to gritting and overtime unless thay get a cast iron guarantee that the weather is going to get worse or last a few days.

After the recent very bad spell in Carlow it appeared that Carlow County Council and town council were either flat broke or were waiting "just one more day" to see if there was a thaw, rather than spend anything on clearing well used roads around the town!

the only vehicle i have seen in Carlow town in that whole snowbound period was a small tractor with a bucket on the front that was scraping the top layer off the ice on the roads to "clear" it.

There did not seem to be any plan or any funds to put any plan in place in the county as even the by-pass was down to one narrow lane for over two weeks, have the corrupt councillors "salted away" all the money?

Capt'n Midnight

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

What exactly is the big problem here? I can buy table salt, vacuum bagged, for 19c a kilo, retail. Why not just store 100,000 tonnes and keep it on hand in large bags? Even at retail prices it would only cost 19m.

In the UK they keep it in big yellow crates on the side of the road

The_Wrecker

Ive recently returned from the Bavarian region of Germany. A total difference. -14, 4-6inchs a days and life goes on (Fussen i stayed in) and they ploughed it hourly while pumping out grit. The roads are narrow but the gritter also covered the footpaths which for a short while before the christmas festivals were dodgy but nothing compared to here.

parsi

Funny.

If you watch Berlin TV or read Berlin papers they are damning about the state of the roads/paths.

One of the issues is about the law that the path outside your building should be cleared. It seems that there is confusion - should it be the tenant or the landlord ? Last week RBB (berlin TV) had a report which showed that one of the companies (REWE) which has a contract to clear snow didn't even clear its own premises - their spokesperson seemed unconcerned. Another part of the report discussed how the Ordnungsamt (sort of a section in each district that deals with things that piss you off - noise, parking, pavements...) of a particular district was issuing a fine to the City of Berlin for failure to clear the snow from its (Ordnungsamts) premises..

liger

The DJ on Radio nova just said the Ship carrying our salt supply sank!!! Only turned on at that point so dont know if he was taking the piddle. Anyone hear anything.????