Advice on second hand 4WD ?

Mountainsandh

Hi all, hubby and I are living in the countryside, and what with the weather, we now have made the decision to get a 4WD.
We tend to drive old bangers, and are not willing to pay a fortune for it, an old second hand one in working order would do.

Question is : what make ? what to look for ?

I'm not very keen on the big ones, so was looking at the Jimny (suzuki ?) is that any good ? There's loads going for cheap.

Any advice welcome, we don't have a clue, we just want something a bit more suited to rough weather/roads/bohreens than an ordinary car. We do get a fair bit of floods so winter tyres not really our solution. Cheers

Alanstrainor

Budget?

mickdw

In your situation, I would get a subaru forester or something like that. You get 4 wheel drive, fair ride height, reliabilty and car like driving experience compared to the more jeep like options. Should be available for small money too

J77

Audi Allroad Quttro! Has to be!

CJhaughey

J77 wrote: »

Audi Allroad Quttro! Has to be!

We tend to drive old bangers, and are not willing to pay a fortune for it.

Mountainsandh

Budget 0 to say, 3000 or thereabouts. When I say old and second hand, I mean it .

Seweryn

Mountainsandh wrote: »

Budget 0 to say, 3000 or thereabouts. When I say old and second hand, I mean it .

That is plenty of money for a good and reliable Subaru Legacy Estate:
http://cars.donedeal.ie/for-sale/cars/1562685
or the Outback:
http://cars.donedeal.ie/for-sale/cars/1744812

Ferris

Maybe a little over budget but this forester seems ok:

http://cars.donedeal.ie/for-sale/cars/1758660

Might be better in a flood than an outback or legacy.

Seweryn

Ferris wrote: »

Maybe a little over budget but this forester seems ok:

http://cars.donedeal.ie/for-sale/cars/1758660

That is a really nice car for the money. Bargain, if all mechanical bits are in tact and if the car was serviced as it should.

dr.fuzzenstein

Suzuki Vitara, unbreakable
http://www.carzone.ie/search/Suzuki/Vitara/JX/201040199795667/advert?channel=CARS

CJhaughey

The Suzuki Jimny series SJ413 and the older SJ410 are very capable offroad machines despite their looks.
The Daihatsu Fourtrak is also a sturdy and reliable offroad machine while suffering from the usual agri-style ride.
If you don't mind the slightly bouncier ride then either of those two if in good condition would be a fine jeep for relatively small money.
Look around though, my BIL just sold a LWB 95 series landcruiser Auto for €1700.
It was in great condition for that money and sold very fast.
The 90 series are a very comfortable drive compared to any leafsprung 4wd and if one can be got at a good price then it would be worth paying a little more for.

ballymac676

HI personally wouldn't get petrol - think it would rob you. We bought a smashing 02 Nissan Terrano - with very low mileage in immaculate condition from the North. We paid €400 euro to convert it to commercial and €50 to clear it at customs. Wouldn't be without it. And it is within your budget range. It is very economical to run, tax and insure and we wouldn't be without it.

mickdw

ballymac676 wrote: »

HI personally wouldn't get petrol - think it would rob you. We bought a smashing 02 Nissan Terrano - with very low mileage in immaculate condition from the North. We paid €400 euro to convert it to commercial and €50 to clear it at customs. Wouldn't be without it. And it is within your budget range. It is very economical to run, tax and insure and we wouldn't be without it.

I thought they were supposed to be terrible things altogether. Certainly when new, they didnt get too many good reports

ballymac676

No I did a lot of research before we went for this one - including borrowing one or two from friends. And found that this came up as being good on diesel -We do pull a trailer with ours so this was important to us. In saying that we drive it to town and work and find it great.

galwaytt

Cheap cheap, still a Subaru

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WuxZjrfi8W8

CJhaughey

Those Terranos are the same as the Ford Maverick from the same period. I think they had a 2.7 litre which was pretty gutless. If you don't need any power then it's probably fine.
BTW the €50 VRT will no longer be in operation from next year.

gbee

mickdw wrote: »

I thought they were supposed to be terrible things altogether. Certainly when new, they didnt get too many good reports

Two points on that, as a car they are total sh*** as an off road duty car [not trialling or heavy off road] they are fantastic.

The main problem with them is their parts are made of paper maché, I spent €4,000 in 2009 bringing mine back up to DOE standards and my average spend was similar in other years, own one for 5 years now.

On a good run I get 30mpg and 24mpg urban ~ for what it is, good. One can have fun with it it has a really capable low box and coupled with the right tyres will pull out of any mud or snow and climb icy hills and dales all day long.

Not comfortable with standard seats, steering is erratic and it likes to be driven on and thrown into corners ~ add a bit of water on the road and you'd think you were in a dingy in an Atlantic storm.

But they have their charm and are competent where it counts mostly, they are the top end of the soft roaders with real off road, bad weather performance and if fitted with 3rd party heavy duty or racing parts, you'll get a duty cycle out them [and not the three months from the Spanish paper mache].

gbee

CJhaughey wrote: »

Those Terranos are the same as the Ford Maverick from the same period. I think they had a 2.7 litre which was pretty gutless. If you don't need any power then it's probably fine.

It's adequate, the American market did not like the Maverick [Petrol] {as seen on the Simpson} and thought the petrol equivalent of the standard 2.7TDi underpowered ~ for their market yes, but in reality the bigger engine was no match for the average driving skills of the yanks, they crashed them wholesale ~ the body design of the Maverick was just not designed for high-speed driving and the bigger engine only made this worse.

The petrol tank was not up to standard either and it burst into flames at a glance. At this point Ford who had been making the Maverick in Spain as a joint effort finished their relationship and walked away to face the lawsuits.

The Spanish company thought "OH Look, all this machinery left by the yanks, no point in it going to waste, let's make the Terrano!" So they did, and the II and III and the IV.

BTW, in its class a fairly bog standard Terrano II circa 2002 won its class two years in a row for Nissan Racing Team in the Paris Dakar rally. Then though, it's like as if the Terrano had never existed ..... Jeremy Clarkson thought the Terrano he drove was so bad he would not review it.

ballymac676

I am 'stepping out' of this discussion after this reply as I am not in the slightes mechanical. All I know is we have a Terrano II SE Plus which pulls two 16.2 horses effortlessly and cruises along at 60mph without being sore on diesel. We had it during last winters really bad weather and again this year and we were never stuck to go anywhere thanks to this vehicle. As I said we wouldn't be without it and would recommend it to anyone. Mind we think we got ours at a great price and as said only €50 duty had to be paid on it. Good luck to OP in your search

gbee

ballymac676 wrote: »

All I know is we have a Terrano II SE Plus which pulls two 16.2 horses effortlessly

I want to keep this quote and use it again. I've out pulled a Land Rover in mud, many people don't understand or believe that the Terrano could do that.

Lex Luthor

Forester would be my recommendation aswell. no surprises there

Anan1

Mine too, if the OP doesn't mind the fuel consumption.

Mountainsandh

CJhaughey wrote: »

The Suzuki Jimny series SJ413 and the older SJ410 are very capable offroad machines despite their looks.
The Daihatsu Fourtrak is also a sturdy and reliable offroad machine while suffering from the usual agri-style ride.
If you don't mind the slightly bouncier ride then either of those two if in good condition would be a fine jeep for relatively small money.
QUOTE]

Thank you all for the advice, it really helps, not just for now but maybe in future if we've a bit more money to go for the higher litr-age ones. For now I think CJhaughey you pretty much summed up what has caught our eye, and we don't mind the "agri-style" ride since it's only for short distances .
Forrester looks something else, but too dear to "keep" just now.

101sean

Only just spotted this, but I agree with CJH, if it's a standby vehicle and cheap you want, Suzuki SJ or Jimny is probably the way to go. Big forum and spares support via the UK as well. Keep a car as an everyday runaround, if not, a Vitara is better for regular use. A Jimny or SJ is not something you want to drive long distance, make a 70s Land Rover seem comfortable (knew a guy though that commuted in an LJ80 many years ago, real masochist!:eek:) Cart sprung Fourtraks are also pretty indestructible but spares support inc minor stuff may not be so good these days and they'll all be battered farm hacks.

Neighbour has a Terrano, nothing basically wrong with it but has had loads of niggling problems and spares can be pricey here, 2.7 in a smallish vehicle makes them expensive to tax privately as well.

If you're used to running bangers and handy with tools, an older Land Cruiser should be OK, reasonably good support, there's an Irish LC forum now and several owners on the 4x4 forum here that will point you to what to look for and avoid. Land Rover probably wouldn't be your cup of tea (they are greenest vehicles on the planet though )

Matt Simis

CJhaughey wrote: »

We tend to drive old bangers, and are not willing to pay a fortune for it.

My old 2.7T Allroad which was mechanically perfect, great spec'ed and had a new transmission and new turbos and recent air suspension servicing (and a lot more) sold for EUR3500 to guy who exported it to Hungary a year ago.
So yeah, you can get an excellent and sound running Allroad for this price, but most Irish people run away from the 2.7T tax and fuel economy. The only maintenance aspect on an AR that Boardsies seem to gravitate on is the Air Suspension, ignoroing the fact that nearly all decent Estate cars have rear Air Suspension (self leveling) anyhow (ie its not rare) and no one mentions it and that the Air Springs are like EUR300 or less a pop and can be changed one at a time and last 120k miles.

Note I didnt sell it at that price, the guy I sold it to did. The exporter who bought it at couldnt believe his luck, back home the same car sells for 2-3x.


Saying all that, its unlikely you will find an Allroad as they are fairly rare (and most are the rubbish TDI model here) so the Forester is a good alternative.

bmw535d

Pajero Pajero Pajero Pajero Pajero Pajero Pajero

alias no.9

gbee wrote: »

It's adequate, the American market did not like the Maverick [Petrol] {as seen on the Simpson} and thought the petrol equivalent of the standard 2.7TDi underpowered ~ for their market yes, but in reality the bigger engine was no match for the average driving skills of the yanks, they crashed them wholesale ~ the body design of the Maverick was just not designed for high-speed driving and the bigger engine only made this worse.

The petrol tank was not up to standard either and it burst into flames at a glance. At this point Ford who had been making the Maverick in Spain as a joint effort finished their relationship and walked away to face the lawsuits.

The Spanish company thought "OH Look, all this machinery left by the yanks, no point in it going to waste, let's make the Terrano!" So they did, and the II and III and the IV.

BTW, in its class a fairly bog standard Terrano II circa 2002 won its class two years in a row for Nissan Racing Team in the Paris Dakar rally. Then though, it's like as if the Terrano had never existed ..... Jeremy Clarkson thought the Terrano he drove was so bad he would not review it.

I wasn't aware that either the Ford or Nissan versions of what was sold here as the Terrano II and Maverick were ever sold in the US, though the Terrano and Maverick names may have been used over there.
I also think you're getting confused about Fords safety history. It was the Pinto that had problems with spontaneous combustion, and was probably the Simpsons reference. It was the Ford Explorer that was their SUV disaster with multiple rollovers due to incorrectly spec'd tyres/tyre pressures and consequent blowouts. Neither were related to the Maverick/Terrano II sold here.

sh1tstirrer

Mountainsandh wrote: »

Hi all, hubby and I are living in the countryside, and what with the weather, we now have made the decision to get a 4WD.
We tend to drive old bangers, and are not willing to pay a fortune for it, an old second hand one in working order would do.

Question is : what make ? what to look for ?

I'm not very keen on the big ones, so was looking at the Jimny (suzuki ?) is that any good ? There's loads going for cheap.

Any advice welcome, we don't have a clue, we just want something a bit more suited to rough weather/roads/bohreens than an ordinary car. We do get a fair bit of floods so winter tyres not really our solution. Cheers

You can buy a 4x4 cheap. Maintaining it (the older and cheaper the more costly to maintain) putting fuel in it tax and insurance is going to be the costly part. All this extra cost because of a bit of snow and ice.

Mountainsandh

Thanks for the advice, we also get floods around here, and have a lot of very poor country roads around that sort of make the hardship of maintaining one worthwhile. Believe me I resisted it, we've been here 6 years and we did not get one from the start as we thought we could do without...
If I could only use it on days when it's really needed, honestly I would, but as I've been discussing on another thread about Pay As you drive insurance, since unfortunately this hasn't been available here so far, we will probably get rid of one of our regular car and replace it with the 4wd for the (country) school runs, etc...

So instead of the Jimny we're now looking at Grand vitaras, which look a bit more comfortable in the event of having to use it for a longer trip, and are still not as bad as, say, a Forrester consumption wise.

edit : actually there should also be a Tax As You Drive option

mickdw

Mountainsandh wrote: »

edit : actually there should also be a Tax As You Drive option

If only

Muckie

Go with a Subaru, can't beat the AWD especially in this weather.

Have an Impreza estate myself 6 years. Great reliable car.


The plough is "optional "though :pac:

macnab

How about an older Toyota Rav4, they used to get great reviews.

Marlow

Definatly can't go wrong with Audi Quattro's.

I bought an '89 Audi 200 Quattro Avant for 1300 (2.2 petrol-turbo, 860/year tax), cost me about another 1000 eur to nct it (that's full service, new timing belt, new spark plugs, new brake pads and a few bushings). There are a few newer ones for sale on done deal:

Audi A6 Avant Quattro 1.8T - http://cars.donedeal.ie/for-sale/cars/1618158 - 2750
Audi 100 Avant S4 - http://cars.donedeal.ie/for-sale/cars/1668099 - 2800

There is an advantage to having a petrol one compared to a diesel and that is, if it's really going to freeze and the diesel isn't frost protected, you won't be able to start the car, as the diesel will be sitting like paste in the tank. One reason, why nearly nobody drives diesel cars in Sweden and Norway.

MPG is pretty good on the Audi's, around 25-30 mpg.

Subaru's definatly also are a good choice, very capable, no idea on the fuel consumption though. Heard it's pretty bad with the turbo ones.

Otherwise, small 4x4's, I'd stay away from them. You get the worst of both worlds (in the Jimmy or the Pajero Junior types of things).

Terrano, Maverick, proper Pajeros, Patrol, Lada Niva 4x4, etc. definatly are off-road going, but not sure you'd need that. Again, check on fuel consumption.

/M