I cannot stand my future brother-in-law

LegacyUser · 11-12-2010 9:13pm #1

Okay, first off my sister moved to Cork from Dublin a few years ago and met a guy last Christmas. To everyone's amazement he proposed to her 5 months after that, but she is 26 now so she can obviously make her own decisions no matter how rash they may seem. Her fiancée is 28, the same age as me, and I've only met him around 4 or 5 times but as soon as I met him I really took an instant disliked him.

When I first met him (after he got engaged to my sister) and introduced myself he never made eye contact with me, he also nearly crushed my hand when I shook it then ignored me to carry on a conversation that he was previously with having one of my uncles. Not the best first impression in the world but I let it slide.

After that he was up for the weekend at a family christening and we were all in the pub sitting around chatting. At the start we were only engaged in small talk but after a few drinks we got to chat abit more and he came across as very arrogant, bragging about his car and new apartment and pretty much talking himself up as much as possible. That's fine, he wants to make a positive impression, no harm in that, but I got an overall bad vibe off him.

The third time we met was the worst. It was my dads 50th birthday party in our local pub and everyone was merry and having a good time. My sister arrived with her fiancée and a few of his mates from Cork and they pretty much ruined the party. They got absolutely buckled and were very rude to some of the guests, my young cousin actually left early because one of the lads tried to start a fight with him. The fiancée really pissed me off though. He rudely interpreted me talking to a family friend then gave me a drunken lecture at the bar about what a loser I apparently am (I lost my job this earlier year and couldn't find another plus to make matters worse my girlfriend of 3 and a half years dumped me for another guy around the same time). I left the party discreetly after that and my mind was made up about him right there and then. I discussed this with my parents but they just said that it was down to alcohol and me just being paranoid and over sensitive, but a few of my cousins heard his rantings and called me for a chat about the night etc.

He came up a few more times after that but by now my family know exactly how I feel and I only agreed to meet him twice, once when I went to my parents for dinner where he managed to insult me again buy jokingly saying that a fat women off the TV was my ex-girlfriend, then saying he was 'only havin' the craic' like he knew me for years or something. He comes across as such an arrogant prat and he probably doesn't even know it. He also is one of those lowlifes that has to put other people down to make himself feel better about himself.

There are lots of other niggling little things that I could add but this post is getting rather long winded now so I'll cut to the chase. My lease is up in my apartment (it's being sold by the landlord) and my mother suggested that I move in with her and my father for one month until I find a new place. I agreed as I would have been staying there anyway for probably around a week at Christmas. I've been here a few days and everything is grand but my mother dropped the bombshell that my sister and fiancée will be staying with them also for 6 days over Christmas. She said that she was nervous telling me because she knows that I don't get on with the fiancée but I assured her that it was fine by me as it was her house as she can invite who she likes to stay with her.

Inside I'm fuming though because I totally loathe this bloke and the thought of spending the guts of a week under the same roof as him is actually making me physically sick. The house is tiny and most of my mates will be away with there families and it's not like I have the money to be out everyday & night while he is there.

I don't mean to come across as selfish or self-absorbed it's just that it'd been such a difficult year for me and I was really looking forward to spending time with my family for Christmas and now this muppet could throw a major spanner in the works and put a major downer on everything. I'm totally dreading Christmas now!

tinkerbell · 11-12-2010 10:11pm

I have one piece of advice for you when you are dealing with a twat like him:

Next time he insults you tell him that it he has nothing nice to say then shut the hell up. That house is your parents house, you are their son. He is just a blow in and he should not be allowed insult you under your own roof.

Trust me, twats like that - once you call them out on their stupid behaviour they usually shut up.

LegacyUser · 11-12-2010 11:51pm

Thank you for the advice. I have been on the verge of telling him to shut his big bogger mouth a few times but I don't want to end up having a row and causing a rift in my family and especially not at Christmas. Btw as far as I can tell my sister is oblivious to all of this, she obviously knows the way he acted at my fathers birthday was uncalled for but it was her idea to invite him to spend Christmas with my family. It will be the first time that anyone but a family member will be spending Christmas with us too so it will be odd enough without it being a complete and utter idiot sitting across the table from me. Btw I was talking to my father about it earlier and he is very neutral with his opinions but told me to just ignore him and try not to let him spoil my Christmas, he also said that the guy "does like the sound of his own voice"...........which says alot about him.

Deise Musashi · 12-12-2010 12:18am

I like your Dad!

Very old school

Say nothing bad, but damn the guy with one succinct phrase.

The fiance sounds a lot like my brother in law, a complete tool but very impressed with himself.
For my wife and his kids we haven't had words.

I avoid him as much as possible, especially since I think the next stupid comment out of his mouth will result in physicality!

For the sake of your parents at least I would advise avoidance and a tongue biting of marathon proportions.

If the guy actually goads you personally on private matters then let her rip. Let him know there is a line and it will not be crossed without repercussions.

No-One wants to "ruin Christmas", but there is a limit to the crap you should have to take.

I am aware that my reply is heavily coloured by my own situation, so take with a large dose of reality.
What may work for me this year may not be an ideal solution for yourself, best of luck to us both lad!

JONJO THE MISER · 12-12-2010 7:05am

Keep us updated and don't take any of his crap.

Monkey Allen · 12-12-2010 10:58am

Don't let hatred of one person be the centre of your life. And if its not in the centre, then why bother getting worked up over it.

It sounds to me like from day one he needed to get off on the right note and for him, that meant making sure he has some power over you. It gives him leverage with the in-laws.

But so what if he's done that. You probably feel like you need to have a smart cutting reply to his comments. You dont. You just need to let him know how you feel about his comments. Not in a sympathy seeking way or a forceful way. Just simply 'I see you're just having a laugh but I'd prefer if you talked to me with more respect, future brother.'

Also, ask him out on a fishing trip. Not in the Godfather sense

but as a genuine offer of friendship.

I've always been amazed as to how quickly people can change their behaviour around other people in a good way.

Give it a go. Its a bitter pill to swallow but you'll enjoy the benefits of having a good relationship with your brother in law. Unless you sister breaks up with him, you'll have to deal with it.

Zen65 · 12-12-2010 11:15am

Bah Humbug wrote: »

I don't mean to come across as selfish or self-absorbed......

Honestly OP, there's a strong element of that in your post. You seem to be building up a catalogue of things you don't like about him, of incidents where you feel he disrespects you. Your dislike of him grows so quickly, spurred on by the cumulative memories of fairly minor incidents to which you are attaching an increasing significance.

Not that your future BIL sounds like a wonderful guy. He does sound like somebody who is loud and vexatious to the spirit. But your reaction to him is unhealthy, for yourself, for your sister, and for the family.

This man will probably never be a close friend, but he may be your BIL for the remainder of your lives, so at very least you need to let go of the incidents which are in the past and make a concerted effort to get along with him, even if it will never be more than a polite acquaintanceship.

Be at peace,

Z

iguana · 12-12-2010 1:24pm

I'm afraid I agree with Zen65. I get that this guy has occasionally behaved like a tool but you are also finding fault with him for some seriously irrelevant things, his lack of eye contact on first meeting, his handshake, the fact that he prioritised a conversation he was having with your uncle over beginning one with you.

This guy may never be your good friend, you may never like him, but he is the man your sister loves and plans to marry and you need to respect that and come to terms with his place in your life. He may be in your life to some extent forever. He will be your brother-in-law and your parents son-in-law and you shouldn't be making them feel uncomfortable about their relationship with him. If you have a problem with him either keep it to yourself or find someone outside of your family to vent with. Your mother should not have felt uncomfortable about your reaction to her relationship with her daughter's partner.

Bear in mind that in the future, this man will probably be the father of your nieces and nephews, and the uncle to your children. You don't want to make either of those relationships strained, or your future children to their cousins. You will just have to find away to at least let his comments and behaviour roll off you, or find away to tell calmly let him know they are unacceptable.

Firetrap · 12-12-2010 2:23pm

He does sound like a bit of a tool alright but unfortunately he's the man your sister thinks is Mr Wonderful and she's not going to want to hear you say a word against him. All you can do is try to be as civil as you can around him because like it or not, you're stuck with him. It will make life very awkward for you down the line if you fall out with him.

As for Christmas, are there any things you can do to get out of the house? Relatives to visit? Long walks? Trip to the cinema?

LegacyUser · 12-12-2010 3:29pm

iguana wrote: »

I'm afraid I agree with Zen65. I get that this guy has occasionally behaved like a tool but you are also finding fault with him for some seriously irrelevant things, his lack of eye contact on first meeting, his handshake, the fact that he prioritised a conversation he was having with your uncle over beginning one with you.

This guy may never be your good friend, you may never like him, but he is the man your sister loves and plans to marry and you need to respect that and come to terms with his place in your life. He may be in your life to some extent forever. He will be your brother-in-law and your parents son-in-law and you shouldn't be making them feel uncomfortable about their relationship with him. If you have a problem with him either keep it to yourself or find someone outside of your family to vent with. Your mother should not have felt uncomfortable about your reaction to her relationship with her daughter's partner.

Bear in mind that in the future, this man will probably be the father of your nieces and nephews, and the uncle to your children. You don't want to make either of those relationships strained, or your future children to their cousins. You will just have to find away to at least let his comments and behaviour roll off you, or find away to tell calmly let him know they are unacceptable.

I think this reply was very harsh and was posted by a female poster who only wrote it from the point of view of how this situation was effecting the female members of my family only. I feel if I was female poster then your answer would be way more constructive and less blinkered.

I also think the suggestion that I am deliberately trying to find faults with my sisters fiancée after what I just posted is totally ridiculous. I gave him the benefit of the doubt after our first couple of encounters but after he totally insulted and humiliated me at my fathers birthday I drew the line. That was only the third time that we had ever met and to be honest he should of got a smack in the gob for saying crap like. There was no excuse for it and I'm sorry but this guy is just a horrible human being and my parents and myself have a right to be very cautious him and my sisters welfare (she has a bad track record with abusive boyfriends).

I added the selfish and self-absorbed statement at the end of my OP because I realized I was coming across that way, but this will be my first Christmas being unemployed, single and homeless so I think I would need to be made of Teflon not to feel any other way right now. The fact that I'll be sharing a house with an egomaniac stranger who has a habit of ruining ever occasion with his verbal diarrhoea is just the icing on the cake.

Ickle Magoo · 12-12-2010 3:43pm

Bah Humbug, when you post on PI you can expect to get varied responses from all manner of posters posting from all manner of perspectives. That is, after all, the entire point of this forum.

By all means only listen to those who are agreeing with you if it makes you feel better but please don't insult posters who have taken the time and effort to reply to your thread just because what they say is not what you want to hear.

Many thanks

Ickle

LegacyUser · 12-12-2010 3:59pm

Apologise if I came across as insulting but I really cannot find where I insulted any other poster on this thread

I'm also reading and taking ever post on board and am grateful for a more rounded insight into my situation from all of the posters kind enough to share their views. I just took exception that the post that I replied too and IMHO thought that it was a very harsh and one dimensional view of my situation.

Ickle Magoo · 12-12-2010 4:19pm

Insinuating that a poster only has a particular perspective due to being blinkered because you are of the opposite gender rather than because that is their take on the situation as you have written it is certainly insulting, especially given they were but one of several posters who have given much the same advice. /Mod hat off

Look, your parents have invited the guy and your sister to stay for a week, your sister is marrying the guy - he clearly isn't causing issues to the degree you have with him, with everyone.

Sometimes we just don't get on with people our family chose to marry/date and the adult thing to do is just to suck it up and spend as little time in their company as possible - it just so happens this year that your folks are trying to make your life easier and offering you a room at the same time your sister and her fella are visiting.

Make sure to tell your family if he says something you find offensive so you can't be bullied and don't be shy about calling him out, calmly and politely, on nasty comments in full hearing of everyone else so there is a clear boundary drawn.

All the best

LegacyUser · 12-12-2010 5:27pm

That is fair enough.

In regards to the situation with my sisters fiancée, my sister actually invited him and my parents agreed but it would have been awkward anyway since my parents have a tiny semi-detached house and he will be sleeping on the sofa for the week, but of course that is not his fault. The main thing that gets me is the length of time that he will be staying with us, from the 22nd of December until the 29th. He has a big enough family down in Cork (3 brothers and 2 sisters) so I can't understand why we are burdened with him for the week over Christmas? Does his family not want to see him for some reason?

I actually haven't mentioned that my sister doesn't know that I hate him and I would never ever expose my true feelings at the risk of hurting her, so I have had to grin and bear it up until now but this just seems like a bridge too far. I haven't seen eye to eye with her in the past and she has had a few falling outs with my parents but she is the only sibling that I have so I deeply care for her even though she can be extremely selfish sometimes. But that is neither here or there at this moment in time.

I'm just worried that I'll have this gombeen in my face 24/7 and in situations where my sister will want to go shopping or on girlie night with her old friends then it'll be left to me to try an entertain the fiancée on my own with no money. Plus he is going to have plenty of digs for me at the fact that I'm back living with my parents even though it is only for a month.

I know, I know......I am coming across as selfish and self-absorbed again but I was really looking forward to Christmas this year and I have to say that the more I think about it this year the more depressing it seems.

amdublin · 12-12-2010 5:54pm

Bah Humbug wrote: »

I know, I know......I am coming across as selfish and self-absorbed again but I was really looking forward to Christmas this year and I have to say that the more I think about it this year the more depressing it seems.

It is six days out of your life. I appreciate you don't like him come on a little bit of perspective here. It could be a lot worse - at least he is down in Cork and not living beside you.

LegacyUser · 12-12-2010 6:00pm

amdublin wrote:

It is six days out of your life. I appreciate you don't like him come on a little bit of perspective here. It could be a lot worse - at least he is down in Cork and not living beside you.

Good point and I'm extremely grateful that he isn't living locally so that I'd see him all of the time.

thefeatheredcat · 12-12-2010 6:48pm

OP, he sounds a little like my sister in law in some areas, with boasting and bragging and putting people down. Flags to me of a very insecure person from my own experience, and I daresay that all with your future brother in law isn't as rosy as he'd like you to believe.

Even if you haven't mentioned to your sister your dislike of him, she probably knows as your meetings have been, well, not great.

I think in this situation, you'll just have to make the best of things. I get the impression that due to the disastrous previous occasions you and your brother and law have met, it could be a great chance to get to know eachother a little better and put the past behind ye. A week sounds long, but the time will fly, and I would imagine he's hardly going to be sitting around the house as I'm sure the two of them will have plans, such as meeting his siblings and friends or the two of them going off spending time together.

It may not turn out to be the nightmare you expect it to be, maybe even quite unexpectedly good.

iguana · 12-12-2010 7:09pm

Bah Humbug wrote: »

I just took exception that the post that I replied too and IMHO thought that it was a very harsh and one dimensional view of my situation.

I was giving my view as a person who is a bit older than you and has clearly had a HELL of a lot more experience dealings with close in-laws than you. And if you think I seemed harsh, that's unfortunate, in actual fact I held back a bit. As I said I think, from your description, that this guy sounds like a tool. His comments about your financial situation are at best utterly inept and at worst downright nasty. Also if he and his friends did spoil your father's birthday party that is horrible, that said your parents don't seem to have half of the problem with him that you do, so I suspect he wasn't quite as bad as you are inferring.

However, you sound just as bad. Judging someone negatively because of their handshake and possible discomfort when making eye-contact, but deigning to give him the "benefit of the doubt" is beyond arrogant. And you were annoyed that he continued his conversation with his uncle instead of beginning a new one with you. Has it ever occurred to you that he was trying not to rude to your uncle? And you accuse him of having verbal diarrhoea, when he is with his future in-laws at least one of whom is hostile toward him! It sounds like he is having a fairly natural response. And he talked himself up in front of the family of the woman who he plans to marry, who he knows has some reservations about whether he is good for her? Again an utterly natural action.

I also think the fact that you are not mortified that your mother was openly nervous about telling you who she had invited into her own home is quite telling. Your actions are making the rest of your family uncomfortable. You are perfectly entitled to not like this guy very much, to not want to be his friend, but you are not entitled to make your parents feel uncomfortable about their relationship with their daughter's future husband. You don't have to take his crap, and you shouldn't, but that is your issue to deal with, not your parents.

Also you are 28 and your attitude about having a house guest for Christmas is immature. Yes you have had a bad year and were looking forward to the holiday period for a bit of a boost, hell that's a big part of the purpose of the holiday. But you and your sister are adults now, that means accepting that things change, Christmas too. And that outside of Hallmark and Disney movies Christmas is only as magical as you make it and your problems don't go away for the celebration and sometimes are amplified. I lost my baby on the run up to Christmas 2008 and ended up having to put on a brave face with my in-laws who didn't know I'd been pregnant. It was hell. But turned out to have been a lot better than Christmas 2009 where my dog had a serious accident on Dec 20th and had his leg amputated on the 21st meaning that we were stuck in London for the holiday and over Christmas my husband, who had been ill for a year took a sharp negative turn and ended up fighting for his life in an ICU in the New Year. So you better believe I was damn looking forward to a stress free Christmas this year, but last week my husband was informed the contract he moved back to Ireland for and had expected to last until April 2012 was being pulled at the end of the week so he is left with a mad scramble to find a job here or we will be "celebrating" this Christmas with a return emigration hanging over us.

So maybe you feel I was being harsh but I think you are putting your feeling too far above everyone else's. And I think that could have a much more negative effect on your family than this guy is, however much of a tool he may be.

grrrrrrrrrr · 12-12-2010 8:57pm

Sounds as if hes intimidated of you and really nervous. Thats why he talks himself up and shook your hand too hard. He mightnt be wat you like in a friend but you hardly gave the lad a chance. He just wants to impress you. Just make an effort

Monkey Allen · 12-12-2010 9:31pm

grrrrrrrrrr wrote: »

Sounds as if hes intimidated of you and really nervous. Thats why he talks himself up and shook your hand too hard. He mightnt be wat you like in a friend but you hardly gave the lad a chance. He just wants to impress you. Just make an effort

I dont think thats the case. he wants an edge. He sees a weakness in the OP. It suits him to take advantage of that. But, the weakness wouldn't be there if the OP was more confident. Theres no reason to feel threatened by this guy. Just show your disappointment in the things that he says by telling him and offering him a friendship.

This could be a case of who makes the first move. Well you've acknowledged the problem so you make the move. You'll learn a lot from this if you do it.

Raekwon · 12-12-2010 10:15pm

I feel that the OP is getting unfairly slated here, it's not his fault that his sister has terrible taste in men and that her boyfriend is acting like an absolute dick around him.

OP if I where you I would do my utmost to not let this clown ruin your Christmas. Just be as pleasant as possible to him when you are in his company and if he makes any snide remarks say something like; "Do you feel better about yourself now?" or "Wow, how does it feel to be so perfect?". Just don't get into a fully blown argument with him because you will be made to look like the bad guy as your sister and mother will most likely take his side and your dad will probably want to stay out of it. Correct me if I'm wrong but what I've read from your posts that's the impression I'm getting.

Monkey Allen wrote: »

I dont think thats the case. he wants an edge. He sees a weakness in the OP. It suits him to take advantage of that. But, the weakness wouldn't be there if the OP was more confident. Theres no reason to feel threatened by this guy. Just show your disappointment in the things that he says by telling him and offering him a friendship.

So what if the OP has confidence issues, he said himself that he had a very difficult year and I'm sure alot of people would be feeling at a low-ebb in his position. Does his apparent lack of confidence give his sisters boyfriend the right to constantly demean and humiliate him? Hell no! The bf sounds like a complete and utter gobshíte who has stepped over the line in a big way. It actually sounds like he considers the OP as competition in a warped kind of way and is trying be the dominant alpha male in the situation (even though the competition only exists in his head as the rival is related to his partner). In my personal opinion I'd say that the boyfriend has huge physiological problems and it would be really interesting to hear more back ground on him. He probably had he an abusive father or was he bullied at school or something to that effect, he sounds like a classic case though.

Good luck OP and be careful around this guy!

I am a friend · 12-12-2010 10:22pm

There are things you can do over Xmas to get out of the house that dont cost money e.g. volunteer locally even for a few evenings.

It sounds to me that your confidence is low and that this guy is hitting all the right buttons to get a reaction. He is over doing it but because you are sensitive to your change in circumstances you are also over reacting about the 6 days..

Stay out of the house and out of his way as much as possible.

grrrrrrrrrr · 12-12-2010 10:29pm

Sounds as if hes intimidated of you and really nervous. Thats why he talks himself up and shook your hand too hard. He mightnt be wat you like in a friend but you hardly gave the lad a chance. He just wants to impress you. Just make an effort

amdublin · 12-12-2010 10:32pm

Yeah I agree with I Am a Friend. It is only six days, try to be out of the house as much as possible

Monkey Allen · 12-12-2010 10:37pm

Raekwon wrote: »

I feel that the OP is getting unfairly slated here, it's not his fault that his sister has terrible taste in men and that her boyfriend is acting like an absolute dick around him.

OP if I where you I would do my utmost to not let this clown ruin your Christmas. Just be as pleasant as possible to him when you are in his company and if he makes any snide remarks say something like; "Do you feel better about yourself now?" or "Wow, how does it feel to be so perfect?". Just don't get into a fully blown argument with him because you will be made to look like the bad guy as your sister and mother will most likely take his side and your dad will probably want to stay out of it. Correct me if I'm wrong but what I've read from your posts that's the impression I'm getting.

So what if the OP has confidence issues, he said himself that he had a very difficult year and I'm sure alot of people would be feeling at a low-ebb in his position. Does his apparent lack of confidence give his sisters boyfriend the right to constantly demean and humiliate him? Hell no! The bf sounds like a complete and utter gobshíte who has stepped over the line in a big way. It actually sounds like he considers the OP as competition in a warped kind of way and is trying be the dominant alpha male in the situation (even though the competition only exists in his head as the rival is related to his partner). In my personal opinion I'd say that the boyfriend has huge physiological problems and it would be really interesting to hear more back ground on him. He probably had he an abusive father or was he bullied at school or something to that effect, he sounds like a classic case though.

Good luck OP and be careful around this guy!

It doesnt give anyone the right to intimidate someone else. But, we're all responsible for our own situation, regardless of how it happened. Being vunerable because of whats happened to you means you've allowed yourself to be broken by others. Not healthy and not going to fix anything by looking for sympathy.

funkey_monkey · 12-12-2010 11:51pm

It does seem like you might be overanalysing this a bit. Yes, to me he does sound like a bit of a dick but if it all goes pear shaped at Xmas because you and him have a row it could be the start of a serious family rift. You really don't want that as your parents will be caught in the middle.

My advice would be to say nothing and avoid being with the guy alone as much as possible. It does seem that although your father appears cool about him too - it is you who is dwelling on the previous incidences.

Although to be fair, if I was in your situation I would not let him make any snide comments about my situation - just be clever and don't let the Xmas booze lead to bad judgement. You can only turn the other cheek so many times but please calm down - you seem to be spoiling for a fight.

Bottle_of_Smoke · 12-12-2010 11:54pm

Sounds like an awful prick. Unfortunately you can't choose your in laws.

It is only 6 days though. Hang out with mates. When he's there stand your ground. You don't have to act polite over Christmas if he's insulting you. A good one here that usually gets to bullies(and that's exactly what he is) is telling him to ''stop showing off''. It's something that's told to children when they're trying to be cool by belittling someone. It also strikes right at the heart of what he's up to and will humiliate him - though you've only made a light hearted remark.

Have no time for this kind of coward. You haven't come across self centered to me at all.

Zen65 · 13-12-2010 12:25am

Bah Humbug wrote: »

I gave him the benefit of the doubt after our first couple of encounters but after he totally insulted and humiliated me at my fathers birthday I drew the line. That was only the third time that we had ever met and to be honest he should of got a smack in the gob for saying crap like. There was no excuse for it and I'm sorry but this guy is just a horrible human being and my parents and myself have a right to be very cautious him and my sisters welfare (she has a bad track record with abusive boyfriends).

OP,

Calm down a moment. Have a read of what you've posted here and think about what you're saying.

Do you honestly believe that this guy deserves to be hit because he insulted you (in a manner which he probably considers as just slagging)??

You're 28, you refer to this guy as a "horrible human being" (no slagging there, just judgement)... and yet you think you're being reasonable to suggest that he should be treated violently for daring to slag you off??? I've met some teenagers who think this way, but at your age I would normally expect some greater empathy between humans.

It really seems to me that you have issues with what's happening in your own life; with your lost employment, and your lost girlfriend (all very unfortunate events in their own right) - and you're directing some of your anger over these issues towards this guy, because he's clueless enough to try slagging you about them?

my parents and myself have a right to be very cautious him and my sisters welfare (she has a bad track record with abusive boyfriends).

Wait, did I miss something?? Has this guy done anything to suggest to you or your parents that he may be abusive towards your sister? That would be a huge issue if it were true. If there was any suggestion this guy was abusive then your first posting here is a red herring because his abusive nature would be the only issue you should be discussing!! Or maybe he has never done anything abusive towards your sister, but your dislike for him is so strong that you're happy to throw a bit of "mud" in his direction to try justify your own dislike of him??

Obviously OP I don't know the answer to that. I can only try to decipher what you write about him. At this stage he sounds like an immature man, but he's got plenty of competition for the trophy in that division.

In time, I think you may find the anger you feel is for your own situation, not for the behaviour of this guy. It would be terribly short-sighted if you let your anger manifest itself either physically or verbally towards him. The most likely outcome is that your family would no longer invite you to important events because they could not trust you to behave rationally, and that surely is not an outcome that you want?

I hope you don't consider my views to be blinkered. I can genuinely assure you that I'm not trying to attack you, and if it helps I can also assure you I am not a female. I am substantially older than you and I have very many in-laws with very diverse backgrounds, so my views are based on experience.

Be at peace,

Z

Bottle_of_Smoke · 13-12-2010 12:35am

Zen65 wrote: »

OP,

Calm down a moment. Have a read of what you've posted here and think about what you're saying.

Do you honestly believe that this guy deserves to be hit because he insulted you (in a manner which he probably considers as just slagging)??

You're 28, you refer to this guy as a "horrible human being" (no slagging there, just judgement)... and yet you think you're being reasonable to suggest that he should be treated violently for daring to slag you off??? I've met some teenagers who think this way, but at your age I would normally expect some greater empathy between humans.

Mate I'm 25 - if someone said those things to me in front of my family it would only be social convention that would stop me physically attacking him. I think you're giving this guy too much credit. They were clearly nasty things he said. not just the actions of a dimwit having a laugh.

Monkey Allen · 13-12-2010 1:22am

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

Mate I'm 25 - if someone said those things to me in front of my family it would only be social convention that would stop me physically attacking him. I think you're giving this guy too much credit. They were clearly nasty things he said. not just the actions of a dimwit having a laugh.

Hitting someone isnt the answer. It makes you look like the one who is at fault for over reacting. OP, you can resolve this by empowering yourself to focus your energy on more productive activities. This bully makes comments about you because you let it bother you and that suits him. Tell him 'I can appreciate thats your sense of humour, but dont direct it voer here. Its not welcome. Are we clear?'

Bottle_of_Smoke · 13-12-2010 8:12am

Monkey Allen wrote: »

Hitting someone isnt the answer. It makes you look like the one who is at fault for over reacting. OP, you can resolve this by empowering yourself to focus your energy on more productive activities. This bully makes comments about you because you let it bother you and that suits him. Tell him 'I can appreciate thats your sense of humour, but dont direct it voer here. Its not welcome. Are we clear?'

He didn't hit him. just commented that he deserved it. I don't think he has any intention of going down that route it is just an expression

LegacyUser · 13-12-2010 1:42pm

First of all I think people are reading too much into this. I went into as much detail as possible and was very honest in regards to my own situation to give posters a more rounded view of the situation but it seems that I have so how come across as overly aggressive and totally arrogant..........yet total void of all confidence

Also people don't really seem to think that the fiancée is doing much wrong here and pretty much agree with him that he is "only havin' da craic" and I should lighten up and stop being a push over. I can tell you one thing, I am twice the man that this clown thinks he is and so what if I am down on my luck, I doubt I'm the only one at the moment, but he needs to show way more respect then he has so far as this whole situation is of his making, not mine!

Secondly I never said I was going to physically assault the guy. I said that he deserved a smack in the mouth for the way that he talked to me, I never ever said that I was going to hit him. I was on the end of an unprovoked verbal backlash from this guy at an important family event and I bite my lip and didn't retaliate for the sake of my family. I think that says alot more about me then it does against some thick mullah who thinks that he is something special.

Zen65 wrote: »

Wait, did I miss something?? Has this guy done anything to suggest to you or your parents that he may be abusive towards your sister? That would be a huge issue if it were true. If there was any suggestion this guy was abusive then your first posting here is a red herring because his abusive nature would be the only issue you should be discussing!! Or maybe he has never done anything abusive towards your sister, but your dislike for him is so strong that you're happy to throw a bit of "mud" in his direction to try justify your own dislike of him??

You didn't miss anything, as far as I know this guy hasn't laid a finger on my sister, but how are we to know that he never will? He obviously has huge character flaws and hasn't exactly made a great impression on my family plus add to the fact that he loves a drink yet alcohol seems to bring out the worst in him, there are more then enough red flags there to warrant being cautious of him.

The rest of your post was very good though Z and I agree that my own personal issues are obviously not helping me right now and I agree that I am probably blowing things out of proportion in regards to Christmas some what. I also don't consider your views blinkered <snip>.

WellyJ · 13-12-2010 3:44pm

Why is everyone being so tough on the OP?

This sounds like a nightmare situation.

curlzy · 13-12-2010 4:19pm

Hey OP,

I didn't read all the responses so excuse me if I repeat someone else.

Firstly, I know EXACTLY where your head is at. I had a recent thing where I was in forced proximity to someone I absolutely HATE with a passion for a long long long time. Like this person made me cry on multiple occasions out of pure frustration. Total knacker scum is too kind a description for them.

Anyway the only way I could deal with them in the end was through utter calm. Just be quiet and non reactive with him. If he says something nasty/insulting/condescending then don't say anything, just look at him, count to 5 in your head and then nail it, just say "well that's not very nice" or "hmmm not really any of your concern is it?" etc etc. Don't get into an argument, don't respond to it other than pointing out his bad manners in a quiet voice. This will mortify him and really show up his bad manners. You have to have CLASS when dealing with someone like him, that means being the bigger man (I know it's hard when your hand is itching to slap him). It will also make your sister re-evaluate him. A lack of a response or very quietly pointing out the obvious (i.e. "well that's a rude thing to say") will work a millions times better then loosing the rag. Take a note out of your father's book, a quiet response is sometimes way more effective. Just don't play his game, just smile and nod when he braggs, at the end of the day who gives a **** what he drives/owns etc. He does sound very insecure and passive aggressive, so you need to be passive in return. Like I said either say nothing or a simple sentence is the best response. Also a quick glance at your sister when he pulls this **** should get her to open her eyes. You have my sympathy, being around someone who you hate is really really really hard but remember it's only 6 days. Try your best to enjoy your Christmas. Best of luck.

Also : I'm female, not sure why that should make an ounce of difference but you seem to think it's important.

seamus · 13-12-2010 4:32pm

Bah Humbug wrote: »

there are more then enough red flags there to warrant being cautious of him.

I completely and utterly disagree.

Because he can act a bit laddish and macho and has a tendency to shoot his mouth off when he's drinking, you're worried for your sister's safety? Over-reacting much?

Look, he sounds like a complete plonker, going on your description. But as iguana alluded to early on, it sounds like you were ready to form a negative opinion of the guy before you even met him - he shook your hand too strongly and then didn't interrupt his conversation to speak to you, therefore you got off to a bad start?

To me it sounds a bit like you were initially overprotective of your sister - slightly older guy, unknown quantity, proposed before you even got a chance to meet him - and I suspect unless he turned out to be a perfect gentleman who sat quietly in the corner and spoke when spoken to, he was never going to tick all the boxes.

Granted, he fell a good deal short of the expected box-ticking, but in reality the only thing you should expect any boyfriend/fiance of your sister's to do is make her happy. Anything outside of that is irrelevant. And if he makes her happy, then make an effort to see past his shortcomings.
I've seen it happen before where you get a very loud, laddish kind of guy meets the future in-laws and acts like he's with his mates down the pub; crude jokes, slagging, the lot. It doesn't mean that they're bad people necessarily, they just have a different idea about how to act around people than you do.

I would say to stop focussing on these six days as torture. Wipe the slate clean in your head and give the guy the benefit of the doubt. You've only met him a couple of times previously, and every single time your expectation of him was overwhelmingly negative, so he was unlikely to make a great impression.
Now you've got six whole days where you'll get to know him. If you go in, mind open, then you can legitimately say after six days that you don't like him or that, "actually, he's still a bit loud an arrogant for my liking, but he's OK". If you automatically assume that you won't like him, then you're going to have a torturous six days and at the end of it you won't have made any kind of effort.

If he crosses a line, tell him calmly and remove yourself from the conversation.

LegacyUser · 13-12-2010 5:20pm

Lads ease up on the OP - regardless of who's right or wrong the fact is that after the utter pox of a year he's just had, he now has to share close quarters with someone he can't stand right when he was hoping for a nice Christmas... I'd be losing the will to live if I was in his shoes.

curlzy wrote: »

Anyway the only way I could deal with them in the end was through utter calm. Just be quiet and non reactive with him. If he says something nasty/insulting/condescending then don't say anything, just look at him, count to 5 in your head and then nail it, just say "well that's not very nice" or "hmmm not really any of your concern is it?" etc etc. Don't get into an argument, don't respond to it other than pointing out his bad manners in a quiet voice. This will mortify him and really show up his bad manners. You have to have CLASS when dealing with someone like him, that means being the bigger man (I know it's hard when your hand is itching to slap him). It will also make your sister re-evaluate him. A lack of a response or very quietly pointing out the obvious (i.e. "well that's a rude thing to say") will work a millions times better then loosing the rag. Take a note out of your father's book, a quiet response is sometimes way more effective. Just don't play his game, just smile and nod when he braggs, at the end of the day who gives a **** what he drives/owns etc. He does sound very insecure and passive aggressive, so you need to be passive in return. Like I said either say nothing or a simple sentence is the best response. Also a quick glance at your sister when he pulls this **** should get her to open her eyes. You have my sympathy, being around someone who you hate is really really really hard but remember it's only 6 days. Try your best to enjoy your Christmas. Best of luck.

Also : I'm female, not sure why that should make an ounce of difference but you seem to think it's important.

+++1

It's the only way - be the bigger man and just blank him when he's being a tool. Smile sweetly and say nothing, just don't respond. He does sound like a bit of a bully and bullies feed off any hint of victimisation or 'he's picking on me' vibes. The only way to win is to show him it's having zero effect on you.

Also as someone else has said - if your sister does go ahead and marry this guy, you need to look at the bigger picture, you'll be related to him and this bad feeling will have to be sorted before it causes a serious rift. I almost don't want to say this - but maybe under the bravado there's someone in there you might be able to get along with on some level??

tinkerbell · 13-12-2010 5:50pm

I don't understand why people are being so horrible to the OP. His sister's fiancé has been a twat to him on numerous occasions and now he has to spend Christmas, which he was really looking forward to, in the same house as this ignorant git? I know for one that I would be furious if my sibling's partner treated me with disrespect like that, they'd soon know about it and wouldn't do it again because I would call them up on it and tell them what I thought of them.

OP, what I would advise to you is the next time that he pulls this crap on you, ask him who the hell does he think he is disrespecting you in your family home, and if he has a problem with a member of the family then he should just leave the house and come back when he has sorted out his attitude.

I would not tolerate his behaviour, he has no right to be a twat to you. So call him up on it, he will hopefully be so mortified by his behaviour that he'll soon shut up.

Zen65 · 13-12-2010 7:11pm

Bah Humbug wrote: »

You didn't miss anything, as far as I know this guy hasn't laid a finger on my sister, but how are we to know that he never will? He obviously has huge character flaws ......

OP, we all have character flaws (some of which might seem "huge" to other people) - and you can never be sure that a person will not at some stage turn to violence. Were I to be cynical I could suggest that since you expressed a belief that this man was deserving of a smack in the mouth that you are already predisposed towards violent ways? Of course such a comment about you would be most unfair; you have not suggested that you would do such a thing. Similarly you have not shown any reason to have questioned your sister's safety in his company. By questioning it in the way you do, you are allowing yourself licence to increase your dislike of him.

That is of course your prerogative, but to be fair to your sister I would humbly suggest that you could apply the same amount of effort to overlook his faults and be glad that he makes your sister happy. It is a gift that is often not appreciated fully that somebody should make another person happy.

I think Seamus is on the button when he says "he sounds like a complete plonker". In my experience the sort of immature behaviours this man exhibits often change in time, as he himself begins to see the error of his ways. He may never grow to be a close friend, but with perseverance you may find he grows to be quite tolerable.

Now that I think of it, I posibly was a plonker of this magnitude in my younger days!

Be at peace,

Z

jimmycrackcorm · 14-12-2010 12:25am

tinkerbell wrote: »

I don't understand why people are being so horrible to the OP. His sister's fiancé has been a twat to him on numerous occasions and now he has to spend Christmas, which he was really looking forward to, in the same house as this ignorant git? .

Perhaps because when you compare the OPs opinion of the guy to his father who recognized the guy had his flaws

likes the sound of his own voice

then the OP comes across as over-negative. He even questioned why the Fiance is not going to his own home for xmas.

One way or the other, the OP needs to recognize that the guy is going to be part of the family and try so desperately to lower himself to the level he perceives of the future BIL.

Big Bag of Chips · 14-12-2010 10:41am

OP - regardless of whether or not he's as bad as you say he is.. there is clearly a personality clash here. You don't like each other - well you don't like him, he probably doesn't even think about you!

You are all worked up and consumed by him, and I'd guess you are nothing but a fleeting thought to him.

If he says something to you that you don't like or don't agree with.. very simply say "and why does that bother you?" "is that such a big issue for you?" etc..

If you question him you are forcing him to answer or elaborate, if he doesn't he will be embarrassed and start realising he needs to watch what he's saying around you. If he DOES, then he will embarrass himself in front of yous sister and your family, and she may very well take it up with him and tell him to back off.

Either way - you sitting back, accepting it and seething silently about it is not going to change it. He's not going to have a eureka moment, unless you bring it to his attention.

OS119 · 14-12-2010 10:53am

Big Bag of Chips wrote: »

....Either way - you sitting back, accepting it and seething silently about it is not going to change it. He's not going to have a eureka moment, unless you bring it to his attention.

this is my view.

OP, best way to do it is whenever he either starts bigging himself up, or slagging you down just tilt your head, go all doe-eyed, flutter your eyelids and say 'i love you', or 'you're so perfect', or, if you're feeling particularly brave 'have you ever made love to a man?'.

he'll get the message real fast.

Phat Cat · 14-12-2010 5:10pm

Jaysus the OP is getting a fair ol' roosting here! I think alot of posters are being very unfair to him given that he has shown incredible restraint after what sounds like a down right nasty year. The guy that he discribes sounds like a villian from a movie or something but calling the OP arrogant and selfish is very short sighted after what he has had to put up with.

Everyone seems to hung up on their first interaction too. I have personally given dozens of job interviews and for me first impressions and initial reactions are very important IMO. For example if I met a candidate and he gave me a powerful handshake and looked me right in the eye it would probably indicate that he was very confident or even excited. But if I got the same handshake off another candidate who refused to look me in my eyes I would think the exact opposite. If he then refused to even knowledge me by talking to somebody else or distracting himself from the situation then alarm bells would be ringing in my head.

The OP even said that he didn't think too much about it at the time and "let it slide" but he went back to it for reference when his initial suspicions proved to be justified when his future brother in law began to insult and belittle him in front of his own family. I'm surprised his sister hasn't pulled her fella up on his behaviour but the OP did mention that they haven't seen eye to eye and also reviled that she had a selfish steak so maybe she is partly to blame in all of this mess too? Can she honestly not see what's happening or does she even care? I'm surprised nobody mention her yet actually.

One thing for sure is that the brother in law is an out and out bully. He had no right to insult the OP in the manner that he did. I mean calling someone a loser to their face is bad enough but when that person is a stranger that you need to form a positive relationship with for that sake of your future families happiness.........it actually beggars believe at how stupid and selfish his actions were.

By the way the way he was described I don't think he be able to change on his own, plus l'd say that there is a strong possibility that he will use Christmas as an further opportunity to see how far he can push the OP. All the OP needs to do is to stay calm and let this bully expose himself for what he really is. I'd say that the mother and father know exactly what he is like but are determined to get along with him for the sake of their daughter. Their daughter on the other hand is is probably oblivious to these apparent flaws and right how is still blinded by love after being sweep off her feet by this fella who asked her to marry him and who she only knows a year. IMO she is the key to all of this because a rift looks like its on the cards unless she steps in as peacemaker and sorts these male egos out.

Dinge · 14-12-2010 10:48pm

Regardless of what the OP thinks of his future brother in law, it looks like he's going to be part of the family. I can detect from what he has written here that he's really consumed by his dislike of him and has already ruined Christmas for himself before anyone comes to visit at all.

All I can suggest is that the he does his best to be civil to him and not let him wind him up. Some people get off on this sort of behaviour and the OP will only be playing into his hands if he works himself up into a lather over him.

I cannot stand my future brother-in-law

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