Dole - Privacy

Worried Soul

Dole - Privacy
I just want to know if anyone can find out whether or not you are signing on for the dole? I know its no shame nowadays but I'd rather not have anyone find out. I am on a placement at the moment and i think people just presume I'm being paid (albeit a meagre sum). Also I have kept this hidden from some very important people in my life and I dont want them to find out. Any way it could be disclosed in the future? My pride is the only thing I got left

thebman

Probably more of a personal issue TBH but I don't think anyone can find out unless they see you signing on etc...

If your on an unpaid work placement, I don't know if your eligible for dole so I hope you've checked that out already.

Permabear

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gollem_1975

Worried Soul wrote: »

Dole - Privacy
I just want to know if anyone can find out whether or not you are signing on for the dole? I know its no shame nowadays but I'd rather not have anyone find out. I am on a placement at the moment and i think people just presume I'm being paid (albeit a meagre sum). Also I have kept this hidden from some very important people in my life and I dont want them to find out. Any way it could be disclosed in the future? My pride is the only thing I got left

there is no shame in being on the dole.. there are 400,000+ of us on it. (i;m also on a placement )

now on the other hand if you said you were a low paid civil servant you'd be getting flamed by now by some of the folk around these parts

there is no legislation preventing future disclosure of your salary afaik regardless of who you are being paid by but don't see why anyone would benefit from disclosing it... its not the sort of thing you'll be finding on wikileaks!

the only way I see your VIPs finding out is when/if your JSB runs out and then you need to get means tested for support from DSFA.

Are those people in your life going to snoop around trying to find out this info

gollem_1975

donegalfella wrote: »

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if you are on WPP you can sign on by post and get JSB into your bank account.

however this is not something that will typically be put in place when you begin your placement.. you need to wait for DSFA and Fas to get their ducks in a row first..which is not something that happens overnight (they got it sorted for me after 4 months)

cavedave

Worried Soul points out one of the good arguments against food stamps and such instead of just paying unemployed people cash, There is a loss of privacy associated with paying for your groceries with foodstamps.

amen

the details of everyone who receives some form of state support (childrens allowance, unemployment benefit, rent allowance, Enterprise Ireland grants, County enterprise grants, medical cards, farm grants, start a business grants etc) should be available.

Would be a good way to cut down on fraud.

thebman

cavedave wrote: »

Worried Soul points out one of the good arguments against food stamps and such instead of just paying unemployed people cash, There is a loss of privacy associated with paying for your groceries with foodstamps.

Foodstamps maybe but a social debit card would not be a bad idea. State can keep track of what people spend their money on and the user gets an discrete card to pay for purchases with.

Helps the state work out if benefits are too high and they could easily get Visa or Maestro to create the cards with their names on them to mask that they are state welfare cards for privacy reasons.

Saadyst

amen wrote: »

the details of everyone who receives some form of state support (childrens allowance, unemployment benefit, rent allowance, Enterprise Ireland grants, County enterprise grants, medical cards, farm grants, start a business grants etc) should be available.

Would be a good way to cut down on fraud.

Yeah everyone should lose their privacy and dignity because a few % are abusing the system.

So basically anyone on a form of welfare is put on the equivalent of a sex offenders register?

gollem_1975

Saadyst wrote: »

Yeah everyone should lose their privacy and dignity because a few % are abusing the system.

So basically anyone on a form of welfare is put on the equivalent of a sex offenders register?

but your comments are also reinforcing any stigma associated with receiving state benefit!

why should people feel shame that they are receiving something that they are entitled to under the system.

I think a debit card as suggested by another poster might be a good idea.

In that it could only be used to buy essential items (food) from legitimate businesses in the state( as opposed to being sent abroad or spent on booze/smokes/black market etc.). - please feel free to rubbish this debit card idea - its not an idea i have been nuturing for any great length of time.

Immaculata

I sympathise with you but really, there's no shame in receiving social welfare payments if you fit the criteria. Everyone in the country is going to be on social welfare (i.e. the state pension) when they hit retirement age, for example, and pretty much everyone in the country has been in receipt of JSB now and again during the course of their adult life. You paid your taxes long enough, and/or will be paying taxes again for long enough when you're back in work, so don't be embarrassed.

Unless someone sees you signing on, at the local or picking up your payment from the post office, they can't tell if you're on the dole. Get your payment paid into your bank account, if that helps. If the social welfare officials need to means test you at some point in the future, they may call over to where you live.

It's just my two cents, but since you're grafting away on a work placement, you're doing everything humanly possible to get back into regular work. Why not tell the important people in your life that your work situation became difficult due to the recession, you're now on a work placement to improve your chances of getting work, and the placement is funded by social welfare: which is the truth.

Why should anyone object to you telling them that? In fact, shouldn't they admire your dedication and work ethic?

thebman

This highlights the problem with our social welfare system TBH.

Throughout boom years, we had full employment and many on the overly generous welfare system was long term dolers with no intention of getting a job or had a job on the side.

Through letting the people exploit the system like this, the government have made it a repulisive idea for hard working people like the OP on hard times to apply for the social welfare fund they have paid into which was paying for the people exploiting the system in good times.

How people are not more disgusted by this surprises me TBH. We need to make a greater distinction between the long term unemployed and the recently unemployed. The long term benefit people should not be getting dole, it should be called what it is a handout.

Saadyst

gollem_1975 wrote: »

but your comments are also reinforcing any stigma associated with receiving state benefit!

why should people feel shame that they are receiving something that they are entitled to under the system.

I think a debit card as suggested by another poster might be a good idea.

In that it could only be used to buy essential items (food) from legitimate businesses in the state( as opposed to being sent abroad or spent on booze/smokes/black market etc.). - please feel free to rubbish this debit card idea - its not an idea i have been nuturing for any great length of time.

My point is generally that if people are entitled to it, especially if they've paid in - they can't be treated as some sort of substandard citizen as people here suggest.

Nolanger

People can find out if you're on the dole as your social welfare records are available in some organisations outside that department.

zig

im thinking this may be more of a personal issue, this isnt the first time ive seen him post this, I think its in the work and jobs section as well.

amen

Yeah everyone should lose their privacy and dignity because a few % are abusing the system.

read my post. Thats not what I am saying. I am saying everyone, farmers, companies, charities etc any entity in Ireland that gets government money no matter how small should have their name published with the amount and the reason for the payment.

Look in the politics forum about phantom siptu accounts. If this information was public then siptu would have noticed when the first payment was made instead of finding out several million later.

There is no stigam with Dole. Why should there be ? Its not you fault there are no jobs in Ireland.