I want to go abroad, she doesn't

jobhunter12

Difficult scenario, been in the best relationship of my life for under a year.. Things are going great, however I am unemployed and she is working full-time in a sheltered sector of the economy.
All of her friends, and people in her circle, have been totally unaffected by the downturn.
I am eager to go abroad in the New Year with her, whereas as she is rather reluctant. I feel I’m under-employed/not achieving my potential etc here in Ireland, yet everything seems to be fine in her life.
We’ve discussed this and it’s becoming hard for us to reach an agreement. I don’t get the whole Irish thing of needing to ‘live close to mammy’, that seems to be prevalent among young, well-educated Irish.
I am close to my family, and I’d miss them but the reality is my siblings and friends are starting to their own thing anyway in terms of having kids, getting married etc and I can see a situation where I’ll only see my mates from my town three or four times a year if I was living here anyhow.
Much as I love my family I can’t live on cups of tea at 2pm round my folks on a Wednesday!
The reality is there is no upturn and there won’t be here for ages, and in the meantime all I get from people is a ‘stick at it’ vibe which is damn all practical use.
The issue of me possibly moving abroad due to work has become a bit problematic, also with her friends etc who as I’ve mentioned are a td divorced from reality/work in sheltered economy.
We’ve discussed what would happen if things continued to be bad, and we’ve both agreed that we wouldn’t do long term, for two people in our late 20’s, we are both entitled to full-time partners etc, and I’d see it as a sign of inflexibility if a girlfriend with no real commitments wouldn’t move. The reality is nothing has changed in terms of opportunities in the last six months here, and I can’t see any hope on the horizon...Anyways, would be interested to get some views on my situation?
Has anyone else been in a similar scenario?..Or going through it? And can anyone explain the whole attachment to your family thing in the age of email/phone/skype?
Surely, your 20’s and 30’s is about progressing your career etc instead of accepting a mediocre career?

LittleBook

You keep mentioning "reality". Most people are only aware of their own reality (understandably) and the problem is that you and your girlfriend have completely different realities. She and her friends aren't "divorced from reality", they just have a different reality from you.

She's happy in Ireland, in a secure job she (presumably) enjoys and likes being close to her friends and family ... which is not just a Irish thing by the way.

You're unemployed, with no prospects, content with seeing your friends 3 or 4 times a year and could happily move away from your family.

It will be extremely difficult to reconcile these two. To stay together, someone will have to make a sacrifice and, personally, I would see her sacrifice as being enormous.

And to be honest, your post comes across as though the only way is your way. You are asking her to give up everything, while you have little to lose.

I'm sorry to tell you but I'd be surprised if she went with you and, even if she did, I'd be even more surprised if the relationship lasted. Emigrating where both partners aren't 100% happy about the idea can be disastrous.

FoxT

hi there,
Maybe if your gf has a good job here she is worried that if she moves abroad & things dont work (either relationship or employment) then coming back & getting a job again will be difficult.

If you move, then there is a big difference between moving to the EU where you could conceivably get home fairly often, or to AUS/US/NZ, where that would be impossible.

You could also consider staying in Ireland & retraining or improving your current qualifications. If that is possible for you, then it could be a double-win as you will be better positioned careerwise when the economy improves.

If moving is your only option & she is determined that she will not go, then it puts you in the position of having to choose between her, and moving.


That is a question that only you can answer for yourself. I know what I would do, but that is irrelevant, as this is about what is best for you!

hightower1

jobhunter12 wrote: »

I’d see it as a sign of inflexibility if a girlfriend with no real commitments wouldn’t move.

There is always give and take in a relationship but moving country is outside something within reason for most imo.
Its not a small comprimise.

I have had mates travel and off right now doing so and imo their mental, we work long and hard enough to get to a comfortable standard of living as is and I cant see why anyone would up and go for a year or so just to come back and have to start from scratch again. All for the sake of a years holiday?

I know life is about experiences but isnt it also about the long term too? About how your day to day life is? I am sure thats what she is focused on right now. imo I think she's right but I can understand your want to get out of here.

The choice is thankfully clear, the decision is not...

Stay and be with her... leave and persue your own wants. Hope coming to the conclusion isnt too difficult mate. best of luck, honestly.

LegacyUser

Why not move abroad (eg: the UK, for accessibility to OH) by yourself for 3-6months to "test the water", as it were?
Or, if staying here, consider diversifying?
Either way, I'd agree you need a job, for your own sanity.
Plenty of couples have long distance relationships in this economy, if your OH is well-employed, there's nothing to stop her visiting you at weekends. It's a bit unrealistic to expect to both get jobs in the same area/county in a recession-hit economy. A trainee hospital consultant(age34) I know spent 2years on 6month rotations in 4 different cities here in Ireland, away from her husband& 2young kids. Now that's tough.
Long story short, where there's a will, there's a way.

LegacyUser

I was in the exact same situation...
I was in a good job, and living long distance from my boyfriend at the time.
He took career leave of 3 years from his job who were offering a good package that he couldnt really turn down, 3 years off earning 1/3 of his wages.
With is contract he can only work abroad, not in Ireland, as technically he is still employed by his work (the county council).
For a few months he was living at home, not working, and starting to go a little crazy (as were his parents as he said his reason for taking the leave was to go travelling- he had savings).
The difference here was that, no matter how much i pleaded that i would come travelling with him where ever he went, that i would leave my job etc for him, he always REFUSED.
He loved me (loves me!) so much that he did not want the responsibility of me leaving a good job for him.
Think about this.
I am crazy about this guy, as is he about me, but he just would not accept me leaving that security and have it on his conscience.
After more than half a year he still wasnt gone because he didnt want to leave me and couldnt not ask of me the things you so easily think your GF should do for you.
I think this is a huge huge thing.
This is love.
Eventually things worked out for us.
I was unfairly dismissed from my job, got a solicitor and got a big cheque, was able to then move to be with him further down the country (which he also was very against me doing unless i had another job there first).
It was like a blessing had come our way.
Just when he HAD to do something as his parents were kicking him out until he made something of his career leave this happened and i was relieved of my job without guilt.
Now we are happily living together and it is ME who has no job, he makes money playing poker, hes a poker pro playing the UK & Ireland circuit for the last year, but we are happy to just be together.
I hope maybe this can give you a different perspective on things, and see how treating a person like their life is truely important can work out your way anyway because i just love and trust this guy so much now! Im sure you can understand why...

Good luck with your situation.

Toots

OP, I don't understand how you figure she has 'no commitments'. She has a secure and stable job, which is like gold dust at the moment, she has her family and she has her friends. They are all commitments. For her to throw all that away and emigrate when she really doesn't want to would be utter foolishness on her part. TBH, it sounds to me like you're the inflexible one.

Where are you planning on emigrating to? If it's somewhere close by like the UK or Europe, it'd be possible to still see each other regularly enough, which would make maintaining a long distance relationship easier. However if you're considering going further afield, you should be aware that it could be too much strain for the two of you to stay together.

LegacyUser

You said it's been the best relationship of your life...but also that you've only been going out for under a year. It's a massive ask to expect her to leave behind her friends, family, job, for- what, exactly? You are still in the "rose garden" stage of the relationship, there's no secure commitment in place, basically the foundations aren't solid enough yet. It'd be completely& wholly one-way traffic; her sacrificing her life for you, you paddling your own canoe& have her toddle after you. What would she be left with should ye break up abroad, if you were the only reason she was there? "the memories"?!
If you love each other, you'll get through it. You can't expect everything/one to conveniently slot into place, it's unrealistic not to have a bit of hardship in maintaining a relationship.

IrishEyes19

Stay here with her if you can guarantee you wont resent her later because she didnt move, these "lost oppertunities" can be used like canon fire in arguments between couples during rough patches.

As for the staying with family here, I dont agree with you, skype, email, phone is nothing compared to seeing your family face to face and I would be the same, I would find it very difficult to leave the country and not see my family/friends on a regular basis, it just isnt the same. If she is happy with her situation, job, friends and family, why would she want to move when relocating and starting over again would be hard for her. With the possibility of moving away to a country and looking for a new job in these tough times, make new friends,with only her boyfriend as company. Sorry to be harsh, but having an OH just isnt enough in life. You cant expect her to drop her life for you.

Sauve

OP,
Your post is exactly what myself and my fiance have been going through for almost two years now. The only difference being that we are together over ten years.....
He was made redundant in January '08 and has wanted to move abroad ever since.

I always resisted because like your girlfriend, I have a steady, fairly well-paid job which I don't think I'd ever get again if I went abroad. I live near my family who I'm very close to, I've built up some very good friendships here and I love where we live. We were supposed to be getting married in Sept next year too.

Another side to me not wanting to go abroad was the uncertainty of giving up my job. As the only one in our house working, I've been keeping the head down, working hard, and the thought of packing in the only certainty that we both have right now seemed daft.

However, in my tunnel-visioned battle to keep things ticking along, I was constantly putting the fact that my fiance was unhappy out of my head, I kept telling myself that things would get better, he'd find a job, etc etc.
But it hadn't, we were fighting constantly, he was resenting me a lot, and to be honest, there were times when I wondered whether we'd be able to stay together.

We discussed him moving and me staying here, but decided against that as if he moves it will be long term and we couldnt see it working out.

So recently I decided that I will move with him. If he can get a good job abroad, then we're in the same situation money-wise, but at least he'll be happy again. And that, from what I've learned, is the most important thing.

I may end up having to take a job that I'm underqualified for, but at the end of the day, if I come home and he's smiling, then that's what will make things work for us, not how much money we're earning.

To sum it all up (sorry about the long post), I've picked him over everything that I have here, and I really hope that it pays off. But if I was in your situation OP, just a year in to your relationship, it might be a different story.

Don't be too harsh on your girlfriend- from my experience, she'll be suffering too. She just has a different way of looking at the world from yours, and neither of you are right or wrong.
The best thing you can do is have a lot of open, honest conversations before the resentment and bickering starts, because trust me, that'll test the strongest of relationships.
Best of luck, hope all works out for you both.

LegacyUser

I’d see it as a sign of inflexibility if a girlfriend with no real commitments wouldn’t move.

eh why the hell should she give up a steady job just because you can't find one here?!!

You say she has no commitments? yes she does!!! she has a job!

I feel I’m under-employed/not achieving my potential etc here in Ireland

So what? why does this mean your gf has to sacrifice her employment and future job prospects for you?

The reality is there is no upturn and there won’t be here for ages

so why on earth would SHE give up a full time job?

Surely, your 20’s and 30’s is about progressing your career etc instead of accepting a mediocre career?

wow just wow! you don't even have a job, and are getting on your high horse about your gf having "a mediocre" career...AND you expect HER to give up this job so YOU can find employment somewhere else?

What happens if she gives up her job and moves with you, and then she can't find work in the new country?...but i suppose that doesn't matter as long as YOU find employment right?

What does she do then? go back home? and end up on the dole? like you said jobs are very hard to find these days, giving up a full time job on the off chance you might find employment in another country is madness!

Have you even researched this? Do you know if it'd be easy for you AND her to find employment in whatever country you want to move to?

You seem incredibly selfish OP, if a relationship is all on YOUR terms then its not a proper relationship. your gf has no reason to move, she has a life here friends, family, job, these things may not be important to you, but they obviously are to her, expecting her to drop everything and live her life YOUR way is incredibly disrespectful. You really don't seem interested in a compromise at all, you just want it all your own way. Your attitude to her and her friends almost seems resentful, you seem to think her and her friends life is beneath you? it seems like a very very odd way to think of somebody you claim to have strong feelings for!

It boils down to whats more important to you OP? her? or your career?

If your career and yourself is your number one priority then off you go emigrate and do what you have to do but at least have the decency to dump this woman and allow her to live HER life - She doesn't deserve to be treated as a poor second to your career.

muboop1

Ah mate, get your head out of the clouds...

YOU want to get out of here because you have no job.
YOU don't mind as you don't see your mates anyway
YOU...
YOU...

YOU see the pattern here yeh?

She would be giving up so much, you would be giving up nothing...

Also are you considering,
The relationship is less then a year. Are you even living together yet?
Are you guaranteed a job abroad?
If she goes abroad will she be able to get a decent job?

If the answer is NO to both of the above, regardless of friends and family, you'd be mad to leave at the moment.
If it's yes to both, there may be some room to negotiate.

Mate, look at it from her perspective... You haven't made it clear if you are guaraunteed a good job abroad, so assume you haven't. You havent said she can get one either. So she prob cant. Neither of you are guaraunted a job. Or at least a decent one. The relationship is very new. doesn't want to leave mates etc...

Distorted

Does this have to even be an issue at this stage OP? I think you're being a bit harsh on your girlfriend in the circumstances. What is to stop you moving abroad yourself, finding a job, a flat, and establishing yourself, and then she can set up some interviews before giving up her job and you both end up unemployed and living in a foreign country with no money?

I think she is just being sensible and prudent, no-one responsible would give up a stable job in this economic climate and I don't see how you can say she is divorced from reality, when she is the one going out to work each day! Wheres the harm in spending some months apart, you job seeking abroad, her visiting you at weekends, you visiting her at weekends, etc.? I know several couples who do this without the need for one of them to give up a stable job. Are you suggesting that her current job is so unimportant that she should give it up in favour of supporting you in finding a job? That sounds rather old-fashioned.

While I think its commendable that you are wanting to move abroad rather than accept unemployment, I think you are asking too much of someone you have been going out with for only a year. I think you might be asking too much even of a wife in many cases!

Why make something a problem when its not yet a problem? If, 9 months down the line, you have found a good job and there are viable opportunities for her and she is still refusing to move, then is the time to treat it as a problem. But I think moving abroad to look for work is something you can do on your own initially.

LegacyUser

I think you might want to take this decision taking in consideration a few other things other than the job and the relationship. You cannot force her to move with you, but you can decide what comes first in your life and makes you happier, whether a job, relationship, personal experience etc. And you own that to yourself, so you don’t resent her in the future and don’t regret the lost time.

- When you move abroad, in the beginning, you have more expenses than income, and a huge amount of stress. You have to bring some money with you in case it takes a while for you to find a job. Lots of paperwork before you start working and renting, even if it's in the EU. You have to figure out what type of CV works there, how to sell yourself. You have to figure out accommodation, where, how, with whom. Your standard of living falls tremendously. You might not have a computer and internet access immediately to send the cvs and find accommodation. Consider weeks in a hostel, sharing your room with lots other people, juggling job interviews, keeping your suit clean, your papers organised etc when 20 Australian teens arrive at 4am partying like mad. Been there, done that. Takes a good while to adapt. Check your stamina before going, cos it’s tough in the first months. Not to mention the cultural shock.
And since you have no connections, you probably will take a job that is way under your capacity/potential in the beginning.

- It is absolutely fantastic living in a different country and in a different culture. If you like travelling and that's your thing, you gonna marvel any time you have to go to the supermarket, at any new transport you take, at the language/faces/etc. If not, you gonna feel very umcomfortable.

Are these aspects that you want for yourself? Have you always wanted to try going abroad, for the sake of the experience? Or you are just hearing about the people who went and did well? People usually don’t report the tough part, only the good one.

Best of luck!

R.D. aka MR.D

You owe it to yourself and you owe it to her to go your own way.

Speaking as some one who emigrated with a partner who was 100% committed as I was things don't always work out the way you plan. We're now broken up and i am back in Ireland for the meantime.

It was the best decision i ever made because I know more about myself and what motivates me in life.

One of the things I learned was that the grass is not always greener on the other side. The other most important thing I learned is different strokes for different folks.

Just because you don't view her life as important doesn't mean that it isn't.

jobhunter12

OP here, was offline for a good few days, appreciate the replies and given me plenty of thought. Apologies if I didn't seem to be seeing things from her point of view, was just having a particularly stressful day of worrying about the future/jobs market.
The points you guys have made are rational, and quite logical, and trust her job and overall happiness with friends/family etc matters a LOT to me.
Some very fair points, we are going out a relatively short period of time and as one or two of you pointed out how would I handle giving up things here if the roles were reversed? Don't know if I would be that enthusiastic if everything in my life was going great.
My way is not the only way, I will stick it out here for the time being, keep plugging away and hopefully something will come good.
I was looking at continental Europe, but it would mean her giving up a permament enough role, and yes, in the current climate it seems like madness.
If its a choice between staying here and being in the relationship or travelling abroad to work without her, I'd chose her hands down!
been_there..I like how your story panned out, I'll hope for the same!
Who knows, if we are still going out in a year or two, she might come round to the idea of living somewhere else.
Its not a travel like a J1 student experience I'm looking for, but basic work/career progression I'm after.
Irish eyes..There's no way I'd resent her if I didn't work abroad! Not an issue!
And as many of you have pointed out, if I am to moved abroad, it'd be most likely on my own initially, she'd be mad to move unless everything was good to go elsewhere.
Anyway, thanks again for the bit of perspective from everyone!