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United Earth Government

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  • #52
    nyarlothothep
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,181 ✭✭✭nyarlothothep


    EnterNow wrote: »
    There are many, in places such as Somalia who wouldn't agree. And in these places throughout the world, the reason is commonly warfare, & huge governmental debt which will never be paid off due to the colossal interest rates of which loans were granted. Conquest & economics, alive & well in 2011. No amount of charity or donations can help these places, & in fact many charities have spawned some truly rich individuals. I wouldn't even guess at how much money is owed to the US by African countries, & I can't even guess at the interest rates either.

    You've half the planet in desperate poverty (India, Africa, Asia (parts of)), you've half the planet trying to kill the other half over a difference in religious belief, you've whole countries at war over who owns what land, you've countries invading other countries over natural resources, & god knows how many other examples. It may be the best time for humanity to date, but we've a lot of growing up to do. There's NASA about to become a passenger in space exploration because the funds arn't there to commit to scientific study. Yet they're pumping out Black Hawks, F18's, F22's & UAV's because apparently we can afford to go to war?

    I actually think we've taken a few steps backwards over the last three or four decades.

    I agree that the rate of progress is not uniform, that serious corruption exists and that a few steps backwards have been taken. Although these problems aren't insurmountable, its really up to people as to what kind of world they want to live in.

    I think with NASA part of the problem is mismanagement, I read somewhere that the focus is on just keeping employed in manufacturing the same components again and again rather than developing new propulsion systems. In addition there is big money in manufacturing military aircraft, irc there was a proposal to modify the F16 I think by basically putting in an extra engine or something like that, it was summarily dismissed by congress for being wasteful because thats just what it was, primarily because it was intended to funnel profits into Lockheed and Martin, irc. I think also that a major part of it is scientists haven't come up with a good means for space propulsion. Imo ftl is the only way to go, otherwise we're never going to get much further than our solar system, so there is probably a malaise and boredom with space travel because it isn't going anywhere.


  • #53
    Myrddin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 33,733 ✭✭✭✭Myrddin


    nyarlothothep wrote: »
    I agree that the rate of progress is not uniform, that serious corruption exists and that a few steps backwards have been taken. Although these problems aren't insurmountable, its really up to people as to what kind of world they want to live in.

    I think with NASA part of the problem is mismanagement, I read somewhere that the focus is on just keeping employed in manufacturing the same components again and again rather than developing new propulsion systems. In addition there is big money in manufacturing military aircraft, irc there was a proposal to modify the F16 I think by basically putting in an extra engine or something like that, it was summarily dismissed by congress for being wasteful because thats just what it was, primarily because it was intended to funnel profits into Lockheed and Martin, irc. I think also that a major part of it is scientists haven't come up with a good means for space propulsion. Imo ftl is the only way to go, otherwise we're never going to get much further than our solar system, so there is probably a malaise and boredom with space travel because it isn't going anywhere.

    Agreed. Though FTL are you serious? I agree of course that its the only way to see the things we want to see, but its a rather lofty goal given the economic mess we're in, the fundamental physical boundaries, & well, our lack of knowing how to get even remotely close to it.

    Thats interesting re the F16, are they that audacious just to roll money into Lockheed etc? And I also agree with you that space travel, at least in the eyes of the tax paying citizen, has become boring & routine. Personally I think we've done all we can, & the next step involves massive commitment & the huge risk to human life (manned trip to Mars). I think the Americans are happy to let the Chinese & Indian government burn up money doing the things that were done 10/20/30/40 years ago. There's nothing new to learn, nothing new to discover in low Earth orbit. The moon is barren, & not much else lies in plain sight. So why waste the dollars?

    I suppose at this juncture we're getting way off topic regards UEG's, but I think between us, we both ackowledge that humanity has come a long way in a very short space of time....but we've a much, much longer way to go before we get to anything resembling a Roddeberry'esque vision.


  • #54
    nyarlothothep
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,181 ✭✭✭nyarlothothep


    EnterNow wrote: »
    Agreed. Though FTL are you serious? I agree of course that its the only way to see the things we want to see, but its a rather lofty goal given the economic mess we're in, the fundamental physical boundaries, & well, our lack of knowing how to get even remotely close to it.

    Thats interesting re the F16, are they that audacious just to roll money into Lockheed etc? And I also agree with you that space travel, at least in the eyes of the tax paying citizen, has become boring & routine. Personally I think we've done all we can, & the next step involves massive commitment & the huge risk to human life (manned trip to Mars). I think the Americans are happy to let the Chinese & Indian government burn up money doing the things that were done 10/20/30/40 years ago. There's nothing new to learn, nothing new to discover in low Earth orbit. The moon is barren, & not much else lies in plain sight. So why waste the dollars?

    I suppose at this juncture we're getting way off topic regards UEG's, but I think between us, we both ackowledge that humanity has come a long way in a very short space of time....but we've a much, much longer way to go before we get to anything resembling a Roddeberry'esque vision.

    Yeah these are pretty much my thoughts. I think FTL is a long way off if not impossible at least in terms of how we're conventionally thinking about it but given that the distances in space are so vast, we need something like this to make space travel have a point beyond having a little backyard in our solar system. On the other hand the amount of energy required to warp space time is god like. If the universe is a simulation it would be an audacious act on the part of the simulants "to mess around with the program" which is why I don't think its permitted lol. We also need to develop terraforming as a science. It may not be as far off as it seems though, technological progress is "sprinting." I'd say we could have terraforming tech in 500 years time.


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