Is this legally wrong?

RatherNotSay

Hi there,

I am a mother of a 6 year old girl. Her father and I are no longer together. He pays me maintenance every week, which I have to remind him of doing every Monday.
My problem is this:-
He has a very well paid job, bought his own house and everything. I lost my job over a year ago and am very much struggling to make ends meet. I have approached him a few times asking him for a loan, which I intend each time to pay back in CASH, or in some cases I have asked him to pay the maintenance a bit early. Each and every time I have approached him asking this, he will do it no problem but he wants me to send dirty pictures/texts or meet up with him for various sex acts. Now bear in mind I have moved on with a new partner and another child. He also has a girlfriend.
Things turned sour just recently with us because with Christmas coming up I asked him if I could get the months maintenance in a lump so I could get her presents etc. His response was that he would want 24 hours worth of meetings and dirty texts and pictures. Im ashamed to say that I have done it once in the past when I was so desperate to pay a bill, I couldn't see any other way as we were about to be cut off. Anyway, this time I just couldn't do it. I told him where to go and told him he's disgusting and should be ashamed of the way he is going on and what position he is putting me in. He is an opportunist and has no real want to help out for his daughters sake.
He has threatened me with Court to regulate access and maintenance. This got me thinking. SURELY what he is doing would have some legal ramifications? He also randomly sends me texts when I HAVENT been looking for money from him asking me to send pictures or texts and when I say no, he says name your price and I'll lodge the money straight away. I know that I shouldn't approach him for money in the first place but when you're in my shoes, you'll know how hard it is to make ends meet.
Any information regarding this would be brilliant because I feel disgusting and would like to be able to turn to him the next time he says it and give him a mouthful!

Thanks.

metrovelvet

Two choices.

1. Get a court order

2. Learn not to be dependant on maintenance.

RatherNotSay

1 - Yes I think I will.
2 - As I said, when your in a position like me when it comes to finances, you'll understand that you treasure every cent that you can get.

Walls

What he is asking you to do is sex acts for money. I would recommend that you inform him you're going to a solicitor to ask for more money and will be bringing the texts he sent you into court as part of the demand. He's shown himself to be acting repulsively to the mother of his child, I can't see that behaviour being rewarded.

Yikes, by the way, what a piece of work. You okay?

neuro-praxis

RatherNotSay wrote: »

when your in a position like me when it comes to finances, you'll understand that you treasure every cent that you can get.

some things are worth more than money

LegacyUser

As someone who's on the dole I understand the money thing.

But seriously.That guy is dirt. Save all the messages. I'd imagine that might have serious legal ramifications.

AvaKinder

What he is doing is obviously both illegal and immoral. You should definitely seek to have the maintenance court ordered.

However you have indicated that you have gone along with this in the past. Which, unfortunately, makes you guilty of acting illegally as well, what you did could be seen as prostitution. I have nothing but sympathy for your money worries and the difficult position you are in. I also cannot say that I wouldn't do the same as you did were I in your situation.

However, you have cheated on your own partner and accepted money for sexual favours so I would therefore advise against attempting to use those texts in any legal battle for maintenance as they will reflect badly on yourself as well.

I really hope you can come to some sort of arrangement with your ex that cuts out any of this sort of thing. His behaviour is disgusting, but you must also hold up your hands and admit fault for allowing it to continue.

whatsamsn

Well your ex is a scumbag. It is extortion. I think everyone would agree on that one .... but....

RatherNotSay wrote: »

.....Now bear in mind I have moved on with a new partner and another child. He also has a girlfriend..

What are you doing.
Look i'm on the social welfare myself so I can at least grasp your money worries. But you slept with your ex in exchange of money while you currently have a new partner and have another child with this new guy.


You are over a barrell here.
Although what he did can been seen as illegal your acts would be aswell... prostitution. Not to mention the fact if you goto a solictor you run the risk of your new partner finding out and also destroying your new childs parental future.


While half of me is sympathic to your situation (money worries can happen to us all) the other half is that you are to blame. Apart from fixing a financial situation didnt you think of any ramifications? Apart from this scumbag probably asking for the same again (which he has now) didnt you think he might blackmail you? (which he is of character to do so)
You've already gone through one broken relationship with a child involved. Theres no way you would want the same again. You're over a barrell here.


Im sorry if I am coming off as jerkish or judgemental. I dont mean to be. But surely you must of seen the dangers here?

(and for the record how come this new partner isnt helping you out? you do have a kid with the guy)

Distorted

Yes of course its wrong! I think you're both as bad as each other and I don't think blaming him is fair. He seems to be paying you maintenance but you want more and you want it early. Its not the lack of any maintenance that is the issue here. Thousands of women are in this situation and don't resort to cheating on their current partner to sort it out but you seem to view him as a cash cow and hence he wants something in return for his money. Most of them would consider getting maintenance and access set by a court before doing this. Its utterly ridiculous. I think you should take control of your life, sort yourself out and stop blaming other people for the way you choose to live it.

Wowreally?

Hello,

since he kept harrasing you for pornographic images i suggest you sue him for sexual harrasment and extortion

AvaKinder

Wowreally? wrote: »

Hello,

since he kept harrasing you for pornographic images i suggest you sue him for sexual harrasment and extortion

The OP said that she has gone along with this in the past, therefore trying to bring a legal case against him could result in her getting in trouble for prostitution.

seenitall

AFAIK, prostitution is not illegal in this country. Sexual harassment and extortion, on the other hand, are.

metrovelvet

Financial abuse is recognised in family law. This is what your ex is practising. You should not have caved the first time. You should go straight to court for a court order. You dont even need to go into the ins and outs of what has happenned.

You could also stipulate that all contact is to be about the children.

Make sure you have evidence that you asked him to stop with these requests.

Nevyn

There is not such thing as a charge of prostitution in this country, it is not illegal for one
adult to pay another adult to preform a sex on them somewhere private.

Legally it is not 'wrong' but I would say morally it is.
Adjust you expectations and the way you are living and don't crumble to enguaging him lilke that, seriously he is doing it to control you.

28064212

Prostitution is not illegal in Ireland. Advertising it is, but a personal transaction between two people is not illegal.

OP, you're entitled to your maintenance each week. And that's all. If you want to change that, it's up to you to negotiate with him. He does not have to give you a loan, he does not have to pay you in advance, he does not have to pay you in a lump sum. It is not his job to manage your finances.

RatherNotSay

I just want to make it clear to everyone, I have not slept with him for maintenance. I should have made that clear. I have sent him pictures and texts in the past but I havent slept with him.

Neuro-praxis – Yes I know that all too well.

Ava Kinder – When I say that I have gone along with this in the past, I have sent him some pictures/texts. I have not slept with him since before we broke up.

Whatsamsn – I just want to clear up that I haven't slept with him. He keeps asking for sex in exchange for it but I haven't gone along with it. So far, it has been texts and pictures (thats bad enough that, I know) Yes I thought about him blackmailing me but I can blackmail him just as much cos he has a girlfriend and I have all his texts and can show his girlfriend just as easily as he can show my boyfriend.

Distorted – I think my life is pretty sorted, apart from my money situation. Clearly you dont have money problems, or ever have done, nor do you have children to try and support. I never once said I wanted MORE maintenance. I went to him twice for a loan when I was about to be disconnected from one of my utilities. The return he would of gotten on loaning me the money would have been the money back, plus interest, like most normal loans go by. Him being the sick freak he is thought he would use it to his advantage and get what he could out of it. And as for me blaming other people for the way I live my life, I think you have some neck speaking to me like that. I don't blame anyone for anything. To be honest, you sound like someone who actually thinks my sick freak of an ex is onto a good idea.

Taltos

OP

this guy is pure poison.

Suggest that you make out a log of all of these requests / incidences.
Also add to that the maintenance you receive - incl dates you are paid & how much etc.
Include also your outgoings - separating it out into buckets - eg Food Shopping; Clothes shopping for child etc.

Finally and most importantly go to a solicitor immediately and ask what you can do?
Tell them what you want - eg increased maintenance; reduced contact; charges to be brought.
Be prepared for the fallout - there is a chance that you will not be believed - sending the texts etc may count against you - but the log of your dire straights may help.

I find his behavour to be abhorrent - he is treating the mother of his child as a prostitute - do what you can to get as much independence as possible and limit / cut all contact.
Also - if you have not already - be 100% open with your current partner - be prepared for the shock etc - but reinforce you do not NEED him to barge in and make things worse - that is what your ex is possibly counting on.

Wonder how he will feel when his current partner learns of his exploits...

Above all though - be safe here...

RatherNotSay

Taltos, thank you for that. It is nice to hear some advice that doesn't have an air of judgment about it. I hate that it has come to this but yes, I was weak in the past and thought if I could get help, whats a few texts and pictures. Oh, how wrong was I??

Distorted

RatherNotSay wrote: »

Distorted – I think my life is pretty sorted, apart from my money situation. To be honest, you sound like someone who actually thinks my sick freak of an ex is onto a good idea.

So where was your sharp tongue when your ex asked for the photos and you got the loan off him? If you can be sharp with people on here, why couldn't you say the same to him? Where is your pride?

I've had money problems in the past. I didn't solve them the way you did!

RatherNotSay wrote: »

Yes I thought about him blackmailing me but I can blackmail him just as much cos he has a girlfriend and I have all his texts and can show his girlfriend just as easily as he can show my boyfriend.

So you see nothing wrong with using blackmail? I'm sorry, but I'm just not finding the holier than thou act entirely convincing here.

28064212

OP, after reading back over your posts, what exactly are you looking for? It's not really clear.

Your thread title is "Is this legally wrong?". The answer is probably not, except for maybe a harrassment charge that could be arguably brought against him, but you'd have to tell your partner, and the fact that you went along with it on two occasions would weaken your case.

From this point on, what do you want to be different? If you simply want him to stop annoying you for pics/sex, send him an email or a text (so you have a written record) saying definitively, once-and-for-all, in crystal clear language that you will never sleep with him or send him anything of that nature ever again.

You're going to have to live with the fact that you probably won't be getting leeway anymore in terms of his maintenance, and you probably won't be able to go to him for a loan.

Wisco

I'd advise avoided contact, unless you need to talk about an issue that has to do with your child. Surely you can have your maintenance payments go directly into your bank by standing order? I know it's coming up to Christmas, but I think you need to set yourself a budget (I may not have kids, but I do have to account for every penny every week at this stage) and stick to it. If this means you have to take longer to buy xmas presents, or buy fewer, so be it.
I'd also think that this would be the last person you'd want to get a loan from as if anything goes wrong, he seems like the type to say you hadn't repaid, looking for more photos, etc, which is totally unreasonable.
I also think it would be a good idea to sit down with your current partner and explain what's going on. This way, your ex has no more leverage over you (can't threaten to tell your current partner) and you'd also have some support from your current partner (or I hope you would, surely he'll be able to see that your ex is extorting money from you and just generally being an @rsehole). And it would be one less worry for you too.
Good luck. Money worries aren't fun. And it's even worse when you have that sort of mental stress/abuse added to it.

Zen65

AvaKinder wrote: »

What he is doing is obviously both illegal and immoral.

I don't know on what basis AvaKinder imagines it is obvious? I wish the comment explained that thinking.

I'm quite sure it is not illegal, if the ex is paying the maintenance payments as OP says.

The term "immoral" is subjective, since each person's concept of morality will differ. I think most fair-minded people would consider his actions to be opportunistic, exploitative, and despicable, ....but perhaps that's just my own moral perspective?

If the maintenance payments have been sanctioned by a court, then he is obliged to make these payments without any form of recompense by OP. If OP is seeking payments / loans over and above those sanctioned by a court then he is free to choose whatever terms he wishes, and such demands are not blackmail in the legal sense. It is not financial abuse, since he owes OP nothing more than the court has sanctioned in maintenance payments.

OP,

It's not clear from your post that you have had the maintenance payments sanctioned by a court order. If not, I would suggest you start here and consider taking this approach. Of course once the terms of a maintenance order are set down by a court order it will be harder for you to look for payments over-and-above these terms.

I think you should go to a Citizens Information centre and talk to a trained counsellor to help you decide your next steps? I fear you may get a mix of good and bad advice here on Boards, including some from people who wish only to express moral indignation towards your ex, or towards you. Neither of these are helpful I think, whereas the good people at Citizens Information are trained to help you, and it's free.


Be at peace,

Z

MILF

Distorted wrote: »

So where was your sharp tongue when your ex asked for the photos and you got the loan off him? If you can be sharp with people on here, why couldn't you say the same to him? Where is your pride?

I've had money problems in the past. I didn't solve them the way you did!



So you see nothing wrong with using blackmail? I'm sorry, but I'm just not finding the holier than thou act entirely convincing here.

Distorted, are you posting on this to give her a hard time and make yourself look high and mighty or are you willing to give her some advice, which she clearly needs. Stop bullying her.

Elle Collins

Distorted wrote: »

I've had money problems in the past. I didn't solve them the way you did!

That doesn't make you a better person than the OP, though you seem to think it does.

OP, I'd advise you to contact Citizens Information as the last poster has advised. Have your maintanance payments sorted properly and do not contact this vermin for any reason other than to do with your daughter ever again.

Nevyn

MILF if you have a problem with a post report it, do not back seat mod.
Elle Collins personal attacks are not permitted on this forum.
Distorted if you can't keep your posts helpful to the op don't bother posting.
No more infractions from here on out, people will just be banned.

Taltos

RatherNotSay wrote: »

Taltos, thank you for that. It is nice to hear some advice that doesn't have an air of judgment about it. I hate that it has come to this but yes, I was weak in the past and thought if I could get help, whats a few texts and pictures. Oh, how wrong was I??

Stop beating yourself over the head.
At the end of the day you are as human as the rest of us - and most of us have made "silly" choices in the past. Who knows what we will do when it really comes to the crunch.

Look - what you did or have done is now in the past - put it behind you - learn from it and do all you can never to allow anyone to control you like this.
Take the advice of Zen above and seek the help you need.

If your ex is not signed up to pay an adequate amount then move mountains to get him to that place. Also seek legal advice for yourself.

At the end of the day you did what you thought was best for you and your child - ok so maybe some of your choices were suspect - but you know what - you have now seen from these calls the type of person your ex really is. You are well shot of him and now you need to do all you can to protect both yourself and your kid. Part of that is opening up to your BF about your choices - take it slowly - doubtless he will be shocked - however if you are lucky he will be able to work through his emotions to stick by you - be prepared though - he might not be able to. You have seen some of the replies here, sometimes folk just cannot see the real issue for the noise around it.

The issue here is - blackmail & maintenance.
Noise - the questionable decisions you took when desperate... Desperate being the key word folks...

whatsamsn

RatherNotSay wrote: »

Whatsamsn – I just want to clear up that I haven't slept with him. He keeps asking for sex in exchange for it but I haven't gone along with it. So far, it has been texts and pictures (thats bad enough that, I know) Yes I thought about him blackmailing me but I can blackmail him just as much cos he has a girlfriend and I have all his texts and can show his girlfriend just as easily as he can show my boyfriend.

Ohhh....
Just as well you havent. You're not as bent over a barrel as much.

But still be very careful op. While although he has something to loose aswell (his girlfriend) I would still say you hve more to loose (new partner & new child with him) .... Your current partner finding out you sent him dirty texts and pics might cause a rift. Certainly not as bad as sex. But you know yourself & he only has a new gf. she could be gone in a month.

This guy is a snake. Thats for certain. And you cant trust the actions of a snake. I still say blackmail is something he will try. Its in character for someone who has done all this so far.

Other users suggest legal advice. I would look into that. See where you stand legally. But... the catch 22 with preceeding with legal action down the line probably means your new partner will find out.

wolfpawnat

Though you are at fault for your past behaviour, you are entitled to financial help with your child.

Inform him you are taking him to court for legally enforced maintenance payments. The judge will means test you both and can award anything up to €150 per week for the child!

Also you can put a request in for half of school and other expensive times.

If he wants more regular access then fine! Give it to him. And inform him that you are okay with this. It will take the wind right out of his sails as that seems to be his biggest weapon against you!

Good luck and if you want anymore info, my parents went through the system for years so I have nearly as much knowledge as a family law solicitor:) And ignore nasty comments, at least you had the honesty to admit to your faults in this and that is a respectable quality

Taltos

Just be ready - his next move will be to blackmail you into telling your new partner or others about the photos....

Be strong and don't let him have that power - hence my suggestion to let your partner know.

28064212

Hang on, the OP hasn't said that she wants to change the level of maintenance or the level of access. She's said that she no longer wants to be involved in trading pictures etc for financial favours. That's not particularly difficult. What she hasn't said is whether she's looking for those financial favours to be continued, which is where there will be problems.

liah

Definitely come clean with your partner ASAP, OP. He will find out if you want the situation to improve.

All you can do is try to explain to him that your perv of an ex refused to pay for child maintenance unless you did these things, and out of desperation you sent him texts/pics just to be able to keep your family fed and clothed because, as I'm sure he knows, you're having some difficulties. Be very apologetic and regretful (if you feel regret, don't fake it if you don't).

It may bother him but if you're genuine, completely genuine about the reasons and how bad you feel for having to resort to pandering to him, I'd reckon his anger would be directed at your ex for asking you to do this at all rather than you. At least, if he's in any way a good person he should see it as that.

Again, it was only texts/pics, the things take a millisecond to send and hold very little weight, it's not as if you're sending them to your ex out of love or any emotion or desire.

After you clear it up with your current boyfriend take it straight to court and try to push for legally enforced maintenance from him.

28064212

liah wrote: »

All you can do is try to explain to him that your perv of an ex refused to pay for child maintenance unless you did these things

And she'd be lying.

She's looking for financial favours over and above the agreed-upon maintenance. She has never mentioned the ex refusing to pay maintenance.

If she wants to change the level of maintenance, then that's a completely separate issue. She has not said she wants to do that.

tbh

>"I need extra money to help support your child"
<"I'll give it to you if you give me a blow job"

scumbag.

whatsamsn

Op,
What about this new partner? (the guy you have another kid with)

Am I right to believe you live with him, your 6 year old daughter, and the new kid you share together?

tinkerbell

OP, first of all you need to tell your new partner everything. Keeping things a secret is not a good idea and your ex will eventually tell your new partner or at least will say he will to blackmail you more. So you need to come clean about the texts and photos you have been sending.

Secondly, take your ex to court and get maintenance set by a judge and then he has to give you the money on a certain date every week / month.