Kidney and his World Cup "Squad"

Ian_K

Here are the players used by Kidney this Autumn;

Healy
Court
Best
Cronin
Varley
Buckley
Hayes
DOC
MOD
Toner
Ryan
Ferris
Leamy
SOB
Wallace
Heaslip
Reddan
Stringer
Boss
Sexton
ROG
Trimble
Bowe
Fitz
Wallace
BOD
Darcy
Earls
Murphy
Kearney



If you think about it we used 30 players this autumn, thats exactly the amount that will have to be named for the world cup so hes technically not incorrect when he says hes built a squad

Paul O'Connell, Leo Cullen, Tomas O'Leary and Jerry Flannery will definetely come back into the picture when fit, we would also hope that Mike Ross, Fionn Carr, Felix Jones and Gavin Duffy will be considered so thats 38 players in the mix for 30 squad positions. Eight players capable of playing international rugby will be left at home.

I, for one, think this is a much stronger position than we were in going in to the last world cup where we brought along guys like Bryan Young, Paddy Wallace (as second choice outhalf) and Brian Carney

Positive thinking guys!

errlloyd

Realistically he's not going to bring 4 hookers, so you can cut that to 37, and assume the worst for Varley?

Ian_K

errlloyd wrote: »

Realistically he's not going to bring 4 hookers, so you can cut that to 37, and assume the worst for Varley?

Probably but looking beyond the world cup imo Varley has the most complete game of any of our hookers
Excellent lineout thrower and almost as good around the park as Cronin

One of the four scrumhalfs will be left out too, should be Reddan imo

errlloyd

Yeah, its a slightly more difficult call. Btw I fully agree on Varley.

It'd be interesting to lose the first match of the 6 nations and treat the rest like a development run.

I would say Felix Jones and Gavin Duffy will struggle to be considered, we have plenty of cover at 15, and plenty of utility backs. It pains me to say this, cause Felix is a school boy from where I went to school and would be the first in a long time to play international rugby.

Podge_irl

Ian_K wrote: »

we would also hope that Mike Ross, Fionn Carr, Felix Jones and Gavin Duffy will be considered

They won't be.

LeeroyJones

I think the realistic pool of players that Kidney will select from will be;

Loose-Heads
Healy
Horan
Court if Kidney sees him as a Loose, after a few, in particular the NZ performance I would hope Kidney sees him as a tight

Hookers
Flannery
Best
Cronin
Varley

Tight-heads
Buckley
Court if Kidney sees him as a tight-yet to be confirmed
Hayes (where Kidney and I differ, many of you will know that I back Kidney more than most but I cannot understand the decision to stand over Hayes at this point in his career)

Second Rows
POC
DOC
Ryan
Cullen
Toner
MOD

Blindside
Ferris
Leamy

Openside
Wallace
SOB
Jennings - a player who often comes and goes out of the Irish set-up. So for that reason it's hard to know whether or not Kidney still has him in his WC plans

No. 8
Heaslip
Leamy

Scrum Halves
Stringer
TOL
Reddan
Boss

Out-Halves
ROG
Sexton
Wallace - disappointed he didn't get any sort of run at 10, like hooker and scrum-half, we need 3 out-halves given it's a specialist position

12
D'arcy
Wallace

13
BOD
Earls

Wingers
Fitzgerald
Bowe
Trimble

Full-Backs
Kearney
Murphy

Note This is not my selection, rather what I predict Kidney to be thinking regarding who he will pick from for 2011.

While it may not be popular, I don't think the likes of Carr, J Murphy, Casey, Jones, Ross, Duffy, or Muldoon will feature. This was the time Kidney would have selected them if he was considering them.

If i was to predict the 30, it would be the list above without Varley, Hayes(with Court covering tight), Toner, MOD, Jennings and Boss

Cosmo Kramer

Podge_irl wrote: »

They won't be.

You're right. Barring injuries or the emergence of an out and out superstar for one of the provinces, you could probably pick the 30 now and get 28 or 29 right.

Actually, now that I'm here I'll have a stab and look back at it in 9 or 10 months time.

Props: Healy, Court, Buckley, Hayes (seriously)
Hookers: Flannery, Best, Cronin
Locks: POC, DOC, Cullen, M O'Driscoll
Back Row: Ferris, Wallace, O'Brien, Heaslip, Leamy
Scrum Halves: Stringer, O'Leary, Reddan
Out Halves: O'Gara, Sexton
Wings: Bowe, Trimble, Fitzgerald, Earls
Centres: O'Driscoll, D'arcy, Wallace
Full Backs: Kearney, Murphy

Many of the backs can play multiple positions obviously. Chances are there'll be an injury or two and the likes of Toner or Ryan will go.

cson

@ Leeroy: I don't think Marcus Horan will play Test Rugby for Ireland again notwithstanding Kidneys loyalties to his former Munster favourites.

Ian_K

My 30;

Healy
Court
Buckley
Ross
Flannery
Cronin
Varley
DOC
POC
Toner
D Wallace
Leamy
Muldoon
Ferris
Heaslip
SOB
Stringer
TOL
Boss
ROG
Sexton
Fitz
Bowe
Earls
BOD
P Wallace
Darcy
Kearney
G Murphy
Carr


Kidneys will have Best, Hayes, MOD, Reddan & D Ryan ahead of Ross, Varley, Muldoon, Boss and Carr

LeeroyJones

cson wrote: »

@ Leeroy: I don't think Marcus Horan will play Test Rugby for Ireland again notwithstanding Kidneys loyalties to his former Munster favourites.

Well my reasoning is that Kidney selected him in the original squad before he got injured, thus he is in Kidney's plans.
We can be confident in thinking that Healy and Buckley are going to the WC. More than likely Court is too, as he has been utilised in every match. So if we are sending 4 props as per usual, that leaves one spot left.
My 2 favourites for this are Horan and Hayes. As Court did well this series at tighthead, hopefully Kidney will send him to compete with Buckley for the 3 jersey, leaving Horan to fill the void to cover Healy.

Cpt_Blackbeard

cson wrote: »

Kidneys loyalties to his former Munster favourites.

Hahaha.

Yes his "loyalties to his former Munster favourites" is clear from the AIs. That explains why Reddan is ahead of Stringer, Heaslip/Ferris are ahead of Leamy (He could be slotted in for either and the team wouldn't really suffer, he should be on the bench though), Sexton ahead of ROG, Best ahead of Varley/Cronin (Cronin was at Munster with Kidney).

I'm sure it explains how Fitz/Kearney/Trimble are ahead of J.Murphy too.

It also Clearly explains how Earls doesn't start for Ireland despite being our most dynamic back :rolleyes:.

It also explains how Kidney picked BOD as captain ahead of POC despite his bashing of Kidney in his book.

The only place that there can be any debate is with Ross and SOB, Toner is rightfully behind MOD imo and Cullen himself said that the AIs came too early for him to be in contention.

desertcircus

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Hahaha.

Yes his "loyalties to his former Munster favourites" is clear from the AIs. That explains why Reddan is ahead of Stringer, Heaslip/Ferris are ahead of Leamy (He could be slotted in for either and the team wouldn't really suffer, he should be on the bench though), Sexton ahead of ROG, Best ahead of Varley/Cronin (Cronin was at Munster with Kidney).

I'm sure it explains how Fitz/Kearney/Trimble are ahead of J.Murphy too.

It also Clearly explains how Earls doesn't start for Ireland despite being our most dynamic back :rolleyes:.

It also explains how Kidney picked BOD as captain ahead of POC despite his bashing of Kidney in his book.

The only place that there can be any debate is with Ross and SOB, Toner is rightfully behind MOD imo and Cullen himself said that the AIs came too early for him to be in contention.

Reddan was picked ahead of Stringer because Stringer was off the radar and wasn't even first choice for his province until O'Leary was injured. Heaslip and Ferris are in ferocious form and hard to ignore. Sexton is ahead of O'Gara because he suits the Irish backline better and is a much better tackler. Best is there because he's got a lot of experience, and is second choice behind Flannery anyway. Johne Murphy wasn't even at Munster when Kidney was. Earls had a groin injury then an ankle injury this summer and autumn, and could have been a big risk.

Cpt_Blackbeard

desertcircus wrote: »

Reddan was picked ahead of Stringer because Stringer was off the radar and wasn't even first choice for his province until O'Leary was injured. Heaslip and Ferris are in ferocious form and hard to ignore. Sexton is ahead of O'Gara because he suits the Irish backline better and is a much better tackler. Best is there because he's got a lot of experience, and is second choice behind Flannery anyway. Johne Murphy wasn't even at Munster when Kidney was. Earls had a groin injury then an ankle injury this summer and autumn, and could have been a big risk.

But he still isn't picking his Munster favourites. He seems to pick players by reputation if nothing else. If Earls was a risk, he shouldn't have been on the bench.

trackguy

I see Kidney going with these guys barring injury -

Hayes, Buckley, Court, Healy
Flannery, Best, Cronin
POC, DOC, MOD, Toner
Heaslip, Ferris, Wallace, SOB, Leamy

Stringer, TOL, Reddan
ROG, Sexton
BOD, Darcy, Wallace
Fitz, Kearney, Bowe, Trimble, Earls, G Murphy

Hayes shouldn't be there - Mike Ross needs to present Kidney with a problem by performing well on a regular basis till the end of this season.

Rory Best is living on the fact that he is a leader in the team. His performances around the park are as average as ever and his throwing was abysmal this autumn. Again, the alternative in Varley needs to present Kidney with a problem. Whether he will get enough time in the big games is debatable.

MOD is a contentious selection, especially given that Leo Cullen is ignored. An honest performer but not quite the leader that Cullen is. With POC's health a concern, Cullen needs to be in the squad ASAP. He was very good in last year's 6 Nations.

The backrow is obvious and I don't think there are many other alternatives - Muldoon is a victim of playing for the smallest province.

The scrum-halves is a simple 3/4. I feel Boss doesn't have the decision making of the others and this is why he will & should lose out.

Fly-halves are non-negotiable.

The centres, in theory, pick themselves with Wallace as the alternative given his ability to create space and as a 2nd playmaker. Whether he can do this is debatable I guess but we don't have a whole plethora of options in any case. Earls is the back-up 13.

Back three are well-established in the squad. Picks for the team are up for debate after this series bar Bowe. J Murphy won't break into the squad because of his strength - versatility. Fionn Carr just doesn't have the big game exposure and won't get it by WC time.

profitius

Ian_K wrote: »

Probably but looking beyond the world cup imo Varley has the most complete game of any of our hookers
Excellent lineout thrower and almost as good around the park as Cronin

One of the four scrumhalfs will be left out too, should be Reddan imo

Theres a lot of hype about Varley lately. I must have been watching a different Varley because the Varley I've been watching this season is not a good thrower. He's about average.

thomond2006

profitius wrote: »

Theres a lot of hype about Varley lately. I must have been watching a different Varley because the Varley I've been watching this season is not a good thrower. He's about average.

He's a decent thrower IMO, he had one bad game against London Irish but tbf most packs struggle against them at the lineout. He's also very underrated in the loose.

I wouldn't 'hype' him as anything special, but he's a good solid player that will do a job.

danthefan

It doesn't matter what 30 man squad goes. He'll play some of the other guys against the USA, ****e on about how he's built a squad, say build a squad a few dozen more times, then pick a XV he's already long decided on for the games against Aus, Italy and (hopefully) beyond. We'll go out in the QF and whoever takes over will have an outrageously huge rebuild on his hands.

thomond2006

danthefan wrote: »

It doesn't matter what 30 man squad goes. He'll play some of the other guys against the USA, ****e on about how he's built a squad, say build a squad a few dozen more times, then pick a XV he's already long decided on for the games against Aus, Italy and (hopefully) beyond. We'll go out in the QF and whoever takes over will have an outrageously huge rebuild on his hands.

You're on the money (sadly).

Looking at his selections during the autumn, the squad should be something like (assuming players are fit):

Forwards (16)

Flannery
Best
Cronin

Healy
Court
Buckley
Hayes

POC
DOC
Cullen - Kidney did pick him in the Six Nations so he does rate him. Cullen said himself that he didn't feel up to test rugby now.
MOD/Toner/Tuohy/Ryan

Ferris
SOB
Wallace
Heaslip
Leamy


Backs (14)

TOL
Reddan
Stringer

ROG
Sexton

D'Arcy
Wallace (also third OH)
BOD
Earls

Fitzgerald
Bowe
Trimble

Kearney
G Murphy

There's only a few players who can break that 30 tbh, I think it's fairly set in stone.

The likes of Ross, Jennings, Johne Murphy and Carr haven't got a look in yet and won't in the Six Nations.

cson

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Hahaha.

Yes his "loyalties to his former Munster favourites" is clear from the AIs. That explains why Reddan is ahead of Stringer, Heaslip/Ferris are ahead of Leamy (He could be slotted in for either and the team wouldn't really suffer, he should be on the bench though), Sexton ahead of ROG, Best ahead of Varley/Cronin (Cronin was at Munster with Kidney).

I'm sure it explains how Fitz/Kearney/Trimble are ahead of J.Murphy too.

It also Clearly explains how Earls doesn't start for Ireland despite being our most dynamic back :rolleyes:.

It also explains how Kidney picked BOD as captain ahead of POC despite his bashing of Kidney in his book.

The only place that there can be any debate is with Ross and SOB, Toner is rightfully behind MOD imo and Cullen himself said that the AIs came too early for him to be in contention.

Good man.

Quote what suits you and take what I said out of context. :rolleyes:

stejkenny

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Hahaha.

Yes his "loyalties to his former Munster favourites" is clear from the AIs. That explains why Reddan is ahead of Stringer, Heaslip/Ferris are ahead of Leamy (He could be slotted in for either and the team wouldn't really suffer, he should be on the bench though), Sexton ahead of ROG, Best ahead of Varley/Cronin (Cronin was at Munster with Kidney).

I'm sure it explains how Fitz/Kearney/Trimble are ahead of J.Murphy too.

It also Clearly explains how Earls doesn't start for Ireland despite being our most dynamic back :rolleyes:.

It also explains how Kidney picked BOD as captain ahead of POC despite his bashing of Kidney in his book.

The only place that there can be any debate is with Ross and SOB, Toner is rightfully behind MOD imo and Cullen himself said that the AIs came too early for him to be in contention.

How is he are most "dynamic" back; BOD was captian before he took over and he said himself he didnt see any reason to change it.

Stringer is in ahead of Reddan;

Sexton is a no brainer;

But what is teh reason for using Hayes and Horan?? there both cack and old; The reason is because he knows them well from playing for years at Munster; he cant say the same about Ross or Cullen so that is in a way bias. Get over it blackbeard no one had a go at Munster, just pointed out the obvious

Cpt_Blackbeard

stejkenny wrote: »

How is he are most "dynamic" back; BOD was captian before he took over and he said himself he didnt see any reason to change it.

Stringer is in ahead of Reddan;

Sexton is a no brainer;

But what is teh reason for using Hayes and Horan?? there both cack and old; The reason is because he knows them well from playing for years at Munster; he cant say the same about Ross or Cullen so that is in a way bias. Get over it blackbeard no one had a go at Munster, just pointed out the obvious

He is our best player with ball in hand; He is possibly the fastest player and has give or take the best step on the panel. Just listen to the crowd when each player gets the ball, you wouldn't have to even watch the game to know that he gets the biggest reaction because he is always a threat.

I wouldn't be sure about Sringer being ahead of Reddan, Reddan started the bigger games even though it is clear to see why he never got a chance at Munster.

There is no point starting the outhalf debate tbh. Sexton is better with ball in hand and defensively but ROG can control a game and can create something out of nothing. Its only a no brainer for Leinster fans and some of the Dublin Irish media.

I did say that Ross should have gotten his chance instead of Hayes. But Ross is the no.3 tighthead in Kidney's eyes. Buckley and Court are both extremely inexperienced at this level and need game time if they are to be in our WC 22. Buckley showed against the Pumas that he can hold his own in the scrum and he is when at full fitness a great player around the field whereas Ross is viewed as lazy.

I'm not saying that anyone is having a go at Munster I'm just pointing out that more players are overlooked by Kidney than just the Leinster lads. Leinster players in the AIs got more of the 50-50 decisions but ye still complain that your new hero (Ross) doesn't get gametime. Another player who had to leave Munster as he wasn't good enough...:D

Cpt_Blackbeard

cson wrote: »

Good man.

Quote what suits you and take what I said out of context. :rolleyes:

Care to explain how it is out of context? You expressed your view that the Irish team would be made of mostly Leinster players were it not for Kidney's provincial bias. I merely showed you to be wrong.

Don't worry I'm sure you can try beat me at the internet another time... :pac:

Nuigforce

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

He is our best player with ball in hand; and has give or take the best step on the panel. :eek::eek::eek:

Its only a no brainer for Leinster fans and some of the Dublin Irish media.

A no brainer for me also. Rog an invaluable option to have without doubt

Cpt_Blackbeard

Nuigforce wrote: »

A no brainer for me also. Rog an invaluable option to have without doubt

As long as you are aware that I am talking about Earls and not trying to misquote me I fail to see what the shocked faces are about..?

Earls and Fitz have the best steps on the panel and there is no doubting Earls' pace (He prob up there with Sean Cronin over 10m ). Who you prefer depends on the colour of your glasses really. Fitz though seems unable to score tries at any meaningful rate, which baffles me.

I'm not too bothered at outhalf at this stage. I still feel ROG brings more to the table but we seem to be guaranteed a try with hi coming off the bench

stejkenny

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

He is our best player with ball in hand; He is possibly the fastest player and has give or take the best step on the panel.

Its only a no brainer for Leinster fans and some of the Dublin Irish media.

Another player who had to leave Munster as he wasn't good enough...:D

Careful

Cpt_Blackbeard

stejkenny wrote: »

Careful

Careful with what?

I have no problem saying that Ross wouldn't start for Munster now even. He would be behind Buckley and possibly Hayes due to Kidney's meddling. He isn't even Leinster's top TH, Wright is ahead of him as far as I'm aware (unless Kidney ensures that Ross starts). He has no chance of starting with Ulster for one abvius reason.

I guess Ross can go to Connacht, I'm sure he would start there :P

And there is nothing to be careful about with the other comments as I see them..?

tolosenc

What I'd pick and what Kidney will pick are completely different

Props: Healy, Ross, Buckley, Court - but I've no doubt it'll be Hayes in for Ross.
Hookers: Flannery, Strauss, Cronin - dunno if Strauss will want to play though, in which case Best should go.
SR: DOC, POC, Cullen and Toner - Cullen hasn't a hope, I see MOD in for him and Ryan for Toner
Back Row: SOB, Ferris, Leamy, Heaslip, Jennings - SOB won't make it and Wallace will. Muldoon can forget it!

SH: Stringer, Reddan, Boss - TOL will go, probably ahead of Boss, but maybe Stringer. Don't understand why though.
FH: Sexton, O'Gara and Keatley - Keatley won't go, Wallace will be emergency cover.

Centers: BOD, D'arcy, Wallace, McFadden - McFadden won't be there, Earls instead.
Back 3: Bowe, Trimble, Fitz, Kearney.

cson

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Care to explain how it is out of context? You expressed your view that the Irish team would be made of mostly Leinster players were it not for Kidney's provincial bias. I merely showed you to be wrong.

Don't worry I'm sure you can try beat me at the internet another time... :pac:

Take up a career in Tabloid Journalism tbh.

stejkenny

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Careful with what?

I have no problem saying that Ross wouldn't start for Munster now even. He would be behind Buckley and possibly Hayes due to Kidney's meddling. He isn't even Leinster's top TH, Wright is ahead of him as far as I'm aware (unless Kidney ensures that Ross starts). He has no chance of starting with Ulster for one abvius reason.

I guess Ross can go to Connacht, I'm sure he would start there :P

And there is nothing to be careful about with the other comments as I see them..?

How can you say he would be behind Hayes because of Kidneys meddling; Kidney is not Munsters coach and Stan wright is injured and wont be back for a while. Ross is pretty much Leinster first choice tight head. On his present form he would stroll into any Munstrer front row considering Munster have been mullered up front against Leinster for the last year or two.

How the f??k can you say that Earls is Ireland's best man with ball in hand when he doesn't get a game. Are you judging it all by "that" try against the dragons!! Explain how Earls has suddenly become the most "dangerous" irish player with ball in hand that has now overtaken all Irish centres before him. I mean they wqay you put we should just base the Irish team around him alone. Do you have pictures of him stuck on the wall in the shower?

Is Ross Ireland's best Tight Head so by that assertation??

Who is this Dublin media you speak of????

Cpt_Blackbeard

tolosenc wrote: »

What I'd pick and what Kidney will pick are completely different

Props: Healy, Ross, Buckley, Court - but I've no doubt it'll be Hayes in for Ross.
Hookers: Flannery, Strauss, Cronin - dunno if Strauss will want to play though, in which case Best should go.
SR: DOC, POC, Cullen and Toner - Cullen hasn't a hope, I see MOD in for him and Ryan for Toner
Back Row: SOB, Ferris, Leamy, Heaslip, Jennings - SOB won't make it and Wallace will. Muldoon can forget it!

SH: Stringer, Reddan, Boss - TOL will go, probably ahead of Boss, but maybe Stringer. Don't understand why though.
FH: Sexton, O'Gara and Keatley - Keatley won't go, Wallace will be emergency cover.

Centers: BOD, D'arcy, Wallace, McFadden - McFadden won't be there, Earls instead.
Back 3: Bowe, Trimble, Fitz, Kearney.

Its a good squad if a little blue-tinted.

They are the right props but we could well see John Hayes and I'm sure he will pull a performance form what will be most likely his last season. I don't know if Strauss is even Irish qualified, but anyway I wouldn't have him in ahead of Varley. Flannery doesn't look like ever returning to fitness.

No matter what happens in the second row, a deserving player will miss out. If POC is back to form, we don't need Toner for the Lineout and I'd like to see POC, DOC, Cullen and Ryan (he covers 6 too and is a very good player despite not being a dominant jumper in the middle of the LO)

Swap Jennings for Wallace and you have the best backrow.

Keatley won't make the squad, but will hopefully feature heavily next time around. That leaves a place in the squad for Earls (I won't start on you for not including him :P) I'd then drop McFadden and bring in J.Murphy. McFadden is our 4th 13 after BOD Earls and Bowe and Murphy is the perfect squad player. He could start 11,12,13,14,15 and not damage the team, but I'd play him form the bench. It's then a flip up between G.Murphy and Kearney. Kearney should be relegated to Magners duty to see if he has what is needed to be an international player.

I'm sure someone is missing but your squad looks great now that I've altered it :P

Nuigforce

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

As long as you are aware that I am talking about Earls and not trying to misquote me I fail to see what the shocked faces are about..?

Earls and Fitz have the best steps on the panel and there is no doubting Earls' pace (He prob up there with Sean Cronin over 10m ). Who you prefer depends on the colour of your glasses really. Fitz though seems unable to score tries at any meaningful rate, which baffles me.

I'm not too bothered at outhalf at this stage. I still feel ROG brings more to the table but we seem to be guaranteed a try with hi coming off the bench

Best Player with ball in hand was what got me.
out half is anyones personal opinion

little173

To be fair, he was only arguing and illustrating the point that Kidney is supposedly picking his old Munster favourites, which on general and specific evidence, is clearly not the case.

I for one, really think DK should find a way of getting Earls into the team, I guess it will just be a straight fight with Luke for left wing if everyone is fit so will see.

trackguy

little173 wrote: »

To be fair, he was only arguing and illustrating the point that Kidney is supposedly picking his old Munster favourites, which on general and specific evidence, is clearly not the case.

I for one, really think DK should find a way of getting Earls into the team, I guess it will just be a straight fight with Luke for left wing if everyone is fit so will see.

If everyone is fit and Ireland try to play the supposed new ball-in-hand game, Kearney should be the one to drop to the bench.

Fitz at full-back, Earls left wing, Bowe right wing is be the best ball-in-hand and counter-attacking back 3.

Cpt_Blackbeard

cson wrote: »

Take up a career in Tabloid Journalism tbh.

Its a deal, Ill use my position to spew the generalised BS that the like of George Hook and yourself preach. :rolleyes:

stejkenny wrote: »

How can you say he would be behind Hayes because of Kidneys meddling; Kidney is not Munsters coach and Stan wright is injured and wont be back for a while. Ross is pretty much Leinster first choice tight head. On his present form he would stroll into any Munstrer front row considering Munster have been mullered up front against Leinster for the last year or two.

How the f??k can you say that Earls is Ireland's best man with ball in hand when he doesn't get a game. Are you judging it all by "that" try against the dragons!! Explain how Earls has suddenly become the most "dangerous" irish player with ball in hand that has now overtaken all Irish centres before him. I mean they wqay you put we should just base the Irish team around him alone. Do you have pictures of him stuck on the wall in the shower?

Is Ross Ireland's best Tight Head so by that assertation??

Who is this Dublin media you speak of????

Kidney can force the provinces into picking who he sees fit in whatever position he wants and let them play for however long he wants. That is why Wallace has been playing 10 for Ulster, so Kidney gets to see him play.

As long as Kidney is in charge of the Irish setup, Ross would not start for Munster. He is behind 2 props who Kidney views as better options. He is the best scrummager of the 3, but he cannot be compared to a fit Buckley in the loose. I've never heard the NZ or SA management talk of the threat Ross offers...

Well I'm ruling out forwards because they offer a different threat with ball in hand. BOD offers little to nothing going forward at this stage, he canters across the pitch looking for gaps that he doesn't have the pace to exploit. D'Arcy has been turned from a skillful player into a bash merchant (his try yesterday is the exception not the rule), any threat he has to step a player and score a try is horribly offset by his lack of pace. Bowe offers a differing threat to Earls, he sees a gap and has the strength and pace to exploit it rather than a deadly step; Him and Earls are of similar threat imo. but Bowe has proved himself at the higher level. Fitz has a great step but is slightly slower than Earls (before Earls' injury anyway), he should be a threat but not a scoring threat; I don't know why, but he just can't score. Trimble isn't in the same league and Kearney is lucky to be an international player in current form.

Its the media you have jumped on the Sexton bandwagon as Leinster finally have an OH to be considered. Its the media that ignores anything that happens in Dublin, yet says attacks in Clare are in Limerick. You'd have to be stupid or living in Dublin to not see how the media hypes the capital and puts down the rest of the country.

danthefan

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Its the media you have jumped on the Sexton bandwagon as Leinster finally have an OH to be considered. Its the media that ignores anything that happens in Dublin, yet says attacks in Clare are in Limerick. You'd have to be stupid or living in Dublin to not see how the media hypes the capital and puts down the rest of the country.

Have some ketchup.

trackguy

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Its a deal, Ill use my position to spew the generalised BS that the like of George Hook and yourself preach. :rolleyes:



Kidney can force the provinces into picking who he sees fit in whatever position he wants and let them play for however long he wants. That is why Wallace has been playing 10 for Ulster, so Kidney gets to see him play.

As long as Kidney is in charge of the Irish setup, Ross would not start for Munster. He is behind 2 props who Kidney views as better options. He is the best scrummager of the 3, but he cannot be compared to a fit Buckley in the loose. I've never heard the NZ or SA management talk of the threat Ross offers...

Well I'm ruling out forwards because they offer a different threat with ball in hand. BOD offers little to nothing going forward at this stage, he canters across the pitch looking for gaps that he doesn't have the pace to exploit. D'Arcy has been turned from a skillful player into a bash merchant (his try yesterday is the exception not the rule), any threat he has to step a player and score a try is horribly offset by his lack of pace. Bowe offers a differing threat to Earls, he sees a gap and has the strength and pace to exploit it rather than a deadly step; Him and Earls are of similar threat imo. but Bowe has proved himself at the higher level. Fitz has a great step but is slightly slower than Earls (before Earls' injury anyway), he should be a threat but not a scoring threat; I don't know why, but he just can't score. Trimble isn't in the same league and Kearney is lucky to be an international player in current form.

Its the media you have jumped on the Sexton bandwagon as Leinster finally have an OH to be considered. Its the media that ignores anything that happens in Dublin, yet says attacks in Clare are in Limerick. You'd have to be stupid or living in Dublin to not see how the media hypes the capital and puts down the rest of the country.

Wow. You know this is the rugby forum?

Sexton is the form fly-half and is better suited to Ireland's game at present. ROG is a great asset to have and has shown how good an impact player he is this November but he can not get the backline moving like Sexton can. That, allied with his suspect defence, is why he is on the bench.

As for the rest of the paragraph - that is grade A paranoia. Seriously.

stejkenny

And it looks like i was right about the shower thing too!!

d'Oracle

While we are obviously concerned with how the AI's went, I reckon there is too much rugby with actual consequence to be played yet.

stejkenny

And i have to say this is the first time i have seen D'arcy labelled a "bash merchant", has he turned into a "bash merchant" as he got older or is it a new career choice.

Sam Tuitopoo is a bash merchant, Gordon D'arcy is not. They play totally different games.

And id be pretty surprised iff people in SA or NZ were talking about Mike Ross seeing as h doesnt see any international game time or ever get a mention from Edney.

stejkenny

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Its the media you have jumped on the Sexton bandwagon as Leinster finally have an OH to be considered. Its the media that ignores anything that happens in Dublin, yet says attacks in Clare are in Limerick. You'd have to be stupid or living in Dublin to not see how the media hypes the capital and puts down the rest of the country.

Do you work for the Examiner??

Cpt_Blackbeard

trackguy wrote: »

Wow. You know this is the rugby forum?

Sexton is the form fly-half and is better suited to Ireland's game at present. ROG is a great asset to have and has shown how good an impact player he is this November but he can not get the backline moving like Sexton can. That, allied with his suspect defence, is why he is on the bench.

As for the rest of the paragraph - that is grade A paranoia. Seriously.

I'm fully aware of that, but I was asked about the Iriah media and I gave my opinion. Any Leinster player will be hyped up much more than an equal Munster player. So when it come time for the Irish team to be picked , ye cry foul at the ex-munster coach and accuse him of provincial bias. Ross and SOB should be picked, but neither are better than Buckley or Wallace(when fit)

I've mentioned that I see no problem with the OH situation. I see ROG as the better player but as long as he continues to save Ireland from the bench I'm happy

Cpt_Blackbeard

stejkenny wrote: »

And it looks like i was right about the shower thing too!!

Ah a bit of sense surely..?

The shower is a highly impractical place to hang a picture. His picture is on the ceiling above my bed

stejkenny

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

I'm fully aware of that, but I was asked about the Iriah media and I gave my opinion. Any Leinster player will be hyped up much more than an equal Munster player. So when it come time for the Irish team to be picked , ye cry foul at the ex-munster coach and accuse him of provincial bias. Ross and SOB should be picked, but neither are better than Buckley or Wallace(when fit)

I've mentioned that I see no problem with the OH situation. I see ROG as the better player but as long as he continues to save Ireland from the bench I'm happy

lol

stejkenny

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Ah a bit of sense surely..?

The shower is a highly impractical place to hang a picture. His picture is on the ceiling above my bed

Oh Keith baby oh yeeeeaaahhhhh i just loooooooove having you in bed here with me, oh yes the way you carry that ball; you beefcake, you champion, your the best centre in Ireland Keith.....pppplleeeeaaaase by my 13 keithy baby ....

trackguy

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

I'm fully aware of that, but I was asked about the Iriah media and I gave my opinion. Any Leinster player will be hyped up much more than an equal Munster player. So when it come time for the Irish team to be picked , ye cry foul at the ex-munster coach and accuse him of provincial bias. Ross and SOB should be picked, but neither are better than Buckley or Wallace(when fit)

I've mentioned that I see no problem with the OH situation. I see ROG as the better player but as long as he continues to save Ireland from the bench I'm happy

I don't do this. You are generalising about me and others as you generalise about the media. Please try and get some perspective.

Save Ireland from the bench? When has he been doing this exactly? I'm not trying to be disparaging towards ROG but he hasn't saved us.

He got us closer against SA - created one very good try and a very lucky 2nd but missed the conversion. He didn't really change the game against Argentina now did he?

You are just as biased and narrow-minded as those Leinster supporters you criticise.

Why does everyone keep harping on about the provinces? Kidney is not provincially biased - he is simply too loyal to long-established players, regardless of province.

Otacon

A guy has a differing opinion so he is now a homosexual and less than a dog...
Debate the points or ignore him. Can't believe what is happening to this forum.



Back on topic, I think we saw during this AI series who Kidney and co. have in their mind's eye regarding the RWC. It will take injuries IMO to change that.

Cpt_Blackbeard

d'Oracle wrote: »

While we are obviously concerned with how the AI's went, I reckon there is too much rugby with actual consequence to be played yet.

I have to agree with you. While Kidney has made some horribly frustrating decisions this Autumn, he does have a knack of pacing a team just right. Munster were often terrible in the ML but upped their game in the HC.

The team is showing improvement, which is the main thing.

Cpt_Blackbeard

Otacon wrote: »

Back on topic, I think we saw during this AI series who Kidney and co. have in their mind's eye regarding the RWC. It will take injuries IMO to change that.

I think everyone (me especially) was expecting way too much squad building wise from the AIs. We will have to wait until after the WC to see if Kidney has the long term vision to build a good squad from the great potential that exists in the country.

It would have given a great insight to Irish rugby if all the injuries we are facing now had happened at the start of the 4 games not at the end. With injuries to (I think) Best, BOD, Fitz and Kearney, it would be great to have another 2/3 games for Kidney to try some exciting prospects and pairings and see how it goes.

Ian_K

trackguy wrote: »

If everyone is fit and Ireland try to play the supposed new ball-in-hand game, Kearney should be the one to drop to the bench.

Fitz at full-back, Earls left wing, Bowe right wing is be the best ball-in-hand and counter-attacking back 3

This is good. I agree with this.

Even if Earls' long term future is in the centre i think he's too good to be left out waiting for BOD to retire, 11.Earls 14.Bowe 15.Fitz is definetely our most attacking back three and if we're really going to commit to playing expansive counter attacking rugby this would be the way to go. Kearney has done nothing to justify inclusion in the team for the six nations

RuggieBear

cson and Cpt_Blackbeard and sickpuppy banned

trackguy

Ian_K wrote: »

This is good. I agree with this.

Even if Earls' long term future is in the centre i think he's too good to be left out waiting for BOD to retire, 11.Earls 14.Bowe 15.Fitz is definetely our most attacking back three and if we're really going to commit to playing expansive counter attacking rugby this would be the way to go. Kearney has done nothing to justify inclusion in the team for the six nations

The 9, 10, 12, 13 should also follow this logic. BOD is there and just isn't going to shift from 13 whether he should or not. Is D'Arcy providing enough in attack to justify his selection? Probably not in my opinion but his defence and rapport with BOD keeps him there. You could also see the thinking in 'Be solid in midfield and flash out wide'

The half-backs need to be the right pair too. Reddan, looking at his supposed strengths should be the man for the job but he rarely looks up to the pace of the international game. Stringer, though limited, is the most dependable in an attacking sense. He and Sexton showed alot of promise as a pair.

I'd like to see Fitz, Earls, Bowe, BOD, D'Arcy, Sexton, Stringer as the backline.